08-05-11 10:11 AM
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  1. JasW's Avatar
    Actually, I think it's quite a valid point made in the boldfaced section of the piece below. RIM overreacted to the iPad, and should have instead devoted itself to bringing out a QNX smartphone(s) instead of the PlayBook. (And the other valid point is of course RIM's underreaction to the iPhone in 2007).

    New OS 7 Phones Won’t Help BlackBerry’s Turnaround

    By KEVIN C. TOFEL of GigaOm

    Published: August 3, 2011

    Reminding everyone that they’re still in the mobile game, Research In Motion announced five new BlackBerry OS 7 handsets Wednesday. Actually, of the five, two were previously introduced: RIM showed off the BlackBerry Bold 9900 and 9930 in May, but those models haven’t arrived in stores yet. The BlackBerry Torch line will see three slightly upgraded models: The 9810 includes a slide-out keyboard, while the 9850 and 9860 are touchscreen only with the largest displays on a BlackBerry device yet at 3.7-inches.

    All five handsets run on BlackBerry 7 OS, which is a stop-gap platform until RIM transitions its smartphone lineup to the QNX-powered operating system it uses for the BlackBerry PlayBook tablet. That means for most, these new handsets are incremental upgrades in terms of software, because a new generation of BlackBerry handsets running a completely different operating system will be forthcoming. RIM expects carriers to begin selling the new handsets by the end of this month. AT&T has already announced it will offer the 4G BlackBerry Torch 9810 this month and later follow with 4G versions of the Bold 9900 and Torch 9860.

    In terms of software, RIM is touting a speedier Internet experience with an improved WebKit browser that’s 40 percent faster than BB 6 devices and twice as fast as older BB 5 smartphones. Helping to boost performance is RIM’s Liquid Graphics technology. The latest BBM client and voice-activated universal search add to the experience. On the hardware side, RIM is using 1.2 GHz processors to boost performance and high-resolution displays to improve the user experience. The new 3.7-inch screen of the Torch 9850 and 9860, for example is 800480 resolution. The two Bold models include support for near-field communication (NFC) chips that could be used for mobile payments. And high-definition video recording is a staple on the handsets as well.

    Still, when RIM announced the two new Bold devices in May, I said the upgrades weren’t aggressive enough. And although the new handsets show positive evolution and will surely sell to the BlackBerry faithful, I keep coming back to one thought: RIM is trying grow its smartphone business in 2012 with phones and a platform that evokes thoughts of 2010. That doesn’t mean these handsets will flop. Some will buy them and be happy — but not enough to counteract RIM’s slowing sales figures in a market that’s growing overall — but I say 2012 because we’ll be entering the final third of 2011 when the first of these new BlackBerry devices arrive. They’ll power sales (or not as the case may be) at least through the first half of 2012.

    Remember that RIM purchased QNX in April of 2010, mainly for the platform and strong Adobe Flash operation in the QNX operating system. Instead of building a new smartphone platform with the sale, RIM spent a year building a tablet, which in hindsight, may not have been the best approach. The tablet market is only just beginning; there’s time to build a solid product there and still compete. But the smartphone market is RIM’s bread and butter. The company should have made a fast transition to QNX on the handset where it would have benefitted faster from the tens of millions of smartphones sold every quarter.

    Ultimately, the problem for RIM’s handsets comes down to 2007, however. Apple introduced the iPhone that year, and only Google responded by creating a solid touchscreen experience and growing Android ecosystem in 2008. We’re closing in on 2012, and RIM’s best response is still in the works.
    New OS 7 Phones Won't Help BlackBerry's Turnaround - NYTimes.com
    scorpiodsu likes this.
    08-03-11 02:07 PM
  2. pbfan's Avatar
    work only on wifi. They don't understand system development, either. Actually PB sets up a good starting point for QNX phones.
    nliang likes this.
    08-03-11 02:15 PM
  3. Economist101's Avatar
    work only on wifi. They don't understand system development, either. Actually PB sets up a good starting point for QNX phones.
    On the contrary, I believe the assumption is that had RIM started with a QNX-based smartphone instead of a QNX-based tablet, the smartphone would have been cellular-capable.

    As for "system development," I don't see your point. I'm quite certain that RIM could have started with a phone if that was its decision.
    08-03-11 02:21 PM
  4. pbfan's Avatar
    "cellphone" components are integrated to the OS.
    It needs at these components to make a super phone and we have none of them:

    "Native" email components
    3G/4G data components
    JAVA player components
    "cellphone" components

    Another test stage is 3G/4G PB.
    Last edited by pbfan; 08-03-11 at 02:49 PM.
    08-03-11 02:34 PM
  5. missing_K-W's Avatar
    The decision to go PB first IMHO was a good decision....This allows RIM to solidify the OS, and have all critical issues dealt with at the launch of the phones...

