02-11-14 01:11 PM
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  1. milo53's Avatar
    Yes, the denial and excuses need to stop. And that starts from the top - before Heins, it was a mess; Heins began the clean up but unfortunately the perception and reputation of excellence - that blackberry had, and was slowly eroding in the face of the competition - was shot. I hope Chen stems the bleeding. Lazardis walking out of a bbc interview - that kind of blinkered thinking and arrogance is what has put blackberry where it is. That and the apologists and yes men they surrounded themselves.

    Bb10 is an excellent platform and it deserves better. I hope Chen draws a line under the past and this is the start of a new blackberry!

    Sent from Tapatalk
    You got it, arrogance. This is why BB is where they are, plain ole arrogance and denial. Team Lazaridis and Balsille will go down in history as the worst for sure.
    02-09-14 10:24 PM
  2. xanadome's Avatar
    Your whole idea stems from this so called rivalry with apple
    Not at all.
    Remove your prejudice, and you will get to the truth :-).
    JeepBB likes this.
    02-09-14 10:42 PM
  3. milo53's Avatar
    There were a series of posts about a month ago from someone who worked for BB during the BB10 development.

    The way he tells it, the BB10 guys were mostly new, full of themselves (coz they were building "THE FUTURE!!!"), and didn't think they had any lessons to learn from the BB7 guys sitting in the corner.

    The two teams apparently never spoke in any meaningful way to each other. BB10 was pretty much developed as a clean-sheet-of-paper exercise, and most of the legacy know-how from BB7 was ignored.

    His opinion, which I share, was that this non-communication and wheel-reinventing was what led to a large number of legacy features missing in 10.0, and bugs in the BB10 implementation of no-brainer BB bread and butter stuff that hadn't been an issue to BB in the past. E.G. Anyone recall BB10's "issues" with replying to email - it was all over the forums at the time. A BB phone that couldn't do email properly!
    Spot on! Lazeridis created this style of management, it created nothing but, a divisive environment.

    One group felt like "lame ducks" the other "future stars"

    Terrible for morale and creativity.
    JeepBB likes this.
    02-09-14 10:48 PM
  4. xanadome's Avatar
    For example the guy saying he's using his 9900 along with the iphone... I'd say it sounds like your iPhone isn't exactly getting the job done 100% if you have to balance it out with another phone... but hey let's ignore that
    Most people here would think it's completely other way around, don't you think? :-).
    Anyway, I consider the 9900 as a superb communication device, and I use it as such (a dedicated communication device, and yes, I believe 9900 is better than the iPhone in that regard). I supplement the weak points of the 9900 with the iPhone. What's wrong with that? Do you think I am an Apple fanboy? If so, why do I use the 9900?
    Again, remove your obsessive prejudice against Apple, and it would be easier for you to make a clear analysis and get to the truth :-).
    02-09-14 10:49 PM
  5. asvab7's Avatar
    In addition to the lack of marketing, the bastardization by carriers and store representatives, the move away from the @blackberry.net email is a certain killer, especially for those that never wished for their emails to go over a third party channel such as yahoo, Gmail or outlook.com. A business centric email account is important especially for those users that are still paying $30.00 per month for BIS.

    Posted via CB10
    02-09-14 10:52 PM
  6. I Poo-poo on iPhones's Avatar
    It's not their issue that BB took 6-7 years to answer the iPhone/Android - what they see is that the latest iPhone or Android phone does a ton of things that the BB either can't do or can't do well
    ...
    They buy the product that gives them the best bang for their buck
    Excluding the Android from the discussion, iPhones do jack, and they do not give "the best bang for their buck". On the contrary, all Apple products are hyper-inflated in price to the extent there are cheaper products that have more functionality, more power, and better aesthetics. That said, Apple product-owners erroneously believe they own a high-class pedigree item that deserves to be flashed around amongst their social group, thereby gaining esteemed looks from their less-endowed friends.

    Apple product-owners are in effect posers who enjoy flashing their $#1tty stuff, 'cause they are attention-seeking whores.


    Checklist:

    iPod - $#1\
    iPhone - $#1\
    iPad - $#1\
    Mac - $#1\
    Tim Cook - $#1\


    An OS which wasn't finished just like the playbook. It worked but didn't work well. Missing features legacy devices had, and lack of marketing. Also the ecosystem was poor compared to the big dogs
    It's high time the Apple dog is muzzled and castrated.


    With Samsung and Apple dominating the smartphone market, BlackBerry had to do something really special to break into this duopoly. Failures in marketing, apps and carrier support ensured it's failure.
    Here's a chart that illustrates the meteoric rise of Android, the fall of BlackBerry, and the impending fall of iPhone.


