[newcollector]

Just read this article by James Brumley titled "Numbers Don't Lie":

"Say what you want about Google's (GOOG) Android and Apple's (AAPL) iPhone, and now Microsoft's (MSFT) Mobile Windows 7, chipping away at the BlackBerry's place in the smartphone world. The fact of the matter is Canada's Research in Motion Ltd. (RIMM) has increased annual earnings every year - significantly - since 2005. They were up 30.8% over the last year, and RIM is plausibly priced at only 9.2 times next year's expected earnings."

Needless to say, I am a happy BB user and investor.

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[jlb21]

For comparison, it would be nice to know what the same numbers are for Google and Apple.

[1812dave]

and there's this: BlackBerry OS Tops Apple's iOS in U.S. for November - Yahoo! News

[WillieLee]

For comparison, it would be nice to know what the same numbers are for Google and Apple.

For real comparison, it would be Motorola, HTC, LG, Nokia, Sony Ericcson and the dozens of other manufacturers. Of all of them, only Apple makes more profit than RIM in the smartphone sector.

[Erievon]

True. Android is not a hardware maker, just an OS providor. "Market Share" for android is highly deceptive, since they don't actually sell hardware (anymore). So split android into all its manufacturers and they all fall way short of RIM and Apple.

[lssanjose]

Anything with a Google name on it, is a sign of an agreement, or partnership. Little by little, Google is riding on the backs of manufacturers.

[howarmat]

riding all the way to the top of the smartphone world

[lssanjose]

riding all the way to the top of the smartphone world

nice way to top things off.

[stuaw11]

For real comparison, it would be Motorola, HTC, LG, Nokia, Sony Ericcson and the dozens of other manufacturers. Of all of them, only Apple makes more profit than RIM in the smartphone sector.

True. Android is not a hardware maker, just an OS providor. "Market Share" for android is highly deceptive, since they don't actually sell hardware (anymore). So split android into all its manufacturers and they all fall way short of RIM and Apple.

Why split them by manufacturers? Its the platform marketshare being stated. RIM is a platform too, not one device. If you wanted to do that then youd have to analyze each BB model separately too and discount rehashes on phones being the same except the camera and OS. Id bet any one iphone model killed in sales compared to any one model device of another device.

Just because RIM makes their hardware doesnt mean you automatically consolidate them into one stat with the same 50 phone Android has. Stats are platform based, how many people using that platform, not each device. That'd be irrelevant.

[skidooman93]

Why split them by manufacturers? Its the platform marketshare being stated. RIM is a platform too, not one device. If you wanted to do that then youd have to analyze each BB model separately too and discount rehashes on phones being the same except the camera and OS. Id bet any one iphone model killed in sales compared to any one model device of another device.

Just because RIM makes their hardware doesnt mean you automatically consolidate them into one stat with the same 50 phone Android has. Stats are platform based, how many people using that platform, not each device. That'd be irrelevant.

Your statement makes no sense. RIM is a OS and device. Samsung, Motorola, LG, etc. All make the hardware and farm out for the OS. You cant compare Android to a BB. The stats have been skewd campairing and andriod device to a BB. You need to compare a all samsung devices, or all motorola devices, or all apple devices.
If you are compairing operating systems. I have no doubt that android will run past apple and bb soon. There are many more devices with that operating system being released, because you have close to a dozen manufacturers at work. Compared to just 2 others. It is the same as comparing PC sales to Apple computer sales. It just doesn't make any sense to release numbers like these. All the other manufacturers are going to android OS instead of their own OS. So you are comparing "apples to oranges".

[_StephenBB81]

Why split them by manufacturers? Its the platform marketshare being stated. RIM is a platform too, not one device. If you wanted to do that then youd have to analyze each BB model separately too and discount rehashes on phones being the same except the camera and OS. Id bet any one iphone model killed in sales compared to any one model device of another device.

Just because RIM makes their hardware doesnt mean you automatically consolidate them into one stat with the same 50 phone Android has. Stats are platform based, how many people using that platform, not each device. That'd be irrelevant.

because the Article is about Earnings NOT Market share,

This is one Article your love of Marketshare isn't related too,

When talking Company Earnings, Google isn't really in the mix since they don't give their earnings from Android, nor do they break out the costs of Android

BUT Hardware Manufacturers are a little easier to get that information out of based on the breakdown of sales, that is why you'd break each Android Manufacturer out.


The last line of the OP was
"I am a happy BB user and investor."

You can't invest in Android, you must invest in GOOGLE, which is far more than just Android,
And don't say Apple if far more than iOS devices, because Apple is very much iPhone/ipod touch/iPad Mac Computer sales don't even hold a candle to their mobile sales.

[i7guy]

because the Article is about Earnings NOT Market share,

This is one Article your love of Marketshare isn't related too,

When talking Company Earnings, Google isn't really in the mix since they don't give their earnings from Android, nor do they break out the costs of Android

BUT Hardware Manufacturers are a little easier to get that information out of based on the breakdown of sales, that is why you'd break each Android Manufacturer out.


The last line of the OP was
"I am a happy BB user and investor."

You can't invest in Android, you must invest in GOOGLE, which is far more than just Android,
And don't say Apple if far more than iOS devices, because Apple is very much iPhone/ipod touch/iPad Mac Computer sales don't even hold a candle to their mobile sales.

