05-08-16 08:06 PM
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  1. Bbnivende's Avatar
    It appears that the new Slider might be a large phatablet type device .

    I would have rather seen a device as wide as a Classic but with a Passport style KB and a 4:3 screen. The square screen format only works for a small screen. IMO

    Edit: I would love to see a BlackBerry modular design. One body, two interchangeable screens. One screen with PKB attached and another just an all touch. The key is having just the one chassis.

    Posted via CB10
    Last edited by Bbnivende; 07-17-15 at 05:48 PM.
    07-17-15 03:53 PM
  2. DragonMama's Avatar
    A keyboard is only as good as the user. It's all about proofing one's writing. PKB actually started the trend of lazy writing and poor grammar with abbreviations like BTW, CU, LMAO.
    I straddle the age gaps (I'm 38 but I've been "online" longer than almost all of my peers, having been on BBSes back in the mid-1990s when I was a teen).

    The abbreviations you reference are actually significantly older than social cell phone use. Those were in use back when the only mobile devices with text capabilities were alphanumeric pagers - which, by the by, you have Deaf folks to thank for the spread of mobile tech outside of business uses. And that's also a market segment that is NOT well-served by speech-to-text as they often have significant speech impediments.

    Yes, there's a learning curve switching from anything to anything else. However, I've been a touchtypist for more than half my life (yes, I was a touchtypist at 16 - thanks to the aforementioned BBS time, I learned to touch type because I turned off the lights in the room so my mother wouldn't know I was still awake). I got my first cell phone in 1999, a Nokia somethingorother... Then I got a Motorola flip something when I had my first kid and really wanted to keep the keys from getting pressed by his foot jabbing my hip. I think that might have had a camera, too. That was replaced by a Blackberry Flip, which was replaced by a MyTouch 4g Slide four years ago and I am STILL using that phone (after rooting it and getting a semi-recent version of Android running on it, I think JellyBean - as long as the productivity apps I run on it work I don't care if I have the latest and greatest, I don't play games on my phone). I suspect it is a shared trait particular to fluent touchtypists, that I cannot do swipe typing - I am nearly blind to the letters on the left side of the keyboard/screen when I'm only using my right finger, and vice versa. I can actually touchtype on my 4g Slide, when I'm typing on it with dual thumbs I can look up from the entire device (usually to see what my kids are getting up to) and keep typing with more accuracy than many have on a virtual keyboard. I'm not using it to compose THIS message, though - this is on a fully size keyboard with a toddler who is refusing to sleep climbing all over me (so my eyes have been off the screen repeatedly).

    On a full size computer keyboard, I type well over 100wpm. On my Slide, I can go around 60 easily. I composed much of my first novel on my Blackberry Flip and edited it on my Slide. I compose 5000 word scenes on the Slide with some regularity (often while at various entertainment venues with my kids - I can get out quite a few bits while waiting for them to go on a ride at an amusement park with their dad). My husband has a Samsung S5 and has offered it to me when I've expressed frustration with how much better the camera on his phone is, but I have just taken to carrying a point-and-shoot around with me instead of sacrificing the much more important functionality of using the phone as a communication device for the sake of a better camera built-in. The few times I've tried to write anything on his phone, such as a grocery shopping list, I have uttered many words that we do not like the children to repeat, at high volume. I hate typing on it. None of the bluetooth keyboards that can go on a phone or reasonably be carried with a phone are tollerable (the keys are all stacked in straight collumns instead of staggered like bricks the way they are on the Android sliders and computer keyboards - I don't have enough experience with BB keyboards anymore to remember how they're stacked but that's a tota dealbreaker for me, I will not hit the A key properly if they're not staggered and I use that key a LOT).

    Oh, and I challenge any of you speech-to-text fans to use that around four kids between toddlerhood and tween years. You think damnyouautocorrect.com is entertaining? Oy. Toddlers and preschoolers (and adolescents) generally can not get the concept of Mom talking and it not being a conversation with THEM.

    Generally speaking (and this is very much a generalization, not aimed at anyone specific and there are exclusions on each side), my observation is that PKB-preferers are more likely to be makers - creators of content. VKB-preferers are consumers (I won't go so far as to say leeches, will I? Nah... ) of that content, who generally have a preference for form over function. Apple marketed the hell out of iPhones, it's been The Device To Have for a long time, and Jobs decided early on that he didn't want a PKB mucking up the sleekness of his form. All the iPhone Acolytes bowed down and threw money at those things... I consider them toys (in fact, I got an iPod Touch free for opening a bank account a few years back and it was a toddler toy within a month, the only app on it that didn't come with it that is intended for over the age of 5 is an ebook reader app) .

