02-22-14 11:44 PM
184 1234 ...
tools
  1. bp3dots's Avatar
    There is something you should be aware of. These are not hipsters interested in the latest and greatest technology but rather they are elderly people who have given to society their whole lives. The last thing they need to be told is they are to disabled to use a phone on top of everything else. Yes I took notice of your shot at tiny keys and small screen but tell me how big is the screen on an iPhone when you open the keyboard. They functioned just fine on a feature phone. When they call it is on a land line. They just need a little more from their phone that's all. I might also add I have a Z30 but always grab the Q for typing.
    I didn't take a shot at the Q. It very obviously has a significantly smaller screen and small buttons. That is a fact. I didn't say it was bad. I said those two things are generally not the easiest for elderly people (limited vision and lower motor skills - especially with parkinsons in the mix.) The iPhone offers features that are meant to make things easier to do for many people who have more difficulty than most.

    I also said it might not have been right for the person you referenced in particular, however, it is a very solid recommendation. When I was in a store, I would have followed up by making sure that person knew how to use all those features as well as possible before they left.

    Funny that you menton feature phones. They also have bigger buttons that the Q, which is good for dailing, (and really about all one would do on a feature phone anyway) And most can be set to have larger font's for the numbers on the screen, so that even though it is small, it is more readable.

    I made no personal attack at you, (or the Q) and agreed that they should have been able to return/excange without hassle once they saw they preferred the Q's. But the guy who sold them the iPhones in the first place made as good a recommendation as you can get. I don't even like iOS products, but I can see their advantages where present.
    rzanger likes this.
    02-22-14 01:33 PM
  2. bp3dots's Avatar
    I would rather a sales rep give me what I ask for (whether they or you think I need it) rather than push a product on me because the rep likes it...which in this case turned out to be neither needed or useful to the customer.

    Posted via CB10
    I understand your point. But when someone comes in asking for a tire because their wipers dont work, it's kind negligent to sell them the tire.

    Maybe you're caught in the difference between recommending the right thing and refusing to sell whatever the customer asked for altogether. Which I agree is wrong. But a decent salesperson should at least explain why the recommendation might be better and then, if you still want it, go ahead and give it to you.
    app_Developer and mikeo007 like this.
    02-22-14 01:40 PM
  3. bbq10l's Avatar
    Go straight to corporate headquarters office and cc the press with your story. Watch the sparks fly. Upselling is one thing but purposely selling a person with a medical condition something that they can't use is something else entirely.

    Posted via CB10
    How exactly was the salesperson supposed to be an expert on medical conditions of the aging? How was that person to know what device was medically appropriate? You expect a little too much here...

    Posted via CB10
    Smitty13 likes this.
    02-22-14 01:46 PM
  4. ray689's Avatar
    I understand your point. But when someone comes in asking for a tire because their wipers dont work, it's kind negligent to sell them the tire.

    Maybe you're caught in the difference between recommending the right thing and refusing to sell whatever the customer asked for altogether. Which I agree is wrong. But a decent salesperson should at least explain why the recommendation might be better and then, if you still want it, go ahead and give it to you.
    That analogy clearly doesn't apply in this case and is not what I meant. And what explanation did this sales rep and many others who sell phones give? "Get an IPhone, it's better ". Really why? Did he ask the customer what their main uses will be and why they asked for a Q10 in the first place? Did he ask him if things like apps are important or is he just looking for a simple typing experience on a physical keyboard? None of that happened. So no this rep wasn't making a recommendation that was good for this customer, he was making a recommendation based on his own preference and that happens daily. This is why I said, give the customer what they asked for unless they came in looking for your recommendation.


    Posted via CB10
    02-22-14 01:50 PM
  5. ray689's Avatar
    How exactly was the salesperson supposed to be an expert on medical conditions of the aging? How was that person to know what device was medically appropriate? You expect a little too much here...

    Posted via CB10
    Exactly so that's why he should have given the customer what he asked for rather than. Recommending what he himself prefers.

    Posted via CB10
    rzanger, Skyforever and wincyUt like this.
    02-22-14 01:51 PM
  6. canuckvoip's Avatar
    iPhones are actually well known for being useable by folks with various disabilities, and have a large amount of assistance style apps. Not to mention Siri, which can be very helpful for doing certain tasks.

    Now maybe this wasn't the best phone for your person, but realistically, if recommending a phone for someone who will likely have low motor control and not the best vision, big icons and speech commands are probably advantageous over small keys and tiny screen.

