1. d-tech007's Avatar
    Hi,

    I Have recently been working in a few of the well known phone stores here in the UK - O2, Vodafone, EE. Not as a staff member or merchandising but just a contractor working with the stores, and across all of these companies I've come to the conclusion that the sales staff haven't got a clue about BBos10 and are not interested in pushing the devices either.

    Comments from: I hate BB's, how do you get back to the home screen on these things? why would anyone want to buy a BlackBerry anyway? Etc

    Know I realise these comments were only spoken as I wasn't an actual customer but it does show that the staff are not really interested in BlackBerry handsets and if they they aren't interested and can't even operate the handsets how can they be pushing the idea of BlackBerry over android/ apple?

    As far I can see this has got to change if BlackBerry has any chance of survival within the consumer market.

    Thoughts welcome.


    Posted via CB10
    10-30-13 10:46 AM
  2. Uzi's Avatar
    yeah I think BlackBerry failed in marketing the awesome of BlackBerry 10 os in my country malaysia also very few people aware BlackBerry 10 so sad

    waiting for Z30
    10-30-13 10:48 AM
  3. felixweber's Avatar
    Well guess that is why they work where they work and why I never ask any kind of salesperson....

    Posted via CB10
    10-30-13 10:50 AM
  4. d-tech007's Avatar
    Very few of the staff I spoke to even knew about a "Z30" device let alone when or if it would be available in store.

    Posted via CB10
    10-30-13 10:50 AM
  5. v cheng's Avatar
    I was in a one of the big service provider's conference. The attendants were managers from their retail stores. None of them supported blackberry. In their opinion it's a dead product. This is a reflection of insufficient training from BlackBerry to the server providers and perhaps lack of incentives for the sales staff to push the product. Can't blame them for not pushing it when customers come to the outlet asking for iPhone or Samsung, it's a sale in the book already. Why bother convincing them to buy BlackBerry, they already have the commission in their pockets. They are there to make money selling the best products for them, blackberry is just another product. It is not surprisingly that they decided not to carry the product. Afterall they are not on consignment, the service provider has to pay for them.

    BlackBerry's hardware and software are great but their marketing lacks innovation. I guess it's a great tech company, with no selling skills and was complacent in a rapidly changing market.

    The products sell itself, only up to a certain point. It was great when you are the only kid in the block with a new toy, now everyone has a newer toy.

    I'm old school and love my new Z30. Had to buy mine from another service providers, pay to unlock it so that I can use it on Fido. But it's nothing new, been doing that since the Storm.

    I wish BlackBerry well.


    Posted via CB10
    10-30-13 11:24 AM
  6. ElGusta's Avatar
    The problem is people are not asking for BlackBerry devices anymore.

    If you walk into an athletic shop as a customer and pick up a pair of Nike or Adidas to try would you appreciate if the clerk averts your attention to a pair of hiking boots?

    BlackBerry branded their product as a 'tool'. In turn this has negatively affected the general consumers perception of the brand.
    10-30-13 11:52 AM
  7. geoffsdad's Avatar
    Clearly this is a major issue based on the amount of similar threads on Crackberry. As a company, I believe blackberry under estimated the negativity here in the US and Therefore had no contingency plans to deal with the carrier and sales rep negativity. Everybody wants to blame Marketing but I don't think throwing marketing dollars is going to overcome the sheer hatred some people have for BlackBerry. For those that don't believe the hatred exists in the US or believe hate is too strong a word, you are wrong. Hatred IS the correct word to use. Witnessed it on too many occasions. Again, people can blame blackberry all the want, and they may be right, but the carriers and control of their sales reps should share equal blame. The entire US rollout was a train wreck in part because of the US carriers. If BlackBerry is going to win over carrier support and sales reps, it has got to capitalize on the promise of QNX. In other words BB10 has got to do something that no other OS can do. THEN Market the H3ll out of that.