    This gives RIM a window of 1 year+ to iron out the PB bugs and allow for a bulletproof phone OS....

    RIM is under an OS transition....most companies fail.....Transitions are painful....No need to rush the QNX phones...execute with the lessons learned from the maturity of the PB.....
    08-03-11 02:46 PM
  6. JasW's Avatar
    PB is necessary stage for testing ONX OS before

    "cellphone" components are integrated to the OS.
    It needs at these components to make a super phone and we have none of them:

    "Native" email components
    3G/4G data components
    JAVA player components
    "cellphone" components
    That doesn't follow at all. Why would developing, engineering, and releasing a tablet be necessary before one adds the other components? That's an awful lot of energy expended in the wrong direction. Unless, of course, you could tell me that RIM jumped right on QNX smartphone development out of the box and nothing in the development of the PB has hindered the timely development of the smartphone.
    08-03-11 02:51 PM
  7. southlander's Avatar
    In regards to the consumer market, consumers do not know QNX from Java ME. All they know is fast vs. slow, pretty screen, etc.

    These OS7 phones are clearly going match anything else out there speed wise. They look great. Benchmarks show the browser to be best in class, thereby 100% addressing the chief complaint about BlackBerrys.

    And with regards to QNX, there'd be a lot less apps support out of the gate. How is that better?

    So I cannot see the logic that says OS7 is a failure just because its roots are in an aged OS. If RIM revamped things and it's now awesome, it'll sell. If anything I'd argue RIM should have just gotten **OS7 finished sooner**. That's all.
    lotuslanderz likes this.
    08-03-11 02:57 PM
  8. lnichols's Avatar
    Blackberry can't release a phone that doesn't have e-mail, PIM, and the ability to get FIPS approved. It is what their core customers expect. As we can see from the Playbook, they are having issues getting the e-mail and PIM on QNX platform, and they just recently got FIPS. Also I have my doubts a QNX phone would have great battery life if available this second. The Playbook is working out these issues for the phones. Phones will now be FIPS approved day of release based on the broad security statement in the FIPS security policy awarded to RIM. Native e-mail and PIM from the Playbook development can be put into the phones. RIM's strategy may have doomed the Playbook to lackluster sales and bad press, but it certainly will be used to make the QNX phones complete at launch.
    08-03-11 03:00 PM
  9. ADGrant's Avatar
    The decision to go PB first IMHO was a good decision....This allows RIM to solidify the OS, and have all critical issues dealt with at the launch of the phones...

    This gives RIM a window of 1 year+ to iron out the PB bugs and allow for a bulletproof phone OS....
    They would have been better off spending the year developing a new phone instead of releasing an unfinished tablet.
    dynot, K Bear and Caymancroc like this.
    08-03-11 03:02 PM
  10. lnichols's Avatar
    They would have been better off spending the year developing a new phone instead of releasing an unfinished tablet.
    The tablet is the phone. Take the OS, the OMAP4 architecture, the front and rear cameras, and throw it in a 4 to 4.5" (hopefully closer to 4") chassis and add a radio and you have your QNX phone. It is the same thing that Apple does with the iDevice line. Obviously the Tablet is incomplete, so a phone would be incomplete now too. They are working out the issues with the tablet and will release the fixed product in a phone, and update the Tablet. They are going to revamp the UI to combine TabletOS and BBOS and then both the tablet and QNX phone will get this UI.

