02-22-14 11:44 PM
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  1. ray689's Avatar
    I specialize in sales and marketing. What do you do for a living?
    Pretty generic answer there. Are you in retail phones sales was the question?


    Posted via CB10
    02-22-14 10:55 PM
  2. rzanger's Avatar
    This notion that salespeople have the power to sell anything other than exactly what a customer wants from them is patently ridiculous and a strange phenomenon I've witnessed exactly NOWHERE outside of Crackberry. If a person wants a qwerty phone, they tell the rep that. However much the rep may try and sway them,...that's what salespeople DO, folks.

    They're not holding a gun to your head.
    Your quite right. We are going to Bestbuy tomorrow to measure a tv to make sure it fits where we want it to. Then it's on to Amazon or elsewhere online to buy it . I guess that's what I learned from my experience. I will just let my wallet do the talking. Unintended consequences? Maybe.
    02-22-14 10:56 PM
  3. Omnitech's Avatar
    Why does it matter what I do for a living?

    Oh, but it does, believe me, it does.

    And I'll take that as a "yes".



    I specialize in sales and marketing. What do you do for a living?

    Color me surprised!



    This notion that salespeople have the power to sell anything other than exactly what a customer wants from them is patently ridiculous and a strange phenomenon I've witnessed exactly NOWHERE outside of Crackberry. If a person wants a qwerty phone, they tell the rep that. However much the rep may try and sway them,...that's what salespeople DO, folks.

    They're not holding a gun to your head.


    I would say, based upon that comment, you've never worked in a commissioned sales environment.
    ray689 likes this.
    02-22-14 10:56 PM
  4. rzanger's Avatar
    Or walked out until he could get some more advice.
    He did walkout and phoned me for help. That doesn't bother you?
    02-22-14 10:57 PM
  5. birdman_38's Avatar
    Pretty generic answer there. Are you in retail phones sales was the question?
    I've sold office equipment in the past so I know about incentives. I could sell shoes now, it doesn't matter. Still not sure how that relates to the OP's failure to be there for his dad when he could have used his help.
    02-22-14 10:58 PM
  6. tchocky77's Avatar
    Nobody said that man. Get it straight. Average consumers are not experts in mobile tech. If an average person goes in and is told things like..."don't by this one because that company is out of business" then what do you think they will do?
    Kind of like if I went to a plumbing store to buy a certain brand of air conditioner. Guess what, I wouldn't leave the store with it if the rep told me, don't buy it they're out of business. You know why, because I don't know squat about air conditioners. Did that rep do the right thing?


    Posted via CB10
    We're talking about sales. There is no "right." There is only the sale. If you're shopping for an air conditioner, either do some research and decide exactly what you want, or listen to the salesman when he tells you what you want.

    Either way, that guy has a job to do. If he's worth a d@mn, he'll try and do it.
    bbq10l likes this.
    02-22-14 11:00 PM
  7. ray689's Avatar
    I've sold office equipment in the past so I know about incentives. I could sell shoes now, it doesn't matter. Still not sure how that relates to the OP's failure to be there for his dad when he could have used his help.
    Need his help? I guess that means you do admit that there was bias and he was pushed when he should have been. That is what the thread is truly about the bias against BlackBerry. You saying that the OP should have been there to "help" his father I guess implies that you actually agree and are just arguing for the sake of flaming people.

    Posted via CB10
    02-22-14 11:01 PM
  8. birdman_38's Avatar
    He did walkout and phoned me for help. That doesn't bother you?
    How did you feel when he did that? Wish you could have been there?
    bbq10l likes this.
    02-22-14 11:01 PM
  9. Omnitech's Avatar
    Either way, that guy has a job to do. If he's worth a d@mn, he'll try and do it.

    Cash is King!

    See Post #108.
    02-22-14 11:03 PM
  10. birdman_38's Avatar
    I guess that means you do admit that there was bias and he was pushed when he should have been. That is what the thread is truly about the bias against BlackBerry.
    We all know that is a challenge BlackBerry is up against and fails to combat. We don't need another thread stating so, especially one that is featured in the "trending now" section.
    bbq10l likes this.
    02-22-14 11:04 PM
  11. Omnitech's Avatar
    I've sold office equipment in the past so I know about incentives. I could sell shoes now, it doesn't matter.

    Spoken like a salesman.

    Redefine the frame, deflect.

