[playbookster]

I'm half convinced that is what people are actually licensing (besides the name) - the apps but the versions that run on any version of android rather than a fully blown tweaked Android like we see on Dtek50 and dtek60. Then you only need the software team for the apps and can get rid of the rest and cut the expense down to the bone.

It's BB10 they are phasing out and Android software they are going all in on.

[cgk]

It's BB10 they are phasing out and Android software they are going all in on.

Yes I know that - my point is - it's not clear from what they have said that they are paying for Android in the sense of the version that BBRY runs on its devices with the apps baked in or people are paying for just the app suite that they will slap on a pretty stock android. The latter is much cheaper for both the licensees and for BBRY themselves because they just need an app development team rather than a larger team to deal with the wider complexities of Android.

[conite]

Yes I know that - my point is - it's not clear from what they have said that they are paying for Android in the sense of the version that BBRY runs on its devices with the apps baked in or people are paying for just the app suite that they will slap on a pretty stock android. The latter is much cheaper for both the licensees and for BBRY themselves because they just need an app development team rather than a larger team to deal with the wider complexities of Android.

BlackBerry has stated in a few ways that the BlackBerry-secured OS will be seen going forward. Without it, there isn't much to licence really.

[cgk]

BlackBerry has stated in a few ways that the BlackBerry-secured OS will be seen going forward. Without it, there isn't much to licence really.

Given low end consumers (given that is who the licencee is going after if we can trust translations) don't care about that how is blackberry going to charge a premium for that ? Or alternatively without charging a premium for that ?

I can just about see some value in the blackberry name for the low-end and cheapo devices but that really requires the licencing terms to be advantageous because they already have to pay google 'testing' fees and there is the MSFT tax.

If it is in with the Indonesian model I would guess that the joint venture got it as a song just so BBRY can point to a partner.

[conite]

Given low end consumers (given that is who the licencee is going after if we can trust translations) don't care about that how is blackberry going to charge a premium for that ? Or alternatively without charging a premium for that ?

I can just about see some value in the blackberry name for the low-end and cheapo devices but that really requires the licencing terms to be advantageous because they already have to pay google 'testing' fees and there is the MSFT tax.

If it is in with the Indonesian model I would guess that the joint venture got it as a song just so BBRY can point to a partner.

I guess we'll have to wait and see, but I see nothing in it for either BlackBerry or another company to just slap the BlackBerry name on some low end device.

[app_Developer]

I guess we'll have to wait and see, but I see nothing in it for either BlackBerry or another company to just slap the BlackBerry name on some low end device.

I think it could help in Indonesia, given their brand strength there. Maybe some version of this can work in Canada or SA also with mid range devices.

I hope BB will report licensing revenue separately in future earnings reports. Given Chen's track record wrt transparency, I'm not holding my breath for that, though.

[cgk]

I guess we'll have to wait and see, but I see nothing in it for either BlackBerry or another company to just slap the BlackBerry name on some low end device.

I'm not sure there is anything in it - I just think it's part of the transition and we'll see it all fold completely in a year or so when there are no other partners announced.

[conite]

I'm not sure there is anything in it - I just think it's part of the transition and we'll see it all fold completely in a year or so when there are no other partners announced.

I look at it this way. The investment is already made in hardened marshmallow, and is currently underway with hardened nougat. So they can almost give it away at this point because of the sunk costs.

Maybe $50 for both the hardening and the apps per device.

[bb10adopter111]

I look at it this way. The investment is already made in hardened marshmallow, and is currently underway with hardened nougat. So they can almost give it away at this point because of the sunk costs.

Maybe $50 for both the hardening and the apps per device.

Also, now that they are out of the device business, they could easily partner with Samsung or another manufacturer for an Enterprise-oriented Android phone. An additional $50 per device for that market would not be a problem. What I don't know is if they could employ the patented boot protections for that price, since that also involves the manufacturing process.

Posted via CB10

[cgk]

Also, now that they are out of the device business, they could easily partner with Samsung or another manufacturer for an Enterprise-oriented Android phone. An additional $50 per device for that market would not be a problem. What I don't know is if they could employ the patented boot protections for that price, since that also involves the manufacturing process.

Posted via CB10

Blackberry themselves don't find that a realistic option:

Pini admits that such partnerships are not likely to occur with Android’s biggest names, who have already developed their own in-house security and productivity offerings. The company is instead targeting what he deems “second- and third-tier” handset makers.

https://techcrunch.com/2016/09/29/bl...source=twitter

[bb10adopter111]

Blackberry themselves don't find that a realistic option:



https://techcrunch.com/2016/09/29/bl...source=twitter

I forgot about that. Thanks for reminding me.

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[anon(9607753)]

I look at it this way. The investment is already made in hardened marshmallow, and is currently underway with hardened nougat. So they can almost give it away at this point because of the sunk costs.

