[SassyD]

Can someone explain what the hype is about the possible qnx phones? I see constant comments about wanting one.... what EXACTLY is so great? I'm probably going to get a new BB this month (hope) sooo... is this a mistake.

AND, with all of RIM's delays... is it actually possible that they will come out next year? Why would RIM put two completely different phones out so close together?

[_StephenBB81]

Can someone explain what the hype is about the possible qnx phones? I see constant comments about wanting one.... what EXACTLY is so great? I'm probably going to get a new BB this month (hope) sooo... is this a mistake.

AND, with all of RIM's delays... is it actually possible that they will come out next year? Why would RIM put two completely different phones out so close together?

QNX is the OS that the Playbook is built on,
What makes QNX so great is that it isn't built on a JVM like the Current BlackBerry OS, that is culminating with OS7.

QNX is a microkernel-based OS, which has received FIPS certification in just a few months with the PlayBook, showing it's inherent design with security in mind.

RIM has been working on an Android emulation layer to allow users to RUN Android applications within the Android emulator, this is expected to Also be on the QNX phone, opening up the BlackBerry users to the Android market place.

RIM promises that the first QNX phone will be dual core and if the playbook is any indication of build quality and features most expect the device will also have the apparently coveted Front facing camera, all of this makes people think that QNX will be the best thing for BlackBerry, and while I think it will be as well, it isn't worth it to me to skip over OS7 waiting for a QNX device that probably wont be the form factor I want

[southlander]

There is no evidence the QNX phones are coming all that soon. Likely RIM will announce them at BB World in the Spring and then best case scenario is early Summer release, in my opinion. So I will be getting one of the new, FAST, BlackBerrys asap.

QNX itself is not the OS entirely but rather the core of it. See the PlayBook for its BB Tablet OS to get an idea of what to expect. It is more powerful at its core than the current BB OS. Of course end user implementation can mean more than raw technical prowess. For example, the PlayBook OS has some rough edges that the phone OS's (even the older ones), don't. But these are more user-facing features that hopefully are not hard to add. Easier than the core architecture of the OS. So we all have our fingers crossed that RIM fills in the holes in the QNX stuff and delivers the BB phone OS, backed with QNX power! We will all see.

Posted from my CrackBerry at wapforums.crackberry.com

[_StephenBB81]

There is no evidence the QNX phones are coming all that soon. Likely RIM will announce them at BB World in the Spring and then best case scenario is early Summer release, in my opinion. So I will be getting one of the new, FAST, BlackBerrys asap.

Well Mike was quoted as saying we'd see it Early 2012, so I expect to see a QNX slab device by March 2012, and hopefully a QWERTY QNX device August 2012

[trsbbs]

If you wait for a QNX phone you may be waiting a while for Apps to go with it.

Hopefully they will roll the QNX phones out better and in a more completed form
then they have with the Playbook. The PB still is not done yet or even close.

QNX phones should be a game resetter for RIM, but it depends on how well RIM
executes the roll out.

Tim

[West Coast Flavor]

Bold 9900 is a great phone in the sense you know what you'll be getting. Qnx is all rumors. We have no idea when.. OR the form factors. Besides all touch. I think you'll be ok with the 9900 or any os7 device. Unless you like to keep up with the Jones'z.

Posted from my CrackBerry at wapforums.crackberry.com

[big_time2]

There is no evidence the QNX phones are coming all that soon. Likely RIM will announce them at BB World in the Spring and then best case scenario is early Summer release, in my opinion. So I will be getting one of the new, FAST, BlackBerrys asap.

That's probably what's going to happen. Oh wait. No. That sounds a lot like what happened this year. The summer is almost over and the phone that was announced at BB World is still not on sale.

Do you really think QNX phone will come out on time?

My bets are that QNX phones are not going on sale until the holiday season next year.

[sleepngbear]

There is no evidence the QNX phones are coming all that soon. Likely RIM will announce them at BB World in the Spring and then best case scenario is early Summer release, in my opinion. So I will be getting one of the new, FAST, BlackBerrys asap.