    Sorta like what people in mobile phone stores do when someone comes in wanting something they don't want to sell.

    You should have heard some of the people in some of the Verizon stores I called, asking them if they had inventory of the Z10 on rollout-day.

    Some of them were just downright hostile about the whole thing, as if it was a piece of garbage not even worth discussing.

    Other reps in other stores had a completely different attitude.

    If you don't think that has an influence on customers who are easily railroaded, here's a nice big Willie J. Brown bridge I'd like to sell you...
    Nharzhool likes this.
    02-22-14 11:06 PM
  12. ray689's Avatar
    We're talking about sales. There is no "right." There is only the sale. If you're shopping for an air conditioner, either do some research and decide exactly what you want, or listen to the salesman when he tells you what you want.

    Either way, that guy has a job to do. If he's worth a d@mn, he'll try and do it.
    I do my research all the time. Unfortunately 95% of the smartphone shopping public will not. That's what I'm talking about.
    Anyone in this thread who does not believe there is a bias against BlackBerry with many sales reps (given the hundreds of experiences on CB) is clearly clueless.
    And sorry to break it to you, it's very rare to find one that's "worth a damn" but good luck with that.

    Posted via CB10
    02-22-14 11:06 PM
  13. birdman_38's Avatar
    You should have heard some of the people in some of the Verizon stores I called, asking them if they had inventory of the Z10 on rollout-day.

    Some of them were just downright hostile about the whole thing, as if it was a piece of garbage not even worth discussing.
    Blame BlackBerry for that.
    bbq10l likes this.
    02-22-14 11:11 PM
  14. Ecm's Avatar
    [WARN]OK everyone, time to cool off. Lose the personal comments and language. If the off topic stuff continues, this thread will be closed.[/WARN]
    Nharzhool likes this.
    02-22-14 11:12 PM
  15. birdman_38's Avatar
    By making absurd comments about professional phone sales reps who are there to look out for the best interest of the customer? And you say it like you actually believe it.
    You speak as though all sales reps are evil. I don't believe that to be the case at all.
    bbq10l likes this.
    02-22-14 11:12 PM
  16. ray689's Avatar
    You speak as though all sales reps are evil. I don't believe that to be the case at all.
    Didn't say anyone was evil. I said they are biased...plenty of evidence of that on CB and all the experiences people have had.

    Posted via CB10
    02-22-14 11:15 PM
  17. Omnitech's Avatar
    You speak as though all sales reps are evil. I don't believe that to be the case at all.

    I certainly didn't say that and I don't think Ray was saying that, but I do think that based on the details we have been given in this specific case, there isn't a lot of evidence to suggest the rep in question was being respectful of the customer's desires.

    And of course when we observe patterns that repeat themselves over and over and over (ie BlackBerry bashing), then it certainly helps us make more accurate judgements about which scenario is more plausible.

    And to reiterate what I wrote earlier: I perfectly understand the concept of trying to steer customers into a product that one truly believes is better/more reliable/etc. The question is how far you take that when someone has expressed direct and unambiguous interest in a different product for a specific reason or reasons.

    It has been suggested here that "people of that era" are "more familiar with adversity". Well guess what: "people of that era" also tend to expect politeness, gentility, respect and grace - characteristics which tend to be scoffed-at by people today under the age of 40 or so.

    And I don't see a lot of evidence that this was on offer from the sales rep.

    But the bottom line is: it's a pattern we have seen repeat with dreadful regularity. People are NOT making up these stories.
    02-22-14 11:17 PM
  18. birdman_38's Avatar
    Didn't say anyone was evil. I said they are biased...plenty of evidence of that on CB and all the experiences people have had.
    Ok, salespeople are biased. Politicians are crooked. Lawyers are greedy, etc, etc, etc. How is this even news?

    It would be nice if people came up with a solution instead of just complain about it all the time.
    02-22-14 11:19 PM
  19. rzanger's Avatar
    We all know that is a challenge BlackBerry is up against and fails to combat. We don't need another thread stating so, especially one that is featured in the "trending now" section.
    I disagree. If you like your Blackberry there is no more important thread than this. Take note. This is a Blackberry forum and this crap is real. This is not social media exactly and I choose to fight my own personal battles where it counts in the store. But one should be able to share their experiences with others. If you don't like it then don't participate. Nobody has a gun to your head.
    ray689, Omnitech and canuckvoip like this.
    02-22-14 11:23 PM
  20. bbq10l's Avatar
    I do my research all the time. Unfortunately 95% of the smartphone shopping public will not. That's what I'm talking about.
    Anyone in this thread who does not believe there is a bias against BlackBerry with many sales reps (given the hundreds of experiences on CB) is clearly clueless.
    And sorry to break it to you, it's very rare to find one that's "worth a damn" but good luck with that.

