[sf49ers]

And that tell me one thing. It's a port. I've never once seen RIM build an OS from the ground up in terms of base functionality and support for a new device. All they do is take the same old wicker chair OS from another BB, edit and change some of the code around while leaving stuff behind causing continuing bugs down the line for that OS and put it on the new model. I'm no super coder, but when I used to write stuff, I would always write from the ground up for the specific application. Now I understand that you can't do that for each and every device, but RIM needs a skeletal build of an OS. A concrete build that's so basic it's just a perfected shell that they can use for each of their model builds. I don't think we're witnessing this type of development map. I hate to say it, but everyone laughs at manufactureres that make just one model of smartphone and don't offer 50 billion variants, but the benefit to that is that they can concentrate on perfecting the OS code. Ask any BB developer and they'll tell you why they've stopped writing BB apps. The OS's are so fragmented from build to build and from model to model it's almost impossible to write the app once and export it for each model and expect it to work as intended. They have to spend extra time tweeking each variant for each model they plan on the app supporting. That's a big red flag on just how stable and streamlined the BBOS is.

Fragmentation is inevitable no matter what, a company cannot survive by making just one device, please don't quote Apple. Sooner or latter Apple will have to introduce another variant of iPhone otherwise they will be losing end because they will be catering to only a segment of people. As long as the growth curve if going up you are fine but when it peaks out there is no escape, look at Apple's PC line, iPod line and it is inevitable they will have to do the same with their iphone and ipad line too in the near future.

OS 6.1 and BB devices slated for 2011 and playbook is completely antithesis of what RIM has been doing in the past, the device screen resolutions, processors are different. Once OS 6.1 is base lined they can port it to any device they want and it how they work, as we know OS6.1 baseline is still work in progress. FYI.. they are getting enough developer traction and infact they added 5000 apps in the last three months, Webworks SDK in another important step in that direction of normalization of architecture across devices and platforms(QNX). Screen resolution adaptivity has been dealt in all recent API's and developers are shown how to leverage it in recent webcasts. Coming to the device in question, it is still work in progress and it is too early to comment on anything concerning software.

[sf49ers]

I think the software isn't gonna be anything groundbreaking with 6.1, but I think mainly it will be a speed boost.

groundbreaking? not expected but feature rich and speed boost? definitely yes.

[JRSCCivic98]

this is what I was talking about. The updated specs showed physical buttons on the bottom. If that was wrong, then the monaco is what we see in the video.No front facing camera though. And I highly doubt that it will have it. The first image of this device came out almost a year ago with that leaked photo we all remember with the guy and his thumb ring. And nothing has changed since then in the look. We all thought it was possible that the M sticker over the top right was possibly the front facing camera, and it may have just been a cover up for the LED for one reason or another.

And since this phone was in the works for so long, I can see why it wouldnt have that front camera or even LTE or that matter. RIM has a reputation for not thinking ahead. And considering that their new device time frame is so long in the making, thinking ahead seems to be something critical they need to adopt.

I hate to be grim about it but thats the mindset RIM has given me and many many others. Its a nice looking device from a design standpoint. But without LTE or that frontal camera, I dont see how a 2nd or 3rd quarter release is keeping up with competition. I'm trying, I'm really trying. And I'm going to hold out till this years outcome before I switch to give them a chance. If I feel they havent learned anything, I'm keeping my Bold until the iphone 5 comes to VZW

So basically, after 2 years (from concept design inception) we have this. I guess that means by 2014 we'll have LTE/QNX BBs.

[Shlooky]

Tooo laggy for my liking, already been burnt once with the Storm 1, not buying another laggy Storm.

[JRSCCivic98]

Lag is one thing, but no one's talked about app space under OS6.1 yet. If you're limited to the RAM portion again, that's still 768MB for OS (6.1 should be a fairly good size) and apps. The 4GB of internal storage is again just media as is the removable card. If people have MicroSDs for their pics and music/videos, that basically means 4GB of internal media flash is wasted on nothing. That's what happened with 1GB on my S1 and 2GB on my S2.

Something tells me no OS prior to QNX will solve this issue.

[UrbanGlowCam]

Lag is one thing, but no one's talked about app space under OS6.1 yet. If you're limited to the RAM portion again, that's still 768MB for OS (6.1 should be a fairly good size) and apps. The 4GB of internal storage is again just media as is the removable card. If people have MicroSDs for their pics and music/videos, that basically means 4GB of internal media flash is wasted on nothing. That's what happened with 1GB on my S1 and 2GB on my S2.

Something tells me no OS prior to QNX will solve this issue.

Agreed. I really hope they solved this by now. Don't forget who gave you your 100th thanks btw lol.

To be fair to the Monaco test device regarding speed, it actually loaded everything pretty quickly (minus the image). It was the ui/scrolling that was really choppy & slow to respond.

