08-01-16 08:32 PM
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  1. JeepBB's Avatar
    It's not dead, if we find a way to remember it.
    If you need to find a way to remember BB10... then BB10 is most definitely dead!

    If BB10 were "alive", you would surely be able to go to a carrier store and buy a recently released BB10 phone. Can you do that?

    It's very simple. Remembrance is something people do for the fondly remembered dead!

    BB10 is dead.
    DrBoomBotz likes this.
    07-09-16 04:45 PM
  2. dcal1701's Avatar
    If you need to find a way to remember BB10... then BB10 is most definitely dead!

    If BB10 were "alive", you would surely be able to go to a carrier store and buy a recently released BB10 phone. Can you do that?

    It's very simple. Remembrance is something people do for the fondly remembered dead!

    BB10 is dead.
    I was making a tongue in cheek joke referring to spock after wrath of Khan but yeah nevermind, my bb10 seems to be alive at least at this point, mind I could fire up my old curve 8900 and that would probably be functioning to some degree so :-/

    Posted via CB10
    07-09-16 04:49 PM
  3. JeepBB's Avatar
    I was making a tongue in cheek joke referring to spock after wrath of Khan but yeah nevermind, my bb10 seems to be alive at least at this point, mind I could fire up my old curve 8900 and that would probably be functioning to some degree so :-/
    Too late here for me to get the Star Trek reference, sorry.

    My old HP iPAQ running WinCE also runs, much to my astonishment, when I tried it the other day.

    WinCE is also dead.
    07-09-16 04:53 PM
  4. Alloyjane's Avatar
    BB10 didn't die. It was murdered! Arrogance, stupidity, and overall cluelessness are the guilty parties.

    I can't even begin to explain how useful my Passport is. Such a crime, what they've done to this wonderful platform.

    I was looking for a bluetooth keyboard for my tablet and holy crap! The complaints about virtual keyboards. If BlackBerry had any brains, they would've marketed to that crowd, not just the loyalists, the techies, and the business types.

    If they had brains, they would also build their own bluetooth keyboard and an attachable keyboard like the one they sued Ryan Seacrest for. They would also do a real marketing campaign and work with known celebrities who use their devices to be productive in order to make sure their products are current and meeting the needs of the modern consumer.

    It doesn't take psychic powers to figure out what people want.
    tabish4u likes this.
    07-09-16 06:18 PM
  5. idssteve's Avatar
    In the USA. BlackBerry went from its peak of popularity down to almost as low in popularity as it now - all in one year - 2012. (Per Google Trends) . No new products and the unpopularity of PKB phones.
    Well, according to statistia, sales peaked at 51.1M in 2011, 32.3M in 2012 and 19.3M in 2013 ... After ZQ intro... If the dreaded pkb were THE root of ALL troubles, the Z10 should have improved sales rather than hurt. Obviously, things weren't quite so simple.

    Stupidly announcing BBOS obsolescence in Fall of 2011, just a couple months after 9900 intro, didn't help. Throw in Verizon's front line sales floor animosity still stinging from Storm returns. Lack of 4G and no new devices, and it's little wonder sales were slipping in 2012. Pkb, or not. Sales tanked in 2013.

    BB10 (the OP's subject) obviously wasn't "Apple" enough to attract significant Apple-Droid consumers. Toolbelt-less Q10 wasn't "BlackBerry" enough to attract legacy users. Such is the risk of "safe" compromised solutions.

    Without a compelling upgrade path, 10s of millions of legacy users were stranded. That might've been ok if 10s of millions of Apple users ran to grab up Z10s. That didn't happen. BB10.0 was a flop because it didn't appeal to enough Apple-droid consumers nor enough BB legacy users. Had it been released with 10.3.2, bb10 might have stood a chance at eventually attracting enough legacy migration to approach app critical mass without Apple's consumers. Maybe.

