08-26-16 08:50 PM
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  1. KAM1138's Avatar
    Hello Everyone,

    I'm of the opinion that Blackberry needs to be much more aggressive in marketing themselves, and rebuilding their brand.

    That's why I find the Blackberry Hub+ suite to be exciting. That's a make or break for me in regards to Android, and I HOPE that if other people get to experience the Hub they will find that it is a far better solution to their communications needs.

    So, I think this is an opportunity for Blackberry to again become THE name in Mobile communication--via their software, which is what they say they want to company to be about.

    So...what are they doing to market this? I've seen very little about it, and nothing in the "real world." I've heard all the arguments that Blackberry's failures in the past have nothing to do with marketing (you're all wrong, wrong, 1000 times wrong--it is definitely a component of their problems, among others).

    So, is Blackberry going to get out and push this promising Software that may appeal to many NEW customers as well as older BB users? Or are they going to keep repeating the same mistakes.

    Of course--perhaps I've just missed where they are advertising and marketing the Hub+ to consumers. If so, please anyone who has seen this, point it out. I'd love to see it.

    Because if this "software company" is failing to market its software as well...then something needs to change.

    KAM
    ardakca likes this.
    08-16-16 08:56 AM
  2. Dunt Dunt Dunt's Avatar
    I see a lot of BlackBerry needs to market threads here....

    And while I think marketing is always a good thing. I think you really have to consider how much marketing cost and what the potential "rewards" might be..

    This is some "game" where you can expect a billions of dollars in returns, thus spending a $100 million on marketing might be worth the cost. HUB+ is for an average user probably a little difficult to set up properly, and probably not nearly as exciting as blowing up your friends village.

    How many ads have you seen for non-game applications for mobile devices?

    I would expect that HUB+'s marketing will be focused on enterprise.. and will be part of BlackBerry's overall enterprise solutions.
    KAM1138, TGR1, bakron1 and 1 others like this.
    08-16-16 09:06 AM
  3. KAM1138's Avatar
    I see a lot of BlackBerry needs to market threads here....

    And while I think marketing is always a good thing. I think you really have to consider how much marketing cost and what the potential "rewards" might be..

    This is some "game" where you can expect a billions of dollars in returns, thus spending a $100 million on marketing might be worth the cost. HUB+ is for an average user probably a little difficult to set up properly, and probably not nearly as exciting as blowing up your friends village.

    How many ads have you seen for non-game applications for mobile devices?

    I would expect that HUB+'s marketing will be focused on enterprise.. and will be part of BlackBerry's overall enterprise solutions.
    First, I think you have to consider the position Blackberry is in.
    The "Reward" is potentially reviving the entire mindset people have that plagues your company. The Blackberry name is still continually met with "I didn't know they were still in business" reactions.

    People (here and other places) have argued "Well, Blackberry's responsibility is to their stockholders, etc" which is true. Ok--So, they've CHOSEN to make this product--the Hub+, and CHOSEN to claim they are a software company, so NOT marketing that product that they've invested in is insane.

    If they aren't planning on actually selling their software products to people (which is benefited by marketing), then what's the point? THIS is their product now, so NOT building their brand to a point that allows them POSITIVE name recognition is malpractice and incompetence.

    You know why there are a lot of "blackberry needs to market" threads here...Because that's something they need to do.

    If Blackberry's plan is to remain a Brand that people believe doesn't exist anymore, then they should keep on doing what they're doing. I fail to see how that's a good idea in any case.

    Honestly, I'm sick of the "They can't afford to do any marketing" argument. No, they can't afford to NOT do it--we've seen that result again and again with NOTHING they've tried taking off. The PRIV was touted (by some) as the thing that could save the company...well, how's that going? Not great, I imagine. The DTEK50 has some promise (and was probably a better starting point), and it has some minor Buzz around here, but not too much farther (yet).

    Sorry for all the Caps--I'm not intending to "yell" at you. You've made a reasonable response, but I guess I'm sick of the conventional wisdom about Blackberry's approach to things, which fails again and again. It is long past time to try something else.

