[o4liberty]

I am siked to see this device just hope they use all up to date specs not three years ago.

[howarmat]

That's what people said about TCL, yet demand for PKB phones continued to fall by 50% each year, as it has been since 2010. That meant < 400,000 in 2017, <200,000 in 2018, <100,000 in 2019, and a reasonable projection of around 50,000 in 2020. There's no reason to expect that trend to change. A 400-device order isn't exactly a game-changer.

I think they should see more demand since by the time this comes out the last BB device will be 3+ years since release and even the titan almost 2. So there would be many that would upgrade if they catch the cycle just right. But it will really depend on price and what type of secure phone they are aiming at. For all we know this is a complete lockdown phone with no play store aimed at 50k people in very certain enterprise situations.

[Emaderton3]

I think they should see more demand since by the time this comes out the last BB device will be 3+ years since release and even the titan almost 2. So there would be many that would upgrade if they catch the cycle just right. But it will really depend on price and what type of secure phone they are aiming at. For all we know this is a complete lockdown phone with no play store aimed at 50k people in very certain enterprise situations.

But then they may fall victim to the same pattern which isn't a profitable avenue after the first round or so, no?

[cgk]

If I understand correctly, BB Limited will have nothing to do with the distribution or support for these devices apart from licensing their name and maybe some technology they own. Every kind of enterprise sales, support etc. will be up to the new company, Onward. This is what Troy was saying.
(Correct me if I understand this incorrectly)

Yes - so when you are a corporate buyer - if something goes wrong it's nothing at all to do with Blackberry the company - you have no relationship with them.

[howarmat]

But then they may fall victim to the same pattern which isn't a profitable avenue after the first round or so, no?

yep very much so, not saying they wont. I guess Im saying anyone could throw out 1 device and probably sell enough but past that is when it becomes much harder.

[danielstefan35]

I have the feeling it will cost $1000 in NA and EUR1000 in Europe.

[grimlin]

No specs released and I'm already throwing my money at my screen for a pre-order, but nothing is happening.

My only wish right now is that the marketing teaser video where you see the phone zoomed in and slowing rotating is set to the intro to AC/DC's Back in Black...That would be epic.

[Byrese]

I think they should see more demand since by the time this comes out the last BB device will be 3+ years since release and even the titan almost 2. So there would be many that would upgrade if they catch the cycle just right. But it will really depend on price and what type of secure phone they are aiming at. For all we know this is a complete lockdown phone with no play store aimed at 50k people in very certain enterprise situations.

This. I think they're gonna make a lot of money, depending on how they price it of course.

[cgk]

I have the feeling it will cost $1000 in NA and EUR1000 in Europe.

For a device that is intended to appeal to corporate buyers - impossible.

Nobody is paying $1000 to a start-up with a non-standard form factor and a level of risk that they will even exist in a year.

[Chuck Finley69]

https://www.engadget.com/amp/5g-blac...175112005.html

This was a great informative video.

Acknowledged the carrier issue that many seem to want to deny. This company seems to have the crucial “political and operational” expertise to address the carrier issues.

Still lacking the most important answer which is to a “money or economic resources” question. I’m wondering if there’s a Sonim or Sonim backers related type relationship.

[phuoc]

I have the feeling it will cost $1000 in NA and EUR1000 in Europe.

It's needs to be half of that. Volume (sales) over profit first.

[Chuck Finley69]

For a device that is intended to appeal to corporate buyers - impossible.

Especially in the future COVID-19 economy. Curious if some of the backing and support could be strategic tax credits and leveraging bit of the Sonim targeted user market

[Chuck Finley69]

It's needs to be half of that. Volume (sales) over profit first.

That’s not possible at this stage of the mobile OEMs business situations and that business sector maturity stage.

The current economy and the fact that most consumers have devices already.

[idssteve]

Screw consumers. Stop chasing that flooded market. They won't buy ANYthing truly BlackBerry if you PAID them $1000...!!! FOR-PHREEKING-GET them! !!! Buyers who NEED this equipment are eager to PAY for it! Those who don't, won't.

Low volume MUST = high margin. Fact of life. $3000ea should be minimum. Plus an annual subscription fee for "updates". Plus a subscription fee for a built in VPN service. Plus a 3 year "upgrade" purchase option...

RIM's roots were enterprise/business/professional... Before idiotic consumers got involved... Leave consumers for Apple and Google... They're competently equipped for that. BB is NOT! Get BlackBerry back to its roots and KEEP it there, this time. Imo. Fwiw.