    Posted via CB10(BBM#22) on my Z10 featuring BBM Channel C0002FE04
    stackberry369 likes this.
    10-30-13 12:10 PM
  8. Troy Tiscareno's Avatar
    People keep saying that this is a "US problem", but how does that explain BB10's lack of sales everywhere else in the world? IMO, the problem is correct: people became incredibly frustrated with the limits of their BB devices (pre-BB10) compared to their friends' devices, and that frustration was compounded by the fact that many of them were issued BB phones by their workplace, so they couldn't just change phones when they wanted to. The longer they lived with those limitations, the more frustrated they became.

    BUT... I think this is a problem for the entire 1st World, and has been increasingly a problem for emerging markets as well, as affordable but good-quality modern devices have become available. To continue to call this a US problem is myopic IMO.
    dbiv5445 and Roo Zilla like this.
    10-30-13 12:57 PM
  9. dbiv5445's Avatar
    I agree, to much emphasis is put on the US.

    People keep saying that this is a "US problem", but how does that explain BB10's lack of sales everywhere else in the world? IMO, the problem is correct: people became incredibly frustrated with the limits of their BB devices (pre-BB10) compared to their friends' devices, and that frustration was compounded by the fact that many of them were issued BB phones by their workplace, so they couldn't just change phones when they wanted to. The longer they lived with those limitations, the more frustrated they became.

    BUT... I think this is a problem for the entire 1st World, and has been increasingly a problem for emerging markets as well, as affordable but good-quality modern devices have become available. To continue to call this a US problem is myopic IMO.
    10-30-13 01:17 PM
  10. Mr. Marco's Avatar
    People keep saying that this is a "US problem", but how does that explain BB10's lack of sales everywhere else in the world? IMO, the problem is correct: people became incredibly frustrated with the limits of their BB devices (pre-BB10) compared to their friends' devices, and that frustration was compounded by the fact that many of them were issued BB phones by their workplace, so they couldn't just change phones when they wanted to. The longer they lived with those limitations, the more frustrated they became.

    BUT... I think this is a problem for the entire 1st World, and has been increasingly a problem for emerging markets as well, as affordable but good-quality modern devices have become available. To continue to call this a US problem is myopic IMO.
    Apple has steadily been selling iPhone in more and more countries. And Android has steadily been growing in market share for years now.

    And quite frankly sucks for Blackberry that its "do or die" relies on the USA. Sucks that it rests with any one country for that matter.
    10-30-13 01:32 PM
  11. bb4life21's Avatar
    Clearly this is a major issue based on the amount of similar threads on Crackberry. As a company, I believe blackberry under estimated the negativity here in the US and Therefore had no contingency plans to deal with the carrier and sales rep negativity. Everybody wants to blame Marketing but I don't think throwing marketing dollars is going to overcome the sheer hatred some people have for BlackBerry. For those that don't believe the hatred exists in the US or believe hate is too strong a word, you are wrong. Hatred IS the correct word to use. Witnessed it on too many occasions. Again, people can blame blackberry all the want, and they may be right, but the carriers and control of their sales reps should share equal blame. The entire US rollout was a train wreck in part because of the US carriers. If BlackBerry is going to win over carrier support and sales reps, it has got to capitalize on the promise of QNX. In other words BB10 has got to do something that no other OS can do. THEN Market the H3ll out of that.

    Posted via CB10(BBM#22) on my Z10 featuring BBM Channel C0002FE04
    Nobody hates blackberry. Actually it's almost the opposite. The general public can actually care less about anything blackberry. All platforms gets criticism but crackberry always stays with post like this with people crying about hate. Apple sells millions of products and they still get joked on. BlackBerry products are under spec and over priced. Also top that off with delays. Not to mention after the delays nothing ever wows enough to warrant them. My z10 is an average phone at best. It's not the carrier or sales rep job to promote BlackBerry if BlackBerry isn't even doing it themselves
    Roo Zilla likes this.
    10-30-13 01:43 PM
  12. Mr. Marco's Avatar
    Nobody hates blackberry. Actually it's almost the opposite. The general public can actually care less about anything blackberry. All platforms gets criticism but crackberry always stays with post like this with people crying about hate. Apple sells millions of products and they still get joked on. BlackBerry products are under spec and over priced. Also top that off with delays. Not to mention after the delays nothing ever wows enough to warrant them. My z10 is an average phone at best. It's not the carrier or sales rep job to promote BlackBerry if BlackBerry isn't even doing it themselves
    Yeah good point. For a couple of years now more and more have come out to say that iOS is stale and that iPhone needs a larger screen and all that. Yet iPhone still sells like hot cakes.

