03-03-14 03:23 PM
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  1. ami.one's Avatar
    This hurts the Blackberry Brand much much more than any cash that come in from the unsold inventory.
    There is a reason why premium brands don't try to become mass market. BB should have a secondary brand for cheaper phones.
    Other wise the remaining loyal users will leave when they see people toting around cheap BBs while the mass market will disappear with the next Samsung Duo or Gionee or Micromax or Moto G
    03-02-14 11:28 PM
  2. meherzad87's Avatar
    This hurts the Blackberry Brand much much more than any cash that come in from the unsold inventory.
    There is a reason why premium brands don't try to become mass market. BB should have a secondary brand for cheaper phones.
    Other wise the remaining loyal users will leave when they see people toting around cheap BBs while the mass market will disappear with the next Samsung Duo or Gionee or Micromax or Moto G
    Buddy there is nothing like a premium brand now in phones. It's just smartphones that are new are priced high thus making it premium. Even in iPhone for example 5s would be premium while they have the i4 still selling as their base variant for the masses who cannot afford a 5s. But Yea it took 3 years for the i4 to reach that level while it took Z10 just one for known reasons of massive unsold inventory.

    Posted via CB10
    03-03-14 12:18 AM
  3. Stephen Cooper's Avatar
    Yes, it seems like negative image of brand.
    People will not buy z30 for 40 k thinking blackberry will cut prices to 27 k . So it impact on the brand value. People will think that they cut prices regularly and a lot. I mean 40 k then drastically 30 k then 17 k. I bought z10 for 41 k and now its 17 k brand new only 10 months. Come on BlackBerry.

    Posted via CB10
    That's every device manufacturer.

    Posted via CB10
    03-03-14 01:07 AM
  4. Dave Bourque's Avatar
    This sounds like one of those ironic day one sell out anecdotes that we had during the BB10 launch. (Though at least the article is conservative with its claims suggesting 'over 500 units' sold a day.)

    290 USD is hardly "dirt cheap". That is in the price range of a Nexus 4 or a Galaxy S III in the United States. A Lumia 920 can be had for even cheaper. The Z10 is a year old device and many last gen flagships halve in pricing.
    You do realize that the galaxy s3 and Z10 have nearly the exact same specs.

    Z10STL100-3/10.2.1.2141
    03-03-14 01:12 AM
  5. Dave Bourque's Avatar
    Yes, it seems like negative image of brand.
    People will not buy z30 for 40 k thinking blackberry will cut prices to 27 k . So it impact on the brand value. People will think that they cut prices regularly and a lot. I mean 40 k then drastically 30 k then 17 k. I bought z10 for 41 k and now its 17 k brand new only 10 months. Come on BlackBerry.

    Posted via CB10
    You are not alone... i bought a Z10 for 150 on contract. I saw a Z30 on December 26 for 0 on contract (to be fair all high end phones were 0 on that day with contract) . But if you want to say come on you should say it to the consumers. BlackBerry is only doing price cuts based on supply and demand.

    Z10STL100-3/10.2.1.2141
    03-03-14 01:15 AM
  6. tinochiko's Avatar
    You are not alone... i bought a Z10 for 150 on contract. I saw a Z30 on December 26 for 0 on contract (to be fair all high end phones were 0 on that day with contract) . But if you want to say come on you should say it to the consumers. BlackBerry is only doing price cuts based on supply and demand.

    Z10STL100-3/10.2.1.2141
    That's why they need to add value to the brand! That's what makes prices go lower anyway, people not willing to buy at the highest price because BlackBerry is not worth that to them, it was BlackBerry's proper high end device and they should have added more value to the brand.. which Chen is strategically doing, mainly on the enterprise side for now though..

