[AlexBC]

I am even MORE PISSED that BB10 is delayed to 2013 now... I see all these new devices, specially Nokia 920, and I can't really wait to see *what* is gonna be the next BB device.

It was a HUGE missed opportunity, I mean HUGE! Worse than other delays, worse than Playbook, worse than BB7 delays, worst in their history IMO.

I am sure everyone saw Yahoo scrapping the BB devices, that's very disappointing... even if BB10 for sure would NOT have sold as much iPhone 5 and Galaxy, it would have been very much in the discussions and alternative to iOS/Android dominance, and basically propelling Win8 devices to become the only available alternative.

I STRONGLY BELIEVE, BB10 devices MUST BE unveiled by end of October, EVEN IF, the final device cannot be delivered till 2013. People MUST KNOW what's coming, so could make the decision whether or not to wait for BB10. Nokia did it last week, unveiled the phone, features, hands-on, but not releasing it till November, even no pricing... so they are part of the discussion and some iPhone buyers *might* pause to see how's the 920 in real life!

As for me, I am up for upgrade (at work) in November, IF nothing is known about BB10 by then, such as look and feel, screen, camera, other specs, some basic features, Apps, etc... I will be upgrading to Nokia 920 as it is IMO the BEST Smartphone in the market.

Any thoughts?

[hpjrt]

Um, this has been discussed to death and regardless of what you think is imperative, RIM is not going to rush BB10 out at the end of October.

There have been "leaks" and lots of discussion regarding what will be included in BB10 - pictures of the devices even.

BBJam is scheduled to begin next week and we should hear more stuff then as well.

But you know, if you can't wait ... if you feel that the 920 is the very best device on the market ... go for it! Be happy! Put an end to your frustration in your wait for BB10.

Personally I'm waiting for BB10 ... but that's just me.

[AlexBC]

I NEVER said they need to rush BB10, absolutely not, BUT we need to know a bit more about what it is, what are the specs, some specifics to incentivize the wait. 920 isn't out yet, but was unveiled on Sep. 5 for most likely Nov. release... so if BB10 is to be released in Jan, unveil some details in Nov. latest!

If by November they don't tell anyone nothing, it'd be devastating. Most non-hard core, and non Crackberry folks are not even AWARE that BB10 is coming... If they do, then they say, ok... Lumia 920 is awesome, iPhone 5 is out, Galaxy3 is here... but BB10 is cool in X, Y, Z and I'd wait. If there's no clue, then not worth the wait and they miss a huge group of upgrades, including me.

[calicocat2010]

Again read through the other millions of threads on the Same topic.

It doesn't matter what You say, RIM will show it when it's READY, and Thorsten has said that it's Not.

They Have to keep things secret, plus it's still Months early to reveal anything, so chill!

Just wait for BB Jam Americas next week.

[AlexBC]

Oh well... I might just get the Lumia... really sucks as I can't live without BBM, but Wireless charging, Pureview, amazing screen, and gorgous colors are too hard to pass without knowing how BB10 looks like/works!

[Thunderbuck]

Alex, the trouble is that RIM has a serious credibility issue with a lot of the tech-buying public.

Previewing now when the product won't be available until Feb-March just gives all the Apple fanbois over at BGR the chance to point and laugh. "Sure... 'coming soon'... right... LOL... we've never heard THAT from RIM before..." would be the typical reaction.

If RIM hadn't squandered its reputation by blowing by countless release targets, maybe they COULD get away with announcing early, but they can't do it now.

BTW, I don't know if you noticed, but Nokia's early announcement didn't exactly go without a hitch. It was rushed, came off as looking like a desperate attempt to preempt Apple (a dumb idea in itself), and they had to fake some of their sample photos/videos.

Announcing early isn't always a good idea.

[GTiLeo]

whats so bad about waiting? the 9900 can't hold you over for a few more months? i'm waiting, i don't want to wait but i am and my 9900 is just fine till the L series is released

[calicocat2010]

I'm waiting even though my 9900's device is low on memory because I use almost all of my apps and customize it to where I can go a full day.

Be So glad when those Freezes and Restarts are gone!

[GTiLeo]

i don't have freezign problems and i haven't restarted since my last app removal.

honestly i have a few apps installed and i keep telling my dad to get rid of his weather network app which is total crap for the 9900, once i removed it everythign ran smooth as butter

[Clinto]

@AlexBC I could not agree with you more. I am so ticked off right now I don't know what to do... I'm an obsessive compulsive perfectionist, so I chose the beautiful and near perfect Bold 9900. But I am so done with the 1/2 screen.

As much as I love my BB keyboard I am this close (imagine my fingers being really close together) to dropping it and going for the awesome Nokia 920 in Black or Gunmetal. And... after we get the 920 we can easily "flow" our stuff from our laptops to our new Surface Tablet then our WP8 phone.. Perfection right???

