[Maxxxpower]

Oh no, not that "it's just marketing" myth again...

[TgeekB]

Oh no, not that "it's just marketing" myth again...

It's the go to comment. If only they had marketed.....
Some people don't want to look at the big picture, they're just looking for excuses.

[early2bed]

It's the go to comment. If only they had marketed.....
Some people don't want to look at the big picture, they're just looking for excuses.

Some of the other "go to" rationalizations to reach for when you think a product is great but others don't see it:

1. It's priced too high
2. Other people are sheep
3. Other people want to be cool
4. The sales channels don't push it enough
5. There's a conspiracy among the other competitors to corner the market
6. Governments are afraid of foreign competition
7. The executives have been planted to take the company down.

Notice that you have heard each and every one of these multiple times on these pages.

[kevwill6115]

Some of the other "go to" rationalizations to reach for when you think a product is great but others don't see it:

1. It's priced too high
2. Other people are sheep
3. Other people want to be cool
4. The sales channels don't push it enough
5. There's a conspiracy among the other competitors to corner the market
6. Governments are afraid of foreign competition
7. The executives have been planted to take the company down.

Notice that you have heard each and every one of these multiple times on these pages.

Lol exactly. Maybe people just don't want a BlackBerry phone. Then again, maybe I'm just crazy.

Posted via CB10

[Ethereo]

Lol. I predicted this epic Priv fail many months ago, BB could sell Iphones and it would be a flop, who inside this company thinks that PKB is a good choice for phones in 2015-2016?. The fail is bigger because they launched an obsolete product, at very high price, in a market where BB brand means only negative things, let the high prices to Samsung, LG, and the others which got good brand recognition. Seriously if you go Android, BB, you need a full touch phone at middle price, with very good Hw specs. The Priv was the nail in the coffin to the hardware division of BlackBerry.

[Bbnivende]

Lol. I predicted this epic Priv fail many months ago, BB could sell Iphones and it would be a flop, who inside this company thinks that PKB is a good choice for phones in 2015-2016?. The fail is bigger because they launched an obsolete product, at very high price, in a market where BB brand means only negative things, let the high prices to Samsung, LG, and the others which got good brand recognition. Seriously if you go Android, BB, you need a full touch phone at middle price, with very good Hw specs. The Priv was the nail in the coffin to the hardware division of BlackBerry.

Well it would have been better to have a lower price and an even lower priced all touch version with the same internals.

[bh7171]

Oh no, not that "it's just marketing" myth again...

Then explain why a slider BlackBerry (with at the time of release the second highest and possibly best chip in the 808 (better than the 810 arguably) and ALL the apps did not sell well? People are absolutely inept in regards to business and selling if you don't think marketing effectively and massively, in some cases, does NOT matter.

Z10 on 10.3.2

[roleli]

The Priv numbers are not that bad given it is a niche product any way and the high price. Most of the smartphone market is touchscreen devices and that market is going to be the deciding factor for the hardware division. Chen needs to learn from the Priv mistakes and make sure that the next blackberry android device can at least sell over 1.5 million. In order to achieve this I believe the mid range device has to be a full touchscreen device price at less than $400 and available on all usa carriers at the same time. Also, blackberry's mid range device must have equal or better specs than their android rivals.
Posted via CB10

I am in agreement with you... Only expanded to add a low-range device...

I would like blackberry to get input on the name of the phone from the general public at that will serve a little as marketing. Get a final list of 4 to 5 names and then make it know to the public that they get to choose the name by voting. If every thing goes well with the mid range touchscreen device, then release a classic form factor android device.

Excellent Idea... Chen needed you in September 2015

[howarmat]

Then explain why a slider BlackBerry (with at the time of release the second highest and possibly best chip in the 808 (better than the 810 arguably) and ALL the apps did not sell well? People are absolutely inept in regards to business and selling if you don't think marketing effectively and massively, in some cases, does NOT matter.

Z10 on 10.3.2

cost
keyboard
BB brand name
build quality issues
its one of 50 other android choices on a carrier website/store
still lagged behind on a few specs

[roleli]

By what magic will BlackBerry be able to sell a mid price device with the same or better specs than their rivals, who have massive economies of scale and buying power?

People seem to think North America alone. Look at what other lesser known brands have done outside of North America. Blackberry would find welcome reception in Indonesia and Africa with a low-mid range priced Android Device especially now that BBM is cross platform...

[bh7171]

cost
keyboard
BB brand name
build quality issues
its one of 50 other android choices on a carrier website/store
still lagged behind on a few specs

It's cost was again right with other "flagship" devices at the time. (Note 5, S6 Edge, iPhone 6s, etc) Build quality issues probably not unlike other "flagship" devices. (is it known for bending in a pocket or do screens crack at a higher rate than others? I have not read of quality issues here or on Android Central). Brand name BECAUSE a lack of marketing for years. (An Apple slider would have sold in the millions at its price) the launch was absolutely horrendous with a "carrier" exclusive and little to no marketing. This device has "all the apps" of the 50 other flagship devices with "secure" Android, consistent security updates, high resolution screen, very good rear camera and the option of a slide out capacitive touch physical keyboard. Again marketing.... (which includes timing, pricing, carrier exclusives, consistently timed "leaks", etc, etc, etc......

Z10 on 10.3.2

[app_Developer]

People seem to think North America alone. Look at what other lesser known brands have done outside of North America. Blackberry would find welcome reception in Indonesia and Africa with a low-mid range priced Android Device especially now that BBM is cross platform...

What has this to do with America at all?

What I'm asking is how BB can be price competitive with companies with much stronger buying power, such as the large Chinese and Korean manufacturers.