    Mobile OS Market Share - Jan 09 to Jan 14






    Shipments of BlackBerry versus iPhone - Jun 07 to Jun 11
    02-09-14 11:02 PM
  7. trwallace's Avatar
    it really was less about what blackberry did and more about what android and Ios did. They moved on and became the everday user tool. Blackberry was the business phone that you took with you to work and then you used the other phone for personal things. IOS and android managed to marry these two types of phones together and do it with some style. Blackberry failed to move when they saw the entertainment side of the phone and thats why they fell behind. They didnt actually fail they just fell behind to far to catch back up. To say they are done is ridiculous. BB10 has a long way to go and a lot of different avenues they can take it. Its always been about keeping up with the market. What about some of the other players that fell by the wayside. HP, Nokia, motorola, and even microsoft. So dont think blackberrry was the only one that lost out. In fact at least they are still in the game as lots of the players simply dropped out completely. I think everyone seems to have this idea that Blackberry did so many things wrong and thats why they lost out. In actual fact its about apple and samsung doing more things right. The other stuff marketing,apps and carrier support are just part of the reason but not really the biggest part. Is Blackberry down? Yes. Are they down and out? No and not even close to being out of the game.
    xanadome likes this.
    02-09-14 11:04 PM
  8. spikesolie's Avatar
    Most people here would think it's completely other way around, don't you think? :-).
    Anyway, I consider the 9900 as a superb communication device, and I use it as such (a dedicated communication device, and yes, I believe 9900 is better than the iPhone in that regard). I supplement the weak points of the 9900 with the iPhone. What's wrong with that? Do you think I am an Apple fanboy? If so, why do I use the 9900?
    Again, remove your obsessive prejudice against Apple, and it would be easier for you to make a clear analysis and get to the truth :-).
    I used ios for 3 years up until this past November (:

    Posted via CB10
    02-10-14 12:19 AM
  9. belfastdispatcher's Avatar
    I used ios for 3 years up until this past November (:

    Posted via CB10
    Yeah? While you were using your iOS for the past 3 years we were using BBOS, I think we know best what a BlackBerry should be and that's definitely not an iOS clone.


    Sent from my iPhone using CB Forums
    xanadome likes this.
    02-10-14 01:29 AM
  10. belfastdispatcher's Avatar
    For all you os7 users who feel bb10 is just another phone, that's too bad. You didn't expect them to have everything 100% at launch did you? Sticking with your beloved os7 was what got them here in the first place.

    For example the guy saying he's using his 9900 along with the iphone... I'd say it sounds like your iPhone isn't exactly getting the job done 100% if you have to balance it out with another phone... but hey let's ignore that

    Posted via CB10
    At launch? No, but it's now a year later, no longer the launch.


    Sent from my iPhone using CB Forums
    Poirots Progeny and JeepBB like this.
    02-10-14 01:32 AM
  11. spikesolie's Avatar
    At launch? No, but it's now a year later, no longer the launch.


    Sent from my iPhone using CB Forums
    Well they release the features that were requested by most... meaning you and your minions are in the minority. you don't use a bb10 currently anyways.

    Posted via CB10
    02-10-14 09:20 AM
  12. spikesolie's Avatar
    Yeah? While you were using your iOS for the past 3 years we were using BBOS, I think we know best what a BlackBerry should be and that's definitely not an iOS clone.


    Sent from my iPhone using CB Forums
    Well and during those 3 years I can say I've used an ios enough to know bb10 is no iPhone clone.

    It's funny.. the same people that happen to call for os7 remake are the same that post from their iphones... hmm

    I have a suggestion for you.. get rid of your iPhone, get a z30, and pair it with your 9900.. voila! Problem solved.?? You still have a "communication device" right?

    Posted via CB10
    wincyUt likes this.
    02-10-14 09:23 AM
  13. belfastdispatcher's Avatar
    Well and during those 3 years I can say I've used an ios enough to know bb10 is no iPhone clone.

    It's funny.. the same people that happen to call for os7 remake are the same that post from their iphones... hmm

    I have a suggestion for you.. get rid of your iPhone, get a z30, and pair it with your 9900.. voila! Problem solved.?? You still have a "communication device" right?

    Posted via CB10
    Would a Z30 be a better iPod touch then an iphone 5? I don't think so.

    Anyway, I can't sell it, it's not exactly mine to sell. I just use it.