Well, there's no direct evidence, other than RIM stopping development of a 10" PlayBook in order to get the first QNX handheld out the door sooner. We've also heard repeatedly that they're targeting early 2012 for that, and that was before they put the 10" PB on hold. But, as dR said, that is not likely to be a form factor I'd prefer; so I'm planning to jump on one of the up-coming OS7 models as well.

[JAGWIRE]

The form factor more than likely will be a full touch like the 9860/9850, which most business people don't want. The QXN-OS phones are going to be RIM's way of getting into the 'fun-market', as in the regular people not the business sector. The hype is the fact that it will be a direct competotor or the iPhone5 and the Samsung Galaxy S II with having that <RUMORED>duel-core and <RUMORED>front facing camera.

[Phil DeLong]

That's probably what's going to happen. Oh wait. No. That sounds a lot like what happened this year. The summer is almost over and the phone that was announced at BB World is still not on sale.

Do you really think QNX phone will come out on time?

My bets are that QNX phones are not going on sale until the holiday season next year.

Given the time frames we've been facing this year just for OS7, I have to agree.

[sosumi11]

RIM has been working on an Android emulation layer to allow users to RUN Android applications within the Android emulator, this is expected to Also be on the QNX phone, opening up the BlackBerry users to the Android market place.

This is RIM's biggest mistake. Admitting the competition is better.

The reason nobody bought Macs for almost two decades is because of fear of compatibility with Windows. And this was true to an extent (PC's sometimes had difficulty ready Excel and Word docs created on Macs). It took years to clear this up, but it was too late.

Now there is a new OS War and it will be all about compatibility. Why buy a non-Android based phone to run Android apps? And to get only the ones that are approved by RIM which were re-submitted & rewritten by the developer?

RIM is very confused on their direction. Their main reason for their past success was the strength of security, yet they need apps in order to get mass sales. Why don't they build their OWN ecosystem before tapping into someone else's?

This is very similar to the cat and mouse game that Apple played with Real in regards to pretending a Real player is an iPod in order to have access to iTunes.

The only difference is that Android is "open source". At least until litigation is finalized.

[berklon]

The form factor more than likely will be a full touch like the 9860/9850, which most business people don't want. The QXN-OS phones are going to be RIM's way of getting into the 'fun-market', as in the regular people not the business sector.

We keep hearing how the enterprise is opening up more and more to allowing iPhone and Android devices. If that's the case, then a full touch device then RIM is smart for starting out with that - since it'll help them try to gain some share in the "fun market" while helping them try to maintain (or increase) their share in the enterprise.

[Wretch 12]

This is RIM's biggest mistake. Admitting the competition is better.

The reason nobody bought Macs for almost two decades is because of fear of compatibility with Windows. And this was true to an extent (PC's sometimes had difficulty ready Excel and Word docs created on Macs). It took years to clear this up, but it was too late.

Now there is a new OS War and it will be all about compatibility. Why buy a non-Android based phone to run Android apps? And to get only the ones that are approved by RIM which were re-submitted & rewritten by the developer?

RIM is very confused on their direction. Their main reason for their past success was the strength of security, yet they need apps in order to get mass sales. Why don't they build their OWN ecosystem before tapping into someone else's?

This is very similar to the cat and mouse game that Apple played with Real in regards to pretending a Real player is an iPod in order to have access to iTunes.

The only difference is that Android is "open source". At least until litigation is finalized.

I don't really see how they're admitting that the competition is better, they just know that there are more apps surfacing on Android based on sales figures.

After all, there are more options to develop on for Android, as opposed to just Java which is really all we have right now from RIM.

[southlander]

Well Mike was quoted as saying we'd see it Early 2012, so I expect to see a QNX slab device by March 2012, and hopefully a QWERTY QNX device August 2012

True but then we get into the whole -- what did he mean by "see it" thing. It's like the 60 days until native email. Or the OS7 phones released this Summer -- turning into possibly.. the *last calendar day* of the Summer.

Unless someone high up at RIM goes on record committing to a *release* by date X, I have to assume they are talking best case scenarios, etc. Technically we "saw" the Bold 9900 in April/May 2011 but I can't buy one right now in August. Not yet anyway.

