02-27-16 09:26 AM
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  1. JeepBB's Avatar
    and MWC has never been an announcement place for them.

    I mean I have no clue about the future of HW division but what happens in MWC shouldn't be considered as relevant in that matter.

    Both the Leap, and the phone that became the Priv were announced at previous MWC's.

    The failure to announce the heavily-anticipated Vienna, or provide news on Marshmallow, or provide anything hardware related at MWC is (IMO) *hugely* relevant as an indicator for the likely future of Hardware (and also the future for BB's Android adventure).
    mikeo007, andy957, kirson and 2 others like this.
    02-25-16 03:15 AM
  2. Tim Smith2's Avatar
    I think that just about covers it. Nobody at BB is explicitly saying it yet but I think they have now given up the ghost and there will be no more BB devices.

    Sad but probably inevitable.
    techvisor, andy957 and JeepBB like this.
    02-25-16 04:13 AM
  3. bakron1's Avatar
    Myself, I feel the corporate numbers is April will determine wether the hardware division survives or not? I also think the lack of any news at the MWC was not a good sign for a once iconic brand. I also wanted to know if someone who was there at the MWC actually went inside the Blackberry booth to see what was displayed behind the door? Most of the pictures I seen showed a greeting desk in front of a booth.
    02-25-16 05:02 AM
  4. rthonpm's Avatar
    There's a lot of money to be made in the enterprise market. Is it as sexy and exciting as the consumer market? No, but there's also a different set of expectations. There's been some very interesting announcements from BlackBerry out of MWC, but they're on the MDM and security side of the house which has ALWAYS been the core of BlackBerry. Handsets have always been an extra component. Even at its peak, BlackBerry made more money from carrier fees for BIS than it ever did from hardware. They've always been selling a network solution more than they have anything else. Now the focus has swung back to those services, and the recurring income from them.

    Posted via CB10
    02-25-16 05:25 AM
  5. donnation's Avatar
    They just released a new device 3 months ago. In what universe do some of you people live in where you think that Blackberry is going to release a new phone every few months?
    02-25-16 05:52 AM
  6. bakron1's Avatar
    They just released a new device 3 months ago. In what universe do some of you people live in where you think that Blackberry is going to release a new phone every few months?
    Good valid point, I think a lot of folks where expecting the announcement of the Vienna.
    02-25-16 06:11 AM
  7. early2bed's Avatar
    They just released a new device 3 months ago. In what universe do some of you people live in where you think that Blackberry is going to release a new phone every few months?
    MWC, last year, was where they first showed it, though. Even though they didn't have anything ready, they glued something together to show the press and grab a headline. They wanted to show that they were still in hardware.

    It could be, though that their hardware program has thinned down to the point where there would be more uncomfortable questions than eye candy so they decided not to go there.
    JeepBB, techvisor and kirson like this.
    02-25-16 06:48 AM
  8. Bbnivende's Avatar
    They just released a new device 3 months ago. In what universe do some of you people live in where you think that Blackberry is going to release a new phone every few months?
    Potential customers wanted to know that the Vienna was coming - a roadmap . Is BlackBerry committed to making phones or is the PRIV the last. This lack of commitment killed the Z30.

    Posted via CB10
    JeepBB, neoberry99 and techvisor like this.
    02-25-16 07:07 AM
  9. wilber1's Avatar
    Apple did not release any devices at MWC either and the updated 5 SE is coming Soon. Perhaps another time (when not compared to the S7,G5, and all the other newer Android slabs) would be more beneficial?

    The White Knight-BlackBerry Passport
    However we all know Apple/Samsung will make new devices on time and I think Chen just sent us a message that I do not like but will accept for what it is .
    JeepBB, techvisor and andy957 like this.
    02-25-16 07:17 AM
  10. Dunt Dunt Dunt's Avatar
    Potential customers wanted to know that the Vienna was coming - a roadmap . Is BlackBerry committed to making phones or is the PRIV the last. This lack of commitment killed the Z30.

