08-18-12 05:28 PM
71 123
tools
  1. kill_9's Avatar
    At this point in time I have no faith in Research In Motion to deliver BlackBerry 10 on either the smartphone or tablet anytime in 2013. Whatever machinations the development team and senior management have been orchestrating throughout 2012 has proven beyond a shadow of a doubt the "mobile platform" is a long way from seeing the light of day or the harsh reality of night. We were told emphatically by Thorsten Heins that BlackBerry 10 would be released as early as September 2012 and then he announced definitely in 4Q2012. Yet only days ago we hear from the proverbial horse's mouth there is a delay until 1Q2012 with the usual back-pedalling from a recent statement of a January 2012 release time-frame.

    Research In Motion - Deliver BlackBerry 10 in 2012 while you still have some credibility remaining. At least get it pushed out for the BlackBerry PlayBook to show BlackBerry 10 is not vapourware. The falsification of applications on the BlackBerry Dev Alpha must have been sanctioned at the highest level considering it was touted as "the future of BackBerry" by the CEO himself at BlackBerry JAM. Teenage girls s3xting their availability and middle-aged men bidding on these girls via BlackBerry Messenger is not the future. Or at least I hope it is not the future of BlackBerry.
    07-12-12 01:45 PM
  2. amazinglygraceless's Avatar
    Edit your dates.
    crazeee4u and BB10FTW like this.
    07-12-12 01:49 PM
  3. Sith_Apprentice's Avatar
    BB10 is not vaporware, it does exist but you are very correct, it is not ready for the harsh light of day. The software is still quite buggy and freezes often (though the BB10 all touch hardware is ready).
    pantlesspenguin likes this.
    07-12-12 01:54 PM
  4. JasW's Avatar
    Teenage girls s3xting their availability and middle-aged men bidding on these girls via BlackBerry Messenger is not the future.
    I must be missing something. I never even knew it was the present or the past. Maybe I shouldn't have deleted BBM.
    battery and metz9444 like this.
    07-12-12 02:01 PM
  5. kill_9's Avatar
    BB10 is not vaporware, it does exist but you are very correct, it is not ready for the harsh light of day. The software is still quite buggy and freezes often (though the BB10 all touch hardware is ready).
    The development team had two years to work on BlackBerry 10 because the BlackBerry Tablet OS 1.0 et. al.was meant to be the platform for future BlackBerry smartphones. As the first official act as Chief Executive Officer a housecleaning should have swept the development team into the dustbin and a concerted recruitment effort undertaken to hire competent, skilled, passionate, and motivated software engineers, computer programmers, and software project management personnel. Enough with the excuses. Deliver BlackBerry 10!
    07-12-12 03:25 PM
  6. darkmanx2g's Avatar
    Its delayed because of LTE chipsets. Everybody knows that. Sigh...lol
    07-12-12 03:45 PM
  7. Knightcrawler's Avatar
    At this point in time I have no faith in Research In Motion to deliver BlackBerry 10 on either the smartphone or tablet anytime in 2013. Whatever machinations the development team and senior management have been orchestrating throughout 2012 has proven beyond a shadow of a doubt the "mobile platform" is a long way from seeing the light of day or the harsh reality of night. We were told emphatically by Thorsten Heins that BlackBerry 10 would be released as early as September 2012 and then he announced definitely in 4Q2012. Yet only days ago we hear from the proverbial horse's mouth there is a delay until 1Q2012 with the usual back-pedalling from a recent statement of a January 2012 release time-frame.
    No he didn't. Get your facts right before you complain. All previous deadlines were promised by the Co-CEO's, not by Thor. The Q1 2013 deadline is the first date he's ever given.