    I have nothing against folks who prefer to consume on their devices instead of creating. Authors need readers. Just please stop trying to force everyone into the same damn touchscreen only box. I already "lug" around a folding bluetooth keyboard for my tablet so I don't have to carry my laptop or kill my phone battery if I'm going to be out doing a lot of writing (the keyboard is an old Stowaway - I had one when I used a Palm Pilot back in the early days of the 21st century and composed stories on that, then picked up the bluetooth one on eBay when I got my first Android tablet). That needs a flat surface to write. I steal minutes to get my writing done, and only have a flat surface available maybe 25% of the time that I have available to write (school pickup line being one of my most frequent writing times). If it wasn't for my phone having a PKB, I'd get MUCH less writing done than I do. And that would REALLY **** me off.
    07-18-15 11:24 PM
  3. RH1Pearl's Avatar
    I straddle the age gaps (I'm 38 but I've been "online" longer than almost all of my peers, having been on BBSes back in the mid-1990s when I was a teen).

    The abbreviations you reference are actually significantly older than social cell phone use. Those were in use back when the only mobile devices with text capabilities were alphanumeric pagers - which, by the by, you have Deaf folks to thank for the spread of mobile tech outside of business uses. And that's also a market segment that is NOT well-served by speech-to-text as they often have significant speech impediments.

    Yes, there's a learning curve switching from anything to anything else. However, I've been a touchtypist for more than half my life (yes, I was a touchtypist at 16 - thanks to the aforementioned BBS time, I learned to touch type because I turned off the lights in the room so my mother wouldn't know I was still awake). I got my first cell phone in 1999, a Nokia somethingorother... Then I got a Motorola flip something when I had my first kid and really wanted to keep the keys from getting pressed by his foot jabbing my hip. I think that might have had a camera, too. That was replaced by a Blackberry Flip, which was replaced by a MyTouch 4g Slide four years ago and I am STILL using that phone (after rooting it and getting a semi-recent version of Android running on it, I think JellyBean - as long as the productivity apps I run on it work I don't care if I have the latest and greatest, I don't play games on my phone). I suspect it is a shared trait particular to fluent touchtypists, that I cannot do swipe typing - I am nearly blind to the letters on the left side of the keyboard/screen when I'm only using my right finger, and vice versa. I can actually touchtype on my 4g Slide, when I'm typing on it with dual thumbs I can look up from the entire device (usually to see what my kids are getting up to) and keep typing with more accuracy than many have on a virtual keyboard. I'm not using it to compose THIS message, though - this is on a fully size keyboard with a toddler who is refusing to sleep climbing all over me (so my eyes have been off the screen repeatedly).

    On a full size computer keyboard, I type well over 100wpm. On my Slide, I can go around 60 easily. I composed much of my first novel on my Blackberry Flip and edited it on my Slide. I compose 5000 word scenes on the Slide with some regularity (often while at various entertainment venues with my kids - I can get out quite a few bits while waiting for them to go on a ride at an amusement park with their dad). My husband has a Samsung S5 and has offered it to me when I've expressed frustration with how much better the camera on his phone is, but I have just taken to carrying a point-and-shoot around with me instead of sacrificing the much more important functionality of using the phone as a communication device for the sake of a better camera built-in. The few times I've tried to write anything on his phone, such as a grocery shopping list, I have uttered many words that we do not like the children to repeat, at high volume. I hate typing on it. None of the bluetooth keyboards that can go on a phone or reasonably be carried with a phone are tollerable (the keys are all stacked in straight collumns instead of staggered like bricks the way they are on the Android sliders and computer keyboards - I don't have enough experience with BB keyboards anymore to remember how they're stacked but that's a tota dealbreaker for me, I will not hit the A key properly if they're not staggered and I use that key a LOT).

    Oh, and I challenge any of you speech-to-text fans to use that around four kids between toddlerhood and tween years. You think damnyouautocorrect.com is entertaining? Oy. Toddlers and preschoolers (and adolescents) generally can not get the concept of Mom talking and it not being a conversation with THEM.