I am not so sure about the WP8 experience... Why??? Because their STUPID TILE SYSTEM IS THE HOME SCREEN. WTF is up that?? There is literally no clean home screen. And as a perfectionist, I demand cleanliness and perfect orginization. And the WP8 Platform only has a ridiculous cluttered home screen. I am very afraid if I had to look at that messy homescreen every day... That pretty little 920 would be smashed into the pavement one day.. Along with it's equally unorganized messy Surface Tablet brother.

And.. The windows phone doesn't even have a lighting up led notification light. My current Bold has the "Advance OS" custom led light app, a different color for my different contacts so I know who is texting or emailing without even picking it up. Freaking Perfection!

So be forwarned.. friend... In my humble opinion the grass may not be greener on the other side...

As ugly as the new BB 10 London is and as much as it looks like an old Droid X... And... as long as it's taking to get to market.... Yes.. I am still going to hold out for the London and love it's new awesome "flowing UI", one handed usage, awesome camera, dual core goodness, clean home screen layout and of course it's top of the world, superior notification system.

I still will hate it's cheapened look, but yes.. I will hold on, stay the course and wait for the superior BB10 user experience.

And you may want to hold out for BB10 too... Not to mention RIM should be releasing their 10" Tablet to integrate with BB10 phones too.. Should be exciting..

[iankeiththomas]

That strikes me as an odd complaint regarding the Windows home screen. Given that it's quite customizable, and that live tiles can display quite a bit of information, you can make it as clean and useful as you want. It's basically a better implementation of widgets.

At any rate, there's a tension between wanting to publicize the new devices as soon as possible, and not wanting a huge span between announcement and availability.

At this point, RIM has already gone a year without releasing a new high end device while an avalanche of devices have left the 9900 in the dust. I don't thing it makes the situation any worse than it already is if RIM waits until everything is ready, and plus, there is a big benefit to saying "here's our new phone; you can buy it in two weeks."

[Clinto]

That strikes me as an odd complaint regarding the Windows home screen. Given that it's quite customizable, and that live tiles can display quite a bit of information, you can make it as clean and useful as you want. It's basically a better implementation of widgets.

At any rate, there's a tension between wanting to publicize the new devices as soon as possible, and not wanting a huge span between announcement and availability.

At this point, RIM has already gone a year without releasing a new high end device while an avalanche of devices have left the 9900 in the dust. I don't thing it makes the situation any worse than it already is if RIM waits until everything is ready, and plus, there is a big benefit to saying "here's our new phone; you can buy it in two weeks."

Here is an article with an app thats already been made even though Windows 8 is not even out yet, just to help you clean up the home screen and get away from the "live tiles".

To me if you have to download an app to change the basis of the OS, that is just plain wrong.. Just me..

Thinix RetroUI lets Windows 8 users step off the Metro, stick to the classic desktop -- Engadget

But I do agree with you @iankeiththomas, they may as well take some more time to make sure they get BB10 done right.

[iankeiththomas]

I may be wrong, but that appears to be a Windows 8 app. In other words, it will run on desktops, not phones. Certainly, on a desktop the tiles are a whole different story; early reports of how well Windows 8 works with a mouse aren't encouraging, and I have zero interest in a touchscreen PC.

[AlexBC]

@Clinto, well, my Dad got a Windows 7.5 Phone and I've used it a quite a bit and the UI is actually very good. I like it a LOT MORE than Android mess, that's for sure!

I am, and have been waiting for BB10, I DO NOT want to change... I seriously do not... but it's just taking way too long. Before Nokia Win8 phones came out, I wasn't that much in the pinch, but now it's just PAINFUL!

BB9900 is GREAT, I still think the body/style is one of the best in the market, BUT, I just cannot live with the following:

- Battery life is absolutely shameful
- Camera SUCKS
- No good mapping solution
- Having gone through zillions of firmwares to find a stable one
- Screen is simply too small now
- Browser is too dated
- touchscreen is just not up to par anymore
- lack of good apps

So, overall, I really want RIM to succeed, and BB10 to be AWESOME, but come one, GIVE US A BONE, something to look forward to, something to keep me from wanting the London, I know it won't be ready/released till February... but maybe do some soft unvelining, keep stuff secret but drive some interest!

I honestly think beyond my selfish reasons, it is imperative for RIM to reveal more about BB10! Their bread and butter is corporations, and it started with Yahoo and I am afraid more may follow to drop BB. They MUST STOP THE BLEEDING, even before the final release.

Ok, back to drooling over Lumia 920 pics...

PS. Even if BB10 is great, my next phone would have the BEST camera on the market. That's very critical to me as I take a lot of pics going out and do not wanna carry a camera no more.