    As the first official act as Chief Executive Officer a housecleaning should have swept the development team into the dustbin and a concerted recruitment effort undertaken to hire competent, skilled, passionate, and motivated software engineers, computer programmers, and software project management personnel. Enough with the excuses. Deliver BlackBerry 10!
    Ya, because the smart thing to do when you're company is trying to develop an entirely new mobile platform is to let go of all your developers and all the people who actually know how it works, and instead hire a bunch of new people who will need to be trained from scratch. Awesome strategy. Btw, the way to get "skilled, passionate and motivated software engineers and computer programmers, and software project management personnel" is to show that you're company is worth joining. That message doesn't go across too well when you fire the people who've spent countless hours working on your product which then gets delayed due to upper management incompetence and through no fault of your own.
    07-12-12 03:47 PM
  8. Majestic Lion's Avatar
    Whatever machinations the development team and senior management have been orchestrating throughout 2012 has proven beyond a shadow of a doubt the "mobile platform" is a long way from seeing the light of day or the harsh reality of night.
    This was quite poetic really.


    5-star thread, subbed and will read to grandchildren upon Crackberry's 50th anniversary!
    07-12-12 04:03 PM
  9. louzer's Avatar
    This is going to be a painful 7 months or so. The only saving grace is that if you're losing faith, there is no clear destination. Do you jump on a Galaxy S3 with no idea if you're going to be allowed to keep your Universal Search or if Samsung will decide to port their touchwiz to Jelly Bean? Do you snag an iPhone 4s and assume that all iPhone 5 talk is purely rumor? Do you jump on Nokia's Lumia 900 knowing you will top out at WP 7.8 and never see WP8?

    So if you're losing faith, but consider your subsidized phones carefully, then we're not left with many alternatives that make any sense right now.
    07-12-12 04:08 PM
  10. sam_b77's Avatar
    At this point in time I have no faith in Research In Motion to deliver BlackBerry 10 on either the smartphone or tablet anytime in 2013. Whatever machinations the development team and senior management have been orchestrating throughout 2012 has proven beyond a shadow of a doubt the "mobile platform" is a long way from seeing the light of day or the harsh reality of night. We were told emphatically by Thorsten Heins that BlackBerry 10 would be released as early as September 2012 and then he announced definitely in 4Q2012. Yet only days ago we hear from the proverbial horse's mouth there is a delay until 1Q2012 with the usual back-pedalling from a recent statement of a January 2012 release time-frame.

    Research In Motion - Deliver BlackBerry 10 in 2012 while you still have some credibility remaining. At least get it pushed out for the BlackBerry PlayBook to show BlackBerry 10 is not vapourware. The falsification of applications on the BlackBerry Dev Alpha must have been sanctioned at the highest level considering it was touted as "the future of BackBerry" by the CEO himself at BlackBerry JAM. Teenage girls s3xting their availability and middle-aged men bidding on these girls via BlackBerry Messenger is not the future. Or at least I hope it is not the future of BlackBerry.
    Feel better after getting that off your chest??

    Why do you have "faith" in RIM anyway? RIM sells devices not salvation. You don't NEED to have faith in it. They get the BB10 out and you like it, buy it. They are not able to get it out in time for your liking then buy something else. You can always buy another phone if and when BB10 comes out. It's just something which costs a mere $700. There are bigger things in life to worry about committing to, like a house, college education etc...
    07-12-12 04:47 PM
  11. rrrebo's Avatar
    07-12-12 04:57 PM
  12. Thunderbuck's Avatar
    Okay, we get it, you're angry and disappointed. Take a number.

    Let's review a little history here: BB10 could have been released this year. Really. And it would have been just as "incomplete" as the Playbook was on launch. Don't know if you remember this little factoid: the Playbook (and presumably the first QNX phones) were supposed to be able to connect to BES through a Java runtime. RIM sheepishly had to confess last summer that this wasn't going to work, and it probably complicated their product plans considerably. BTW, THOSE developers are likely among the 7,000 or so layoffs so far.

    RIM came pretty close to launching a laughably incomplete smartphone this year. Laughable, because it wouldn't have been compatible with RIM's own services (presumably, such compatibility would have been promised for some future date... imagine a spokesperson trying to announce THAT with a straight face). Thankfully, calmer heads prevailed, and they made the harder decision to give the project another year so that the "integrated" BES/BIS services could be completed.

