04-21-14 09:36 PM
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  1. raino's Avatar
    OP, I think I know what the problem is, you went into a Verizon store. Why didn't you get your Z30 direct from BlackBerry?
    Because you can't get a Z30 that works on Verizon through BlackBerry. At least not very easily.
    04-17-14 06:28 PM
  2. raino's Avatar
    So the government is making people choose a certain platform? I'm confused as to what you are saying. Does it matter how easy it is for them if they can spy on you either way?
    No. Try to keep up with the entire conversation. If one or more platforms have an exploitable backdoor, it/they are inherently more "less secure," even if everyone is equally penetrable on a network level.
    04-17-14 06:29 PM
  3. neo158's Avatar
    Because you can't get a Z30 that works on Verizon through BlackBerry. At least not very easily.
    Good point, although there are better networks than Verizon.
    04-17-14 06:35 PM
  4. Xenolock's Avatar
    I don't necessarily agree with the conspiracy theory, but please remind me--was an NSA backdoor into BB10 or BBOS ever discovered?
    Exactly... BlackBerry didn't accept payola from the NSA like Apple and Google did. Maybe they'd have a decent ad budget if they did.

    From a Z30
    andy957 and jh07 like this.
    04-17-14 06:51 PM
  5. A895's Avatar
    No. Try to keep up with the entire conversation. If one or more platforms have an exploitable backdoor, it/they are inherently more "less secure," even if everyone is equally penetrable on a network level.
    So if one platform has a backdoor its less secure than other devices even though though all can be spied upon on the cellular network? Even though all have backdoors, it's just a case of having the right keys to it. I'm pretty sure without BES a BlackBerry 10 device is just as susceptible to the NSA as much as other platforms.

    Posted via the Android CrackBerry App!
    kbz1960 and chr1sny like this.
    04-17-14 07:09 PM
  6. A895's Avatar
    Good point, although there are better networks than Verizon.
    Coverage Penetration wise in the states? No. Price wise? Yes.

    Posted via the Android CrackBerry App!
    kbz1960 and Dougie011 like this.
    04-17-14 07:10 PM
  7. A895's Avatar
    Exactly... BlackBerry didn't accept payola from the NSA like Apple and Google did. Maybe they'd have a decent ad budget if they did.

    From a Z30
    They took the money because they were forced to do it. Both Apple and Google are American companies so if the american federal government asks for something they have to do it. They just happened to get paid for the "inconvenience".

    Posted via the Android CrackBerry App!
    04-17-14 07:11 PM
  8. BBSpring's Avatar
    Dude, you go all out to let everyone know that consumers are not protected, and that they should not feel more secure. The kicker is, if BB went away, then all of the Corps and Governments, and security minded folks that ARE protected would be "more" exposed.
    It's easy to see how and why some folks feel that BB is under the gun and that they have been ganged up on. I also feel that BB is to blame for a large chunk of their issues, BUT some of the other constant messaging looks rather dodgy and intentional.

    Your stance is clear, I think you earned that bonus.

    According to several articles in the press, BB's (BBOS) has been compromised in the past, even those on BES. I'm not saying it's easy (one story suggested that it took a concerted effort to break BES and that it wasn't assured or "routine"), but a lot of what NSA gathers is simply metadata from your phone calls and texts, to see who you call and went/for how long. Even on BES, your phone calls and texts (the content, not just the metadata) are still "in the clear."

    But, again, we're talking about CONSUMERS here, who won't be on BES anyway, so why would NSA care if you used a BB or iPhone or Android?
    collinc93 likes this.
    04-17-14 07:12 PM
  9. WorkStation 0's Avatar
    Exactly... BlackBerry didn't accept payola from the NSA like Apple and Google did. Maybe they'd have a decent ad budget if they did.

    From a Z30
    So when BBOS dominated the market the NSA was not interested in spying? Somehow this wasn't an issue then.