    KAM
    08-16-16 09:17 AM
  4. Powdah's Avatar
    What will happen with the Hub+ software will be the same as Blend. Design software with great potential and then not finish the job.

    Posted via CB10
    KAM1138 likes this.
    08-16-16 09:40 AM
  5. KAM1138's Avatar
    What will happen with the Hub+ software will be the same as Blend. Design software with great potential and then not finish the job.

    Posted via CB10
    I wish I could say that your prediction was overly pessimistic. I'm not sure I can disagree.

    Blackberry has really promising products, and it just can't seem to capitalize on them.

    KAM
    08-16-16 10:00 AM
  6. Carrtman's Avatar
    The thing with the Hub and Hub + is simply about either wanting it or not. Personally I want different apps for sms, Email not one huge app.....but people that do already know and buy this thing.

    Take for example Photoshop there is no huge marketing needed because everyone interested knows what I can and can't do. BB doesn't have the money for a huge marketing campaign and even if they did pr for a app like the Hub and Hub plus would be very difficult to pull of if you expect results.

    If it's an app like a game sure that would make a lot of sense.
    08-16-16 10:19 AM
  7. KAM1138's Avatar
    The thing with the Hub and Hub + is simply about either wanting it or not. Personally I want different apps for sms, Email not one huge app.....but people that do already know and buy this thing.

    Take for example Photoshop there is no huge marketing needed because everyone interested knows what I can and can't do. BB doesn't have the money for a huge marketing campaign and even if they did pr for a app like the Hub and Hub plus would be very difficult to pull of if you expect results.

    If it's an app like a game sure that would make a lot of sense.
    The question is whether your potential customers know your product exists and if it appeals to them. I find it hard to believe that a general public that thinks Blackberry doesn't exist is aware of a specific product of theirs or knows what it can do.

    1) A customer can't decide if they want your product or not, if they're not aware of it.
    To answer this question, ask how many android users are aware of the Hub+ as an option. I'd be willing to bet a small percentage of them are.
    2) Those who ARE aware of this need to be convinced that Blackberry ISN'T a dead company that used to make some weird phones with keyboards that no one wanted and which didn't have apps (false I know, but they don't).

    So, it seems to me, that putting that product in front of people is the first step to selling it. Failure to do this, will insure failure of the product.

    In short--your comparison of Hub+ to Photoshop is not accurate (IMO). One is a ubiquitous product with a massive reputation, and the other is almost unknown.

    KAM
    08-16-16 10:33 AM
  8. ashane0001's Avatar
    Guys, requiring some feedback? i have been a Blackberry user many years. It finally came to an end this year with my beloved classic.

    Over to Sony and Android, when I saw that the function of Blackberrys HUB coming to all android 6.0 plus hand sets I was over the moon I am using it now?

    Question is " is it the same function as the two android handsets?

    Security " is this with Blackberry or a second or third supplyer?

    Love to know your thoughts

    It's pretty good. Not quite Up to BB10. early days yet
    Typically, this will kill that OS.!!!!

    Questions

    Posted via the CrackBerry App for Android

    Posted via the CrackBerry App for Android
    08-17-16 12:49 AM
  9. Powdah's Avatar
    Marketing could be as much as giving a few thousand phones (actually would be more like 10,000 phones) to various stores for employees to use. Also, teach them how to use them. If they like, they sell. Word of mouth really works
    08-17-16 03:54 PM
  10. bakron1's Avatar
    The problem they would face here in the USA is the Blackberry brand has all but been forgotten here and I personally think they would have to rebuild the brand image here first.

    But, with cash being scarce these days, would it be worth risking the advertising and marketing capital that would be required to rebuild their brand image here and honestly speaking, would anyone care?

    I can tell you from experience that Android and IOS are the dominant platforms here now and Samsung and Apple are the Titans of the market here.

    I think the Priv could have done something here if the price was more competitive with the other Android devices already available?

    Security is a major selling point for Blackberry now and I see that being more of a factor in the enterprise sector rather then the consumer side of things.

    I don't think the payoff in terms of devices sold would justify what it would take in terms on money to launch the type of advertising campaign that would be required?