    Now the return objections etc, thats a whole different matter.
    The superiority complex of some sales twits is unbelievable.
    The guy knew what he wanted. End of story. Give him what he wants and move on. Is that so difficult? Imposing your will, or misguided opinion on others is tragic and pathetic. And then there's the outright lying... Ugh...
    ray689, rzanger and acovey like this.
    02-22-14 01:59 PM
  7. bp3dots's Avatar
    That analogy clearly doesn't apply in this case and is not what I meant. And what explanation did this sales rep and many others who sell phones give? "Get an IPhone, it's better ". Really why? Did he ask the customer what their main uses will be and why they asked for a Q10 in the first place? Did he ask him if things like apps are important or is he just looking for a simple typing experience on a physical keyboard? None of that happened. So no this rep wasn't making a recommendation that was good for this customer, he was making a recommendation based on his own preference and that happens daily. This is why I said, give the customer what they asked for unless they came in looking for your recommendation.


    Posted via CB10
    Sorry, I didn't realize you were there when it happened.

    Yes the analogy was extreme, but it happens. For a more accurate one, A lot of people will go in asking for a "droid" or iPhone and want the exact opposite. Asking a few questions get's them what they really wanted.
    02-22-14 02:00 PM
  8. canuckvoip's Avatar
    The question is who is to blame?

    Posted via my Nexus 10.
    The sales bot obviously.
    rzanger likes this.
    02-22-14 02:00 PM
  9. canuckvoip's Avatar
    You'd be amazed at how many people ask for things they don't actually need, but think they do. Being a good salesman is about finding what is actually best for them.
    And being a good salesperson is NOT ARGUING with the customer or telling them that what they asked for is wrong.
    02-22-14 02:03 PM
  10. canuckvoip's Avatar
    I would rather a sales rep give me what I ask for (whether they or you think I need it) rather than push a product on me because the rep likes it...which in this case turned out to be neither needed or useful to the customer.

    Posted via CB10
    Thank you... you beat me to it.
    rzanger likes this.
    02-22-14 02:05 PM
  11. bbq10l's Avatar
    Exactly so that's why he should have given the customer what he asked for rather than. Recommending what he himself prefers.

    Posted via CB10
    I completely agree with you. He should have gotten what he asked for. But the idea that the salesperson should have understood medical conditions, etc. is outrageous. The post was they he sold the wrong to someone with a medical condition. My point is that a salesperson should not have been expected to know about or consider that.

    Posted via CB10
    02-22-14 02:06 PM
  12. canuckvoip's Avatar
    I understand your point. But when someone comes in asking for a tire because their wipers dont work, it's kind negligent to sell them the tire.

    Maybe you're caught in the difference between recommending the right thing and refusing to sell whatever the customer asked for altogether. Which I agree is wrong. But a decent salesperson should at least explain why the recommendation might be better and then, if you still want it, go ahead and give it to you.
    Bad/utterly wrong analogy. Wipers and tires are hardly in the same category.
    02-22-14 02:08 PM
  13. ray689's Avatar
    Sorry, I didn't realize you were there when it happened.

    Yes the analogy was extreme, but it happens. For a more accurate one, A lot of people will go in asking for a "droid" or iPhone and want the exact opposite. Asking a few questions get's them what they really wanted.
    Didn't say I was there. I was going by what the OP told us.
    Apparently you were there though since you seem to think the sales rep did everything appropriately and through his superior skills decided that an iPhone would be best for this customer after ensuring he asked all the right questions. It was either that or he is just another clueless ifan who happens to be a sales rep and just thinks iphone is the best and better than BlackBerry even though he likely has never used the bb10 platform. And that I know for a fact because I'm a sasktel customer and the Saskatoon only has so many places to go to so I have likely been in these stores.

    Posted via CB10
    canuckvoip and rzanger like this.
    02-22-14 02:09 PM
  14. ray689's Avatar
    I completely agree with you. He should have gotten what he asked for. But the idea that the salesperson should have understood medical conditions, etc. is outrageous. The post was they he sold the wrong to someone with a medical condition. My point is that a salesperson should not have been expected to know about or consider that.

    Posted via CB10
    Guess what, had he given the customer what he asked for then he wouldn't have to worry about or understand anything.


    Posted via CB10
    rzanger likes this.
    02-22-14 02:11 PM
  15. rzanger's Avatar
    I didn't take a shot at the Q. It very obviously has a significantly smaller screen and small buttons. That is a fact. I didn't say it was bad. I said those two things are generally not the easiest for elderly people (limited vision and lower motor skills - especially with parkinsons in the mix.) The iPhone offers features that are meant to make things easier to do for many people who have more difficulty than most.