[aab81901]

Lag is one thing, but no one's talked about app space under OS6.1 yet. If you're limited to the RAM portion again, that's still 768MB for OS (6.1 should be a fairly good size) and apps. The 4GB of internal storage is again just media as is the removable card. If people have MicroSDs for their pics and music/videos, that basically means 4GB of internal media flash is wasted on nothing. That's what happened with 1GB on my S1 and 2GB on my S2.

Something tells me no OS prior to QNX will solve this issue.

I thought when Kevin made the Roadmap, he mentioned that the device will have the ability to store apps on media card (eMMC)? Maybe I was mistaken. Can someone clear this up?

[tack]

It cracks me up that some of you can defend a constant recycling of the same old bugs, introduction of new bugs and general issues with each OS release. I agree with Civic. There are lots of things I love about a BB, but the OS stability and reliability, especially revisions, is cr ap. Come on, we have applications listed at the top on many sites to make reboots easier instead of battery pulls. Hybrids are abound to fix issues. It has been like this since early BB OS versions. I would have hoped this device and software combo would have ran better at this stage, even with an early device/OS combo. The processor is 2x faster with more memory and it still lags and obviously has format issues. OS6 has been around for a bit now. Did they just think of a higher res device or did they plan that in? If they are just addressing it, does it not show a lack of forethought or how not current they are?

You can love BB's, but wow on defending the OS itself. Why are most of you panning for QNX if the current OS is so great? I expect like me you are wanting something more stable, managed and up to date. I hope it rocks, but please get real with the current state of things.

[i7guy]

Why are you panning a phone that hasn't even been released into production based on some prerelease video. If RIM releases a not for prime time phone I can understand it, but I would think they would have this under control given they haven't had a major platform upgrade in a while.

Of course I could be wrong, and the iphone 5 could also be a dud.

[Plazmic Flame]

The problem with the current BB OS is that:

OS 6 was a rehash of OS 5... but OS 5 was a rehash of OS 4.....

3 generations of BB OS and there is a lot of legacy code still in it and it's a complete mess imo. They really need a fresh start sooner than later.

[regulardude]

IMO the RIM's OS is doing fine, easy to use. And it's good for what it was made for: Communication.

[JRSCCivic98]

No, it really isn't. It has it's big faults in that as well now. It was good years ago, but not anymore.

[Bobcat665]

And we wonder why this forum is over-run by trolls. The illustrious JRSCCivic98 is a moderator yet one of THE biggest trolls of all! What's the use of a BlackBerry fansite when all this goes on?

[bighap]

And we wonder why this forum is over-run by trolls. The illustrious JRSCCivic98 is a moderator yet one of THE biggest trolls of all! What's the use of a BlackBerry fansite when all this goes on?

lol she is not a troll. Like many here including myself, she is/was a big BB fan, but hates all of these ridiculous RIM shortcomings. They really need to get their $hit together. It is becoming easier and easier to look at other devices IMO.

[Rooster99]

... What's the use of a BlackBerry fansite when all this goes on?

I love my brother but recognize he's not perfect, and if he's got green stuff between his teeth he'd expect me to tell him. Doesn't mean I'm not a fan. Tough love ain't easy, but it's more real than the other kind.

Besides, I'd thought this was a user site. If fan = blind worship and singing the Barney song, then I'm outta here.

Keep it up Civic - you're one whose posts I look for. I've learned a lot from you, and I suspect even if not everyone else likes what they read, they've learned too.

- R.

[tumer]

Once Qnx is on hh ios will have the oldest os can we start making fun of them then and ios has had the same look since release all they do every year is add a feature and say they invented it like the camera

[tumer]

And civic you should apologize for spreading false information I would think as a mod you would know better the memory problem has been fixed you can store alps on memory card on 6.1
You TROL!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[sf49ers]

ha ha, this is called glorified trolling in the name of positive criticism, the thread in which we discussed the amazing work done by Tat and QNX none of the so called glorified critics showed up to post even a single comment of appreciation in that thread but when there is something negative on the forums some people jump like a pack of wolves. BB users are the most level headed people of all the users across all other platforms and they know what their phones are capable of and love their blackberries for a reason and there is no need for a sarcasm.

[grover5]

ha ha, this is called glorified trolling in the name of positive criticism, the thread in which we discussed the amazing work done by Tat and QNX none of the so called glorified critics showed up to post even a single comment of appreciation in that thread but when there is something negative on the forums some people jump like a pack of wolves. BB users are level headed people and they know what their phones are capable of and love their blackberries for a reason and there is no need for a sarcasm.

This is well said.

Posted from my CrackBerry at wapforums.crackberry.com

[tack]

Oh I think the Playbook looks awesome, and I want to see an kick a-- QNX phone for sure. I just also try to keep things objective and talk about my own experience, which may differ from others. Many of you need to read the definition of Troll. It is someone who goes off topic or posts inflammatory statements / attacks. Discussing a alternative viewpoint about the subject at hand, despite being different from your opinion, is not trolling. Just because I am not gushing with positive comments and glorifying RIM does not make me a troll. I happen to want the BB platform to make a serious comeback. If it does, I will stay. I just don't think things look positive, and I think the last few years have sucked for those of us wanting a competitive touch screen platform in particular. RIM has messed that option up quite bad. I don't think the Monaco will erase that unless things are different than in this video and fast.