    Phone tapping existed for decades then became less common because of the dominance of BlackBerry phones (45-50% market share at one point) then experienced a resurgence due to the popularity of Android an IOS.

    You can't be serious.

    If BlackBerry was as awesome as some of you believe it would sell better. BlackBerry offers a slick OS with little to no ecosystem. Basically a smartphone without the compatibility that smartphones offer. Not compatible with major internet services, Far fewer Apps/ Third party software, Little to no accessory support, Fewer Hardware choices, Fewer features, Fewer carrier partnerships.

    BlackBerry will never get better if they listen to diehards blowing smoke up their ***.

    When HTC started to suck, I stopped buying their devices. They seem to have gotten their **** together recently. It's been 4 years. Given the companies current efforts I would now seriously consider their products. This is how it works.
    neo158, kbz1960, Drew808 and 4 others like this.
    04-17-14 07:24 PM
  10. aha's Avatar
    BlackBerry has a decent ecosystem. You don't see it means nothing to its existence.

    Posted via CB10 with Z30 on 10.2.1.2234
    04-17-14 07:33 PM
  11. coffee-turtle's Avatar
    Wait.

    The moon isn't made of cheese?
    Obviously not a Wallace & Grommit fan.
    04-17-14 07:45 PM
  12. bakron1's Avatar
    I have seen the lack of knowledge and the shunning of the BlackBerry brand at most of the carriers here in the USA. The iPhone and Android devices dominate the market here and that's just the way it is at the moment.

    I have left my iPhone 5s and IOS behind and decided to commit to BlackBerry and OS10 and I not looking back. I have shown my z30 to everyone who has an open mind and wants to try something different. The response has been more positive then negative and I have even converted a few folks over to BlackBerry.

    I have discovered based on my experience that OS10 devices have to be promoted using a "hands on" approach and they will sell themselves.

    The bigger issue is that most all of the carriers are not selling someone a device based on what the consumer might need, they are selling based on what's popular and Apple and Android products are what folks want at the moment.

    I preach BlackBerry here in the USA all the time and even though my carrier T Mobile and BlackBerry are having their pissing match at the moment, I still proudly show my z30 to anyone who wants a device that will improve their productivity and provide them with a well built messaging and social app machine.

    I sure hope that the z3 will take off in the developing countries and provide BlackBerry with a larger user base for OS10. This will aid in more native app being developed and maybe one day in the future, I might see BlackBerry and T Mobile kiss and make up. Until that time, I am 100% committed to BlackBerry and I am not looking back.

    Sent from my z30 on T Mobile USA (10.2.1.2160)
    04-17-14 08:14 PM
  13. WorkStation 0's Avatar
    BlackBerry has a decent ecosystem. You don't see it means nothing to its existence.

    Posted via CB10 with Z30 on 10.2.1.2234
    BlackBerry has a horrible ecosystem. I want a Pebble, a GoPro, a Moto360, Office/Word, a Samsung washing machine ect...

    BlackBerry is just not there. I know that most consumers can't afford these items yet, and in some cases don't even know they exist. BlackBerrys problem of again being behind. What will 2016 look like?

    Still no true BlackBerry flagship/ tablet/ Success. I won't belabor the point. The Market has spoken.

    No compelling argument of superiority. What's the sales pitch? Security? Please explain how a BB10 devices browser history/call/GPS/WiFi data transmitted on a public carrier/network/satellite is secured.

    Don't be naive.

    BlackBerry is behind again. Other platforms are evolving. Wearables/Desktop/tablet/laptop/Appliance/Vehichle/Medical/ New form factors/categories. All synced. It's bigger than just a phone Now.