    Way too much analysis and deep thought by many Crackberry folk here. The Globe and Mail article, Kevin can write his Blackberry book, etc. Doesn't really matter what anyone has to say because at the end of the day I believe it can be boiled down inept management at RIM/Blackberry.
    10-30-13 01:59 PM
  13. jhirizarry's Avatar
    I went the other day to an AT&T store to activate a Z10, just needed to insert a new Sim card and activate it under a new number. I had to yell to take away the phone from the guy as he was going to insert a pin in the mic hole at the top to get to the Sim. I opened the back door, removed the battery and told him where to put the Sim card, he has no clue as how to handle the Z10 at all. BlackBerry has to make moron proof instructions for customers and specially for sales reps at retail stores, as a form of quick start guide with pictures or simple diagrams, must include how to remove back cover, location and labels of sockets and buttons inside and out, and the gestures explained in a simple and short fashion. All this in one page.

    Z10STL100-3/10.2.0.1791 on AT&T
    10-30-13 02:28 PM
  14. bradu1's Avatar
    Well guess that is why they work where they work and why I never ask any kind of salesperson....

    Posted via CB10
    I believe you said in an earlier thread something along the lines that you always buy online. Very smart and efficient. However I think the vast majority do go to stores. I do, because when I've got my mind set on buying a phone, I don't want to wait even a day for it. I want it in my hands now! :-)

    Also, the majority of people are not phone geeks as we are obviously. We must be to be coming here. And those regular consumers are listening to the sales people. After all, those salespeople are supposed to be the experts. We can just punch holes in what they say because we choose to educate ourselves about the products.

    #IchooseBlackBerry10 (BB#25)
    10-30-13 07:01 PM
  15. BBThemes's Avatar
    Hi,

    I Have recently been working in a few of the well known phone stores here in the UK - O2, Vodafone, EE. Not as a staff member or merchandising but just a contractor working with the stores, and across all of these companies I've come to the conclusion that the sales staff haven't got a clue about BBos10 and are not interested in pushing the devices either.

    Comments from: I hate BB's, how do you get back to the home screen on these things? why would anyone want to buy a BlackBerry anyway? Etc

    Know I realise these comments were only spoken as I wasn't an actual customer but it does show that the staff are not really interested in BlackBerry handsets and if they they aren't interested and can't even operate the handsets how can they be pushing the idea of BlackBerry over android/ apple?

    As far I can see this has got to change if BlackBerry has any chance of survival within the consumer market.

    Thoughts welcome.


    Posted via CB10
    having worked for one of those companies in store for about 2 years, i can understand why salespeople dont like BlackBerrys, and dont like selling them. i can also understand why they dont know how to use them. i`ll try go a little in depth so people actually can see it from `the other perspective` if ya like.

    why some salespeople dont like BlackBerrys.
    I used to sell loads of BlackBerrys, obviously i like them and i was ok with sorting them, but even i could see some of the challenges. one example is the quality of the device. considering we used to send phones away for warranty repairs (all makes and models btw) there always seemed to be a high percentage of both 8520 curves and 9500/9520 storm models. now i never recorded the figures, so i wouldnt want to make any claims, but id say after the sony ericsson w595, probably the storms and curves were the least reliable, both in software and hardware.
    For clarity i should add at the time we had no way to load the OS in store, so a `nuked` device was a case of try explaining to customer how to do it, or send it to repair center. now some would be ok with it (i sent alot to CB and a video CB adam did on it) but naturally some werent. also lets not forget these issues meant your data was gone forever too. again this is in a world before BB Protect, so gone was truly gone.
    Naturally from a mix of returns, repairs and obvious customer upset at said repairs and data loss, it wasnt exactly a cheery ride for the salesperson sorting that with a customer complaining in your ear (to be clear i empathise with the customer on the situation, but lets say some people get awfully short fused about it, and rightly so i guess).