    Generally speaking (and this is very much a generalization, not aimed at anyone specific and there are exclusions on each side), my observation is that PKB-preferers are more likely to be makers - creators of content. VKB-preferers are consumers (I won't go so far as to say leeches, will I? Nah... ) of that content, who generally have a preference for form over function. Apple marketed the hell out of iPhones, it's been The Device To Have for a long time, and Jobs decided early on that he didn't want a PKB mucking up the sleekness of his form. All the iPhone Acolytes bowed down and threw money at those things... I consider them toys (in fact, I got an iPod Touch free for opening a bank account a few years back and it was a toddler toy within a month, the only app on it that didn't come with it that is intended for over the age of 5 is an ebook reader app) .

    I have nothing against folks who prefer to consume on their devices instead of creating. Authors need readers. Just please stop trying to force everyone into the same damn touchscreen only box. I already "lug" around a folding bluetooth keyboard for my tablet so I don't have to carry my laptop or kill my phone battery if I'm going to be out doing a lot of writing (the keyboard is an old Stowaway - I had one when I used a Palm Pilot back in the early days of the 21st century and composed stories on that, then picked up the bluetooth one on eBay when I got my first Android tablet). That needs a flat surface to write. I steal minutes to get my writing done, and only have a flat surface available maybe 25% of the time that I have available to write (school pickup line being one of my most frequent writing times). If it wasn't for my phone having a PKB, I'd get MUCH less writing done than I do. And that would REALLY **** me off.
    Why do PKB users think all PKB users crank out proper sentences and don't use abbreviations. I can easily estimate 2/3 of BlackBerry PKB users are in developing nations. I popped by a busy bus station in Manila and saw bunch of BB PKBs. Those dudes were not sending poetic messages with complete sentences. Hardly.
    07-19-15 10:25 AM
  4. scubafan's Avatar
    I think some of the people that think a real keyboard is useless and old school at best, and users are dinosaurs who can't adapt are missing a key point! I can hit speed dial keys or send a "K" in response to a text without ever needing to see the board. You can't use a virtual keyboard by touch.

    So I can place a call reasonably safely on the highway without taking my eyes off of the road. Worth it for that alone for me. YMMV

    Posted via CB10
    DragonMama likes this.
    07-19-15 03:19 PM
  5. Tre Lawrence's Avatar
    I think some of the people that think a real keyboard is useless and old school at best, and users are dinosaurs who can't adapt are missing a key point! I can hit speed dial keys or send a "K" in response to a text without ever needing to see the board. You can't use a virtual keyboard by touch.

    So I can place a call reasonably safely on the highway without taking my eyes off of the road. Worth it for that alone for me. YMMV

    Posted via CB10
    It could be argued that it's safer not to take your hands off the wheel either, but you make a valid point.
    07-19-15 03:51 PM
  6. donnation's Avatar
    I might just go back to T9 texting on a flip phone like back in the day. I always used to laugh when texting started to become popular and most everyone still had flip phones. Those that didn't know about T9 were always amazed at how quick a response they could get to their text.
    07-19-15 04:44 PM
  7. DragonMama's Avatar
    I cannot speak for anything going on in developing nations, I am a "typical American" in that I am monolingual (at least in writing - I am fluent in American Sign Language as a second language) and I've never been off the North American continent. It is quite likely that the folks in Manilla who have PKBs have them because they were sent there as surplus after not selling well in the US, so they have them not out of preference for PKBs but because that's what is readily available.

    Also, as much of a PKB lover as I am, I won't get a device that has the PKB constantly exposed due to not wanting to pocket-type. That's why the only BB I ever had was the Flip. What I'd REALLY love to see is an Android device modeled off the old Sony Clie (which I have also owned since sometime before my first child was born so more than 11 years, forget when I got it). Preferably with the flip-and-rotate mechanism on the long side instead of the short side (I much prefer composing text in landscape mode instead of portrait mode, another reason that BBs haven't been really appealing to me - and the app store anemia has also been a major drawback but that has been secondary to phone form issues of disliking the constantly-exposed PKB and forced-portrait orientation/small screen). The Clie also had the camera lens protected (it is on the hinge and can be rotated so that the lens is protected). I loved being able to essentially turn it into a flip-phone formfactor so the keyboard and screen were BOTH protected when in pocket/purse, then be able to rotate the keyboard so the keys weren't getting pressed if I was using the device as an ebook reader and not taking significant notes on what I was reading, then flip and rotate it back out if I was going to write more than a few words. Oh, and it had a stylis holder built-in, too. The form factor wasn't horrible to deal with at all. I think I know where I have mine stowed, maybe I should pull it out and take some pictures of it next to my husband's S5 so folks can get a sense of scale on the thing? I suspect a lot of the current product designers never even knew the Clie existed. It ran Palm OS for those who have no idea what I'm talking about, and was not a phone, just a PDA that could do pretty much all the "smart" functions I currently use my smartphone to do (other than communicate - and like I said, I don't play games on my phone).