    Posted via CB10
    Agree... I don't think very many expect them to release the Vienna and start selling it. But at least give an indication that the hardware division was moving forward. So far we are holding with Chen's "cautiously optimistic".... which isn't really all that much to hold onto. As you said a Roadmap.... Android 6.0 in April, Vienna in June and the maybe a Passport like device by the end of the year (Their was talk of two "products" in 2016).

    I think Chen is smart enough to know that a lot of folks (Enterprise & Government) are waiting to see if the PRIV and BlackBerry Android move will be a success (and how secure they can make Marshmellow)... or just another short lived BlackBerry product. A hardware no show at MWC was not a good move IMHO, but neither is it a clear end to hardware. But ultimately we only have to wait until April 1st to get a better feel for if there was a reason for not discussing hardware at MWC.
    JeepBB, techvisor and web99 like this.
    02-25-16 07:32 AM
  11. JeepBB's Avatar
    Potential customers wanted to know that the Vienna was coming - a roadmap . Is BlackBerry committed to making phones or is the PRIV the last. This lack of commitment killed the Z30.

    Posted via CB10

    I believe BB *has* given you their answer ... Sometimes silence is deafening, huh?
    techvisor, TgeekB and andy957 like this.
    02-25-16 07:34 AM
  12. Smokeaire's Avatar
    I believe BB *has* given you their answer ... Sometimes silence is deafening, huh?
    Gregory (Scotland Yard detective): "Is there any other point to which you would wish to draw my attention?"
    Holmes: "To the curious incident of the dog in the night-time."
    Gregory: "The dog did nothing in the night-time."
    Holmes: "That was the curious incident."
    02-25-16 07:54 AM
  13. Superfly_FR's Avatar
    Both the Leap, and the phone that became the Priv were announced at previous MWC's.

    The failure to announce the heavily-anticipated Vienna, or provide news on Marshmallow, or provide anything hardware related at MWC is (IMO) *hugely* relevant as an indicator for the likely future of Hardware (and also the future for BB's Android adventure).
    Your take.

    Now, let's consider other options, as - for once - positive returns and sales.
    Given :
    1. These returns may tend to choose another form of device than anticipated ("Vienna" PKB) either for pricing considerations or simply usage.
    2. The current action of the board regarding shares (buy back program X2), before the good news are released (with subsequent SP raise)
    3. A possible (who said 'planned' ?) delay in the Marshmallow integration (I can already hear the horns if "Vienna" is released Lollipop)
    4. The will to keep the focus on enterprises novelties (let's pick MSFT Azure news, to pick the most massive one)

    Wouldn't that be enough to justify they're muted on the hardware part of the story and explain they didn't even spent $2K for a device display on their booth ?

    That looks pretty plausible too, isn't it ?

    P.S: if by "announced" you mean this (in my words, that's a "voluntary leak" - and half a fiasco ) ...
    I'm glad they didn't do it again ! [read : maybe they've learned the lesson ? => add it #5 above]
    No hint of BB devices a MWC- Is this now the end of Blackberry as a phone manufacturer?-mwc-recap6.jpg
    Last edited by Superfly_FR; 02-25-16 at 08:52 AM.
    bakron1 and sidhuk like this.
    02-25-16 08:14 AM
  14. Superfly_FR's Avatar
    Potential customers wanted to know that the Vienna was coming - a roadmap . Is BlackBerry committed to making phones or is the PRIV the last. This lack of commitment killed the Z30.

    Posted via CB10
    Based on what ?
    A rumor and a mockup released one (?) month ago with zero exposure besides some hard core mobile/tech fans sites ? Believe me, outside CB walls, there's absolutely nobody thinking Vienna is anything else than a great town near the river Danube in Austria, Europe (lol, I'm even very, very optimistic). Current potential customers just (if ever) learned BlackBerry released an Android device and it's pretty clear Chen's interest is not to double in right now while it's not even distributed everywhere it should (carriers).