    And I wonder how much profit the carriers make selling it at that price.. not much I would think... which means next time BlackBerry wants them to support their phone (Z30, Q20) they'll have a hard time, (which you can see already with how hard it is to get a Z30 in the UK from anywere apart from car phone warehouse and even then only certain stores) although Obv this was exasperated by the uncertainty in the future of BlackBerry. , which feeds back to value to the brand

    TechCraze C0008DDD1
    03-03-14 01:36 AM
  7. Dave Bourque's Avatar
    Brand value is lowered because of perception. They are going to need to rebuild this perception throughout the year.

    Z10STL100-3/10.2.1.2141
    tinochiko and bungaboy like this.
    03-03-14 01:48 AM
  8. THBW's Avatar
    Well, they already have on the 5s in China. They cut the price 20% before it was even released and then another 10% two weeks after because of poor sale numbers. As to the 4s, it is permanently sold at a discount in most markets.

    The days of discounts are here and everyone is doing it. Apple has been actively discounting for about 18 months and recently it has been cutting into their bottom line. How else to you sell a record number of phones yet have revenues drop. I have no problem with Apple wanting to keep the unit numbers high but it is coming at the expense of price per unit. Expect this trend to continue at an accelerated pace for the next 2 quarters.

    Each company needs to adapt to the fact that hardware margins are going to shrink. This is great for the consumer and it might be good for smartphone makers as well. If prices are lower, people might buy a second phone to meet different needs. If I could get a q10 around 400 dollars, I would buy it as there are many instances that this device would better suit my needs. But at 600 dollars, it's too much of a luxury.



    Posted via CB10
    03-03-14 02:18 AM
  9. imz's Avatar
    This hurts the Blackberry Brand much much more than any cash that come in from the unsold inventory.
    The handset is OVER 1 year old now, technically speaking in Apple terms, out of date as the "S" version is around the corner, in Android terms, obsolete.

    The price slash is well over due, by about a year.
    03-03-14 04:37 AM
  10. greenberry666's Avatar
    That's why they need to add value to the brand! That's what makes prices go lower anyway, people not willing to buy at the highest price because BlackBerry is not worth that to them, it was BlackBerry's proper high end device and they should have added more value to the brand.. which Chen is strategically doing, mainly on the enterprise side for now though..

    And I wonder how much profit the carriers make selling it at that price.. not much I would think... which means next time BlackBerry wants them to support their phone (Z30, Q20) they'll have a hard time, (which you can see already with how hard it is to get a Z30 in the UK from anywere apart from car phone warehouse and even then only certain stores) although Obv this was exasperated by the uncertainty in the future of BlackBerry. , which feeds back to value to the brand

    TechCraze C0008DDD1
    You have everything backwards. The product has inherent value. It's brand perception that is a major problem. They need to get BB10 into everyone's hands so that consumers can observe it's inherent value. Then, when they produce a super-phone, a few people might gouge into their pockets to get it.
    03-03-14 04:58 AM
  11. BoldPreza's Avatar
    I think realistically its a year too late. This phone should never have been priced as high as it was. This was supposed to be the launch pad to draw people in and had it been priced in the $350 to $400 range there would have been much more adoption of the platform which would have provided more apps.

    People can argue all they want about brand perception, fact is that BlackBerry has unfortunately at his point ceded that high end position to Apple. In order for them to really grow their platform they needed to get mass adoption of these phones and to do that on the first gen phone would have required a very aggressive price(in addition to the other things that I won't go into here).
    03-03-14 08:08 AM
  12. lnichols's Avatar
    People need to realize that in the US when you buy an Apple device, you are buying a device with the greatest app support and app quality, and probably the best movie and music distribution system available, and a large retail store network where you can get problem resolution quickly. With Samsung you are getting the largest screens and highest specs in a device possible. With Nokia and BlackBerry you are not getting neither at the moment. This is why large numbers of people will spend $600 on an iPhone or GS4 or Note3, but not that amount on a BlackBerry or Nokia. When the devices are priced at what the market values them or will pay for them, they sell. Microsoft/Nokia realized this, priced devices lower and advertised them and they have been increasing market share and developer support. BlackBerry did not and it sitting on tons of unsold product. It is simple supply and demand, and BlackBerry is not in demand until the price drops to the correct level. BlackBerry needs to hit that level when they release a phone, not until they write down tons of inventory.