Maybe $50 for both the hardening and the apps per device.

Is it true they have actually committed to hardening Android 7?

[Troy Tiscareno]

Maybe $50 for both the hardening and the apps per device.

Oh, I *promise you* that we're in the >$20 per device territory. There's no way in hell that BB (or anyone) is getting $50 a device.

[conite]

Oh, I *promise you* that we're in the >$20 per device territory. There's no way in hell that BB (or anyone) is getting $50 a device.

A two year subscription to the apps alone is $24.

[conite]

Is it true they have actually committed to hardening Android 7?

Yes. BlackBerry said they are well into the project and working closely with Google. Expected time frame for completion is Dec-Feb.

[Dragnet Sound]

Yeah they must be working with Google, cause where do you think they got that dual screen operation. Yep from Work Wider on the Passport.

[Bbnivende]

A two year subscription to the apps alone is $24.

That is retail .

[conite]

That is retail .

Yes. But the suggestion was that no customer would pay $50 for the entire android package - hardening, apps, and all. We know that many are happy to pay $24 over two years just for the apps.

[Dragnet Sound]

Oh yeah about the Keyboard. From what get from what they said about touch sensitive Keyboard I think there would be no moving parts on it so I suspect that the full screen would be all one sheet of glass with 1/3 of the screen on bottom would have dimples like keys.(textured glass keys). That would be awesome you could do a lot of things with this application. Maybe I am over thinking again.
BB4ever.

[Jonas Hagglund]

It's time that everyone in here is understanding that Blackberry isn't going to manufacture their cell phones anymore. They have partners that design and make the phones and only the internal is from Blackberry. I personally think that this is a bad idea. The phone's won't sell.
Blackberry should keept making their own cell phone's and spend more money on marketing. A lot of people don't even know what Blackberry is anymore. I have talked about Blackberry with people in my surroundings and they never heard about the company at all.

[Slash82]

Again, this is a device-centric argument. BlackBerry is very clear on its corporate direction, and everything they have done reinforces that objective.

We see supposed missteps on the device front only because we care about it, and BlackBerry doesn't.

Yes, you are right!
And that new direction comes out of being "clueless" (I know that's a kind of harsh word for it) about a vision for their handset products.
As I wrote, software is straight forward - it just works.

[cgk]

Yes. But the suggestion was that no customer would pay $50 for the entire android package - hardening, apps, and all. We know that many are happy to pay $24 over two years just for the apps.

I don't find that realistic because you'd need to add google 'testing' fees on top plus likely the MSFT tax - you'd be getting on for maybe $60-$70 a device.

[Slash82]

I think it's not that - it's that they don't have the contracts in place - so it feels to me that they are maybe in talks with a company to license for a device that could be a keyboard phone and they are fairly confident that deal is happening but until the paperwork is done they don't want to confirm it.

I notice when they do mention partners, they stick very closely to this idea that it's china or india, they have never suggested or even hinted at a North America partner or even a European partner. So at present, on the very slim information we have, if it's not in Indonesian, it relies on a deal with china or India.

Yeah, that might be the case - but additional to that they have no vision about their (hardware) products.
Being successful is more than just "throwing" out a new device every year, with better specs - that only works for Apple.
To make impact you have to bring something new, something that will make people freak out - just like the iPhone did 10 years ago.

This might be harder in 2016 as back in 2008 - but now we have the hardware to make some visions come true, but when you only have a kinda different phone with a halfway app supported platform, that won't bring success.

What about Mike Lazaridis vision of a mobile computing platform?
He didn't say about "smartphone", he talked about "super phones" - that is what was on his mind!
What about whole new way how to use your smartphone?
Example:
Look what Microsoft was/is trying to do with their Windows 10-Phones - you are able to use those like a "mini PC", plug in a mouse and monitor.
That's genius and the first OS10 devices kinda were in that direction - smartphone and real "mini PC" in one device.
Spin that thoughts further in combination with IoT and set bars to make the iPhone and Android look outdated.
Maybe it's too late now for such dreams - but BlackBerry had the chance and the technology (especially with OS10s multitasking capabilites)!
And until now Windows fails in delivering a good experience with that.

It's more than sitting there and waiting for developers to jump on an new platform.
There are smarter people than me who get way more money than me to think about such things and make them happen.

[silversmith75]

I thought he said there was a pkb phone coming next?

#luvmybb10os

[Bbnivende]

Yes. But the suggestion was that no customer would pay $50 for the entire android package - hardening, apps, and all. We know that many are happy to pay $24 over two years just for the apps.

I think that Tony was talking about BlackBerry's take. Personally, I think that the price difference between the DTEK and Alcatel is too high for consumers but probably not for enterprise (if they bought non flagship phones).

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