    I think their best bet is to forge ahead in in the security software sector and be a niche brand and be happy with the results as long as the enterprise sales figures justify making devices?

    Only time will tell and based on what I have seen and read lately, it should be an interesting 2016. Just my 2 cents worth.
    Dunt Dunt Dunt likes this.
    08-17-16 04:16 PM
  11. bb10adopter111's Avatar
    The problem they would face here in the USA is the Blackberry brand has all but been forgotten here and I personally think they would have to rebuild the brand image here first.

    But, with cash being scarce these days, would it be worth risking the advertising and marketing capital that would be required to rebuild their brand image here and honestly speaking, would anyone care?

    I can tell you from experience that Android and IOS are the dominant platforms here now and Samsung and Apple are the Titans of the market here.

    I think the Priv could have done something here if the price was more competitive with the other Android devices already available?

    Security is a major selling point for Blackberry now and I see that being more of a factor in the enterprise sector rather then the consumer side of things.

    I don't think the payoff in terms of devices sold would justify what it would take in terms on money to launch the type of advertising campaign that would be required?

    I think their best bet is to forge ahead in in the security software sector and be a niche brand and be happy with the results as long as the enterprise sales figures justify making devices?

    Only time will tell and based on what I have seen and read lately, it should be an interesting 2016. Just my 2 cents worth.
    I think you're spot on in your analysis. Blackberry has always been focused on Enterprise solutions. Their mistake was that, when consumers started buying their phones in the mid '00s, they started to think they were good at the mass consumer market. In fact, they didn't understand the market at all, but consumers were so happy to get email on their phone that they bought RIM's phones despite the fact that they had been developed for fleets.

    Blackberry needs to stay focused on the market that it understands, which is Enterprise. Moreover, it's likely to be a growing niche with sustainable advantages as Enterprises continue to increase their focus on securing their digital resources.

    Posted via CB10
    bakron1, TGR1 and Troy Tiscareno like this.
    08-17-16 10:59 PM
  12. KAM1138's Avatar
    The problem they would face here in the USA is the Blackberry brand has all but been forgotten here and I personally think they would have to rebuild the brand image here first.

    But, with cash being scarce these days, would it be worth risking the advertising and marketing capital that would be required to rebuild their brand image here and honestly speaking, would anyone care?
    First--I was BEGGING for Blackberry to rebuild their Brand image, PRIOR to launching BB10. Clearly, they did not. Yes OF COURSE they need to rebuild their brand image--at least with whatever market they're hoping to work in.

    So, the issue is whether they want to be in the business that they are continuing to produce products for or not?
    If the answer is yes, then they need to market themselves and rebuild their brand. If not, then they need to stop playing around and focus on whatever it is that they think can succeed.

    You don't ask whether it is worth the "risk" marketing AFTER you've spent the money on developing the product.
    You don't make a Product (of any kind) and NOT promote it, and just hope that things work out--at least not if you're in BBRY's position. Yet, that's the same mistake that people keep justifying Blackberry Making again and again...and again.

    People keep talking about what BlackBerry can afford to do. Wrong. It's about what they can't afford to NOT do.
    If they are going to be in the business of selling products to consumers (of whatever level), then they need to MARKET to that Consumer. Period, end of story. If you can't afford that, and aren't willing to make that investment, then stop wasting money on producing the product that is guaranteed to fail due to lack of marketing.

    Seriously--the argument I've heard all this time is:
    Well, we don't have enough money to market our product, but let's go ahead and waste the money on developing the product anyway.
    They're either making the investment in the WHOLE PACKAGE, or they're not.

    KAM
    Powdah likes this.
    08-18-16 10:12 AM
  13. KAM1138's Avatar
    I think you're spot on in your analysis. Blackberry has always been focused on Enterprise solutions. Their mistake was that, when consumers started buying their phones in the mid '00s, they started to think they were good at the mass consumer market. In fact, they didn't understand the market at all, but consumers were so happy to get email on their phone that they bought RIM's phones despite the fact that they had been developed for fleets.