    Something is pretty obvious : our (the typical CB members) level of expectations is pretty darn high; unfortunately, we tend to forget it and it sometimes leads to summaries caught by some so-called journalists like "(given what we read on CB) BlackBerry is about to kill their HW division".
    Chicken and eggs, again. Won't help. At all.
    Last edited by Superfly_FR; 02-25-16 at 09:06 AM. Reason: finetuning and a lot of Mhhhhhooooooos' ;)
    02-25-16 08:45 AM
  15. Bbnivende's Avatar
    It is the silence that is bothersome not just to fans but also to Enterprise users and even investors. I am not sure that BlackBerry has many users left who are not either fans or enterprise users. It was John Chen who opened the door on the speculation. They should have just said that there would not be a new phone to be showcased at the MWC.


    "In an interview with Bloomberg, Chen elaborated when asked about plans for another Android phone, "Depends on the Priv. If the Priv is well received in the market and looks like it is. There's a good chance [...], we will still focus on the high-end probably closer to mid-range coming out in 2016."

    Posted via CB10
    andy957 likes this.
    02-25-16 09:24 AM
  16. Blacklatino's Avatar
    I'm waiting for Chen to go on stage, rip off his jacket and shirt, and reveal a "BB10 is dead" tattoo across his chest.

    Anything short of that, and I won't believe it.
    Ugh.....I don't need any additional incentive to do extra pushups.

    LOL. I won't be surprised at whatever we hear/read from BlackBerry. Looking forward to some posting "but, they have $xx Billion in the bank" as a snappy comeback.
    JeepBB likes this.
    02-25-16 09:56 AM
  17. Superfly_FR's Avatar
    Investors : all they ask for is to drop the HW. There's a consensus about it (outside the BBRY section of this forum !).
    Chen's quote : where is it mentioned they will announce anything in MWC, 53 days after 2015 passed away ?

    Again, it all started with a rumor, that became somehow "plausible" then became certainty, in several brains.
    Just because there was a pic attached to it.

    Watch the timing, consider the "quiet period" (3 weeks before next E.R)
    FY Q4 2015 Quarter End: February 29, 2016 Reporting Date: April 1, 2016
    where basically nothing can be stated that would influence the SP.

    They need this time window (something like from now to mid-march) to focus on and spread their #1 message : "Hello : if you think EMM, you mean BlackBerry, whatever the platform, device or network".
    Not about a device, an OS version or its pricing, carrier support or wireless charging capabilities ... which would submerge the news #BlackBerry.

    I must admit that's me and my "reverse-engineering" way of thinking, but I won't be happy they'll do it otherwise.
    smart548 and sidhuk like this.
    02-25-16 09:59 AM
  18. mavsguy842's Avatar
    I don't think BlackBerry should've made a device announcement at MWC. BlackBerry needs to get away from announcing new devices so far in advance. They need to announce within a month or two of launch and there's no way BlackBerry is 2 months away form releasing the Venice; Verizon doesn't even have the Priv yet.

    Phone software progress is a better sign to me of a commitment to hardware than an announcement of a new device. I want Hub improvements, BBM video on Android's version of BBM, BBM integration into the Hub, BlackBerry Experience Suite for Android, and of course Marshmallow on the Priv.
    Superfly_FR and sidhuk like this.
    02-25-16 10:13 AM
  19. Dunt Dunt Dunt's Avatar
    Based on what ?
    A rumor and a mockup released one (?) month ago with zero exposure besides some hard core mobile/tech fans sites ? Believe me, outside CB walls, there's absolutely nobody thinking Vienna is anything else than a great town near the river Danube in Austria, Europe (lol, I'm even very, very optimistic). Current potential customers just (if ever) learned BlackBerry released an Android device and it's pretty clear Chen's interest is not to double in right now while it's not even distributed everywhere it should (carriers).