    The BB10 ecosystem is just phones.
    Akuji_ism and bbq10l like this.
    04-17-14 08:15 PM
  14. bakron1's Avatar
    Oops, pushed the wrong button
    04-17-14 08:16 PM
  15. raino's Avatar
    So if one platform has a backdoor its less secure than other devices even though though all can be spied upon on the cellular network? Even though all have backdoors, it's just a case of having the right keys to it. I'm pretty sure without BES a BlackBerry 10 device is just as susceptible to the NSA as much as other platforms.
    Spying through a foreign network likely requires a physical presence of personnel/equipment in that country (as in the case of Angela Merkel's communication.) However, if that's not possible, a backdoor easily takes care of it. Obviously they would not have pursued that venture if it wasn't worth it, or SCS interception was enough.
    04-17-14 08:31 PM
  16. Troy Tiscareno's Avatar
    Dude, you go all out to let everyone know that consumers are not protected, and that they should not feel more secure.
    Damn right. People need to understand exactly what is and isn't protected, so they can make intelligent, informed decisions about how they use technology. And for BB specifically, many people simply believe that owning a BB makes their entire phone impenetrable, no matter what they do with it or how they use it. That type of (very common) misinformation is very dangerous, and people should be quick to squash it at every opportunity.

    The kicker is, if BB went away, then all of the Corps and Governments, and security minded folks that ARE protected would be "more" exposed.
    True, and that's why I hope BB can manage to survive. I'm not sure they will, and honestly there is less and less hope of that happening, but I still hope it does, despite being realistic about their situation and some of the poor decisions the company has made.

    It's easy to see how and why some folks feel that BB is under the gun and that they have been ganged up on.
    I get that, but people need to be realistic about what is legitimate "ganging up on" and what is self-inflicted, or just bad luck.

    I also feel that BB is to blame for a large chunk of their issues, BUT some of the other constant messaging looks rather dodgy and intentional.
    I'm not the one who brought up a conspiracy theory that the US government (perhaps BB's largest customer) doesn't want US citizens to have access to BB handsets. I've seen exactly ZERO credible evidence of that, and it also doesn't make sense.

    Your stance is clear, I think you earned that bonus.
    Good. I hope my stance IS clear. Now, where's this bonus you mention? I really could use the money.
    kbz1960 and bbq10l like this.
    04-17-14 08:57 PM
  17. RH1Pearl's Avatar
    If there is a conspiracy theory in the US, then what do you call IPhone dominant market in BlackBerry's home country in Canada - Lack of demand?
    kbz1960 likes this.
    04-17-14 09:06 PM
  18. keepthetorch's Avatar
    BlackBerry has a horrible ecosystem. I want a Pebble, a GoPro, a Moto360, Office/Word, a Samsung washing machine ect...

    BlackBerry is just not there. I know that most consumers can't afford these items yet, and in some cases don't even know they exist. BlackBerrys problem of again being behind. What will 2016 look like?

    Still no true BlackBerry flagship/ tablet/ Success. I won't belabor the point. The Market has spoken.

    No compelling argument of superiority. What's the sales pitch? Security? Please explain how a BB10 devices browser history/call/GPS/WiFi data transmitted on a public carrier/network/satellite is secured.

    Don't be naive.

    BlackBerry is behind again. Other platforms are evolving. Wearables/Desktop/tablet/laptop/Appliance/Vehichle/Medical/ New form factors/categories. All synced. It's bigger than just a phone Now.

    The BB10 ecosystem is just phones.
    Feel better now?
    thisiscjay and milo53 like this.
    04-17-14 09:50 PM
  19. A895's Avatar
    Spying through a foreign network likely requires a physical presence of personnel/equipment in that country (as in the case of Angela Merkel's communication.) However, if that's not possible, a backdoor easily takes care of it. Obviously they would not have pursued that venture if it wasn't worth it, or SCS interception was enough.
    Foreign network? I'm talking about the BB10 devices in the U.S. they are all open to the NSA. That battle cry of security with BB10 means little if it uses normal cell towers. Unless you are encrypting your device and all traffic (data, SMS, calls) you are always vulnerable.