    Blackberry needs to stay focused on the market that it understands, which is Enterprise. Moreover, it's likely to be a growing niche with sustainable advantages as Enterprises continue to increase their focus on securing their digital resources.

    Posted via CB10
    If that's the market they want to be in--fine. Then DON'T waste time or money pretending to be in another.

    So, when a market they didn't anticipate fell into their lap, they should have said "No, sorry--we don't want your business, because we don't understand that market."

    Well, no. The answer is to LEARN and develop and take advantages of opportunities. That's what smart businesses can do.

    KAM
    08-18-16 10:15 AM
  14. KAM1138's Avatar
    Hello,

    Extending on the idea that Blackberry Stumbled onto a market (in the past)--where they dominated for a time.

    Well, what we're saying is that Blackberry had a product that people wanted. What was that product? Top-notch Communications.

    Why did that end? Others came around with acceptable (if inferior) solutions for communications, and OTHER bells and whistles people wanted more, which caused them to leave BBRY.

    Well, with Hub+ Blackberry has the potential to offer those Superior Communications capabilities Via software (the business they claim to be in), without requiring customers to make a choice between their bells and whistles and the Communications power.

    I think the Hub+ is a GREAT idea, and could theoretically appeal to a lot of consumers. This IS the business they've chosen to be in--Software. It is ridiculous to make a product and NOT get behind it with the effort it takes to help it succeed.

    KAM
    08-18-16 10:22 AM
  15. KAM1138's Avatar
    What will happen with the Hub+ software will be the same as Blend. Design software with great potential and then not finish the job.
    Posted via CB10
    You know...this is EXACTLY the point. How many times does Blackberry have to fail to capitalize on very good and in some cases excellent products before they learn?

    All the justifications in the world aren't going to change the actual facts of what has and is continuing to happen. Repeating the same mistakes, and expecting a different outcome...well, we know what that's called.

    KAM
    Powdah likes this.
    08-18-16 10:36 AM
  16. Troy Tiscareno's Avatar
    Marketing could be as much as giving a few thousand phones (actually would be more like 10,000 phones) to various stores for employees to use. Also, teach them how to use them. If they like, they sell. Word of mouth really works
    Few stores actually stock the phones - and BB doesn't have the funds to build those phones without prepaid orders for them, and the retailers don't have enough demand to pre-pay for them - so giving away a bunch of free phones wouldn't help. BB is mostly selling by direct mail/web order these days.

    I'm not saying that the premise isn't good - it's in fact exactly what Apple and Samsung do - but BB simply can't afford it. Their entire phone division is too small and too cash poor for that anymore, so they have to limit their marketing to things they can do SUPER CHEAP that will still give them some impact to their sales figures.
    Dunt Dunt Dunt and web99 like this.
    08-18-16 07:12 PM
  17. Troy Tiscareno's Avatar
    So, the issue is whether they want to be in the business that they are continuing to produce products for or not?
    If the answer is yes, then they need to market themselves and rebuild their brand.
    In this case, it isn't quite black and white. Phones used to be BB's main source of income, but today, they've essentially become a hobby that BB hopes to sustain - even at break-even - because they feel that it helps them sell software and/or because they haven't quite weened their customers, their distributors/retailers, and themselves off of hardware yet.

    But as a hobby, they are only going to advertise at a level that's BARELY above the free advertising they get in the tech press - because that's all they can afford to spend on their hobby that is still losing money (though not nearly as much as they were with BB10).

    If you believe that BB thinks that phones will ever again be a primary source of income, you simply haven't been paying attention to what Chen has been saying for the last several years. Phones are a sideline to the software business, and only sustainable if it can reach break-even. That's been made crystal clear a dozen times over - and customers can either accept that for what it is, or move to another provider. And if enough customers leave BB's phone business, BB will reluctantly shutter it.
    08-18-16 07:20 PM
  18. KAM1138's Avatar
    In this case, it isn't quite black and white. Phones used to be BB's main source of income, but today, they've essentially become a hobby that BB hopes to sustain - even at break-even - because they feel that it helps them sell software and/or because they haven't quite weened their customers, their distributors/retailers, and themselves off of hardware yet.