    Something is pretty obvious : our (the typical CB members) level of expectations is pretty darn high; unfortunately, we tend to forget it and it sometimes leads to summaries caught by some so-called journalists like "(given what we read on CB) BlackBerry is about to kill their HW division".
    Chicken and eggs, again. Won't help. At all.
    See I don't think Enterprise is as ignorant as you want to believe they are..... I think current BBOS/BB10/BES customers are fully aware of what is going on with BlackBerry, and are very concerned about the future and how it may impact them. They may not necessary be looking for the Vienna, but any kind of indicator that the Android "solution" is going to be long term. I doubt the few of them that just made the transition from BBOS to BB10 are expecting that BlackBerry's lack of new BB10 Devices (granted for just 2016) and the commitment for two minor updates is a good sign. They are watching BlackBerry.

    MWC is a time to talk about immediate plans and long term plans..... At the very least it was a missed opportunity to reassure customers. If Marshmallow is on track for a release soon.... why not mention it? Why not have the PRIV there and show it with at least a beta of Marshmallow and talk about how it offers better security?
    02-25-16 10:16 AM
  20. Bbnivende's Avatar
    I don't think BlackBerry should've made a device announcement at MWC. BlackBerry needs to get away from announcing new devices so far in advance. They need to announce within a month or two of launch and there's no way BlackBerry is 2 months away form releasing the Venice; Verizon doesn't even have the Priv yet.

    Phone software progress is a better sign to me of a commitment to hardware than an announcement of a new device. I want Hub improvements, BBM video on Android's version of BBM, BBM integration into the Hub, BlackBerry Experience Suite for Android, and of course Marshmallow on the Priv.
    In the entire world wide customer base of BlackBerry, Verizon is not a big deal. Also if BBM ceased to exist not a huge issue. Still I agree with you that BlackBerry has to show that they will continue to develop their OS.
    02-25-16 11:01 AM
  21. Superfly_FR's Avatar
    See I don't think Enterprise is as ignorant as you want to believe they are..... I think current BBOS/BB10/BES customers are fully aware of what is going on with BlackBerry, and are very concerned about the future and how it may impact them. They may not necessary be looking for the Vienna, but any kind of indicator that the Android "solution" is going to be long term. I doubt the few of them that just made the transition from BBOS to BB10 are expecting that BlackBerry's lack of new BB10 Devices (granted for just 2016) and the commitment for two minor updates is a good sign. They are watching BlackBerry.

    MWC is a time to talk about immediate plans and long term plans..... At the very least it was a missed opportunity to reassure customers. If Marshmallow is on track for a release soon.... why not mention it? Why not have the PRIV there and show it with at least a beta of Marshmallow and talk about how it offers better security?
    I absolutely get the point(s) and I weight it.

    1. Enterprises : they're on a 1 to 1 relationship at this point and the message is "whatever is your choice of device/platform, what we're setting up right now will fit; great eh ?" + "don't worry we'll get you covered on this aspect, but I'm not allowed to be more specific". And yes, it'll do the job.
    2. The Android "solution" is just that (as of date) : an android solution. With Good, Knox and Android for Work you can take pretty much any (major) Android device and lock it into BES.
    3. BB10 : I don't know. And I'd bet they don't know either when (and where) this is going. I can only repeat the same thing : "BB10 is going nowhere until BlackBerry or one of their subsidiaries gain the same highest level of accreditation than BBOS/BB10".

    MWC is indeed a place of announcements, and BlackBerry did their part. The fact is they choose to focus on EMM/IoT/Enterprises announcements (and all we can expect from that : MSFT Azure as a prelude to O365 integration, for instance: talk about a news !). They simply CAN'T blur the message with early announcements, as they've probably not spent a lot of resource on the "Vienna" either (and probably zero on (sales) marketing right now).

    IMHO, nothing on the HW front before FY2015 Q4 E.R, that's April 1st. Add a few weeks, let the flowers bud and start counting days of May to be ready in June. In the meantime, let's speculate (I am), that's fun, but MWC as a sign ? no, I don't buy it.
    02-25-16 11:45 AM
  22. Dunt Dunt Dunt's Avatar
    I absolutely get the point(s) and I weight it.