[pythons]

Rim has been clear that it's only got one shot left in it's gun - this one has to count....
...As it stands curently RIM can't compete in either business or play with either IOS or Droid.
...The market share RIM has already lost plus their stock detail very well the position they put themselves in.

That said the company has a chance to hold the line it currently has and to build up again...
...IF ( and I mean if ) they can release a product that has equal or better functionality then IOS or Droid.
...The Playbook is essentially a LOST CAUSE - no Hulu, no Netflix, no Skype.
...= NO PLAY. Other than that it's a great tablet if you want to watch youtube.

BBX has a chance to come out swinging and they absolutely must have a knockout in the first round with this new phone....
...The people who know the BBX inside and out made the determination to hold off.
...Perhaps they know something we don't?

Yeah, it sucks and I agree with you that they should start to spark interest by showing more then what they have as of late...
...Given this is a gound up new phone it stands the chance of looking like it was rushed.
...Perhaps RIM needed this extra time to polish out that aspect of the BBX?

If the phone has or does not have Skype will be the test if this device has a chance...
...It will settle the question if RIM is still in the game or it unfortunately waited to long and is doomed.

[pythons]

Sorry, double post...

[Blacklatino]

I am even MORE PISSED that BB10 is delayed to 2013 now... I see all these new devices, specially Nokia 920, and I can't really wait to see *what* is gonna be the next BB device.

It was a HUGE missed opportunity, I mean HUGE! Worse than other delays, worse than Playbook, worse than BB7 delays, worst in their history IMO.

I am sure everyone saw Yahoo scrapping the BB devices, that's very disappointing... even if BB10 for sure would NOT have sold as much iPhone 5 and Galaxy, it would have been very much in the discussions and alternative to iOS/Android dominance, and basically propelling Win8 devices to become the only available alternative.

I STRONGLY BELIEVE, BB10 devices MUST BE unveiled by end of October, EVEN IF, the final device cannot be delivered till 2013. People MUST KNOW what's coming, so could make the decision whether or not to wait for BB10. Nokia did it last week, unveiled the phone, features, hands-on, but not releasing it till November, even no pricing... so they are part of the discussion and some iPhone buyers *might* pause to see how's the 920 in real life!

As for me, I am up for upgrade (at work) in November, IF nothing is known about BB10 by then, such as look and feel, screen, camera, other specs, some basic features, Apps, etc... I will be upgrading to Nokia 920 as it is IMO the BEST Smartphone in the market.

Any thoughts?

So, is there a particular reason that you have to upgrade and not wait? There is a difference between need to vs. want to- which is why I ask. Regardless of the devices I have now, I'll get a BB10 if/when it is released......like many, many others. We've acknowledged the delays......and most have moved on. Nothing new, but, thanks for the reminder.

[Blacklatino]

really sucks as I can't live without BBM

(Pulls out pad and pen, pushes up glasses, and points towards the couch).....and how does that make you feel? I detect anger. Taking any meds? Need some?


Take a pill and Chillax.....it's not that serious.

[Alex_Hong]

Honestly, wait till next week to see what they show at BB JAM Americas. I'm sure they will do a bit more demo to developers, because it would help them create better apps if they were to know how the UI works. Also they have to kinda tell the developers what will be built into the OS too, to avoid developers creating apps that the OS itself could already do.

RIM had been heavily criticised in the past, for showing a device and only making it available months away, I think they are just trying to avoid a repeat. I honestly don't think its that bad, we have seen many leaks already, as well as leaked slides showing possible BB10 features. I personally think its still too early to show too much, just the things developers need to know.

I think now, you just have to think real carefully between what you want, versus what you need. I want a full touch screen devices, an awesome browser (similar to the one on playbook, but more stable), more apps too. But there are things i need that are available on BB that aren't available on other platforms. So i'm sticking with my BB, even after buying a Lumia 800, i still use my BB as my daily driver.

If you think that you are willing to compromise what you like about BB in order to go to the Lumia 920, go ahead, its a pretty awesome device too. No smartphone platform is perfect, there are bound to be some compromises here and there, ultimately its what you are willing to compromise.

[Fmar]

@AlexBC I am not so sure about the WP8 experience... Why??? Because their STUPID TILE SYSTEM IS THE HOME SCREEN. WTF is up that?? There is literally no clean home screen. And as a perfectionist, I demand cleanliness and perfect orginization. And the WP8 Platform only has a ridiculous cluttered home screen. I am very afraid if I had to look at that messy homescreen every day... That pretty little 920 would be smashed into the pavement one day.. Along with it's equally unorganized messy Surface Tablet brother.

Not sure you making any sense. The tile system is organisation. You decide what tiles you want and don't have to have all apps on it. You have a gesture to view all apps.