    Posted via CB10
    bbq10l likes this.
    03-03-14 08:52 AM
  13. spikesolie's Avatar
    People need to realize that in the US when you buy an Apple device, you are buying a device with the greatest app support and app quality, and probably the best movie and music distribution system available, and a large retail store network where you can get problem resolution quickly. With Samsung you are getting the largest screens and highest specs in a device possible. With Nokia and BlackBerry you are not getting neither at the moment. This is why large numbers of people will spend $600 on an iPhone or GS4 or Note3, but not that amount on a BlackBerry or Nokia. When the devices are priced at what the market values them or will pay for them, they sell. Microsoft/Nokia realized this, priced devices lower and advertised them and they have been increasing market share and developer support. BlackBerry did not and it sitting on tons of unsold product. It is simple supply and demand, and BlackBerry is not in demand until the price drops to the correct level. BlackBerry needs to hit that level when they release a phone, not until they write down tons of inventory.

    Posted via CB10
    We've discussed this before, quite frankly majority of people don't care for apple's movie and music distribution, or Samsung's largest screens... and definitely not specs... your average Joe or your 12 year old iPhone 5s carrier doesn't understand what an octocore do for their phone. You might wanna get off crackberry for a while.

    The whole ecosystems bs that you keep touting, is also false. When people buy iphones, they didn't buy it thinking, hey because I have an apple tv already, I should really buy an iPhone, they bought the iPhone because it was popular and innovative back then, they got used to it and ended up buying more things from apple and now they've invested a lot into that ecosystem.

    You keep bringing large screens into this... some people really do like Samsung but hate large screens still end up buying the large screen phones. stop assuming everyone wants a phone that barely fits in their pockets

    Posted via CB10
    03-03-14 10:40 AM
  14. tinochiko's Avatar
    You have everything backwards. The product has inherent value. It's brand perception that is a major problem. They need to get BB10 into everyone's hands so that consumers can observe it's inherent value. Then, when they produce a super-phone, a few people might gouge into their pockets to get it.
    Right so in order for someone to buy your phone for its true value they need to have your phone so they recognise it's value..

    In theory that might work but it's joy practical let alone possible,

    So when I said value to the brand? And you say brand perception that's somehow a different thing?


    Reducing the price so that people recognise the value and buy your next phone is one strategy, it would work well for someone like Samsung, but a better strategy for BlackBerry is to use their money in effective, efficient marketing, that won't cost a lot, but improves the way people feel when they talk about BlackBerry, associating with positive thoughts and emotions rather than negative..

    This way the market equilibrium price for their products will be relatively higher for all their products, and in the long term their phones hold their value well..

    TechCraze C0008DDD1
    03-03-14 10:50 AM
  15. Eric Ton's Avatar
    Well, they already have on the 5s in China. They cut the price 20% before it was even released and then another 10% two weeks after because of poor sale numbers. As to the 4s, it is permanently sold at a discount in most markets.

    The days of discounts are here and everyone is doing it. Apple has been actively discounting for about 18 months and recently it has been cutting into their bottom line. How else to you sell a record number of phones yet have revenues drop. I have no problem with Apple wanting to keep the unit numbers high but it is coming at the expense of price per unit. Expect this trend to continue at an accelerated pace for the next 2 quarters.

    Each company needs to adapt to the fact that hardware margins are going to shrink. This is great for the consumer and it might be good for smartphone makers as well. If prices are lower, people might buy a second phone to meet different needs. If I could get a q10 around 400 dollars, I would buy it as there are many instances that this device would better suit my needs. But at 600 dollars, it's too much of a luxury.



    Posted via CB10
    Really? I thought they just reported record revenue...smh
    03-03-14 10:53 AM
  16. tinochiko's Avatar
    I think realistically its a year too late. This phone should never have been priced as high as it was. This was supposed to be the launch pad to draw people in and had it been priced in the $350 to $400 range there would have been much more adoption of the platform which would have provided more apps.