    The iPhone, iPad, iPod Touch, and AppleTV are all basically the same devices and same OS.
    08-03-11 03:11 PM
  11. scorpiodsu's Avatar
    I agree. RIM should have been working on QNX devices from the jump and left the playbook alone. The smartphone market is where the majority of the users are and that's where they should have been concentrating. I think the playbook would have been a good device for the beginning of 2012. One of the things is that now RIM put out the playbook, Google, Apple and Microsoft get to see the OS without it competing directly with their smartphone devices. Just a little backwards by RIM in my opinion.
    08-03-11 03:18 PM
  12. scorpiodsu's Avatar
    Blackberry can't release a phone that doesn't have e-mail, PIM, and the ability to get FIPS approved. It is what their core customers expect. As we can see from the Playbook, they are having issues getting the e-mail and PIM on QNX platform, and they just recently got FIPS.
    But thing is that maybe if they spent time on developing QNX on smartphones these things could have been done during the time they were working on the playbook. And no one is saying that the QNX phone should have came out when the playbook came out but more like this fall. But instead, RIM is using resources on the playbook. If those resources would have been used for smartphone development then a QNX with native email, FIPS approved and all the other stuff probably would have been possible this fall. I'm sure everyone with a playbook would trade their playbook and their blackberry for a QNX phone if it could have been available in the fall.
    08-03-11 03:25 PM
  13. lnichols's Avatar
    But thing is that maybe if they spent time on developing QNX on smartphones these things could have been done during the time they were working on the playbook. And no one is saying that the QNX phone should have came out when the playbook came out but more like this fall. But instead, RIM is using resources on the playbook. If those resources would have been used for smartphone development then a QNX with native email, FIPS approved and all the other stuff probably would have been possible this fall. I'm sure everyone with a playbook would trade their playbook and their blackberry for a QNX phone if it could have been available in the fall.
    The phone will be a small Playbook! When they get the things worked out you load the OS on MiniMe Playbook and voila, QNX phone! Everything that they are working on for the Playbook: Native e-mail, PIM, FIPS, Android Player, cellular radio stacks, Wifi Stacks, Bluetooth stacks, etc., will be used one to one in the QNX phone. The hardware will be repackaged into smaller chassis. The Playbook isn't delaying the development of the QNX phone, it is the development of the QNX phone.
    08-03-11 03:30 PM
  14. southlander's Avatar
    In the end the "order" of execution probably will not have mattered. Anyway you slice it, RIM will have built a QNX-based OS for its devices and also revamped the older BBOS all within 2 years or less while maintaining compatibility. All the bloggers act like there is some set deadline when there is not.
    08-03-11 03:43 PM
  15. aawilson's Avatar
    I would have definitely started with a tablet. I mean look at the iPad, everybody calls it an oversized iPod touch, because that's what it is. If I wanted to "test and perfect" any combination of software and hardware, I wouldn't contaminate my existing line of products, I'd create a new one. Also, the reason the QNX phone couldn't first has already been defended by Mike, he said they are waiting for a duo core processor that will fit in the phones.
    CBplayer and OneArseneWenger like this.
    08-03-11 03:57 PM
  16. Coffee Addict's Avatar
    As they say, hindsight is a wonderful thing! None of us will know, which strategy would have been successful.

    I think going for PB development first is less risky decision for RIM. Imagine, if they had come up with QNX phone first and it couldn't prove a success due to lack of apps and ecosystem for entirely new OS. They would have alienated a core customers. Now with PB in already in market, learnt lessons hopefully and it gives developers more time to bring out apps and build a ecosystem around QNX.

    My 2 pence worth!
    purijagmohan and LuisCast like this.
    08-03-11 04:49 PM
  17. Fuzzballz's Avatar
    There are two things that must happen to save RIM from becoming the Myspace of the cell-phone industry.

    1) RIM must survive between now and the time a QNX phone comes out.
    2) The QNX phone must be a show-stopper.

    #1 is likely, #2 is unlikely.
    08-03-11 05:58 PM
  18. CGI's Avatar
    The decision to go PB first IMHO was a good decision....This allows RIM to solidify the OS, and have all critical issues dealt with at the launch of the phones...

    This gives RIM a window of 1 year+ to iron out the PB bugs and allow for a bulletproof phone OS....

    RIM is under an OS transition....most companies fail.....Transitions are painful....No need to rush the QNX phones...execute with the lessons learned from the maturity of the PB.....
    1) Instead of getting QNX in multi-millions of phones they've shipped it in 500,000 playbooks.

    2) Because of the resource dedicated to the playbook, they've not released a new phone in >1yr.

    3) Their stock and reputation is taking a beating.

    Without question, without doubt, and without hesitation; the QNX Playbook was a HUGE mistake for RIM. Not that it's not a nice product... I'm talking strictly about the impact to the overall business.
    scorpiodsu and Shlooky like this.
    08-03-11 06:03 PM
  19. calicocat2010's Avatar
    The phone will be a small Playbook! When they get the things worked out you load the OS on MiniMe Playbook and voila, QNX phone! Everything that they are working on for the Playbook: Native e-mail, PIM, FIPS, Android Player, cellular radio stacks, Wifi Stacks, Bluetooth stacks, etc., will be used one to one in the QNX phone. The hardware will be repackaged into smaller chassis. The Playbook isn't delaying the development of the QNX phone, it is the development of the QNX phone.
    So basically we have a QNX phone it's just in a tablet.....I guess then we don't need to complain about QNX coming....Not.
    08-03-11 07:30 PM
  20. lnichols's Avatar
    So basically we have a QNX phone it's just in a tablet.....I guess then we don't need to complain about QNX coming....Not.
    Wow. No this idea that the Playbook delayed the phones is ridiculous. The Playbook development is paving the way for the phone to have everything a Blackberry phone has now. Why people can't grasp this is beyond me.
    08-03-11 07:40 PM
  21. missing_K-W's Avatar
    1) Instead of getting QNX in multi-millions of phones they've shipped it in 500,000 playbooks.