    I also said it might not have been right for the person you referenced in particular, however, it is a very solid recommendation. When I was in a store, I would have followed up by making sure that person knew how to use all those features as well as possible before they left.

    Funny that you menton feature phones. They also have bigger buttons that the Q, which is good for dailing, (and really about all one would do on a feature phone anyway) And most can be set to have larger font's for the numbers on the screen, so that even though it is small, it is more readable.

    I made no personal attack at you, (or the Q) and agreed that they should have been able to return/excange without hassle once they saw they preferred the Q's. But the guy who sold them the iPhones in the first place made as good a recommendation as you can get. I don't even like iOS products, but I can see their advantages where present.
    Ok.My apologies So you didn't take a shot. Just have a problem with what some people perceive a negative being trotted out and touting another phones selling points. Obviously an iPhone hasn't worked has it. You missed the most important part which is it was the physical key. Also the other point to this thread is having such a hard time to buy a Blackberry. This is not an isolated incident and concerns me greatly.
    ray689, Skyforever and canuckvoip like this.
    02-22-14 02:11 PM
  16. canuckvoip's Avatar
    Sorry, I didn't realize you were there when it happened.

    Yes the analogy was extreme, but it happens. For a more accurate one, A lot of people will go in asking for a "droid" or iPhone and want the exact opposite. Asking a few questions get's them what they really wanted.
    I'm glad you're here. I hope you are learning something because you should be paying very close attention to the only people that matter to you.
    Customers.
    Wow... what a concept.
    ray689 likes this.
    02-22-14 02:18 PM
  17. rzanger's Avatar
    I completely agree with you. He should have gotten what he asked for. But the idea that the salesperson should have understood medical conditions, etc. is outrageous. The post was they he sold the wrong to someone with a medical condition. My point is that a salesperson should not have been expected to know about or consider that.

    Posted via CB10
    No that wasn't the point. The point was that they were not interested in even discussing a Q10. It is too easy for elderly people to be intimidated when it comes to technology and unless they have someone there to stand up for them they lose every time.
    ray689, bbq10l, wincyUt and 1 others like this.
    02-22-14 02:18 PM
  18. playboldbook's Avatar
    I feel your frustration OP. I have had this happen a few times with Sasktel (just look at one of my past rants).

    When the Z30 first came out there was no sign of it on their website for 2-3 weeks. They were, and still are, pumping the iPhone 5c on the front page of their site. Then when you go to the smartphone section, iPhone has its own link while all others are lumped under the "Smartphones". So is the iPhone a dumbphone? I can only imagine they were forced to buy a ton by Apple.

    After 2-3 weeks, the Z30 was finally on their site but buried so deep a casual search would not have found it. When I asked why the Z30 was not in their main list of smartphones I got a very timid, "Oh, I don't know, it should be". I then gave them the guilt trip about how I like to support smaller companies, and could have easily abandoned Sasktel long ago for Telus or Rogers. And how I would have thought that by being a small Canadian Company they wold have a lot to benefit by leading by example and supporting BB. I take no credit for getting the Z30 listed more prominently but 2 days later it was up with the other BB offering. Still to this day it is not listed (graphically) as being 4G-LTE ready. Just pure laziness on the part of their web editor.

    I actually ended up getting my Z30 from Jump.ca. They admitted that BB was not selling well, but those that bought them did like them. I was not steered away from my choice in their store (Prince Albert Jump.ca). In fact, when I saw a price drop 10 days later i went back in and they just gave me a refund for the difference. I think I will continue to deal with them, rather than Sasktel personnel.

    The parallels between BB and Sasktel are actually quite amusing. In many ways, they take every opportunity to drive a customer away. Hopefully that will change in the near future, because I love my Z30.
    acovey and rzanger like this.
    02-22-14 02:19 PM
  19. bp3dots's Avatar
    Didn't say I was there. I was going by what the OP told us.
    Apparently you were there though since you seem to think the sales rep did everything appropriately and through his superior skills decided that an iPhone would be best for this customer after ensuring he asked all the right questions. It was either that or he is just another clueless ifan who happens to be a sales rep and just thinks iphone is the best and better than BlackBerry even though he likely has never used the bb10 platform. And that I know for a fact because I'm a sasktel customer and the Saskatoon only has so many places to go to so I have likely been in these stores.

    Posted via CB10
    I only said the iPhone would be a good first recommendation for many people with the description of the person OP referred to. I then said it obviously wasn't the best choice in this case, and that there should have been no trouble exchanging them.