    Really, what I'd be THRILLED if BB started doing, if they figure out that being in the phone-manufacturing business is just not sustainable for them, is make after-market PKB add-ons that can snap into a phone case. They could probably essentially 3D print phone cases with space for the keyboard to snap in, and sell the cases just like all the other 3rd party case sellers do. ThinkGeek has been selling (crappy straight-stacked) iPhone PKB cases for ages, surely BB could do better in keyboard layout than anything currently on the market. PKB layout was something they rocked early on, and perhaps they could come up with some way to make it more secure than the bluetooth keyboard issues already mentioned. Heck, folks might be interested in buying the mini PKBs for their home entertainment systems, which would broaden their market while potentially satisfying the wants of all of us PKB lovers without locking us into an otherwise-lacking device that does not sell well. And if the keyboards were modular in a holder that attaches to the phone, that would also get around the multiple languages issue. Surely such a device could be made to not be much bigger than a business card holder (maybe a little larger just to give more space for the keys as larger keys decrease errors). If it could somehow be combined with an Otterbox type protective phone case, I'd be ALL over that. I am way too klutzy for the wafer-thin phones on the market anyway.
    07-19-15 07:43 PM
  8. DragonMama's Avatar
    I didn't send text messages until I had my BB Flip... I've been a touchtypist so long that I actually can't think alphabetically when I'm typing, even back before I was 30 I couldn't remember which letters were on which number without thinking about it constantly. The fact that the numbers on a phone are also flipped vertically compared to the numbers on a computer keyboard really didn't help matters for folks like me!
    07-19-15 07:47 PM
  9. Prem WatsApp's Avatar
    I still have this.

    Screen is broken (workmate accidentally drove over it when it fell out out my pocket) :-(


    Why do reviewers believe a physical keyboard is 'old school'?-img_20150720_105134.jpg

    Why do reviewers believe a physical keyboard is 'old school'?-img_20150720_105128.jpg
    Why do reviewers believe a physical keyboard is 'old school'?-img_20150720_105059.jpg

    An now, look at this...

    Why do reviewers believe a physical keyboard is 'old school'?-img_20150720_105119.jpg

    Amazing form factor. I'd love one a little larger with BB10...

    :-D

      "BB Android Armageddon: Chenisys is uploading in 5,4,3..."  
    Oshasat likes this.
    07-19-15 07:54 PM
  10. Oshasat's Avatar

    (snip)

    Generally speaking (and this is very much a generalization, not aimed at anyone specific and there are exclusions on each side), my observation is that PKB-preferers are more likely to be makers - creators of content. VKB-preferers are consumers (I won't go so far as to say leeches, will I? Nah... ) of that content, who generally have a preference for form over function. Apple marketed the hell out of iPhones, it's been The Device To Have for a long time, and Jobs decided early on that he didn't want a PKB mucking up the sleekness of his form. All the iPhone Acolytes bowed down and threw money at those things... I consider them toys (in fact, I got an iPod Touch free for opening a bank account a few years back and it was a toddler toy within a month, the only app on it that didn't come with it that is intended for over the age of 5 is an ebook reader app) .

