[Troy Tiscareno]

As opposed to how many BB10 users?

Estimates are around 9M. As always, BB didn't give out the exact number, but some simple math puts it in that neighborhood. Those numbers are about 3 months old, so the impact of the Priv hasn't been factored in yet.

[Bbnivende]

The PRIV is just too expensive unless you NEED a PKB and you do not mind the slider concept. That leaves a lot of BB10 users off of the table.

[TgeekB]

Yes. We should also bring back outhouses and the horse and buggy.

[ohaiguise]

Who do people think they are, saying that people should not be allowed to buy something because it's not 'modern'? Such a modern form of fascism LOL! If there is demand for a product, and money can be made from it, it's absolute madness not to sell it. There are some companies that no longer buy BlackBerries, simply because BlackBerry no longer make legacy handsets. They have no interest in BB10 and buy cheap crappy Androids instead. Surely that's lost business?

[TgeekB]

Who do people think they are, saying that people should not be allowed to buy something because it's not 'modern'? Such a modern form of fascism LOL! If there is demand for a product, and money can be made from it, it's absolute madness not to sell it. There are some companies that no longer buy BlackBerries, simply because BlackBerry no longer make legacy handsets. They have no interest in BB10 and buy cheap crappy Androids instead. Surely that's lost business?

The problem is I don't believe there is enough demand for it nor are they making money. They are searching for a way to be competitive.

[BigBadWulf]

What I don't understand is this:

BB10 obviously failed, so they move to android and they came up with basically a BB10 clone.

They could have really recreated the BBOS experience, complete with keyboard and BIS, on powerful android

Beats me why they would go with the same complete failure of BB10 experience.

Because in their estimation (my opinion), the #1 reason BB10 didn't move enough units was lack of ecosystem. Porting over the features people love about BB10 to Android was a logical last ditch attempt at maintaining a hardware division.

Personally, I would still buy a highly spec'd BB10 slab today, fully expecting the ART to never advance, and it's usefulness diminishing within little more than a year. That option is beyond doubtful, so I'm sticking with my Z30 as long as it makes sense, then moving to an Android that suits me I'll load the BlackBerry features onto.

Missed ya Gino!

[Bbnivende]

Who do people think they are, saying that people should not be allowed to buy something because it's not 'modern'? Such a modern form of fascism LOL! If there is demand for a product, and money can be made from it, it's absolute madness not to sell it. There are some companies that no longer buy BlackBerries, simply because BlackBerry no longer make legacy handsets. They have no interest in BB10 and buy cheap crappy Androids instead. Surely that's lost business?

I would say that there is almost zero demand for new BBOS devices. There is still use in markets like Africa etc where devices are handed down within the family and BIS is an advantage.

[idssteve]

Yes, but the number of active BBOS phones has been plummeting - the most recent number was around 12M, down from 30M just a year ago. At that rate, it will be well under 1M by the start of 2017.

If these numbers prove true, that means 11M users who currently use BBOS will be migrating to SOMEthing this year. What part of not even TRYing to attract repeat business makes any sense? ??

[Bbnivende]

If these numbers prove true, that means 11M users who currently use BBOS will be migrating to SOMEthing this year. What part of not even TRYing to attract repeat business makes any sense? ??

Google Trends suggests that Regional interest in BlackBerry is highest in Nigeria, St. Helens, Jamaica, Dominican Republic, Indonesia, Venezuela and Honduras. BBOS users are world wide and not concentrated in countries that are interested in purchasing expensive PKB devices.

Posted via CB10

[BigBadWulf]

Well, I won't disagree or refute the other poster's claim. It's perfectly believable to me. Totally depending on apps he's running. My crew returned to 9900s from Q10s (long story) for about a year before Classic. We already knew better than to load it down with apps. I can't say how many of my crew dual carried during that period but I, and at least a few coworkers, solo carried 99s for that year (2014). Some of us just have no need for some popular apps. If I saw a spinning hourglass during that year, I certainly don't recall it.

The other possible caveat is that my crew disdains wall hugging and prefers to power our 99s with battery swaps. (Another long story). Those routine batt swaps likely also provides memory garbage cleaning functions. Which likely preempts spinning hourglass. ???

Our experience is that 3G & data services (including browsing) are typically available right after boot. Virtually simultaneous with voice. I depend on incoming email dings as audible alert that return calls are ready. Generally less than 3 minutes. Idk what to suggest. Too late now anyway but were you on Sprint or VZW? Our Verizon 9930s and Classic's experience delays in weak signal conditions??

The biggest delay is with BeWeather acquiring GPS. That might never happen inside steel industrial buildings. Classic's GPS seems faster and more robust than 99.

I typically swapped batteries, and wouldn't consider the majority of apps used "power hungry". I do have a lot of active BBM groups, many email addresses, heavily use my browser, and have a lot of indexed SD media storage. I use my phone almost exclusively, relegating my PC use primarily to upgrading. I'd say my signal provided by VZW was outstanding, in comparison to previous ventures with at&t and T-Mobile. If I had used my BlackBerry like you, I probably wouldn't have become nearly as enamored with it.

To each their own, seriously! I'm not trying to belittle how you use your 9930. I know I'm not the norm. My preference is to abuse the heck out of my smartphone, and take it to its very limits, then come up with ways to keep raising the bar, rather than restrict myself, and not suffer it's failings.