    (Italics) Guessing at what the reason was by what he might or might not know is useless, and just stereotyping against your experience with others. We's all seen people who excel and those who suck within the same businesses.


    Ok.My apologies So you didn't take a shot. Just have a problem with what some people perceive a negative being trotted out and touting another phones selling points. Obviously an iPhone hasn't worked has it. You missed the most important part which is it was the physical key. Also the other point to this thread is having such a hard time to buy a Blackberry. This is not an isolated incident and concerns me greatly.
    Again.. I'm not sure how much more clear I can make this: It obviously wasn't the best choice in this case, and that there should have been no trouble exchanging them. Stop trying to make my responses some negative, anti-bb slam. I'm flat out agreeing that you should have had no trouble with the exchange. I also agree that if he did the job right th first time (which we have little info on) maybe the Q would have been bought then.

    However, in general an iPhone makes a good start for people with the issues described. Is that such an impossible thing to acccept? Maybe the guy didn't have an evil, no BB sales policy, but recommended something he genuinely thought would be better for this person.
    02-22-14 03:05 PM
  20. rzanger's Avatar
    OK. Let me clarify again. It wasn't anything to do with the virtues of an iPhone or any other device. It was more a problem of being pushed away from a blackberry device. Already been there done that with the iPhone. This is a very common occurrence and if you don't believe me come here and give it a try.

    Posted via CB10
    acovey likes this.
    02-22-14 03:26 PM
  21. TgeekB's Avatar
    The sales bot obviously.
    Partially. What about Blackberry for sitting on the sidelines too long?

    Posted via my Nexus 10.
    02-22-14 03:29 PM
  22. wincyUt's Avatar
    I understand your point. But when someone comes in asking for a tire because their wipers dont work, it's kind negligent to sell them the tire.

    Maybe you're caught in the difference between recommending the right thing and refusing to sell whatever the customer asked for altogether. Which I agree is wrong. But a decent salesperson should at least explain why the recommendation might be better and then, if you still want it, go ahead and give it to you.
    The first rule in sale is "LISTENING". If a sales person doesn't ask question and listens properly to a customer, then how can the sale person make proper recommendation? Moreover you have to agree that a lot of mobile device sales people know "nothing about technology" but pretend to know. Are there any formal education for mobile devices that's required before being hired to sell phones?. Most mobile phone sale people remind of the "blind leading or guiding the partially blind".
    rzanger and canuckvoip like this.
    02-22-14 03:38 PM
  23. Dave Bourque's Avatar
    02-22-14 03:38 PM
  24. rzanger's Avatar
    You see this is the problem. I am a Blackberry user and that can be a very frustrating thing because of the whole droid/apple/MS/BB fanboy deal. I am well aware of the phone wars but quite frankly I don't really care. It is just a little disturbing that you have to fight for what you want. I am mostly concerned that if people don't push back we will have no more Blackberry and I guess there probably won't be any need for Crackberry either. I posted on here because this is supposed to be a Blackberry site and I really didn't think it was appropriate to take to social media and have to deal with all the trolls. All that being said that is why it wasn't a rant. I will look for the rant forum though and then I will do some ranting. You will easily be able to tell the difference.
    ray689 likes this.
    02-22-14 04:00 PM
  25. canuckvoip's Avatar
    Partially. What about Blackberry for sitting on the sidelines too long?

    Posted via my Nexus 10.
    Sorry... not going to bite on that obvious deflection.
    02-22-14 04:03 PM
184 1234 ...

Similar Threads

  1. Better way to read .pdf files?
    By Baconwich in forum BlackBerry PlayBook
    Replies: 12
    Last Post: 04-23-14, 03:45 PM
  2. How to access iCloud reminders on BlackBerry
    By demc in forum More for your BlackBerry 10 Phone!
    Replies: 2
    Last Post: 03-01-14, 06:31 AM
  3. Sell discounted phones directly to loyals
    By Andy_bb_king in forum Armchair CEO
    Replies: 23
    Last Post: 02-26-14, 04:03 PM
  4. Recommend Me The Most Reliable Led App
    By LatinoLoco24 in forum BlackBerry 10 Apps
    Replies: 6
    Last Post: 02-23-14, 09:10 AM
  5. So I think I might upgrade and go from the Z10 to Z30...
    By SofaKingBored in forum BlackBerry Z30
    Replies: 16
    Last Post: 02-22-14, 05:27 PM
LINK TO POST COPIED TO CLIPBOARD