    People can argue all they want about brand perception, fact is that BlackBerry has unfortunately at his point ceded that high end position to Apple. In order for them to really grow their platform they needed to get mass adoption of these phones and to do that on the first gen phone would have required a very aggressive price(in addition to the other things that I won't go into here).
    Yes the first Lamborghini ever should have been ;1 so people could see what it was like then buy the next one which would be

    If you made a new os and put it in a device that doesn't guarantee mass adoption and therefore mass dev support etc, in fact you need to get the dev support and the apps before the device is ever in consumer hands.. well how so devs decide if they will support it? Alot don't, some do based on perception of how it will sell, some because they receive incentives,

    The Z10 sales was a big let down, not mainly because it was set at a high price, the market readjusted the price because people didn't want the phone at that price., it became a phone that people get because it is cheap, which isn't something you want you want people to get your phone mainly because of what it gives them, what they can do with it..

    Blackberry didn't effectively market what you could do with the phone, why people should buy it, the message wasn't communicated clearly, it didn't speak to people's emotions, people weren't moved so a lot of people didn't even know it was there, and if they did, they didn't know what it could do for them..

    The effects of reducing the price mean the phone is seen to be worth less, and for a while this represented the BB10 brand so that was seen to be worth less

    It's interesting to me that the Q10 held its value for so long..(here in the UK at least)

    TechCraze C0008DDD1
    03-03-14 11:03 AM
  17. lnichols's Avatar

    The whole ecosystems bs that you keep touting, is also false. When people buy iphones, they didn't buy it thinking, hey because I have an apple tv already, I should really buy an iPhone, they bought the iPhone because it was popular and innovative back then, they got used to it and ended up buying more things from apple and now they've invested a lot into that ecosystem.

    Posted via CB10
    Wow! Saying my point is wrong then stating that point is happening in the same paragraph. Perhaps instead of telling people they should get off of CrackBerry for a while you should take a shot of your own advice.

    Posted via CB10
    bbq10l likes this.
    03-03-14 11:30 AM
  18. lnichols's Avatar
    Yes the first Lamborghini ever should have been ;1 so people could see what it was like then buy the next one which would be

    If you made a new os and put it in a device that doesn't guarantee mass adoption and therefore mass dev support etc, in fact you need to get the dev support and the apps before the device is ever in consumer hands.. well how so devs decide if they will support it? Alot don't, some do based on perception of how it will sell, some because they receive incentives,

    The Z10 sales was a big let down, not mainly because it was set at a high price, the market readjusted the price because people didn't want the phone at that price., it became a phone that people get because it is cheap, which isn't something you want you want people to get your phone mainly because of what it gives them, what they can do with it..

    Blackberry didn't effectively market what you could do with the phone, why people should buy it, the message wasn't communicated clearly, it didn't speak to people's emotions, people weren't moved so a lot of people didn't even know it was there, and if they did, they didn't know what it could do for them..

    The effects of reducing the price mean the phone is seen to be worth less, and for a while this represented the BB10 brand so that was seen to be worth less

    It's interesting to me that the Q10 held its value for so long..(here in the UK at least)

    TechCraze C0008DDD1
    The Q10 is selling for $300 unlocked on some sites in the US. Carriers still have the Z10 and Q10 priced at higher levels though.

    Posted via CB10
    03-03-14 11:32 AM
  19. tinochiko's Avatar
    The Q10 is selling for $300 unlocked on some sites in the US. Carriers still have the Z10 and Q10 priced at higher levels though.

    Posted via CB10
    Really interesting, and from what I've read on here, the USA is where BlackBerry is struggling to get carrier support..