    Posted via the Android CrackBerry App!
    kbz1960 likes this.
    04-17-14 09:52 PM
  20. A895's Avatar
    BlackBerry has a decent ecosystem. You don't see it means nothing to its existence.

    Posted via CB10 with Z30 on 10.2.1.2234
    It does not have a ecosystem. Ecosystem is services that go beyond just Instant Messaging. Apps, games, word processing even, tablets, desktops, and now recently with wearables, and console apps/games as well. BlackBerry has 4 phones, an app store, a cross platform messenger, and a 3 year old tablet. That's really an ecosystem.

    Posted via the Android CrackBerry App!
    04-17-14 09:55 PM
  21. keepthetorch's Avatar
    I have seen the lack of knowledge and the shunning of the BlackBerry brand at most of the carriers here in the USA. The iPhone and Android devices dominate the market here and that's just the way it is at the moment.

    I have left my iPhone 5s and IOS behind and decided to commit to BlackBerry and OS10 and I not looking back. I have shown my z30 to everyone who has an open mind and wants to try something different. The response has been more positive then negative and I have even converted a few folks over to BlackBerry.

    I have discovered based on my experience that OS10 devices have to be promoted using a "hands on" approach and they will sell themselves.

    The bigger issue is that most all of the carriers are not selling someone a device based on what the consumer might need, they are selling based on what's popular and Apple and Android products are what folks want at the moment.

    I preach BlackBerry here in the USA all the time and even though my carrier T Mobile and BlackBerry are having their pissing match at the moment, I still proudly show my z30 to anyone who wants a device that will improve their productivity and provide them with a well built messaging and social app machine.

    I sure hope that the z3 will take off in the developing countries and provide BlackBerry with a larger user base for OS10. This will aid in more native app being developed and maybe one day in the future, I might see BlackBerry and T Mobile kiss and make up. Until that time, I am 100% committed to BlackBerry and I am not looking back.

    Sent from my z30 on T Mobile USA (10.2.1.2160)
    Nice post and refreshing. I hope they can get through this as well.
    04-17-14 09:57 PM
  22. raino's Avatar
    Foreign network? I'm talking about the BB10 devices in the U.S. they are all open to the NSA. That battle cry of security with BB10 means little if it uses normal cell towers.
    I never limited the conversation to US networks.

    Unless you are encrypting your device and all traffic (data, SMS, calls) you are always vulnerable.
    You really think a device level NSA backdoor would not be getting around encryption, especially when, for instance, iMessage's encryption has been challenged independently of this backdoor?
    04-17-14 10:01 PM
  23. keepthetorch's Avatar
    NSA = Not Sufficient Advertising
    Troy Tiscareno and lnichols like this.
    04-17-14 10:07 PM
  24. The Aficionado's Avatar
    BlackBerry should address the nsa hacking of bes.

    They acted like it was a 'rumor', and brushed it off. Everyone knows it's true, so the company looks dumb. I hope that internally, they are figuring out how to beef up the encryption of bes so this can't happen anymore

    Posted via CB10
    04-17-14 10:18 PM
  25. vrud's Avatar
    This despite the fact that consumers aren't on BES, so their communications really aren't any more secure than on any other phone
    Hmm, interesting.
    So, are you saying that if I don't have a BES connection that my messages and calls can be intercepted?
    I use BBM mostly for chats, BBM Video/Audio for calls.

    I do agree that if I use a 3rd party services such as clouds Email, cellular calls, etc. then it's up to the 3rd party provider to disclose my personal info or not. Based on the known supporters of the government reform, I wouldn't entrust my data to FB, Google, MS and so on.

    BlackBerry reported that BBM is not protected on non-BlackBerry smartphones due to OpenSSL bug (btw, does open implies that data is open to everybody?).

    Additionally, having the individual permission management, applications are better isolated on BB10 than let's say Android which minimizes the risk of malware stealing personal data.
    04-17-14 10:26 PM
131 1234 ...

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