Yes, just like you can't invest in ms windows, you have to invest in Microsoft. In addition, the percentage of computer sales of apple computers doesn't hold a candle to the percentage of sales of computers from every manufacturer running Windows.

[stuaw11]

And what do earnings show unless you are a company employee or stockholder?

NOTHING!!

[i7guy]

And what do earnings show unless you are a company employee or stockholder?

NOTHING!!

If earnings show nothing, marketshare shows nothing either.

Do you think I give one thought to how much marketshare a manufacturer has when I make a purchase?

[falconeight]

They should have more earning they spend less on research, development, and hardware.

[CGI]

I love my blackberry as a messenging phone. It's the best in that category.

But I have a Dell Streak for personal use and it does so much more than a blackberry on the internet and media side. No comparison!

Each has their place.

But I can see why the average Joe would migrate to Android or Apple.

[JRZLocal]

I predict Android will be the most popular smartphone operating system by the end of next year.

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[_StephenBB81]

And what do earnings show unless you are a company employee or stockholder?

NOTHING!!

Well a few of us ARE stockholders

AND earnings show that people are purchasing your products, and you are showing a sustainable growth for long term investment, you are a consistent earner vs a buy sell stock looking for high risk high return.

[stuaw11]

If earnings show nothing, marketshare shows nothing either.

Do you think I give one thought to how much marketshare a manufacturer has when I make a purchase?

I didnt know it was all about you

Earnings mean nothing to the average consumer. I HIGHLY doubt even one consumer walks into the carrier store and says hmmm which manufacturer I can pick here from had the highest gross profit last quarter

No, because people, generally, care whats popular (aka marketshare) unless they have a vested interest in the company.

EDIT*- AGAIN you show your clear personal motive and bias which few here or the public, besides ones that hold self-interests, truly care about.

Unless all companies are making near similar profit margins per device then that makes zero sense- If a company sells makes more profit per device they can obviously sell less devices and still make more profit overall. Not the case here, but profits dont show devices sold when compared to similar products without knowing margins. Just because you can hock cheap POS product and get a visible return doesnt make you a great company or even truly competitive.

And furthermore you can still be an earner and yet irrelevant in the marketspace of your type of product.

But again, none of this matter to anyone but people with vested interest in the company they support. Consumers buy what is popular, their friends have, see something they like, quality of past products, etc. This is loyalty and marketshare (the surveys so many BB fanboys have tried to discredit as irrelevant), clearly not earnings. Not one person I have ever met has bought a smartphone because of the stock price or earnings reports of a manufacturer.

[i7guy]

I didnt know it was all about you


And I guess Apple reins supreme then as one of the most profitable of them all. Kind of kills your theory.

Earnings mean nothing to the average consumer. I seriously doubt even one consumer walks into the carrier store and says hmmm which company had the highest gross profit last quarter

No, because people, generally, care whats popular (aka marketshare)

EDIT*- AGAIN you show your clear personal motive and bias which few here, besides ones that hold self-interests, really care about.

Unless all companies are making near similar profit margins per device then that makes zero sense- If a company sells makes more profit per device they can obviously sell less devices and still make more profit overall. Not the case here, but profits dont show devices sold when compared to similar products without knowing margins.

And you can be an earner and yet irrelevant in the marketspace of your type of product.

Apple is profitable but its marketshare isn't anything to write home about. Microsoft kills apple in o/s marketshare. Their marketshare in the smartphone industry is not dominating.

I do not believe people buy a product due solely to marketshare. And finally there's the old analogy of how many burgers macdonalds sold. Doesn't make them great just popular.

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[stuaw11]

We're talking smartphone marketshare, not PC or general.

As I said its not direclty marketshare % itself, but it does show the "popularity" of the device. Which does in fact drives buyers to products- what their friends have, what people they admire own, etc. This mentality is no secret.

Problem with the McDonalds analogy is that Apple sells a ton yet still has the highest quality time after time in every study done for 3 years now without deviation. If anyone is McDonalds its RIM throwing 50 different products out there trying to make a profit on large volumes of cheap devices with not too high quality.

[WillieLee]

And what do earnings show unless you are a company employee or stockholder?

NOTHING!!

Jeez, do you think if people are talking about earnings they might be shareholders? Again, why do you come into threads about the finances of companies if you aren't interested or have nothing to contribute?

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[WillieLee]

I didnt know it was all about you

Says the guy who comes into a thread about the finances of companies and decides no one is interested in finances.

Earnings mean nothing to the average consumer. I HIGHLY doubt even one consumer walks into the carrier store and says hmmm which manufacturer I can pick here from had the highest gross profit last quarter

Here's a handy tip. Next time you see a post that's talking about P/E ratios, realize that you are in the wrong place.

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[WillieLee]

They should have more earning they spend less on research, development, and hardware.

That's not true. As a percentage of revenue, RIM spends more than Apple on R&D.

Posted from my CrackBerry at wapforums.crackberry.com

[JRSCCivic98]

That's not true. As a percentage of revenue, RIM spends more than Apple on R&D.

Posted from my CrackBerry at wapforums.crackberry.com

They're either overpaying or they're researching stuff that's locked up at Area51 and we won't see until 2020. Lol


Oh wait, you said "as a percentage of revenue". Gah, you sneaky fella you.

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