    Also from a sales perspective i`d have to hunt through the tarriffs and find the ones with the BIS packs on them, then faff about setting the device up, not too much an issue, until someone comes in to get BIS activated, and your stood there waiting 8 mins for a reboot after provisioning. again, thats sales time lost, and a customer having to come in with issues. it was what it was, but it did aggravate people for obvious reasons.

    Not knowing how to use them:
    Well heres the thing, i cant speak for any other store, but i must of seen our BlackBerry rep maybe 6 times during my employment there, and those would sometimes be fleeting visits. not one visit really was about how to use the device, or anything that id class as `technical` (service book resending for example), it was always just a general hello, how are things etc. there was a slideshow on the storm, but i didnt see any training material for any other BB devices while i was there, so i can only assume much hasnt changed.
    There was a launch of another phone though (i wont say which) and there was a multi module computer course on it which took about an hour straight to complete, and showed how to set everything up and basically all you`d need to sort a customer. naturally alot of those phones sold as salespeople were comfortable with setting it up and demoing it.
    And that raises another thing, at the time it was more about having dummy units in stores rather than working phones (that was reserved for the far larger stores only) so you never got demo devices to have a fiddle with. now this other phone launched and we got one of each model, a sim card and login details for some stuff so we could just wander round with it and demo it right away. BlackBerry? you obviously would do a demo for the customer, which meant getting out a unit, and booting it up. again, five to ten mins later and your showing them stuff, but no sim card, no BIS, so not much at all tbh.
    Also as a yardstick, when the iPhone 4 launched, we got sent a white and a black one, both loaded with a variety of apps (which killed my lunch time lol) and with pre fitted sims so we could show off the browser, the app store and all the other stuff. the 9900? didnt get sent a demo by BB, i ended up showing my 9900 off more than usual (while praying no customer dropped it) because when your jam packed on a weekend, waiting 5 mins for a phone to boot to demo it just doesnt cut it.


    Anyways, thats a few of the reasons why some salespeople feel how they do, and as i say, i can see where they are coming from in some regards. do you want to talk someone into a BlackBerry which might come back based on past experience (with no hands on time thats all you`d have) or do you want to sell them the most common ones that are selling really well and seem to have less issues?
    Add to that the fact i havent seen even ONE advert in the UK for the Z30, and its no wonder they aint doing so hot.

    Oh and dont believe everything you read sbout comission and such, its not like that for most places, in the UK at least.
    Roo Zilla likes this.
    10-30-13 10:37 PM
  16. geoffsdad's Avatar
    Nobody hates blackberry. Actually it's almost the opposite. The general public can actually care less about anything blackberry. All platforms gets criticism but crackberry always stays with post like this with people crying about hate. Apple sells millions of products and they still get joked on. BlackBerry products are under spec and over priced. Also top that off with delays. Not to mention after the delays nothing ever wows enough to warrant them. My z10 is an average phone at best. It's not the carrier or sales rep job to promote BlackBerry if BlackBerry isn't even doing it themselves
    Sorry I have to disagree. At work I have seen people in management positions stand before large groups and declare their dislike and embarrass the people in the room using BlackBerry. I have had a Sprint store manager sceam at the top of their lungs how much they hate BlackBerry when I asked to have my battery tested. I have heard it in carrier stores by sales reps. The attitude the CEO of Yahoo takes is the best example I can think of. There seems to be some bitter hatred there for whatever reason.

    Posted via CB10(BBM#22) on my Z10 featuring BBM Channel C0002FE04
    10-30-13 11:17 PM
  17. Z30Man's Avatar
    I looove my Z30 period!

    Posted via my BlackBerry Z30.
    10-30-13 11:33 PM
  18. Gator99's Avatar
    Well guess that is why they work where they work and why I never ask any kind of salesperson....