    Posted via CB10
    Being biased isn't a crime. I would say the BlackBerry fans are as biased as anyone else. If 95% of the public walks out of the store with the wrong phone because they failed to do their research, then it's their own fault. You can't blame salespeople for laziness on the part of the consumer. Rather than asserting salespeople are biased against BlackBerry, why don't you consider that they may have reason to be.

    Posted via CB10
    02-22-14 11:24 PM
  21. Omnitech's Avatar
    Ok, salespeople are biased. Politicians are crooked. Lawyers are greedy, etc, etc, etc. How is this even news?

    It would be nice if people came up with a solution instead of just complain about it all the time.

    Well we are discussing potential solutions: ie educating sales reps and making it clear to the companies that employ them that their arm-twisting tactics are not OK.

    Whereas people in the other camp are basically saying: "Stop whining."

    Yep, now there's a solution if there ever was one.
    02-22-14 11:24 PM
  22. ray689's Avatar
    Ok, salespeople are biased. Politicians are crooked. Lawyers are greedy, etc, etc, etc. How is this even news?

    It would be nice if people came up with a solution instead of just complain about it all the time.
    I'm pretty sure if anyone could solve that problem they would have by now. And biased in this case goes far beyond than just having a preference. When people say things like "BlackBerry or out of business", that's just malicious and incorrect.

    Posted via CB10
    02-22-14 11:24 PM
  23. birdman_38's Avatar
    Well guess what: "people of that era" also tend to expect politeness, gentility, respect and grace - characteristics which tend to be scoffed-at by people today under the age of 40 or so.

    And I don't see a lot of evidence that this was on offer from the sales rep.

    But the bottom line is: it's a pattern we have seen repeat with dreadful regularity. People are NOT making up these stories.
    There's no evidence to the contrary. It may have been a pleasant experience. We don't know.

    And, yes, it is a pattern that has existed for the past couple years which (remarkably) hasn't been addressed by BlackBerry yet.
    bbq10l likes this.
    02-22-14 11:25 PM
  24. rzanger's Avatar
    I certainly didn't say that and I don't think Ray was saying that, but I do think that based on the details we have been given in this specific case, there isn't a lot of evidence to suggest the rep in question was being respectful of the customer's desires.

    And of course when we observe patterns that repeat themselves over and over and over (ie BlackBerry bashing), then it certainly helps us make more accurate judgements about which scenario is more plausible.

    And to reiterate what I wrote earlier: I perfectly understand the concept of trying to steer customers into a product that one truly believes is better/more reliable/etc. The question is how far you take that when someone has expressed direct and unambiguous interest in a different product for a specific reason or reasons.

    It has been suggested here that "people of that era" are "more familiar with adversity". Well guess what: "people of that era" also tend to expect politeness, gentility, respect and grace - characteristics which tend to be scoffed-at by people today under the age of 40 or so.

    And I don't see a lot of evidence that this was on offer from the sales rep.

    But the bottom line is: it's a pattern we have seen repeat with dreadful regularity. People are NOT making up these stories.
    Thank you. That is certainly true and is represented by those who choose to focus on the mental capacity of an elderly man. Blackberry haters apparently have no limits.
    ray689 likes this.
    02-22-14 11:29 PM
  25. ray689's Avatar
    Being biased isn't a crime. I would say the BlackBerry fans are as biased as anyone else. If 95% of the public walks out of the store with the wrong phone because they failed to do their research, then it's their own fault. You can't blame salespeople for laziness on the part of the consumer. Rather than asserting salespeople are biased against BlackBerry, why don't you consider that they may have reason to be.

    Posted via CB10
    The consumer relies on these people because they are supposed to be the informed ones. And not once did I say bias was a crime either. Blatant lying and misinformation is another thing.
    Apparently in your magical little perfect bubble, every customer is fully informed about every product they purchase....oh what a wonderful world you must live in. Get real and open your eyes.


    Posted via CB10
    canuckvoip likes this.
    02-22-14 11:30 PM
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