[rollingrock1988]

The form factor more than likely will be a full touch like the 9860/9850, which most business people don't want. The QXN-OS phones are going to be RIM's way of getting into the 'fun-market', as in the regular people not the business sector. The hype is the fact that it will be a direct competotor or the iPhone5 and the Samsung Galaxy S II with having that <RUMORED>duel-core and <RUMORED>front facing camera.

I hate when people say this. They are moving into the direction that they need to move into- A device that is perfect for business and perfect for pleasure. People don't want to lug around 2 or 3 phones, a laptop, a tablet etc.

The QNX phones will make everyone happy. In my opinion it will bring RIM back in a huge way and solidify them in the smartphone arena.

This is RIM's biggest mistake. Admitting the competition is better.

The reason nobody bought Macs for almost two decades is because of fear of compatibility with Windows. And this was true to an extent (PC's sometimes had difficulty ready Excel and Word docs created on Macs). It took years to clear this up, but it was too late.

Now there is a new OS War and it will be all about compatibility. Why buy a non-Android based phone to run Android apps? And to get only the ones that are approved by RIM which were re-submitted & rewritten by the developer?

RIM is very confused on their direction. Their main reason for their past success was the strength of security, yet they need apps in order to get mass sales. Why don't they build their OWN ecosystem before tapping into someone else's?

This is very similar to the cat and mouse game that Apple played with Real in regards to pretending a Real player is an iPod in order to have access to iTunes.

The only difference is that Android is "open source". At least until litigation is finalized.

It's not admitting defeat. It's making their platform even stronger because you can have your cake and eat it too. You can have your Blackberry and have the android apps you want on top of all the other types of apps that can run on their platform (adobe air etc.)

[southlander]

It's not admitting defeat. It's making their platform even stronger because you can have your cake and eat it too. You can have your Blackberry and have the android apps you want on top of all the other types of apps that can run on their platform (adobe air etc.)

Agreed. The "problem" with RIM's strategy is it takes more time and patience than the internet onlookers are willing to give. It is frustrating to watch, but RIM is trying to do something no other company is -- keep the reputation of the world's most secure and efficient mobile device platform *intact*, while transitioning it all to a feature rich, highly scaleable OS and set of services. Adding the Android app player, if RIM pulls it off well, will give buyers that many more options with relatively little effort from RIM. I am sure RIM is doing this in part to allow for Android support in the enterprise, on its devices. Not just so people can run Angry Birds or whatever.

[lnichols]

After seeing the OS7 devices demo'd in all these videos, I'm now in no rush for the QNX phones. They look great, and the web experience looks great (maybe better than the competition). It will definitely get RIM some time to get QNX right.

[Economist101]

Agreed. The "problem" with RIM's strategy is it takes more time and patience than the internet onlookers are willing to give.

I don't buy this. I assume you're referring to QNX, and what that holds for future devices. Yet here's the problem: RIM just acquired QNX last year. It's not as though they saw the iPhone and responded immediately; instead, they saw the iPhone in January 2007 and 39 months later acquired QNX. Not surprisingly, within a year of the QNX acquisition they had the PlayBook launched, so it's not as though RIM's strategy took a long time to develop. The problem is that the strategy itself didn't roll around until 2010.

[southlander]

The "smartphone" arena is quickly turning into the "mobile and cloud computing" arena. That is going to be the major challenge for RIM. They are a full two cycles behind the curve.

They are behind in consumer-facing features and apps. Yet they are ahead of the curve in end to end security and services, and efficiency of data handling.

Things can happen. The world can go on and RIM can descend into non-existence if they are indeed on a totally wrong path.

Or shortly here we may start seeing lots more publicized security breaches as potentially less secure platforms get adopted. And then RIM comes out better because of all that.

Who knows.

[rollingrock1988]

The "smartphone" arena is quickly turning into the "mobile and cloud computing" arena. That is going to be the major challenge for RIM. They are a full two cycles behind the curve.

By adapting Android apps, they are indeed admitting defeat and failed past strategy. The CEOs spouted off for years, much like some posters here, about how apps are stupid and how no one is going to ever use a phone for anything more than talking, e-mailing and texting.