    2) Because of the resource dedicated to the playbook, they've not released a new phone in >1yr.

    3) Their stock and reputation is taking a beating.

    Without question, without doubt, and without hesitation; the QNX Playbook was a HUGE mistake for RIM. Not that it's not a nice product... I'm talking strictly about the impact to the overall business.
    1) The PB is RIM's "MOBILE COMPUTING" platform...in the future it will bring desktop capabilities to mobile computing....Smartphone's are a communications tool first...Now it would be foolish for RIM to not put a lot of resource's into mobile computing.....This product is long term ....with a long term evolution...The platform is only 3 1/2 months old...it requires time to mature...

    Are you aware of "PROJECT HIGHLANDER'....do some research...Future smartphone and tablet OS's will be one and the same (much of the development of the PB software will be on QNX phones)...RIM needs to solidify a mobile computing reach into government, aerospace, military etc ....markets that are outside of the consumer market place.....There is much industry certification and standards that RIM will obtain with QNX that ios and Android won't obtain....much of this high level security and certification for the segments of the market's I have mentioned above....

    2)QNX phones have been in development since 2010....The PB wasn't the main catalyst in BB OS 7 delays....a redesign and re-engineering of hardware was that primary reason...

    3)This can be the topic of much debate and discussion....

    Lastly how is "Tablet OS " a waste? In its current state it is in its mere infancy!!!!!The foundation is layed...it is just a matter of developing software for the platform now....RIM can address the consumer market with offering the gimmicks consumers seek with the Android support and focus on their strengths through in house software development focusing on delivering core functioning with very minimal resources allocated to consumer market support and concern which in reality is a very marginal entity of its own..The consumer entity revolves around software...software that can be simply emulated in the form of the Android App player..

    In the late 90's Apple was in a similar state in terms of their platform transition to ios and OSX...Apple was on the verge of bankruptcy.....RIM current financial state results in having cash on hand that equals 20% of their market cap.....I wish I had RIM's problems...

    RIM needs to focus on not only a "Mobile communications" platform......but also their "MOBILE COMPUTING" , platform. Which currently is supported on the PB......The intrinsic reality is that the PB software is in its infancy....It is only 3 1/2 months old....if RIM delivers on PIM apps, the Android Player , native email, NDK etc between 3-6 months of "tablet OS's" life....Then It will be a force to be reckoned with.....
    Last edited by missing_K-W; 08-03-11 at 07:45 PM.
    08-03-11 07:41 PM
  22. berklon's Avatar
    I think releasing QNX on a tablet first was a smart idea. Phones are RIMs bread and butter - you don't **** off your core customers of your core products by having them be testers for you. It would be extremely foolish to ruin the productivity of people in the enterprise while you tinker with things. Can you imagine not having access to your e-mail or your battery drains very quickly allowing you no use of the device?

    Where RIM messed up was not buying QNX earlier and not having the playbook out a year earlier - because a QNX enabled phone being released 3 or 4 months ago would've helped RIM out big time (assuming the QNX phones didn't disappoint). As it stands now, Apple will have yet another new phone out months before RIM finally gets the much needed QNX phone out - and Android would've had a few as well.

    Basically RIM should've gotten off their *** a lot earlier instead of being complacent.
    Last edited by berklon; 08-03-11 at 08:12 PM.
    08-03-11 08:10 PM
  23. calicocat2010's Avatar
    Wow. No this idea that the Playbook delayed the phones is ridiculous. The Playbook development is paving the way for the phone to have everything a Blackberry phone has now. Why people can't grasp this is beyond me.
    Dude, Chill. I was being sarcastic. I know the delay is ridiculous.
    08-03-11 08:14 PM
  24. Fuzzballz's Avatar
    So people are saying that the Playbook was merely an oversized beta-test of a QNX phone? Possible.. but not how I'd run a company. We'll see if it works out for 'em.
    08-03-11 08:16 PM
  25. lnichols's Avatar
    Dude, Chill. I was being sarcastic. I know the delay is ridiculous.
    Sorry man. Sarcasm is sometimes gets lost in translation on the Internets. I usually throw in my [sarcasm] .... [/sarcasm] tags.
    08-03-11 08:21 PM
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