    Posted via CB10
    You nailed it with that comment. Your bang on.

    Sent from the future on my Z10.
    10-30-13 11:37 PM
  19. Roo Zilla's Avatar
    Well guess that is why they work where they work and why I never ask any kind of salesperson....

    Posted via CB10
    No need to be disparaging about an entire group of people. No need at all.
    bradu1 likes this.
    10-30-13 11:50 PM
  20. Roo Zilla's Avatar
    Sorry I have to disagree. At work I have seen people in management positions stand before large groups and declare their dislike and embarrass the people in the room using BlackBerry.
    I've also seen people make fun of people with BlackBerries, but it's not hate. People in general just like to make fun of other people. It's human nature. If it wasn't a BlackBerry, it would have just been something else. Perhaps the kind of shoes the person was wearing.
    10-30-13 11:53 PM
  21. felixweber's Avatar
    I believe you said in an earlier thread something along the lines that you always buy online. Very smart and efficient. However I think the vast majority do go to stores. I do, because when I've got my mind set on buying a phone, I don't want to wait even a day for it. I want it in my hands now! :-)

    Also, the majority of people are not phone geeks as we are obviously. We must be to be coming here. And those regular consumers are listening to the sales people. After all, those salespeople are supposed to be the experts. We can just punch holes in what they say because we choose to educate ourselves about the products.

    #IchooseBlackBerry10 (BB#25)
    Yeah that is right, just because I don't get why people still want to be tricked by salesperson. I never had any positive experience with them. Latest example : my parents went into a electronic retailer to buy a new expresso maker. Well, I have a bit knowledge and can tell you the only thing they did was to sell the 2. Most expensive machine and even lied about the specs and features....
    According to what I heard the only training they got is how to trick unexperienced people have buy expensive things they don't need...

    So do not complain about them : BlackBerry needs to offer them the highest margins and these stores will sell BlackBerry over all others.... regardless what customers need/want.

    Posted via CB10
    10-31-13 04:20 AM
  22. 3hb78ftg's Avatar
    Clearly this is a major issue based on the amount of similar threads on Crackberry. As a company, I believe blackberry under estimated the negativity here in the US and Therefore had no contingency plans to deal with the carrier and sales rep negativity. Everybody wants to blame Marketing but I don't think throwing marketing dollars is going to overcome the sheer hatred some people have for BlackBerry. For those that don't believe the hatred exists in the US or believe hate is too strong a word, you are wrong. Hatred IS the correct word to use. Witnessed it on too many occasions. Again, people can blame blackberry all the want, and they may be right, but the carriers and control of their sales reps should share equal blame. The entire US rollout was a train wreck in part because of the US carriers. If BlackBerry is going to win over carrier support and sales reps, it has got to capitalize on the promise of QNX. In other words BB10 has got to do something that no other OS can do. THEN Market the H3ll out of that.

    Posted via CB10(BBM#22) on my Z10 featuring BBM Channel C0002FE04
    Talk about hitting the nail on the head.

    The other setback that is over looked is the the sales reps will always try to sell their personal reference no matter what. It's just easier for them to sell something they know how to use because they will be able to answer the customers questions rather than tell them "I don't know".

    True story:

    I was at a local mall and passed an AT&T booth with a customer who was interested in a Z. The sales rep was fiddling with the phone and had this weird expression while tapping the dark screen.

    I turned around and walked up to him and said "let me help you" while swiping up from the bottom. The sales rep didn't like the fact that he looked like an ***** but until the customer asked "me" to show him how to use it and I agreed to show him on mine. The sales rep just watched and even threw in several questions.

    Long story short...the customer bought the Z and the sales rep thanked me for showing him how to use the phone. He even mentioned that he was going to get one for himself now that he understood it because he was actually fed up with his iPhone and only had one because everyone else does.

    I also mentioned to bother on them to forget about calling tech support for any questions and that they should look to CrackBerry for that.

    BlackBerry Z...my weapon of choice.
    10-31-13 08:24 AM

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