    I've said it elsewhere: the delay to Q1 was maybe partly technical, but I think it was also business/marketing driven. Apple and Microsoft are playing "chicken" with each other with 18-wheelers with iPhone 5 and WP8, and by launching BB10 this fall RIM would have been a lowly little gopher at the point of impact.

    It's only one quarter, and not only will it make the product better, it will give it a better chance at survival. Suck it up.
    07-12-12 05:16 PM
  13. kbz1960's Avatar
    Okay, we get it, you're angry and disappointed. Take a number.

    Let's review a little history here: BB10 could have been released this year. Really. And it would have been just as "incomplete" as the Playbook was on launch. Don't know if you remember this little factoid: the Playbook (and presumably the first QNX phones) were supposed to be able to connect to BES through a Java runtime. RIM sheepishly had to confess last summer that this wasn't going to work, and it probably complicated their product plans considerably. BTW, THOSE developers are likely among the 7,000 or so layoffs so far.

    RIM came pretty close to launching a laughably incomplete smartphone this year. Laughable, because it wouldn't have been compatible with RIM's own services (presumably, such compatibility would have been promised for some future date... imagine a spokesperson trying to announce THAT with a straight face). Thankfully, calmer heads prevailed, and they made the harder decision to give the project another year so that the "integrated" BES/BIS services could be completed.

    I've said it elsewhere: the delay to Q1 was maybe partly technical, but I think it was also business/marketing driven. Apple and Microsoft are playing "chicken" with each other with 18-wheelers with iPhone 5 and WP8, and by launching BB10 this fall RIM would have been a lowly little gopher at the point of impact.

    It's only one quarter, and not only will it make the product better, it will give it a better chance at survival. Suck it up.
    Too much time for threads like the the OPs.
    07-12-12 05:41 PM
  14. berklon's Avatar
    This is going to be a painful 7 months or so. The only saving grace is that if you're losing faith, there is no clear destination. Do you jump on a Galaxy S3 with no idea if you're going to be allowed to keep your Universal Search or if Samsung will decide to port their touchwiz to Jelly Bean? Do you snag an iPhone 4s and assume that all iPhone 5 talk is purely rumor? Do you jump on Nokia's Lumia 900 knowing you will top out at WP 7.8 and never see WP8?

    So if you're losing faith, but consider your subsidized phones carefully, then we're not left with many alternatives that make any sense right now.
    You're joking, right?

    Any of the phones you already mentioned are perfectly fine to move towards right now. Basically you're saying don't buy the competitions better phone... but that same competition will have an even BETTER phone out soon.

    Do you honestly think you provided legitimate reasons to stick with BB and wait for RIM to release a phone (that may not ever come) and with very few apps?
    07-12-12 05:57 PM
  15. anon(3896606)'s Avatar
    Just fyi, you posted this in the wrong section.
    Have a good day.
    drjay868 likes this.
    07-12-12 06:24 PM
  16. agolongo's Avatar
    The development team had two years to work on BlackBerry 10 because the BlackBerry Tablet OS 1.0 et. al.was meant to be the platform for future BlackBerry smartphones. As the first official act as Chief Executive Officer a housecleaning should have swept the development team into the dustbin and a concerted recruitment effort undertaken to hire competent, skilled, passionate, and motivated software engineers, computer programmers, and software project management personnel. Enough with the excuses. Deliver BlackBerry 10!
    Two years to develop an OS in NOTHING. Microsoft has a 3 year product cycle with the prior release to use as a code base. Starting from a kernel is much more difficult! I dont believe OS 10 is even using the same kernel version as the Playbook OS
    Last edited by agolongo; 07-12-12 at 06:32 PM.
    07-12-12 06:30 PM
  17. louzer's Avatar
    You're joking, right?

    Any of the phones you already mentioned are perfectly fine to move towards right now. Basically you're saying don't buy the competitions better phone... but that same competition will have an even BETTER phone out soon.