    I have nothing against folks who prefer to consume on their devices instead of creating. Authors need readers. Just please stop trying to force everyone into the same damn touchscreen only box. I already "lug" around a folding bluetooth keyboard for my tablet so I don't have to carry my laptop or kill my phone battery if I'm going to be out doing a lot of writing (the keyboard is an old Stowaway - I had one when I used a Palm Pilot back in the early days of the 21st century and composed stories on that, then picked up the bluetooth one on eBay when I got my first Android tablet). That needs a flat surface to write. I steal minutes to get my writing done, and only have a flat surface available maybe 25% of the time that I have available to write (school pickup line being one of my most frequent writing times). If it wasn't for my phone having a PKB, I'd get MUCH less writing done than I do. And that would REALLY **** me off.
    Nicely said. I also wonder whether the divide between PKB users and the rest is essentially the difference between active ("content creators") and passive consumer-types. Before anyone gets their nose out of joint, let me quickly add that the relationship between the two is one of symbiosis and interdependence. One cannot function without the other. I'm walking away from any comments about "leeches" - - and fast.

    That the iPhone changed the way we use phones goes without saying; they replaced TVs, computers, Blu-ray players, radios, video game consoles, cameras, flashlights, calculators, and so on. What they haven't done, and still don't do well, is replace the word-processor.

    I typed this on a 7-inch tablet and it's a pain AND painstakingly slow.

    Posted via the CrackBerry App for Android
    07-20-15 12:07 AM
  11. RH1Pearl's Avatar
    I straddle the age gaps (I'm 38 but I've been "online" longer than almost all of my peers, having been on BBSes back in the mid-1990s when I was a teen).

    The abbreviations you reference are actually significantly older than social cell phone use. Those were in use back when the only mobile devices with text capabilities were alphanumeric pagers - which, by the by, you have Deaf folks to thank for the spread of mobile tech outside of business uses. And that's also a market segment that is NOT well-served by speech-to-text as they often have significant speech impediments.

    Yes, there's a learning curve switching from anything to anything else. However, I've been a touchtypist for more than half my life (yes, I was a touchtypist at 16 - thanks to the aforementioned BBS time, I learned to touch type because I turned off the lights in the room so my mother wouldn't know I was still awake). I got my first cell phone in 1999, a Nokia somethingorother... Then I got a Motorola flip something when I had my first kid and really wanted to keep the keys from getting pressed by his foot jabbing my hip. I think that might have had a camera, too. That was replaced by a Blackberry Flip, which was replaced by a MyTouch 4g Slide four years ago and I am STILL using that phone (after rooting it and getting a semi-recent version of Android running on it, I think JellyBean - as long as the productivity apps I run on it work I don't care if I have the latest and greatest, I don't play games on my phone). I suspect it is a shared trait particular to fluent touchtypists, that I cannot do swipe typing - I am nearly blind to the letters on the left side of the keyboard/screen when I'm only using my right finger, and vice versa. I can actually touchtype on my 4g Slide, when I'm typing on it with dual thumbs I can look up from the entire device (usually to see what my kids are getting up to) and keep typing with more accuracy than many have on a virtual keyboard. I'm not using it to compose THIS message, though - this is on a fully size keyboard with a toddler who is refusing to sleep climbing all over me (so my eyes have been off the screen repeatedly).

    On a full size computer keyboard, I type well over 100wpm. On my Slide, I can go around 60 easily. I composed much of my first novel on my Blackberry Flip and edited it on my Slide. I compose 5000 word scenes on the Slide with some regularity (often while at various entertainment venues with my kids - I can get out quite a few bits while waiting for them to go on a ride at an amusement park with their dad). My husband has a Samsung S5 and has offered it to me when I've expressed frustration with how much better the camera on his phone is, but I have just taken to carrying a point-and-shoot around with me instead of sacrificing the much more important functionality of using the phone as a communication device for the sake of a better camera built-in. The few times I've tried to write anything on his phone, such as a grocery shopping list, I have uttered many words that we do not like the children to repeat, at high volume. I hate typing on it. None of the bluetooth keyboards that can go on a phone or reasonably be carried with a phone are tollerable (the keys are all stacked in straight collumns instead of staggered like bricks the way they are on the Android sliders and computer keyboards - I don't have enough experience with BB keyboards anymore to remember how they're stacked but that's a tota dealbreaker for me, I will not hit the A key properly if they're not staggered and I use that key a LOT).

    Oh, and I challenge any of you speech-to-text fans to use that around four kids between toddlerhood and tween years. You think damnyouautocorrect.com is entertaining? Oy. Toddlers and preschoolers (and adolescents) generally can not get the concept of Mom talking and it not being a conversation with THEM.