    Sent from my iPhone using CB Forums
    02-10-14 09:25 AM
  14. spikesolie's Avatar
    Would a Z30 be a better iPod touch then an iphone 5? I don't think so.

    Anyway, I can't sell it, it's not exactly mine to sell. I just use it.


    Sent from my iPhone using CB Forums
    I had an iPhone, and an ipod...and the ipod (4th generation) stopped being functional with ios6..it was slow and then the middle button broke and wouldn't push in anyways so I needed a new ipod. Would cost 229. So I said why not try a blackberry phone? Especially since I loved my first blackberry product (playbook) so I got a z10 instead for 215 on ebay... 3 days later I listed my iPhone 4s. and I'm not complaining. Anyways I guess you could say iPhone makes a better ipod but that's because ipods are apple products. That's not anything special. Most people don't carry around an ipod or mp3 entertainer because their phones (including me) does that perfectly

    Posted via CB10
    02-10-14 11:53 AM
  15. belfastdispatcher's Avatar
    I had an iPhone, and an ipod...and the ipod (4th generation) stopped being functional with ios6..it was slow and then the middle button broke and wouldn't push in anyways so I needed a new ipod. Would cost 229. So I said why not try a blackberry phone? Especially since I loved my first blackberry product (playbook) so I got a z10 instead for 215 on ebay... 3 days later I listed my iPhone 4s. and I'm not complaining. Anyways I guess you could say iPhone makes a better ipod but that's because ipods are apple products. That's not anything special. Most people don't carry around an ipod or mp3 entertainer because their phones (including me) does that perfectly

    Posted via CB10
    Hmmm, so you bought your Z10 on eBay? You do realise, while you're being a strong BB10 supporter, you haven't made BlackBerry any money, right? Is that how you support your favourite platform?

    On the other hand I bought 5 new BlackBerrys over the years and a few second hand ones that still make BB money when activated with BIS. Also I've spent 100+ on BB7 apps.

    I think you need to cut down on the lecturing.


    Sent from my iPhone using CB Forums
    02-10-14 12:04 PM
  16. systemvolker's Avatar
    I know what caused the mention issues by the op.

    Updated his os ota. This causes problems.
    Why?
    Because some of the remaining datas and files from an old system app which system apps uses are incompatible with the updated one such as contacts, text messages, calendar, email accounts, and other important system files/and apps which the os use. It might be corrupted or having conflicts.

    Best fix for this is "security wipe".
    Ps: back up contacts first and text messages.
    (Look for apps @ BlackBerry World if you need some)

    Many of us here in cb experienced this and it usually occurs when restoring system backup from an old os to a new os...

    ... and also in ota updates with high version number increments... for ex: from 10.2.0.xxxx and updated ota to 10.2.1.xxxx.

    It happens on other platforms as well.

    I kinda agree with the op but other than that, I still vote for BlackBerry 10 as the best phone os.... and its chosen & based by experience.

    Fixing stuffs in a new platform requires time. So if I were the op, I would gladly shut my mouth off because they knew about this and I'm pretty sure they're working on it.

    They're not getting paid to be dumb.







    Posted via CB10
    02-10-14 12:21 PM
  17. kbz1960's Avatar
    I know what caused the mention issues by the op.

    Updated his os ota. This causes problems.
    Why?
    Because some of the remaining datas and files from an old system app which system apps uses are incompatible with the updated one such as contacts, text messages, calendar, email accounts, and other important system files/and apps which the os use. It might be corrupted or having conflicts.

    Best fix for this is "security wipe".
    Ps: back up contacts first and text messages.
    (Look for apps @ BlackBerry World if you need some)

    Many of us here in cb experienced this and it usually occurs when restoring system backup from an old os to a new os...

    ... and also in ota updates with high version number increments... for ex: from 10.2.0.xxxx and updated ota to 10.2.1.xxxx.

    It happens on other platforms as well.

    I kinda agree with the op but other than that, I still vote for BlackBerry 10 as the best phone os.... and its chosen & based by experience.

    Fixing stuffs in a new platform requires time. So if I were the op, I would gladly shut my mouth off because they knew about this and I'm pretty sure they're working on it.

    They're not getting paid to be dumb.







    Posted via CB10
    That is an issue too. People want their data and they don't want to wipe jump thru this and that hoop just to get it. Something else they need to fix if they ever want consumers buying again.
    02-10-14 12:36 PM
  18. spikesolie's Avatar
    Hmmm, so you bought your Z10 on eBay? You do realise, while you're being a strong BB10 supporter, you haven't made BlackBerry any money, right? Is that how you support your favourite platform?