    Do you honestly think you provided legitimate reasons to stick with BB and wait for RIM to release a phone (that may not ever come) and with very few apps?
    So, if I understand you correctly, you'd recommend that someone commit to 2 years with either an iPhone 4s or a Lumia 900 today instead of waiting it out with their existing phone until around October when the new lineups are scheduled to come out?

    I'm not talking about waiting specifically for BB10. I'm talking about now being a time that it does not make a lot of sense to make a 2 year committment to a new phone.
    bungaboy likes this.
    07-12-12 06:56 PM
  18. berklon's Avatar
    So, if I understand you correctly, you'd recommend that someone commit to 2 years with either an iPhone 4s or a Lumia 900 today instead of waiting it out with their existing phone until around October when the new lineups are scheduled to come out?

    I'm not talking about waiting specifically for BB10. I'm talking about now being a time that it does not make a lot of sense to make a 2 year committment to a new phone.
    My assumption was that you were indicating this could help RIM sell more BB10s, by delaying the purchase of other phones.
    07-12-12 07:01 PM
  19. louzer's Avatar
    My assumption was that you were indicating this could help RIM sell more BB10s, by delaying the purchase of other phones.
    No. I was simply saying that we all have a wait on our hands which is going to make it seem like an even longer time.
    07-12-12 07:42 PM
  20. CHIP72's Avatar
    I've said it elsewhere: the delay to Q1 was maybe partly technical, but I think it was also business/marketing driven. Apple and Microsoft are playing "chicken" with each other with 18-wheelers with iPhone 5 and WP8, and by launching BB10 this fall RIM would have been a lowly little gopher at the point of impact.

    It's only one quarter, and not only will it make the product better, it will give it a better chance at survival. Suck it up.
    Let me make the counterargument to the "launching BB 10 in Q1 2013 is a good idea because it will get lost in the new iPhone/flagship Androids/Windows Phone 8 storm" idea. RIM presumably wants to make BB 10 clearly superior to the competition, right? If that's the case, and many users, once they've played around with BB 10 devices, really DO believe BB 10 is clearly superior to everything else out there, then BB 10 will start to get word-of-mouth support from the tech trendsetters, and more people will buy BB 10 devices. It works to RIM's advantage to launch at the same time as the competition IF they truly have a superior device; if they launch after Christmas, many people will have already spent their money on other smartphones and RIM's superior device, while highly regarded, doesn't gain the market share it will need to be a serious competitor.

    RIM's decision to launch BB 10 in Q1 2013 makes more sense if BB 10 is NOT clearly superior to all of the competing mobile operating systems. Of course, if that's the case, most people besides the Blackberry diehards will pass on getting a BB 10 device regardless when it's launched.
    Last edited by CHIP72; 07-13-12 at 12:09 AM.
    07-12-12 11:49 PM
  21. Superfly_FR's Avatar
    07-13-12 03:55 AM
  22. kill_9's Avatar
    Ya, because the smart thing to do when you're company is trying to develop an entirely new mobile platform is to let go of all your developers and all the people who actually know how it works, and instead hire a bunch of new people who will need to be trained from scratch. Awesome strategy. Btw, the way to get "skilled, passionate and motivated software engineers and computer programmers, and software project management personnel" is to show that you're company is worth joining. That message doesn't go across too well when you fire the people who've spent countless hours working on your product which then gets delayed due to upper management incompetence and through no fault of your own.
    The only competent software engineers are those working for QNX Systems while The Astonishing Tribe and Research In Motion's own internal BlackBerry 10 development team seem to be asleep. I fail to understand how a project that was "on schedule and hitting all the milestones for 4Q2012 release" according to Thorsten could suddenly and inexplicably require an additional 6 months of development time. Regardless, there is something seriously foul within Research In Motion. I use their products on a daily basis and have come to rely upon them. The last thing I want to witness is the demise of this company but they keep shooting themselves in the foot.
    07-13-12 06:53 AM
  23. kill_9's Avatar
    Why do you have "faith" in RIM anyway? RIM sells devices not salvation. You don't NEED to have faith in it. They get the BB10 out and you like it, buy it. They are not able to get it out in time for your liking then buy something else. You can always buy another phone if and when BB10 comes out. It's just something which costs a mere $700. There are bigger things in life to worry about committing to, like a house, college education etc...
    There are many definitions of 'faith' not all of which reference a religious or cult following.

