08-11-11 11:30 AM
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  1. blue81to's Avatar
    Well... I know this is a tragic situation, but on the bright side it's an example of how useful blackberry handsets are for communication purposes. Blackberries don't have the latest and greatest specs but they're good at what they're designed to do, which is communicate. In some ways these riots are an example of why blackberries are so popular in the corporate world.
    08-10-11 02:40 PM
  2. mjordan5's Avatar
    I heard it was on facebook have not heard about the BBM part
    08-10-11 05:01 PM
  3. blue81to's Avatar
    I heard it was on facebook have not heard about the BBM part
    Some news outlets are saying it's bbm

    In October 1985, on the Broadwater Farm estate in Tottenham where the death of Cynthia Jarrett sparked riots that culminated in the brutal murder of PC Keith Blakelock, a community leader stood on his chair at a packed open-air meeting.

    The man bellowed into a megaphone to the 150 residents in front of him: "You tell them that it's a life for a life from now on. This is war."

    Over whoops and cheers from the residents, he turned to a huddle of police officers standing 50 yards away and warned: "I hope you're listening. There is no way I am going to condemn the actions of the youth on Sunday night."

    Twenty six years later, police officers are still listening but the megaphones and open-air meetings have been largely replaced. This weekend's north London riots, the Daily Mail announced on Monday, were "fuelled by social media".

    But is this necessarily the case?

    Certainly, the first online gathering of people mourning and soon vowing to avenge the death of Tottenham resident Mark Duggan took place on Facebook. Some of those behind the page, which now boasts more than 7,500 fans, launched into action shortly before 10.30pm on Saturday evening more than five hours after the first public show of protest, outside the police station on Tottenham High Road.

    At 10.45pm, when rioters set a double decker bus alight, the page posted: "Please upload any pictures or video's you may have from tonight in Tottenham. Share it with people to send the message out as to why this has blown into a riot."

    However, otherwise, if there was any sign that a peaceful protest would escalate, it wasn't to be found on Facebook. Twitter was slightly more indicative: tweets about an attempt to target Sunday's Hackney Carnival were spotted by police and the event was abruptly cancelled.

    Scotland Yard warned on Monday afternoon that those "inciting violence" on the 140-character social network would not go unpunished. Deputy assistant commissioner Stephen Kavanagh confirmed that officers were looking at the website as part of investigations into widespread looting and rioting.

    However, the most powerful and up-to-the-minute rallying appears to have taken place on a more covert social network: BlackBerry Messenger (BBM).

    Using BlackBerry handsets the smartphone of choice for the majority (37%) of British teens, according to last week's Ofcom study BBM allows users to send one-to-many messages to their network of contacts, who are connected by "BBM PINs". For many teens armed with a BlackBerry, BBM has replaced text messaging because it is free, instant and more part of a much larger community than regular SMS.

    And unlike Twitter or Facebook, many BBM messages are untraceable by the authorities (which is why, in large part, BBM is so favoured by Emirati teens to spread illicit gossip about officialdom).

    One BBM broadcast sent on Sunday, which has been shown to the Guardian by multiple sources, calls on "everyone from all sides of London" to vandalise shops on Oxford street.

    It said: "Everyone from all sides of London meet up at the heart of London (central) OXFORD CIRCUS!!, Bare SHOPS are gonna get smashed up so come get some (free stuff!!!) **** the feds we will send them back with OUR riot! >:O Dead the ends and colour war for now so if you see a brother... SALUT! if you see a fed... SHOOT!"

    Another sent shortly before the outbreak of violence in Enfield on Sunday afternoon reads: "Everyone in edmonton enfield wood green everywhere in north link up at enfield town station at 4 o clock sharp!".

    Jenny Jones, the former deputy mayor of London, blamed an under-resourced force for missing the tweets and the status updates. "It's quite possible if they had more resources they could have picked up on this," she said.