    They STILL need to find a way around the "carrier barrier" on Verizon's sales floor, imo. Way too many times folks I know, including myself, return from Verizon stores having been told BB is slow, obsolete, and going out of business... Droid is THE future, according to them. My experience with that messaging dates back to 2010, at least.
    tabish4u and keliew like this.
    07-09-16 09:27 PM
  6. Bbnivende's Avatar
    Well, according to statistia, sales peaked at 51.1M in 2011, 32.3M in 2012 and 19.3M in 2013 ... After ZQ intro... If the dreaded pkb were THE root of ALL troubles, the Z10 should have improved sales rather than hurt. Obviously, things weren't quite so simple.

    Stupidly announcing BBOS obsolescence in Fall of 2011, just a couple months after 9900 intro, didn't help. Throw in Verizon's front line sales floor animosity still stinging from Storm returns. Lack of 4G and no new devices, and it's little wonder sales were slipping in 2012. Pkb, or not. Sales tanked in 2013.

    BB10 (the OP's subject) obviously wasn't "Apple" enough to attract significant Apple-Droid consumers. Toolbelt-less Q10 wasn't "BlackBerry" enough to attract legacy users. Such is the risk of "safe" compromised solutions.

    Without a compelling upgrade path, 10s of millions of legacy users were stranded. That might've been ok if 10s of millions of Apple users ran to grab up Z10s. That didn't happen. BB10.0 was a flop because it didn't appeal to enough Apple-droid consumers nor enough BB legacy users. Had it been released with 10.3.2, bb10 might have stood a chance at eventually attracting enough legacy migration to approach app critical mass without Apple's consumers. Maybe.

    They STILL need to find a way around the "carrier barrier" on Verizon's sales floor, imo. Way too many times folks I know, including myself, return from Verizon stores having been told BB is slow, obsolete, and going out of business... Droid is THE future, according to them. My experience with that messaging dates back to 2010, at least.
    The USA was ahead of the curve. In 2012 they were still selling BBOS devices in the UK, Nigeria, Indonesia, South Africa. The infrastructure in some markets suited BBOS phones. BBM and BIS kept them in the game and there were business phone replacements the USA.

    By the end of 2011, BlackBerry stock had lost 75 percent of its value.

    I think there was a time that a "forked Android" like the BlackBerry 10 could have succeeded . Their Playbook experience should have informed them that native apps were going to be DOA.



    It does not really matter now. All that matters is that these three new phones sell well enough to keep the handset division going. Is there a market for a full time PKB?

    Sure, but I would expect less than a million sold per quarter from that one device. It will sell better than the PRIV.

    Posted via CB10
    Last edited by Bbnivende; 07-10-16 at 01:18 AM.
    Avenzuno likes this.
    07-10-16 12:42 AM
  7. tabish4u's Avatar
    There are many people who say apps were d issue, not many dev inclined for it. yes that was d case, it was obvious, proper planning was required which they missed.
    ios is fav plateform for developers still, but did anyone in bb thought how they did and still doing it? ios 10 still 4 months but dev have time to go through and repackage their apps in advance and you guys are introducing a whole new half backed, yes half baked os and tried to give so much surprise that even dev were surprised.
    ios is 9 year old plateform still apple give them enough time to develop. being so secrative company.
    so lack of decision making and proper planning screwed them. bb10 was delayed for almost a year, let it be one more year but could have launched more refined and put dev on board before hand, previously media craved for angry bird, now we crave for everything.
    bb was pioneer in trackpad, couldnt anyone thought about putting fingerprint scanner like apple did and you would have a diffrentiating os in ur hand. forget touch id you were not been able to even put proper trackpad still in bb10.
    chain13 likes this.
    07-10-16 01:49 AM
  8. chain13's Avatar
    All I want to say has already said by the OP. I can see that any plans blackberry was doing is to make them become the big player again which is hard to accomplish. They should try to bring features that can attract users.

    I just bought a new xiaomi phone and all I can say is they are trying to deliver many features that can make users tied to them. They build ecosystem, has own appstore, theme store, music store, cloud services, payment services etc. Even their own appstore announces me apps update much faster than google play do.