    In my life BlackBerry products and services have become integral so there are no substitutes from which to choose. Security is an essential requirement and we can agree few, if any, do mobile security better than Research In Motion.
    07-13-12 07:00 AM
  24. drjay868's Avatar
    The only competent software engineers are those working for QNX Systems while The Astonishing Tribe and Research In Motion's own internal BlackBerry 10 development team seem to be asleep. I fail to understand how a project that was "on schedule and hitting all the milestones for 4Q2012 release" according to Thorsten could suddenly and inexplicably require an additional 6 months of development time. Regardless, there is something seriously foul within Research In Motion. I use their products on a daily basis and have come to rely upon them. The last thing I want to witness is the demise of this company but they keep shooting themselves in the foot.
    Let't not be overly dramatic... the delay is 6-8weeks according to Kevin's latest interview with Thor. Even before this interview, we didn't know what the exact release date was, so assuming a Nov 22nd Q4 release, an 8 week delay puts into the second week of Jan, Q1. Heck, If they were planning a Dec 31st release, a delay of 1 day would have put us into Q1 2013. I know I'm pulling those dates and situations out my arse, but so is your delay of 6 months.

    There are many definitions of 'faith' not all of which reference a religious or cult following.

    In my life BlackBerry products and services have become integral so there are no substitutes from which to choose. Security is an essential requirement and we can agree few, if any, do mobile security better than Research In Motion.
    Isn't that exactly what we are?

    The word cult in current popular usage usually refers to a new religious movement or other group whose beliefs or practices are considered abnormal or bizarre.
    bungaboy likes this.
    07-13-12 07:13 AM
  25. Frank Castle's Avatar
    You're joking, right?

    Any of the phones you already mentioned are perfectly fine to move towards right now. Basically you're saying don't buy the competitions better phone... but that same competition will have an even BETTER phone out soon.

    Do you honestly think you provided legitimate reasons to stick with BB and wait for RIM to release a phone (that may not ever come) and with very few apps?
    Considering I get the perk of using any mobile device on the market I currently have a 9930, iPhone 4S and just upgraded to the Samsung S III. Really outside of the nice hardware Android runs on I don't find it that great. The SIII has had a lot of App crashing.

    The iPhone is what it is. It's been patched with new features since iOS 1.0. The root issues with the device will not be fixed with iOS 6 and the next iPhone will likely be another marginal update (4" screen, LTE, CPU bump). I think what RIM is working on is going to take mobile to the next level. Personally I find myself less productive on a touch screen and prefer the 9930 form factor, so a BB10 device like that with a 3.2-3.5" screen and nice keyboard is mecca to me. Every single touch screen device I have I only use for internet browsing and Apps.

    So the whole "better" device comment is the holy grail. There is always going to be a better device, how long do you sit on the fence? I use what works for me for the situation I need. Right now the 9930 is my daily driver as it's got a solid feel, fantastic keyboard, decent web browser and some key Apps I use daily. Would I like to see some of the Apps I have on the other device? Sure but I also have multiple devices and rarely don't have at least another device with me. Right now the best combo is an iPad and Blackberry 9900. You sacrifice nothing and get the best of both worlds.

    Whatever happens with RIM winds up fatal, I really don't know what I'd choose. Likely just get a feature phone with a nice keyboard and stick with a tablet for Apps / Internet on the go as I maybe use 90 mins of voice a month. I want to think they can pull this off, I'm in the middle as I see the promise of BB10 but understand the mountain RIM has to climb
    bungaboy likes this.
    07-13-12 08:24 AM
71 123
LINK TO POST COPIED TO CLIPBOARD