    On the other hand I bought 5 new BlackBerrys over the years and a few second hand ones that still make BB money when activated with BIS. Also I've spent 100+ on BB7 apps.

    I think you need to cut down on the lecturing.


    Sent from my iPhone using CB Forums
    Wow I didn't know the z10 I bought was made by Apple....you buying several blackberry over the years has nothing to do with this. If I didn't buy it on ebay, someone else will. Plus from what I know the person who sold me it said he ordered them from blackberry off a promo that BlackBerry was doing for 199/z10. Idk if that's a lie but anyways that has nothing to do with the fact that if I didn't buy a bb10 I would have gone on the same ebay and bought an apple ipod...

    Posted via CB10
    02-10-14 03:02 PM
  19. spikesolie's Avatar
    Hmmm, so you bought your Z10 on eBay? You do realise, while you're being a strong BB10 supporter, you haven't made BlackBerry any money, right? Is that how you support your favourite platform?

    On the other hand I bought 5 new BlackBerrys over the years and a few second hand ones that still make BB money when activated with BIS. Also I've spent 100+ on BB7 apps.

    I think you need to cut down on the lecturing.


    Sent from my iPhone using CB Forums
    Oh Btw I'm a student, not a cash-well. It's the same reason I never bought an iPhone directly. I buy off contract, meaning I would be spending 600-800 on a phone..its either that or buy on Contract with data plans I don't want. It's not my job to keep them in business. I'm not a fanboy who has unlimited cash

    Posted via CB10
    02-10-14 03:04 PM
  20. belfastdispatcher's Avatar
    Oh Btw I'm a student, not a cash-well. It's the same reason I never bought an iPhone directly. I buy off contract, meaning I would be spending 600-800 on a phone..its either that or buy on Contract with data plans I don't want. It's not my job to keep them in business. I'm not a fanboy who has unlimited cash

    Posted via CB10
    Well then don't pass judgements on people that did buy Legacy and BB10 devices, supporting BB, just because they might also have an iphone.

    Perhaps if you paid your cash to BlackBerry directly you'd also expect more bang for your cash.




    Sent from my iPhone using CB Forums
    Poirots Progeny likes this.
    02-11-14 05:31 AM
  21. Jerale Hoard's Avatar
    I think the rapid downfall of BBRY formed its roots way back when then CEOs were grand standing with bravado such as "leapfrogging competitions", "amateur hours are over" and "tools not toys" etc., even though they were totally scared of the potential impact of iPhone.
    So, they regarded Apple like an archenemy, and fell into obsession to target Apple, catch them up and possibly excel them.
    The end results was the BB10, that BBRY were hoping to leapfrog Apple, but ended up producing just another iPhone wannabe with different style of operation and UI (so as not be sued by Apple? :-). Obviously, the market was not at all impressed, and BBRY very quickly accumulated a billion dlr of write down etc. Appalling!

    So, they got scared again, quickly announcing the defeat in the consumer market, and hastily announced to entrench in the enterprise one, at least for now.
    All along, what was completely lost out was "where were those things that were making a BB a BB?". The proof of it is that BBRY is furiously adding BBOS features now, but it may be too late.
    As someone said in this thread, a brand new (and perhaps green) team of coders were hired with a great fanfare to create a brand new super platform, which nobody cared. The market wanted the core functionality, superb UI and efficient keyboard, that was making a BB a BB, on ANY good platform. In a simple term, legacy devices only lacked a good browsing capability, which BB10 provided, but it dropped everything else.
    BB10 platform was fast and smooth and all that. All good and dandy, but so what? It no longer was the BB, which was sustaining the market. Legacy users (a lot of enterprise users included) were left out, and these legacy users are most experienced, knowledgeable and loyal to BBRY, enough to hold out on the Bolds and be content with them. A big blunder, and a strategic error. No marketing and time would have saved them from this blunder
    Y
    Simple as that. Unfortunately, Apple killed them again (well, almost) by BBRY's own obsession to beat Apple. Apple did not do a thing to beat BBRY, but BBRY collapse by themselves, and fast.