I'm sorry how is RIM not competing in the cloud arena? Last I checked there is blackberry protect which is cloud based. It saves everything.

Also- I used gmail so all my email and contacts are also stored in the cloud through them.

RIM doesn't do consumer email so it's not an issue. They have partnered with MS for the Office 365 cloud capabilities.

And no, again I will say they are NOT admitting defeat. No one knew apps would take off like they did. I didn't. What it is, good sir, is an amazing idea. It brings them on par with apps and allows them to have harness more than one style of app coding. Which is awesome and is foresight.

I am not disputing that they dropped the ball, but to say they are admitting defeat has always been an overstatement in my eyes.

[_StephenBB81]

By adapting Android apps, they are indeed admitting defeat and failed past strategy. The CEOs spouted off for years, much like some posters here, about how apps are stupid and how no one is going to ever use a phone for anything more than talking, e-mailing and texting.

By adapting Android Apps they are not admitting defeat they are admitting they don't have Apps and are launching a completely new platform in a world where Apps are important, They have the ability to do exactly what Android does and make an Emulation layer over their kernel just like Android so they are trying to get a fast app library.

it is a risky move because they risk not getting developer making native apps but it does kill a negative element of not having any apps to choose from.

[lnichols]

By adapting Android apps, they are indeed admitting defeat and failed past strategy.

By turning the Android OS into nothing more than an App in TabletOS, that can run other Android apps, they are admitting defeat?!? OK then, I'll take my defeated, FIPS approved TabletOS running the Android OS APP while keeping the rest of the data on the device secure over the alternative. In the meantime RIM will build up the Native TabletOS ecosystem. Different preferences for different people is what makes things great.

[mmcpher]

I like to read posts here from people who know the nuts and bolts and kernels of these devices, even though a lot of it goes over my head. I wonder if the early adopting beta users of the first QNX tablet will provide vital feedback to RIM that will help along and accelerate the development of the phone QNX OS? Maybe developers that have tackled the Playbook tablet QNX will have a leg up when it comes to apps for the 2012 phones. I hope that there will be greater synergy between the Blackberry phones and tablets when they are both running QNX. It is already an under-appreciated feature of the Playbook tablet.

[ADFXPro777]

QNX phones should be a game resetter for RIM, but it depends on how well RIM
executes the roll out.

Tim

I totally agree. When I heard that QNX technology was used in the world's most demanding environments (nuclear power plants, military tanks, massive corporate inventories, etc), I was blown away! A lot of my associates in business and IT also know about this and are eagerly awaiting the arrival of the QNX-powered Blackberries.

However, RIM must execute the marketing of the QNX-powered Blackberries accurately and aggressively, showing and convincing both enterprise and consumers the power of QNX.

If this is done effectively, mobs of people will attack their nearest cellular store, fighting for the QNX phones. Plus, like Apple, we may finally have our own "Church of Blackberry". (Lol)

Posted from my CrackBerry at wapforums.crackberry.com

[southlander]

I don't buy this. I assume you're referring to QNX, and what that holds for future devices. Yet here's the problem: RIM just acquired QNX last year. It's not as though they saw the iPhone and responded immediately; instead, they saw the iPhone in January 2007 and 39 months later acquired QNX. Not surprisingly, within a year of the QNX acquisition they had the PlayBook launched, so it's not as though RIM's strategy took a long time to develop. The problem is that the strategy itself didn't roll around until 2010.

Yes in retrospect RIM did wait too long to buy QNX. Not being privy to what all went on when they did, I could assume they wanted it sooner and it simply took a long time to negotiate with Harman (they owned it, right?). And then RIM did things as fast as they could. Or maybe RIM did -- behind closed doors -- decide to address the iPhone sooner than we all know. Perhaps they contemplated building an OS from scratch and then decided against it and settled on QNX. Not sure. Again anyone here that has no inside knowledge does not know all the things that happened. We have to take their admissions as to what mistakes where made.

I was talking more about the length of transition to QNX after it was bought and they stated that was the plan.