    The last mistake blackberry did was they still targetting corporate market while going full android. It's nonsense, why didnt they targetting all consumer as well?
    tabish4u likes this.
    07-10-16 04:35 AM
  9. keliew's Avatar
    Sure seems like they need to overhaul the marketing aeons ago.

    A good product without a good sales & marketing team would make it a bad product. Sadly.

    BlackBerry Passport via CB10
    MikeX74 likes this.
    07-10-16 05:38 AM
  10. chain13's Avatar
    Sure seems like they need to overhaul the marketing aeons ago.

    A good product without a good sales & marketing team would make it a bad product. Sadly.

    BlackBerry Passport via CB10
    True, but it isn't only about the product, it's about whole ecosystem that make it a good product.
    tabish4u likes this.
    07-10-16 05:47 AM
  11. sorinv's Avatar
    Good read, thanks.

    The fact that Google could spin on a dime in response to the iPhone, and turn what was an obvious BB clone into an iPhone clone; makes MikeL's utter failure to respond to the iPhone for (literally!) years all the more spectacular.
    Google has failed at everything hardware, including smartphones. So your conclusion is not correct.
    07-10-16 05:55 AM
  12. tabish4u's Avatar
    True, but it isn't only about the product, it's about whole ecosystem that make it a good product.
    true, no matter u spill billions in marketing, it wint do nything unless u have things ready for people, stop this marketing hype u dont have apps, features, hardware nd u think an advert will let people buy?
    yes it will attract ppl to know tht its nit theur type phone, thats it. people are informed buyers now.
    tell me how many adverts u sae of one plus and many good companies? did u saw wats app advert?
    i dont buy this advert nd marketing gimmic, you get a good product, it will sell you even have a brandname to make ppl knw ur launches.
    07-10-16 06:34 AM
  13. kvndoom's Avatar
    Since 99.9% of consumers don't want that, I have my doubts it would ever happen.
    99.8! Get yo fax right!

    Passport SE, "The BlockBerry" - Cricket Wireless
    tabish4u likes this.
    07-10-16 06:36 AM
  14. TgeekB's Avatar
    99.8! Get yo fax right!

    Passport SE, "The BlockBerry" - Cricket Wireless
    Thank you for the correction!
    07-10-16 06:51 AM
  15. idssteve's Avatar
    The USA was ahead of the curve. In 2012 they were still selling BBOS devices in the UK, Nigeria, Indonesia, South Africa. The infrastructure in some markets suited BBOS phones. BBM and BIS kept them in the game and there were business phone replacements the USA.

    By the end of 2011, BlackBerry stock had lost 75 percent of its value.

    I think there was a time that a "forked Android" like the BlackBerry 10 could have succeeded . Their Playbook experience should have informed them that native apps were going to be DOA.



    It does not really matter now. All that matters is that these three new phones sell well enough to keep the handset division going. Is there a market for a full time PKB?

    Sure, but I would expect less than a million sold per quarter from that one device. It will sell better than the PRIV.

    Posted via CB10
    Maybe USA market was where Verizon floor staff was maddest?? I really think the influence front line carrier personnel can exercise on the sales floor is generally under appreciated. Especially at consumer level.

    When was the last time you walked into Verizon store and the sales staff actually pointed toward a BlackBerry and said: "try this"...?? 2009, in my case. The Storm.

    June (or July?), 2010, I was driving across multiple states with a crippled phone and stopped at four different Verizon stores in three states seeking a 9650. EVERY single store sales staff recited verbatim "BlackBerry's old. They're going out of business. These Androids are really nice...". !!!! I finished the sentence, the forth time. The kid looked at me funny and volunteered to let me talk to a floor manager who also started reciting the same EXACT line!!

    Talking briefly I quickly learned the animosity over the Storm fiasco was vitriolic! These guys took it personally! I never knew but wondered if those Storm returns impacted some kind of sales commission of some kind?? Idk.