    Generally speaking (and this is very much a generalization, not aimed at anyone specific and there are exclusions on each side), my observation is that PKB-preferers are more likely to be makers - creators of content. VKB-preferers are consumers (I won't go so far as to say leeches, will I? Nah... ) of that content, who generally have a preference for form over function. Apple marketed the hell out of iPhones, it's been The Device To Have for a long time, and Jobs decided early on that he didn't want a PKB mucking up the sleekness of his form. All the iPhone Acolytes bowed down and threw money at those things... I consider them toys (in fact, I got an iPod Touch free for opening a bank account a few years back and it was a toddler toy within a month, the only app on it that didn't come with it that is intended for over the age of 5 is an ebook reader app) .

    I have nothing against folks who prefer to consume on their devices instead of creating. Authors need readers. Just please stop trying to force everyone into the same damn touchscreen only box. I already "lug" around a folding bluetooth keyboard for my tablet so I don't have to carry my laptop or kill my phone battery if I'm going to be out doing a lot of writing (the keyboard is an old Stowaway - I had one when I used a Palm Pilot back in the early days of the 21st century and composed stories on that, then picked up the bluetooth one on eBay when I got my first Android tablet). That needs a flat surface to write. I steal minutes to get my writing done, and only have a flat surface available maybe 25% of the time that I have available to write (school pickup line being one of my most frequent writing times). If it wasn't for my phone having a PKB, I'd get MUCH less writing done than I do. And that would REALLY **** me off.
    60 WPM on a PKB phone is totally false. It takes 1 second to press a key. Even if you're typing 1 letter words, you still have to add spaces and commas. Pressing a single key already takes 1 second. A word with spaces would be an average of 5 characters. That's 300 keystrokes to get to 60 WPM. You're telling us you can press a key 1/10 of a second?
    07-20-15 04:16 AM
  12. ALToronto's Avatar
    60 WPM on a PKB phone is totally false. It takes 1 second to press a key. Even if you're typing 1 letter words, you still have to add spaces and commas. Pressing a single key already takes 1 second. A word with spaces would be an average of 5 characters. That's 300 keystrokes to get to 60 WPM. You're telling us you can press a key 1/10 of a second?
    It takes far less than a full second for a key press. On a Passport, a swipe takes a fraction of a second, and a standard 'word' is 5 characters, spaces and commas included. So 1/5 of a second per character is realistic for an ordinary pkb, and on a Passport that has been 'taught' your style of writing, you could feasibly go higher than 60 wpm.

    Posted via CB10 from my awesome Passport
    solitude1984 and clickitykeys like this.
    07-20-15 07:40 AM
  13. ALToronto's Avatar
    ...snip...

    Also, as much of a PKB lover as I am, I won't get a device that has the PKB constantly exposed due to not wanting to pocket-type. That's why the only BB I ever had was the Flip. What I'd REALLY love to see is an Android device modeled off the old Sony Clie (which I have also owned since sometime before my first child was born so more than 11 years, forget when I got it). Preferably with the flip-and-rotate mechanism on the long side instead of the short side (I much prefer composing text in landscape mode instead of portrait mode, another reason that BBs haven't been really appealing to me - and the app store anemia has also been a major drawback but that has been secondary to phone form issues of disliking the constantly-exposed PKB and forced-portrait orientation/small screen). The Clie also had the camera lens protected (it is on the hinge and can be rotated so that the lens is protected). I loved being able to essentially turn it into a flip-phone formfactor so the keyboard and screen were BOTH protected when in pocket/purse, then be able to rotate the keyboard so the keys weren't getting pressed if I was using the device as an ebook reader and not taking significant notes on what I was reading, then flip and rotate it back out if I was going to write more than a few words. Oh, and it had a stylis holder built-in, too. The form factor wasn't horrible to deal with at all. I think I know where I have mine stowed, maybe I should pull it out and take some pictures of it next to my husband's S5 so folks can get a sense of scale on the thing? I suspect a lot of the current product designers never even knew the Clie existed. It ran Palm OS for those who have no idea what I'm talking about, and was not a phone, just a PDA that could do pretty much all the "smart" functions I currently use my smartphone to do (other than communicate - and like I said, I don't play games on my phone).