    But as a hobby, they are only going to advertise at a level that's BARELY above the free advertising they get in the tech press - because that's all they can afford to spend on their hobby that is still losing money (though not nearly as much as they were with BB10).

    If you believe that BB thinks that phones will ever again be a primary source of income, you simply haven't been paying attention to what Chen has been saying for the last several years. Phones are a sideline to the software business, and only sustainable if it can reach break-even. That's been made crystal clear a dozen times over - and customers can either accept that for what it is, or move to another provider. And if enough customers leave BB's phone business, BB will reluctantly shutter it.
    The product I'm referring to here is Hub+, not a phone.

    They claim software is their focus and it is the product they are offering. So while, I do think what I said applies generally, I am talking specifically about Hub+.

    KAM

    Posted via CB10
    08-18-16 09:04 PM
  19. Allan Milo's Avatar
    This makes me wonder if the problem is that BB has been trying to market phones like they would software and serrvices.

    Posted via CB10
    08-19-16 10:44 AM
  20. Dunt Dunt Dunt's Avatar
    The product I'm referring to here is Hub+, not a phone.

    They claim software is their focus and it is the product they are offering. So while, I do think what I said applies generally, I am talking specifically about Hub+.

    KAM

    Posted via CB10
    BlackBerry has always been a horrible software company....

    But Chen's focus is on Enterprise software related to security. HUB+ is really more of a consumer product, but I'm sure it will be offered as part of BES/Good suites. But I think it's more of secondary product that was needed for their phones, if those phones go away I doubt the apps will see much improvement.
    08-19-16 11:18 AM
  21. Prem WatsApp's Avatar
    Need Blend for ChenDroid... :-)

      "Chenterprise. We are the future. Resistance is futile. Prepare to BBe... "  
    08-23-16 01:01 AM
  22. Tsepz_GP's Avatar
    I did not find BB Hub to be useful, had it on my Galaxy Note 4 for almost 2weeks and barely used it. I have 3 email accounts, FB, Twitter, Instagram, WhatsApp, Snapchat, Skype and YouTube giving me notifications throughout the day, and I found it easier to deal with them in their specific apps.

    Many of us on Android got used to the Notification bar being a 'hub' of sorts, and I just couldn't get used to BB Hub. If BB are to sell it, they need to have something truly solid in it, they currently don't.
    KAM1138 likes this.
    08-23-16 08:16 AM
  23. Powdah's Avatar
    What Blend could have been - https://asana.com/
    08-23-16 10:17 AM
  24. bb10adopter111's Avatar
    I did not find BB Hub to be useful, had it on my Galaxy Note 4 for almost 2weeks and barely used it. I have 3 email accounts, FB, Twitter, Instagram, WhatsApp, Snapchat, Skype and YouTube giving me notifications throughout the day, and I found it easier to deal with them in their specific apps.

    Many of us on Android got used to the Notification bar being a 'hub' of sorts, and I just couldn't get used to BB Hub. If BB are to sell it, they need to have something truly solid in it, they currently don't.
    Thanks for sharing your experience. Personally, I never want to open so many apps just to communicate with people across different platforms, but if it doesn't bother you, then you're absolutely correct that the BlackBerry Hub doesn't offer any benefits. Not having to use individual apps IS the benefit.

    Posted via CB10
    08-23-16 01:34 PM
  25. Tsepz_GP's Avatar
    Thanks for sharing your experience. Personally, I never want to open so many apps just to communicate with people across different platforms, but if it doesn't bother you, then you're absolutely correct that the BlackBerry Hub doesn't offer any benefits. Not having to use individual apps IS the benefit.

    Posted via CB10
    I think making Hub swipable from the left or right would help a lot, otherwise to me it was just another app I opened from the Recent Apps, homescreen or app drawer.

    Without an easier access point than other apps Hub just becomes another app, I think its constant availability in BB10 with a simply swipe truly makes it work well. Its these little things that make or break an app.
    KAM1138 and Ronindan like this.
    08-23-16 02:11 PM
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