    But maybe they were looking in the wrong place. Just as Tottenham residents in 1985 lambasted the media for scaremongering about protesters the Daily Express suggested some had been trained in Russia today's rioters might be surprised to read about "Twitter-organised chaos".
    London riots: how BlackBerry Messenger played a key role | Media | guardian.co.uk
    08-10-11 05:25 PM
  4. BBThemes's Avatar
    Some news outlets are saying it's bbm
    im sure BBM was used, im also sure SMS, phone calls and most other IM clients were used too, lets not make this more than it actually is.

    tonight seems to be trouble free which is hopefully a sign that things have made a turn for the better.
    08-10-11 06:59 PM
  5. shabbs's Avatar
    Hmmm... they're using BBM to communicate because... *wait for it* ... they use BBM to communicate! *shocking* Disappointed to see RIM step in like this, but they were probably put in an impossible position, ie: "Help us or we'll make it look like you didn't want to help and support the hooligans." This smacks of Big Brother listening to all our conversations and using key words to justify civil liberties being thrown out the window.
    08-10-11 07:56 PM
  6. kevinnugent's Avatar
    Hmmm... they're using BBM to communicate because... *wait for it* ... they use BBM to communicate! *shocking* Disappointed to see RIM step in like this, but they were probably put in an impossible position, ie: "Help us or we'll make it look like you didn't want to help and support the hooligans." This smacks of Big Brother listening to all our conversations and using key words to justify civil liberties being thrown out the window.
    If you use a means of communications as a tool to break the law, then you're SOL. I don't care what sort it is. I'd be surprised if there weren't some legislation enacted after this to allow authorities to intercept BBM communications in certain circumstances. Sorry, but it will happen eventually imo.
    08-10-11 08:02 PM
  7. BBThemes's Avatar
    Hmmm... they're using BBM to communicate because... *wait for it* ... they use BBM to communicate! *shocking* Disappointed to see RIM step in like this, but they were probably put in an impossible position, ie: "Help us or we'll make it look like you didn't want to help and support the hooligans." This smacks of Big Brother listening to all our conversations and using key words to justify civil liberties being thrown out the window.
    to be very clear, RIM cannot under UK law hand over any info without cause. they cant simply `datamine` the entire BBM network or anything, we are talking about the police going `this is the PIN of such and such device.
    08-10-11 08:09 PM
  8. shabbs's Avatar
    If you use a means of communications as a tool to break the law, then you're SOL. I don't care what sort it is. I'd be surprised if there weren't some legislation enacted after this to allow authorities to intercept BBM communications in certain circumstances. Sorry, but it will happen eventually imo.
    Are they actually breaking the law with their communications? That's a grey area if anything. Looting, rioting - yes, clearly breaking the law and I hope they nail every single one of the hooligans. I'd say this is no different than wire-taps. You can't just listen in on everything, there needs to be a reasonable suspicion of illegal activity and a warrant obtained with specific parameters. This sounds like a sweeping intrusion which will no doubt net innocents as well.
    08-10-11 08:15 PM
  9. shabbs's Avatar
    to be very clear, RIM cannot under UK law hand over any info without cause. they cant simply `datamine` the entire BBM network or anything, we are talking about the police going `this is the PIN of such and such device.
    I'm fine with that, but how are they identifying the PINs in the first place? How are they tying the hooligans to the PINs? Serious question.
    08-10-11 08:17 PM
  10. BBThemes's Avatar
    I'm fine with that, but how are they identifying the PINs in the first place? How are they tying the hooligans to the PINs? Serious question.
    well as they cant see `real time` info, so its used for evidence for prosecution, im guessing they either arrest someone, find their BB and go from there, or they get undercover officers on the ground invited into the groups and take their PIN`s from the groups/users. both of these ways would at least give a `probable cause` case for getting info. but they cant just have a peek at random stuff, the law doesnt work like that.
    08-10-11 08:25 PM
  11. shabbs's Avatar
    well as they cant see `real time` info, so its used for evidence for prosecution, im guessing they either arrest someone, find their BB and go from there, or they get undercover officers on the ground invited into the groups and take their PIN`s from the groups/users. both of these ways would at least give a `probable cause` case for getting info. but they cant just have a peek at random stuff, the law doesnt work like that.
    Agreed and I hope it is indeed going down like that.
    08-10-11 08:48 PM
  12. Branta's Avatar
    well as they cant see `real time` info, so its used for evidence for prosecution, im guessing they either arrest someone, find their BB and go from there, or they get undercover officers on the ground invited into the groups and take their PIN`s from the groups/users. both of these ways would at least give a `probable cause` case for getting info. but they cant just have a peek at random stuff, the law doesnt work like that.
    Not only does the law not work like that, but random screening of BBM would be hopelessly inefficient and time consuming. It is almost certain the police have found incriminating evidence on phones posessed by those arrested and will be following the trail.