    Really, what I'd be THRILLED if BB started doing, if they figure out that being in the phone-manufacturing business is just not sustainable for them, is make after-market PKB add-ons that can snap into a phone case. They could probably essentially 3D print phone cases with space for the keyboard to snap in, and sell the cases just like all the other 3rd party case sellers do. ThinkGeek has been selling (crappy straight-stacked) iPhone PKB cases for ages, surely BB could do better in keyboard layout than anything currently on the market. PKB layout was something they rocked early on, and perhaps they could come up with some way to make it more secure than the bluetooth keyboard issues already mentioned. Heck, folks might be interested in buying the mini PKBs for their home entertainment systems, which would broaden their market while potentially satisfying the wants of all of us PKB lovers without locking us into an otherwise-lacking device that does not sell well. And if the keyboards were modular in a holder that attaches to the phone, that would also get around the multiple languages issue. Surely such a device could be made to not be much bigger than a business card holder (maybe a little larger just to give more space for the keys as larger keys decrease errors). If it could somehow be combined with an Otterbox type protective phone case, I'd be ALL over that. I am way too klutzy for the wafer-thin phones on the market anyway.
    You do realize that you can set a pkb phone to auto-lock and not respond to random key presses. Even an emergency call takes two key presses, which are unlikely to occur in sequence inside a pocket. One thing I hated about my Palm Treo was one-touch emergency dialing, even when the kb was locked (it was the first touchscreen phone). Someone at Palm thought it was a great idea to just tap on a (fairly large) area on the screen to call 911. I was very happy to switch to the Bold 9000, which put the extra step into emergency calling.

    As for making pkb shells for other makers' phones, forget about it. It's so far beneath BlackBerry, they'd sooner sell themselves off patent by patent.


    Posted via CB10 from my awesome Passport
    07-20-15 07:50 AM
  14. RH1Pearl's Avatar
    It takes far less than a full second for a key press. On a Passport, a swipe takes a fraction of a second, and a standard 'word' is 5 characters, spaces and commas included. So 1/5 of a second per character is realistic for an ordinary pkb, and on a Passport that has been 'taught' your style of writing, you could feasibly go higher than 60 wpm.

    Posted via CB10 from my awesome Passport
    I'm sorry but it's not physically possible. A PC keyboard can reach 120 WPM because there are 8 fingers and 2 thumbs. Two thumb typing and not make a mistake and reach 60 WPM is simply bogus because there are full stops and commas and some words are 7 to 10 letters long. If that user can reach 60 WPM on a PKB, then realistically he should do 300 WPM on a PC keyboard since he's using 2 full hands as opposed to two thumbs. There is no such person in this world that can do 200 to 300 WPM. It's simply not possible unless you change the layout of the keyboard.
    07-20-15 08:46 AM
  15. CTU2fan's Avatar
    I'm sorry but it's not physically possible. A PC keyboard can reach 120 WPM because there are 8 fingers and 2 thumbs. Two thumb typing and not make a mistake and reach 60 WPM is simply bogus because there are full stops and commas and some words are 7 to 10 letters long. If that user can reach 60 WPM on a PKB, then realistically he should do 300 WPM on a PC keyboard since he's using 2 full hands as opposed to two thumbs. There is no such person in this world that can do 200 to 300 WPM. It's simply not possible unless you change the layout of the keyboard.
    As has already been stated, when calculating WPM the count isn't based on literal words, so you're not going to get a higher word count if you're typing something with a bunch of the's and an's and such. It's strictly based on characters. So 60WPM is really 300 characters per minute, regardless how many actual words you type.

    Personally I don't do 60WPM on my Q, but considering how fast I can type and allowing for the use of predictive typing as well as an extensive personal dictionary I don't see why it would be impossible. Improbable maybe, but no more improbable than say VKB folks claiming they can both type and word-flick without looking at the keyboard, and that's been claimed and accepted in here already.

    Posted via CB10
    07-20-15 09:47 AM
  16. RH1Pearl's Avatar
    As has already been stated, when calculating WPM the count isn't based on literal words, so you're not going to get a higher word count if you're typing something with a bunch of the's and an's and such. It's strictly based on characters. So 60WPM is really 300 characters per minute, regardless how many actual words you type.

    Personally I don't do 60WPM on my Q, but considering how fast I can type and allowing for the use of predictive typing as well as an extensive personal dictionary I don't see why it would be impossible. Improbable maybe, but no more improbable than say VKB folks claiming they can both type and word-flick without looking at the keyboard, and that's been claimed and accepted in here already.