The homescreen allows you to have what is important to you on it. It also updates via push to the icons and thus changes images in the icons, text in the icons, view weather outlook in the icon without opening the app.

It is cluttered if you make it cluttered.

Like someone has stated... best smartphone out there imho and I will upgrade to the 920 first chance I can.

With the Surface released Oct 26th in Australia... the smartphone tablet/phone combo just got real.

On a side note, with Billion dollar MS marketing war chest rumoured... expect these devices to be high in the public mind.

[badiyee85]

To TS:

Waiting is always the hardest part.

Then again, not sure if you really want to wait. If you have the moolah, go ahead and buy the 920 off contract, then when BB10 comes out, buy the BB10.

[AlexBC]

@badiyee85, well this is my company phone and they're gonna be releasing Lumia 920 in November, along with Galaxy 3, and iPhone 5. I could upgrade then... and I might.

[theRock1975]

@AlexBC I could not agree with you more. I am so ticked off right now I don't know what to do... I'm an obsessive compulsive perfectionist, so I chose the beautiful and near perfect Bold 9900. But I am so done with the 1/2 screen.

As much as I love my BB keyboard I am this close (imagine my fingers being really close together) to dropping it and going for the awesome Nokia 920 in Black or Gunmetal. And... after we get the 920 we can easily "flow" our stuff from our laptops to our new Surface Tablet then our WP8 phone.. Perfection right???

I am not so sure about the WP8 experience... Why??? Because their STUPID TILE SYSTEM IS THE HOME SCREEN. WTF is up that?? There is literally no clean home screen. And as a perfectionist, I demand cleanliness and perfect orginization. And the WP8 Platform only has a ridiculous cluttered home screen. I am very afraid if I had to look at that messy homescreen every day... That pretty little 920 would be smashed into the pavement one day.. Along with it's equally unorganized messy Surface Tablet brother.

And.. The windows phone doesn't even have a lighting up led notification light. My current Bold has the "Advance OS" custom led light app, a different color for my different contacts so I know who is texting or emailing without even picking it up. Freaking Perfection!

So be forwarned.. friend... In my humble opinion the grass may not be greener on the other side...

As ugly as the new BB 10 London is and as much as it looks like an old Droid X... And... as long as it's taking to get to market.... Yes.. I am still going to hold out for the London and love it's new awesome "flowing UI", one handed usage, awesome camera, dual core goodness, clean home screen layout and of course it's top of the world, superior notification system.

I still will hate it's cheapened look, but yes.. I will hold on, stay the course and wait for the superior BB10 user experience.

And you may want to hold out for BB10 too... Not to mention RIM should be releasing their 10" Tablet to integrate with BB10 phones too.. Should be exciting..

I agree about the WP8 tile system. What an ugly interface. 8bit colors?? really? I have an xbox360 and I hate the main navigation. It's not the same interface as WP8 but close and I just hate it. You click a tile and loading... a new screen appears with a message, you click yes, then loading... after the app loads, you find out it sucks, so you try to leave, another message and loading...

Damn Microsoft, what's wrong with you. I find it easier watching movies via my playbook and hdmi out. Microsoft is still stuck in desktop mode.. I honestly would not believe WP8 gets to #3. It will be:
1) Android
2) Blackberry10 + BB7
3) Apple
4) WP8

[AlexBC]

I agree about the WP8 tile system. What an ugly interface. 8bit colors?? really? I have an xbox360 and I hate the main navigation. It's not the same interface as WP8 but close and I just hate it. You click a tile and loading... a new screen appears with a message, you click yes, then loading... after the app loads, you find out it sucks, so you try to leave, another message and loading...

Damn Microsoft, what's wrong with you. I find it easier watching movies via my playbook and hdmi out. Microsoft is still stuck in desktop mode.. I honestly would not believe WP8 gets to #3. It will be:
1) Android
2) Blackberry10 + BB7
3) Apple
4) WP8

BB above Apple? Are you serious... I wish, but basically impossible.

Think of that 80% of the market... what do they use the phone for? Call/text, email, get on the web, Skype, post on their facebook, taking pics, follow twitter, use maps and play Angry Birds. Which device does all of those well? Apple, WP8, Android... BB is behind on those dumb things ppl do! and that's the problem.

I am very afraid the combination of WP8 and Windows 8 might move them up on BB, and Blackberry would either be the niche in the market at 4th place, or gone . I really hope there's room for 4 players.

[OniBerry]

BB above Apple? Are you serious... I wish, but basically impossible.

I am very afraid the combination of WP8 and Windows 8 might move them up on BB, and Blackberry would either be the niche in the market at 4th place, or gone . I really hope there's room for 4 players.

Shouldn't be any reason why the market cannot 4 different platforms. If consumers support it, then it should do alright.