    TechCraze C0008DDD1
    03-03-14 11:50 AM
  20. Bla1ze's Avatar
    Shame they didn't realize they were overpriced from the get go, goes to show ya what right pricing can do. Now, they've already wrote those phones off so it's just all in hopes the Z10 is good enough to sell them another BB10 device down the road.
    03-03-14 11:54 AM
  21. randall2580's Avatar
    We've discussed this before, quite frankly majority of people don't care for apple's movie and music distribution, or Samsung's largest screens... and definitely not specs... your average Joe or your 12 year old iPhone 5s carrier doesn't understand what an octocore do for their phone. You might wanna get off crackberry for a while.

    The whole ecosystems bs that you keep touting, is also false. When people buy iphones, they didn't buy it thinking, hey because I have an apple tv already, I should really buy an iPhone, they bought the iPhone because it was popular and innovative back then, they got used to it and ended up buying more things from apple and now they've invested a lot into that ecosystem.

    You keep bringing large screens into this... some people really do like Samsung but hate large screens still end up buying the large screen phones. stop assuming everyone wants a phone that barely fits in their pockets

    Posted via CB10
    Everyone of my friends with Apple phones buy them because they are toasters. They buy them because you buy an iPhone and everything you want to do on a smartphone - you can do with an iPhone end of the story. And when they don't work for whatever reason they can walk into the store hold it out and say "FIX MY PHONE" and they leave the store happy 99 44/100th of the time. Your point about the ecosystem runs in circles - and ends with folks who are in the Apple ecosystem are loathe to leave it in the USA. Remember all the talk here on CrackBerry how all of our friends were bored with their iPhones and how when BB10 was released it would be just a matter of time before...how did that work out in the end? Wasn't very much true was it.

    There are reasons that Apple gets the highest price in the smartphone world for their phones, and BlackBerry cannot sell in ATT at free for the z10 and $49 for the Q10. The z30 is already at $99 - read the posts here about trying to buy one, no store stocks them. Hard to get more reduced than free.

    BlackBerry has nearly completely lost the mind share of most of the USA buying public and that is the reason their market share here is what it is.
    bbq10l likes this.
    03-03-14 12:46 PM
  22. bbq10l's Avatar
    We've discussed this before, quite frankly majority of people don't care for apple's movie and music distribution, or Samsung's largest screens... and definitely not specs... your average Joe or your 12 year old iPhone 5s carrier doesn't understand what an octocore do for their phone. You might wanna get off crackberry for a while.

    The whole ecosystems bs that you keep touting, is also false. When people buy iphones, they didn't buy it thinking, hey because I have an apple tv already, I should really buy an iPhone, they bought the iPhone because it was popular and innovative back then, they got used to it and ended up buying more things from apple and now they've invested a lot into that ecosystem.

    You keep bringing large screens into this... some people really do like Samsung but hate large screens still end up buying the large screen phones. stop assuming everyone wants a phone that barely fits in their pockets

    Posted via CB10
    How do you know why the "majority" of people buy anything? Just because you see no value in Apple's movie/music distribution doesn't mean others don't. That is one of the main reasons I use Apple products. You really can't speak for the "majority" of people on anything. Additionally, I use both Apple products and BlackBerry. My favorite remains Apple- precisely due to its ecosystem and customer support. Two things very lacking with BlackBerry.

    Posted via CB10
    03-03-14 03:11 PM
  23. spikesolie's Avatar
    How do you know why the "majority" of people buy anything? Just because you see no value in Apple's movie/music distribution doesn't mean others don't. That is one of the main reasons I use Apple products. You really can't speak for the "majority" of people on anything. Additionally, I use both Apple products and BlackBerry. My favorite remains Apple- precisely due to its ecosystem and customer support. Two things very lacking with BlackBerry.

    Posted via CB10
    Yea the average iPhone users bought it for the movie distribution......

    Posted via CB10
    03-03-14 03:19 PM
  24. D_Gui's Avatar
    Prices from certain retailers in South Africa, one of BB's strongholds, have been below India's 'special prices' for months, no drastic uptake in adoption of the Z10 here...

    BlackBerry's problem is marketing, most people here either thinks it still uses BIS or doesn't even know it exists...
    03-03-14 03:23 PM
49 12

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