    He eventually dug a 9650 from some private stash and got me going but couldn't part ways without "these androids are really nice... ". !!!
    How many passive consumers would persist to BlackBerry thru THAT firewall?? Little wonder USA sales were slipping at that point. Little wonder BB10 sales never really got thru the "carrier barrier".
    07-10-16 07:23 AM
  16. chain13's Avatar
    true, no matter u spill billions in marketing, it wint do nything unless u have things ready for people, stop this marketing hype u dont have apps, features, hardware nd u think an advert will let people buy?
    yes it will attract ppl to know tht its nit theur type phone, thats it. people are informed buyers now.
    tell me how many adverts u sae of one plus and many good companies? did u saw wats app advert?
    i dont buy this advert nd marketing gimmic, you get a good product, it will sell you even have a brandname to make ppl knw ur launches.
    Like microsoft, they've spilled dollars in marketing and see how lumia is going. They still hard breathing.
    07-10-16 07:24 AM
  17. JeepBB's Avatar
    Google has failed at everything hardware, including smartphones. So your conclusion is not correct.
    LOL

    Google is worth more than Apple again - May. 12, 2016

    IIRC, Google outsources its hardware to others and the Nexus line seems to sell just fine. Google is doing what BlackBerry has started to do, but Google has greater success.

    John Chen would sell his own mother to achieve the "failure" that you ascribe to Google. And MikeL's failure to respond to the iPhone, when Google responded near-instantly, is a matter of historical record that is well-documented in the book "losing the signal".
    07-10-16 07:52 AM
  18. TgeekB's Avatar
    LOL

    Google is worth more than Apple again - May. 12, 2016

    IIRC, Google outsources its hardware to others and the Nexus line seems to sell just fine. Google is doing what BlackBerry has started to do, but Google has greater success.

    John Chen would sell his own mother to achieve the "failure" that you ascribe to Google. And MikeL's failure to respond to the iPhone, when Google responded near-instantly, is a matter of historical record that is well-documented in the book "losing the signal".
    "I don't like them so they're a failure".
    07-10-16 08:04 AM
  19. idssteve's Avatar
    Apple & Google leveraged resources derived from other activities. Maybe BB needed search engine and desktop divisions...?? Lol.
    07-10-16 08:43 AM
  20. jegs2's Avatar
    I believe BB can still change and make a comeback
    ... in the consumer handheld communications department?

    Highly unlikely, at least outside of fiction.
    07-10-16 08:52 AM
  21. Carrtman's Avatar
    BB 10 was too complicated and also ditched features loyal fans liked plus pissed of developers by doing so.

    The future for BB is simple, privacy software and end to end encryption for big companies.

    people can blame Chen all they want but the guy was hired to provide a strategy going forward and not to please some internet hardcore BB 10 people.
    TgeekB likes this.
    07-10-16 09:10 AM
  22. Ronindan's Avatar
    Apple & Google leveraged resources derived from other activities. Maybe BB needed search engine and desktop divisions...?? Lol.
    I guess the subscription revenues from BIS & BES does not count as alternative source of income for BB.
    07-10-16 09:31 AM
  23. idssteve's Avatar
    I guess the subscription revenues from BIS & BES does not count as alternative source of income for BB.
    Orders of magnitude disparity between resources & software experience derived from Google's search engine origins compared with BIS/BES. Pretty pathetic comparison, imo. Similar comparison with Apple's desktop, ipod, etc. Imo.
    07-10-16 09:55 AM
  24. DrBoomBotz's Avatar
    BB 10 was too complicated
    07-10-16 11:28 AM
  25. TgeekB's Avatar
    Apple & Google leveraged resources derived from other activities. Maybe BB needed search engine and desktop divisions...?? Lol.
    It certainly doesn't hurt, does it? Being diversified absolutely helps. Look at Microsoft. They have the luxury to slowly change their handheld division because they are still profitable in other areas. Blackberry had all their eggs in one basket, so to speak.
    07-10-16 11:40 AM
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