    Hope the new CEO has a good grasp of the situation, and turn BBRY around quickly.
    Enough said.....
    Does "build from the ground up" mean anything to you? Did Apple have all the features when it was first released? iPhone wannabe? Really dude? So just because a phone has a "rectangular" shape it's considered a wannabe? Also if the market wanted a efficient keyboard then why do most people call it "outdated" tech? Only few wants a keyboard phone. Me, I wanted a touchscreen, just didn't want to fall for Apple or Android devices. Legacy users were not left out. They just don't know about BlackBerry 10's existence. And I disagree with you on the marketing. The superbowl commercial could have saved them big time if it was anything worth watching. A huge opportunity that failed. Didn't really give a person a reason to buy or upgrade to a BlackBerry 10. Apple didn't kill BlackBerry. BlackBerry still going on. Even though stock fell it wasn't due to Apple. I remember when Thorsten said that the "iPhone was outdated" stock actually rose at that remark. It was due to BlackBerry's poor business tactics, lack of marketing, lack of a saving grace (Thorsten hiding and not coming out to refute journalist claims), the lying (BB10 coming to PB), and of course the "For Sale" fiasco. These reasons seemed to be the reasons Bulls turned to Bears.

    Posted via CB10
    02-11-14 06:41 AM
  22. Jerale Hoard's Avatar
    it really was less about what blackberry did and more about what android and Ios did. They moved on and became the everday user tool. Blackberry was the business phone that you took with you to work and then you used the other phone for personal things. IOS and android managed to marry these two types of phones together and do it with some style. Blackberry failed to move when they saw the entertainment side of the phone and thats why they fell behind. They didnt actually fail they just fell behind to far to catch back up. To say they are done is ridiculous. BB10 has a long way to go and a lot of different avenues they can take it. Its always been about keeping up with the market. What about some of the other players that fell by the wayside. HP, Nokia, motorola, and even microsoft. So dont think blackberrry was the only one that lost out. In fact at least they are still in the game as lots of the players simply dropped out completely. I think everyone seems to have this idea that Blackberry did so many things wrong and thats why they lost out. In actual fact its about apple and samsung doing more things right. The other stuff marketing,apps and carrier support are just part of the reason but not really the biggest part. Is Blackberry down? Yes. Are they down and out? No and not even close to being out of the game.
    " I think everyone seems to have this idea that Blackberry did so many things wrong and thats why they lost out."


    BlackBerry did do so many things wrong. That's why stocks fall. Not because of what others are doing right. BlackBerry was just failing and that turned some Bulls against them and turn to Bears. BlackBerry Bulls look for what's right and what BlackBerry was doing was what was wrong and kept Bulls fearful.



    Posted via CB10
    02-11-14 06:51 AM
  23. dtango's Avatar
    I've used BlackBerry since before the first cellular BlackBerry.

    They just grafted on a keyboard to the OS10 touch-screen BlackBerry, leaving behind the trackpad and all of the polished up tweaks of BBOS.

    Just as an example, I have over 5800 contacts...I'm not going to go to a Q10 when there are no Categories in the address book, and a bunch of other omissions, the trackpad loss hurting me most of all.

    With a new OS, BB10, and the computing power that the OS10 devices have, it would have been possible to add:
    • a protocol conversion layer
    • then bring the BBOS user interface (with its keyboard shortcuts) over to a keyboard + trackpad OS10 device (this software is directly available from the 9900...doesn't have to be written from scratch)
    • the Android app function
    • Balance, to keep personal and enterprise separate
    • Hub option -- let user select it or not
    • the other useful stuff from OS10, such as microHDMI port,...


    I purchased a used Bold 9900 as a backup to my old 9900. I have a used Q10, but just for keeping up -- thanks to the 'leaked' versions on CrackBerry !!! But my device in use will be a Bold for quite a while, I believe.

    There's an interesting thread (103 pages long) on the BlackBerry Community Forum,


    Glad to see all the comments.

    George_B
    Here is every reason why Blackberry will never be mainstream and "make it".
    02-11-14 07:00 AM
  24. spikesolie's Avatar
    Well then don't pass judgements on people that did buy Legacy and BB10 devices, supporting BB, just because they might also have an iphone.

    Perhaps if you paid your cash to BlackBerry directly you'd also expect more bang for your cash.




    Sent from my iPhone using CB Forums
    So because I didn't buy directly from BlackBerry I should expect "less bang for my cash"? Again it was rather that or an apple product. If I got the itouch I'd hold it to the same level as people who got theirs directly. It's still an apple product.

    You changed the subject. You are here banging on blackberry when you got an iPhone not getting the job done either. You should expect more bang for your bucks from apple as well!

    Stop holding blackberry to some ridiculous standard while you have another premium product in your hand mainly for entertainment.



    Posted via CB10
    02-11-14 10:01 AM
  25. DINGSTER1's Avatar
    Another thread headed for a lock!

    Sent from my SM-P600 using Tapatalk
    JeepBB likes this.
    02-11-14 12:29 PM
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