[Soapm]

I would take a 9900 running Android...

[Troy Tiscareno]

If these numbers prove true, that means 11M users who currently use BBOS will be migrating to SOMEthing this year. What part of not even TRYing to attract repeat business makes any sense? ??

The vast majority of the remaining BBOS users are in emerging markets, and BB really has nothing that is going to appeal to these people, most of whom are likely to buy newer, relatively high-performing phones in the $200 range - which is less than BB can make phones for and even come close to breaking even.

[belfastdispatcher]

Google Trends suggests that Regional interest in BlackBerry is highest in Nigeria, St. Helens, Jamaica, Dominican Republic, Indonesia, Venezuela and Honduras. BBOS users are world wide and not concentrated in countries that are interested in purchasing expensive PKB devices.

Posted via CB10

Who said anything about making them expensive?

[Bbnivende]

Who said anything about making them expensive?

Mr. Chen.

Posted via CB10

[belfastdispatcher]

If these numbers prove true, that means 11M users who currently use BBOS will be migrating to SOMEthing this year. What part of not even TRYing to attract repeat business makes any sense? ??

They gave up on the repeat business when they still had 60+ M users, and yes, it made no business sense.

Somehow they're still surviving though and they could turn it back if they really wanted.

But not with devices priced like the iPhone and high end androids. That's never gonna happen.

[belfastdispatcher]

Mr. Chen.

Posted via CB10

Mr Chen swings with the wind when making statements.

[roadblochd]

They should probably put some effort into saving BB10. BBOS, as nice as it is, is a bit past it now. And going Android full time will probably bankrupt them.

[belfastdispatcher]

They should probably put some effort into saving BB10. BBOS, as nice as it is, is a bit past it now. And going Android full time will probably bankrupt them.

BBOS is long gone, BB10 was DOA, they could make a BBOS clone using Android, as long as it generally maintains the same experience.

[idssteve]

They gave up on the repeat business when they still had 60+ M users, and yes, it made no business sense.

Somehow they're still surviving though and they could turn it back if they really wanted.

But not with devices priced like the iPhone and high end androids. That's never gonna happen.

It's been painful to witness their willful self destruction and the eager cheering encouraging them to their demise. Each step of the way I've tried to assume their market research resources dwarfed my pitiful sampling capacity. I no longer trust that assumption.

Even at this late date, its been suggested that Chen says he needs 5M sales this year to stay in handsets. Yet some forcast 11M BBOS users to migrate to SOME other platform THIS year and utterly zero effort is made, suggested, or even encouraged to sell anything resembling a legitimate replacement to these EXISTING customers. Unbelievable.

These customers obviously found a way to afford BlackBerrys 4+ years ago. They've obviously had other, less expensive, options available for these past 4+ years. How do we KNOW price is the only variable? ?? MAYbe they really LIKE their legacy BBs??? Maybe they're finally giving up on BB because BB has given up on them?

Maybe??? I KNOW I've felt that way for 4+ years, at least. But... BB's market research resources dwarf my pitiful sampling capacity... Lol.

[bobshine]

Who do people think they are, saying that people should not be allowed to buy something because it's not 'modern'? Such a modern form of fascism LOL! If there is demand for a product, and money can be made from it, it's absolute madness not to sell it. There are some companies that no longer buy BlackBerries, simply because BlackBerry no longer make legacy handsets. They have no interest in BB10 and buy cheap crappy Androids instead. Surely that's lost business?

Who do people think they are saying that BlackBerry should continue losing money by selling outdated devices!

Posted via CB10

[RubberChicken76]

I don't know what hourglassing or 10 minute reboots you are talking about. I've been using a 9900 for years and never once experienced that.

Then you're extremely lucky.

Perhaps you can make a video where you let all of your apps update through App World, showcasing the experience while the apps are updating on the device; then the reboot cycle and what that is like?

[RubberChicken76]

They gave up on the repeat business when they still had 60+ M users, and yes, it made no business sense.

Somehow they're still surviving though and they could turn it back if they really wanted.

But not with devices priced like the iPhone and high end androids. That's never gonna happen.

Well, you just march into Mr. Chen's office, flop your resume on the desk and say, "Get out of here Chump ... I'm the man to save the day!"

#armchairknowitall

[anon(8063781)]

Then you're extremely lucky.

Perhaps you can make a video where you let all of your apps update through App World, showcasing the experience while the apps are updating on the device; then the reboot cycle and what that is like?

Updates are so rare now that it's impossible to speak of "all" of your apps updating. It's one at a time. In my experience, reboot times on the last iterations of BBOS7.1 are no worse than on BB10.

Posted via CB10

[TgeekB]

They gave up on the repeat business when they still had 60+ M users, and yes, it made no business sense.

Somehow they're still surviving though and they could turn it back if they really wanted.

But not with devices priced like the iPhone and high end androids. That's never gonna happen.

Their preference for high priced devices lately is killing them. I think that's the main issue. BBOS, BB10, BB Android..... it doesn't matter. None of them are going to sell if priced higher than more popular models.

[TgeekB]

BBOS is long gone, BB10 was DOA, they could make a BBOS clone using Android, as long as it generally maintains the same experience.

Interesting.