    1. Enterprises : they're on a 1 to 1 relationship at this point and the message is "whatever is your choice of device/platform, what we're setting up right now will fit; great eh ?" + "don't worry we'll get you covered on this aspect, but I'm not allowed to be more specific". And yes, it'll do the job.
    2. The Android "solution" is just that (as of date) : an android solution. With Good, Knox and Android for Work you can take pretty much any (major) Android device and lock it into BES.
    3. BB10 : I don't know. And I'd bet they don't know either when (and where) this is going. I can only repeat the same thing : "BB10 is going nowhere until BlackBerry or one of their subsidiaries gain the same highest level of accreditation than BBOS/BB10".

    MWC is indeed a place of announcements, and BlackBerry did their part. The fact is they choose to focus on EMM/IoT/Enterprises announcements (and all we can expect from that : MSFT Azure as a prelude to O365 integration, for instance: talk about a news !). They simply CAN'T blur the message with early announcements, as they've probably not spent a lot of resource on the "Vienna" either (and probably zero on (sales) marketing right now).

    IMHO, nothing on the HW front before FY2015 Q4 E.R, that's April 1st. Add a few weeks, let the flowers bud and start counting days of May to be ready in June. In the meantime, let's speculate (I am), that's fun, but MWC as a sign ? no, I don't buy it.
    No problem.... we all see things differently. Some of use could be walking in the woods and we see growing plum of smoke and we start going the other way. Others might need the smoke to build a little more before they become concerned, while others would actually need to see the fire before they could believe there was danger.

    Maybe there is a fire and maybe there isn't.... for me MWC was a little more smoke to an already pretty large plume. Think April 1st will help...
    JeepBB, techvisor and kirson like this.
    02-25-16 12:01 PM
  23. mavsguy842's Avatar
    In the entire world wide customer base of BlackBerry, Verizon is not a big deal. Also if BBM ceased to exist not a huge issue. Still I agree with you that BlackBerry has to show that they will continue to develop their OS.
    I didn't mean that Verizon was a huge deal (though at Priv's price point I do believe it is), just that if BlackBerry hasn't finished the rollout/production for the Priv I have huge doubts about their ability to manufacture a new device in ample quantities for a pending launch.
    02-25-16 12:01 PM
  24. Bbnivende's Avatar
    The design may be ready to go but the PRIV issues have probably slowed down the OS development. Also any new phone should have marshmallow. BlackBerry needs more to offer than the PRIV but maybe that is all we will get
    02-25-16 12:18 PM
  25. FCSC's Avatar
    Your take.

    Now, let's consider other options, as - for once - positive returns and sales.
    Given :
    1. These returns may tend to choose another form of device than anticipated ("Vienna" PKB) either for pricing considerations or simply usage.
    2. The current action of the board regarding shares (buy back program X2), before the good news are released (with subsequent SP raise)
    3. A possible (who said 'planned' ?) delay in the Marshmallow integration (I can already hear the horns if "Vienna" is released Lollipop)
    4. The will to keep the focus on enterprises novelties (let's pick MSFT Azure news, to pick the most massive one)

    Wouldn't that be enough to justify they're muted on the hardware part of the story and explain they didn't even spent $2K for a device display on their booth ?

    That looks pretty plausible too, isn't it ?

    P.S: if by "announced" you mean this (in my words, that's a "voluntary leak" - and half a fiasco ) ...
    I'm glad they didn't do it again ! [read : maybe they've learned the lesson ? => add it #5 above]
    Click image for larger version. 

Name:	mwc-recap6.jpg 
Views:	592 
Size:	256.7 KB 
ID:	392422
    I'm sure he's a nice guy, but I can't help myself from questioning why no one told him to button up his shirt before walking out on stage. It's a presentation and he looks sloppy showing his undershirt. Details I know, but still.
    02-25-16 12:45 PM
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