[bh7171]

I think they should see more demand since by the time this comes out the last BB device will be 3+ years since release and even the titan almost 2. So there would be many that would upgrade if they catch the cycle just right. But it will really depend on price and what type of secure phone they are aiming at. For all we know this is a complete lockdown phone with no play store aimed at 50k people in very certain enterprise situations.

If you listened to the podcast or have read any of the numerous articles you would know this will not be a "complete lockdown" device out of the box as they have considered consumers and BlackBerry fans into this endeavor.

[phuoc]

That’s not possible at this stage of the mobile OEMs business situations and that business sector maturity stage.

The current economy and the fact that most consumers have devices already.

Well, that sucks :-( how about $750 otd :-)

[bh7171]

No specs released and I'm already throwing my money at my screen for a pre-order, but nothing is happening.

My only wish right now is that the marketing teaser video where you see the phone zoomed in and slowing rotating is set to the intro to AC/DC's Back in Black...That would be epic.

Indeed it would.... 😎🤟

[cgk]

Low volume MUST = high margin. Fact of life. $3000ea should be minimum. Plus an annual subscription fee for "updates". Plus a subscription fee for a built in VPN service. Plus a 3 year "upgrade" purchase option...

(Apologies if this is a parody too subtle for me)

[Chuck Finley69]

[IMG=331x197]https://media.giphy.com/media/fDzM81OYrNjJC/giphy.gif[/url]



(Apologies if this is a parody too subtle for me)

I’m thinking @idssteve finds the price ok along with all the add-ons since blows his nose with $1 bills

[idssteve]

I’m thinking @idssteve finds the price ok along with all the add-ons since blows his nose with $1 bills

Frugality has its place. Tools of livelihood aren't that place. When a plant is suffering $3k per minute down time, or existentially critical client IP is hacked, NO one wants to hear that ANYone was using a bargain basement fire sale special...

Professionals use professional grade tools. Kenworths cost more than Hondas for a reason. Pro drivers, and their companies, are willing to PAY for the equipment they NEED.

[cgk]

Frugality has its place. Tools of livelihood aren't that place. When a plant is suffering $3k per minute down time, or existentially critical client IP is hacked, NO one wants to hear that ANYone was using a bargain basement fire sale special...

Professionals use professional grade tools. Kenworths cost more than Hondas for a reason. Pro drivers, and their companies, are willing to PAY for the equipment they NEED.

So you are saying "tools not toys"?

[hplovecraft]

In Today world there is no difference between a consumer or a business phone.

A Samsung S10 is in the hands of a 14y old girl making the next tic toc vid... is the same S10 in the hand of a CEO.

And yes, there will be more security software etc on his device.

Things do change.

Screw consumers. Stop chasing that flooded market. They won't buy ANYthing truly BlackBerry if you PAID them $1000...!!! FOR-PHREEKING-GET them! !!! Buyers who NEED this equipment are eager to PAY for it! Those who don't, won't.

Low volume MUST = high margin. Fact of life. $3000ea should be minimum. Plus an annual subscription fee for "updates". Plus a subscription fee for a built in VPN service. Plus a 3 year "upgrade" purchase option...

RIM's roots were enterprise/business/professional... Before idiotic consumers got involved... Leave consumers for Apple and Google... They're competently equipped for that. BB is NOT! Get BlackBerry back to its roots and KEEP it there, this time. Imo. Fwiw.

[hplovecraft]

On a different note.

I must say that it has not been so much fun discussing (fighting, whatever) about stuff here in some time.

[idssteve]

So you are saying "tools not toys"?

I'm saying that the RIGHT tool for the RIGHT job is typically the RIGHT thing to do. That's up to each use case. Clearly, BOA feels it needs a tool more right than what's currently available. My company feels a similar need. Few "consumers" will even grasp that. And they really don't need to.

BB utterly wrecked themselves chasing consumer unicorns while abandoning their "pro space" roots. Pros who need Kenworths COULD use much cheaper Hondas... But what consumer would pay the cross country shipping costs of THAT "savings"... ?

[idssteve]

In Today world there is no difference between a consumer or a business phone.

A Samsung S10 is in the hands of a 14y old girl making the next tic toc vid... is the same S10 in the hand of a CEO.

And yes, there will be more security software etc on his device.

Things do change.

That's a valid point... NO premium is worth the price without solid proof of what the user is actually getting...