    More to the point, this will not just be some low level plod turning up at RIM's office and being granted access to the data. The law is clear about this and the investigators will have appropriate search warrants and other documentation to support their actions. They will be conducting a full forensic investigation. Anything less would taint the evidence found and allow offenders to escape prosecution.
    08-11-11 08:23 AM
  13. daveycrocket's Avatar
    I think this issue conserned with BBM is also about tracing those who insite crime even if they have not "hands on" done it this is also against our laws, conspiricy (sorry for spelling) A 16 year old in Scotland has just been charged. It's good that BBM is secure as no-one can claim their record, trail has been altered in some way. This issue has made me even more determined that BB is the OS for me and mine.
    08-11-11 08:35 AM
  14. trsbbs's Avatar
    UK may disrupt social networks during unrest
    Thu, Aug 11 09:57 AM EDT

    LONDON (Reuters) - Britain is considering disrupting online social networking such as Blackberry Messenger and Twitter during civil unrest, Prime Minister David Cameron said Thursday, a move widely condemned as repressive when used by other countries.

    Egyptian authorities shut down mobile and Internet services in January during mass protests against then-President Hosni Mubarak, while China is quick to shut down online communication it sees as subversive.

    Police and politicians have said online social networks, in particular Research in Motion's popular Blackberry Messager (BBM), were used by rioters and looters to coordinate during four days of disorder across England this week.

    "We are working with police, the intelligence services and industry to look at whether it would be right to stop people communicating via these websites and services when we know they are plotting violence, disorder and criminality," Cameron told parliament during an emergency session prompted by the riots.

    Many of the rioters favored Canadian firm RIM's BBM over Twitter and other social media because its messages are encrypted and private.

    The company said Monday that it cooperates with all telecommunications, law enforcement and regulatory authorities, but it declined to say whether it would hand over chat logs or user details to police.

    RIM's encrypted services have been blamed for aiding militant attacks in India and for allowing unrelated men and women to communicate in Saudi Arabia and the United Arab Emirates.

    In August last year, a source close to talks between RIM and Saudi authorities said the company had agreed to hand over information that would allow monitoring of BBM.

    Online social media was also widely used by members of the British public in recent days to help others avoid troublespots and to coordinate a clean up after the rioting had ended.

    BBM has more than 45 million active users worldwide, 70 percent of whom use it daily, sending billions of messages, pictures and other files in total every month.

    Authorities grappling with violent unrest should avoid heavy-handed clampdowns on social media and instead try to enlist the help of the public against the rioters, said John Bassett, a former senior official at British signals intelligence agency GCHQ and now a senior fellow at the Royal United Services Institute.

    "The use of social media in the unrest looks like a game-changer. But any attempt to exert state control over social media looks likely to fail," he told Reuters.

    "A much better approach would be to encourage and support individuals and community groups in identifying alarming developments on social media and even speaking out on the internet against extremists and criminals, and ensuring that the police have the skills and technical support to get pre-emptive and operational intelligence from social media when necessary."

    (Additional reporting by Peter Apps; editing by Matt Falloon and Gareth Jones)

    UK may disrupt social networks during unrest | Reuters.com
    08-11-11 11:30 AM
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