    Posted via CB10
    Then refer to it as CPM then. Even then, 300 CPM is farfetched unless you're' just typing a bunch of mumbo jumbo or the same characters over and over
    07-20-15 11:09 AM
  17. 21stNow's Avatar
    Then refer to it as CPM then. Even then, 300 CPM is farfetched unless you're' just typing a bunch of mumbo jumbo or the same characters over and over
    CTU2Fan's calculation of WPM is the standard calculation of typing speed, at least in the US. No one person can dictate a change in this anymore than one can dictate a change in the air temperature scale.
    07-20-15 01:50 PM
  18. 21stNow's Avatar
    I suspect it is a shared trait particular to fluent touchtypists, that I cannot do swipe typing - I am nearly blind to the letters on the left side of the keyboard/screen when I'm only using my right finger, and vice versa.
    I am a fluent typist and prefer the word tracing method for text input. It matches my typing style because I think in terms of words, not in terms of letters. Word tracing allows me to use one finger to input a word rather than two thumbs to input a series of letters. As far as typing on a computer keyboard, my mind has the letters matched to one of eight fingers. Remapping those same letters in the same layout to only two thumbs doesn't work for me.

    Oh, and I challenge any of you speech-to-text fans to use that around four kids between toddlerhood and tween years. You think damnyouautocorrect.com is entertaining? Oy. Toddlers and preschoolers (and adolescents) generally can not get the concept of Mom talking and it not being a conversation with THEM.
    I have nothing against using speech-to-text as an input method, but don't use it often. But, I have no reason to try your challenge as this is not a situation that would occur in my everyday life, so I would never select or reject a keyboard based on that situation.
    07-20-15 02:01 PM
  19. RH1Pearl's Avatar
    CTU2Fan's calculation of WPM is the standard calculation of typing speed, at least in the US. No one person can dictate a change in this anymore than one can dictate a change in the air temperature scale.
    I beg to differ. I've taken a typing course and test so I know how WPM is tested.
    07-20-15 02:01 PM
  20. 21stNow's Avatar
    I beg to differ. I've taken a typing course and test so I know how WPM is tested.
    I'm genuinely curious. My typing courses never offered any other definition of WPM and I can't find another definition online. Do you have a source that shows that there is a different method of calculating WPM?

    How to Calculate Typing Speed (WPM) and Accuracy

    I also copied this definition from another website:

    "What are CPM and WPM?

    Characters per minute, and words per minute. The "raw CPM" is the actual number of characters you type per minute, including all the mistakes. The "corrected" scores count only the correctly typed words. "WPM" is just the corrected CPM divided by 5. That's a de facto international standard" (emphasis mine).

    Online Typing Test - CPM, WPM and percentile
    07-20-15 02:15 PM
  21. Bbnivende's Avatar
    Is this old school or older school talk.

    Posted via CB10
    07-20-15 02:33 PM
  22. Prem WatsApp's Avatar
    Is this old school or older school talk.

    Posted via CB10
    We're back to the typewriter age... ;-)

      "BB Android Armageddon: Chenisys is uploading in 5,4,3..."  
    07-20-15 03:37 PM
  23. southlander's Avatar
    I'm sorry but it's not physically possible. A PC keyboard can reach 120 WPM because there are 8 fingers and 2 thumbs. Two thumb typing and not make a mistake and reach 60 WPM is simply bogus because there are full stops and commas and some words are 7 to 10 letters long. If that user can reach 60 WPM on a PKB, then realistically he should do 300 WPM on a PC keyboard since he's using 2 full hands as opposed to two thumbs. There is no such person in this world that can do 200 to 300 WPM. It's simply not possible unless you change the layout of the keyboard.


    Posted via the CrackBerry App for Android
    clickitykeys likes this.
    07-21-15 01:38 AM
  24. clickitykeys's Avatar
    It takes 1 second to press a key. Even if you're typing 1 letter words, you still have to add spaces and commas. Pressing a single key already takes 1 second.
    This is a weird assertion and completely contrary to experience. It doesn't take 1 second per key press, especially when two thumbs interleave the key presses. Either your sense of time is too fast, or your speed of typing is too slow :-).

    Q10/10.3.2
    07-21-15 02:28 AM
  25. JakeOfMaple's Avatar
    My physical keyboard allows me to type without even looking, not old school, simply superior.
    07-25-15 01:47 PM
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