[JRSCCivic98]

ha ha, this is called glorified trolling in the name of positive criticism, the thread in which we discussed the amazing work done by Tat and QNX none of the so called glorified critics showed up to post even a single comment of appreciation in that thread but when there is something negative on the forums some people jump like a pack of wolves. BB users are the most level headed people of all the users across all other platforms and they know what their phones are capable of and love their blackberries for a reason and there is no need for a sarcasm.

lol, I can't be in all palces all the time. However, now that you want to talk about it; You didn't find the graphics they showed to be a bit cartoony on some of the things in the video. I did like the media viewer in the last little bit of the first video, but there was a bit of a jitter in there too. I think this is what most people pick at when they use RIM products. It seems RIM is trying really hard to do some graphic intensive stuff, but they don't use video acceleration from the chipset, they seem to like to use the main procs themselves for some reason to do stuff. Like in the video, the guys says one core is doing the rendering on the big screen and the other core is doing the local touchscreen controls. The CPU shouldn't be rendering anything. The GPU should if it has one... that's where the real power is, not in the CPU. GPUs are much more powerful at number crunching than CPUs are and can generally do equal work that a CPU can at lower speeds and because of the lower speed at lower power usage as well.

[jhimmel]

I love my brother but recognize he's not perfect, and if he's got green stuff between his teeth he'd expect me to tell him. Doesn't mean I'm not a fan. Tough love ain't easy, but it's more real than the other kind..

Except you might actually have something positive to say about the brother you supposedly love once in a while. Constant and never-ending negative posts say something else.

Posted from my CrackBerry at wapforums.crackberry.com

[BoldtotheMax]

Jesus, I don't know how you sleep at night Civic. I betcha you have an email reminder when someone posts anything positive or negative on a RIM product...and jump feverishly to halt all false pretenses on why people would support their BB's...

It is amazing you are a mod on here. You do nothing but hate on anything BB, yet are a mod on Crackberry...flabbergasted!

Yes, you speak in big words, very technical and have a lot of fans...most Android users, new or BB users who became frustrated...

if I saw more a mix of positive/negative from you, I wouldn't say a thing, but it is in itself amazing how you loathe such a product and yet are this high of a power on here...

Do what you will....

Posted from my CrackBerry at wapforums.crackberry.com

[sf49ers]

lol, I can't be in all palces all the time. However, now that you want to talk about it; You didn't find the graphics they showed to be a bit cartoony on some of the things in the video. I did like the media viewer in the last little bit of the first video, but there was a bit of a jitter in there too. I think this is what most people pick at when they use RIM products. It seems RIM is trying really hard to do some graphic intensive stuff, but they don't use video acceleration from the chipset, they seem to like to use the main procs themselves for some reason to do stuff. Like in the video, the guys says one core is doing the rendering on the big screen and the other core is doing the local touchscreen controls. The CPU shouldn't be rendering anything. The GPU should if it has one... that's where the real power is, not in the CPU. GPUs are much more powerful at number crunching than CPUs are and can generally do equal work that a CPU can at lower speeds and because of the lower speed at lower power usage as well.

It is foolish to claim that Tat is not using GPU on the playbook for video acceleration, they earned their bread and butter by doing some remarkable UI and in tech community they are regarded as the god of user interfaces, their cascades framework run in more than 40 million devices and they are better aware what is a CPU and a GPU and how to use it. Believe me Playbook is by far the smoothest table and even the iPad falls shy in comparison to it.

check out this video and listen what Tat ex-CTO has to say on how they leveraged the GPU and CPU on the playbook, this is something ground breaking and the demo has some crazy potential like one can play something on their large screen LCD TV connected to the playbook and at the same time do something completely different on the Playbook.

[UrbanGlowCam]

It is foolish to claim that Tat is not using GPU on the playbook for video acceleration, they earned their bread and butter by doing some remarkable UI and in tech community they are regarded as the god of user interfaces, their cascades framework run in more than 40 million devices and they are better aware what is a CPU and a GPU and how to use it. Believe me Playbook is by far the smoothest table and even the iPad falls shy in comparison to it.

check out this video and listen what Tat ex-CTO has to say on how they leveraged the GPU and CPU on the playbook, this is something ground breaking and the demo has some crazy potential like one can play something on your large screen LCD connected to the playbook and at the same time do something completely different on the Playbook.

Not only that, but it has also shown to have a much more interesting and capable interface. It has the motion of iOS while reaching even further. You can definitely see the GPU in use when zooming/panning around different applications. It really gives the user a more 3 dimensional outlook on what is going on at any given time. There are tons of transitional effects too. I think it will be even better once it is polished over time.

The only problem is, it's not here yet.