[Orange UK]

What pitiful Q4.


BIS down, projected 30% growth in software... can anyone remind me when 30% growth of anything BB happened

[roleli]

What has this to do with America at all?

What I'm asking is how BB can be price competitive with companies with much stronger buying power, such as the large Chinese and Korean manufacturers.

Maybe I missed your point and maybe missed my point.... You look at how the roll-out of the Blackberry BB10 and Android Devices have gone. The focus have been on a narrow group of carriers and countries North America....The phones have been priced high-end with people complaining about price and other factors. What does the brand ZTE, BLU, Alcatel, Huawei, have over Blackberry as a Brand. Blackberry low-mid range devices in the markets outside of the USA 2-3 years ago, even last year would be very attractive..

[crazy mazy]

Everyone is missing the point here, they actually sold more Privs this quarter than last, but BB10 sales declined pretty bad so overall devices sales down 100,000.

[aha]

Everyone is missing the point here, they actually sold more Privs this quarter than last, but BB10 sales declined pretty bad so overall devices sales down 100,000.

Priv was released a few weeks before the end of last quarter... so it was only sold for a few weeks in that quarter, of course this quarter will sell more.

PassportSQW100-1/10.3.2.2339

[DrBoomBotz]

Everyone is missing the point here, they actually sold more Privs this quarter than last, but BB10 sales declined pretty bad so overall devices sales down 100,000.

They priv was only available for 22 days last quarter and the Christmas season was in this quarter. I must be missing your point.

[app_Developer]

Maybe I missed your point and maybe missed my point.... You look at how the roll-out of the Blackberry BB10 and Android Devices have gone. The focus have been on a narrow group of carriers and countries North America....The phones have been priced high-end with people complaining about price and other factors. What does the brand ZTE, BLU, Alcatel, Huawei, have over Blackberry as a Brand. Blackberry low-mid range devices in the markets outside of the USA 2-3 years ago, even last year would be very attractive..

But the low-mid range is dominated by companies that are much larger than BlackBerry and that aren't employing thousands of Canadians with very high payroll taxes.

My point is that if BB were to make the same phone with the same specs as ZTE or Huawei, the BB version would necessarily be quite a bit more expensive. The Chinese manufacturers have much strong leverage over suppliers, and operate at a much larger overall scale.

BLU is the exception there, but even they are building toward being a high volume brand. If they don't become high volume, they will also fail just as BB has.

[roleli]

But the low-mid range is dominated by companies that are much larger than BlackBerry and that aren't employing thousands of Canadians with very high payroll taxes.

My point is that if BB were to make the same phone with the same specs as ZTE or Huawei, the BB version would necessarily be quite a bit more expensive. The Chinese manufacturers have much strong leverage over suppliers, and operate at a much larger overall scale.

BLU is the exception there, but even they are building toward being a high volume brand. If they don't become high volume, they will also fail just as BB has.

Thanks for the Clarity

1. Where are the Blackberry Phones manufactured? What was the purpose of the Foxconn partnership?
2. Even a little bit more expensive might be competitive but not $799 given the brand equity even as damaged as it is
3. Samsung and now Apple have been dabbling in the Mid-range market... Why does Blackberry feel it must be high-end?

[app_Developer]

Thanks for the Clarity

1. Where are the Blackberry Phones manufactured? What was the purpose of the Foxconn partnership?
2. Even a little bit more expensive might be competitive but not $799 given the brand equity even as damaged as it is
3. Samsung and now Apple have been dabbling in the Mid-range market... Why does Blackberry feel it must be high-end?

I don't think Foxconn is building the Priv. But it wouldn't matter, since BB would still have to add its own costs on top. It's not a matter of where the devices is manufactured, the bigger issue is how much BB must pay for screens and boards and SoC's compared to what larger players now pay.

2.) I don't think it can be just "a little more expensive". They could narrow the gap a bit, though, if they went to an all-touch phone. At least that eliminates some cost and complexity.

3.) Again, Samsung and Apple have massive of economies of scale. They can get screens and SoC's for much less cost than a small company like BB. Having said that, Chen did say he is considering going closer to mid-market, but I think that will be a real challenge. Apple can put the A9, for example, in their mid-range phone because they buy hundreds of millions of A9 chips. They aren't making them a few hundred thousand at a time like BB is.

[DrBoomBotz]

1. Where are the Blackberry Phones manufactured?

Depends on which phone you are talking about.

What was the purpose of the Foxconn partnership?

I don't think it was a partnership.
I think the goals were to get more cost effective manufacture and avoid import tariffs to the Indonesian market.

2. Even a little bit more expensive might be competitive but not $799 given the brand equity even as damaged as it is

The Brand "BlackBerry" is a liability not an asset.

3. Samsung and now Apple have been dabbling in the Mid-range market... Why does Blackberry feel it must be high-end?

BlackBerry tried the high-end because they can't compete on price so they went to the end of the market were price is less of an issue.

[thurask]

Where are the Blackberry Phones manufactured? What was the purpose of the Foxconn partnership?

Mostly Mexico, with limited production runs (employee phones, engineering samples, CDMA BB10 devices) in Canada and Foxconn devices (Z3, Classic) in China.

[mad_mdx]

You are dreaming. If it was a BB10 device it would not be on 3 major carriers in the US.

Posted via BlackBerry PRIV

Yes I'm sure that is helpful... not.

[roleli]

Thanks @thurask @app_developer @drboombotz for the answers.

So if you can't compete at the high,mid or low end then what?

[DrBoomBotz]

Thanks @thurask @app_developer @drboombotz for the answers.

So if you can't compete at the high,mid or low end then what?

Get out of hardware.