[Masahiro]

You know how you had to restart your phone after installing apps, yeah that was something that came with using the old BBOS and could not be changed. So if you want more apps and to install them without hassle (crucial for any smartphone) then yes they definitely needed a new OS. Just one of the many major points to why BBOS needed replacement.

I agree. While I was quite happy with my 9900, BBOS was simply not designed for modern features like apps (requiring restarts for updates, as well as very limited allocated memory), high-performance gaming, and general aesthetics and fluidity. Features and improvements that everyone can enjoy are things like the improved browser with Flash capabilities, and overall stability (including no memory leaks).

Posted via CB10

[collinc93]

...because CLOCK that bloody spinning clock!!! It drove me nuts....even if there is some lagging in BB10 that bleeding clock had to go!!

[belfastdispatcher]

Every change of the BBOS software requires retesting of the entire OS to get the security certifications, BB10 only requires retesting if the QNX kernel version or crypto kernel version changes. Also the security certifications are not tied to specific hardware with BB10 like they were with BBOS. So with BB10 you get a much quicker and better way to get secure devices to your customers that value it.

BBOS was based on Java, so licensing to Oracle for every unit for that, they own QNX outright.

QNX will allow them to grow much further than they could with BBOS.

Posted via CB10

At the same time apps were never crashing, they would slow down the OS and you'd know it would need a reboot but after seeing how on Bb10 and iphone 5 apps can crush and quit so randomly it makes BBOS lol stable.

I haven't had a day where both my Q10 and iphone 5 haven't crashed an app.

[belfastdispatcher]

BB10 was introduced to get true 4G LTE speeds, BBOS on BIS/BES wasn't capable of that. I missed some features of BBOS when my Q10 was on 10.1, after upgrading to 10.2 there is no going back as it adds some of the missing BBOS features like email text wrap. 10.2.1 makes BB10's super phones from what I hear.

You do realise 4G is just a network and any OS could work on it right?

[belfastdispatcher]

Os7 is old outdated and it was built on a platform never designed for mobile. They absolutely needed a new os.

What? How could the OS that brought you mobile email not be designed for mobile?

[jpvj]

You do realise 4G is just a network and any OS could work on it right?

That's correct. But did you ever try to meassure the download speed with a BB OS 7 device? I don't know where the limitation was, but my BB 9900 never was able to reach the max of a 3G network, so LTE would not make sense. Maybe it was just the device being slow at writing to the flash memory - I don't know, but it sure was slow compared to other smartphones.

[belfastdispatcher]

That's correct. But did you ever try to meassure the download speed with a BB OS 7 device? I don't know where the limitation was, but my BB 9900 never was able to reach the max of a 3G network, so LTE would not make sense. Maybe it was just the device being slow at writing to the flash memory - I don't know, but it sure was slow compared to other smartphones.

BB7 could use BIS and the carrier network directly, for example while watching YouTube, on BB6 and before once you clicked on the YouTube video the BIS would disconnect, starting with BB7 it didn't.

So you didn't have to use BIS for everything and it didn't have anything to do with the OS, the speed limit was not in the OS.

[dkonigs]

BBOS was designed for the capabilities of a smartphone in 2004. It was a world of far more limited hardware, and far more limited software requirements. All the way up through OS 7, they kept bolting on more and more features that the core OS really wasn't designed to support cleanly (WebKit browser, SQLite engine, smooth hardware-accelerated GUI, touch interaction, etc.) Meanwhile, 3rd party apps kept getting larger and larger, and needing to do more as well. All this just made the platform perform worse and worse, in non-deterministic ways, no matter what you threw at it. The Bold 9900 is basically proof that you can't fix it by throwing better hardware at the problem. Its the most powerful BBOS phone every released, and yet it still shows all the same problems as the older ones after a few months of regular use.

The only reason that you, from the user perspective, may not realize just how horrible BBOS has become, is because the remaining app developers on the platform have so much experience dealing with all of its chronic issues that they now have workarounds for most of them. Users also seem to accept the need for constant reboots as though its normal. Frankly, its not. Its unacceptable. Seriously, just ask any BBOS dev about reliable networking, local databases, reliable file storage, consistent system behavior... These are all things that developers on other platforms pretty much take for granted.

Actually, believe it or not, back around 2006 most apps didn't require reboots to upgrade/uninstall. Many didn't even require code signing either. It was only a small subset that did certain things on the platform. What happened was that as apps needed to do more and more, they started to all do those certain things. At this point, every app does them, so every app needs those reboots.

[lnichols]

At the same time apps were never crashing, they would slow down the OS and you'd know it would need a reboot but after seeing how on Bb10 and iphone 5 apps can crush and quit so randomly it makes BBOS lol stable.

I haven't had a day where both my Q10 and iphone 5 haven't crashed an app.

I'd rather have the app crash out due to an issue, than have the entire OS/phone freeze IP requiring a reboot. BBOS needed to be replaced as it was designed for a different time and different mobile limitations that no longer exist in many places.

That said what is up with you guys not quoting stuff properly? Ah Never mind the forum is f'd up.

Posted via CB10

[belfastdispatcher]

I'd rather have the app crash out due to an issue, than have the entire OS/phone freeze IP requiring a reboot. BBOS needed to be replaced as it was designed for a different time and different mobile limitations that no longer exist in many places.

That said what is up with you guys not quoting stuff properly? Ah Never mind the forum is f'd up.

Posted via CB10

I was pretty pissed off the other day when the eBay app crashed when I was just about to list something. Had to start all over again. You would be too I'm sure.

[Bbnivende]

I agree that BBOS has reached the end of the road . The more I use my 9900 , I appreciate the speed at which I can make calls and answer them as well as sending and opening messages. I would have liked more of a BBOS like experience to the communication part of BB10.





Sent from my Nexus 7 using CB Forums mobile app

[m1kr0]

I disagree, they bought QNX in 2010, at that time they were still making decent profits from BBOS.

If we look at the stock, the signs were there towards the end if 2010 already. In the first part if 2011 the big slide came.




Posted via CB10

[belfastdispatcher]

If we look at the stock, the signs were there towards the end if 2010 already. In the first part if 2011 the big slide came.




Posted via CB10

That's share prices not company profits.

[sianto]

I strongly believe in 10.2.1! When it's officially released and capable of running "all or close to all" android apps... I could sell it to dozens of people myself just by showing it off...
I'm completely sure of that... with a quick demo of the os features (peak, hub) and another demo of their favorite android app running flawlessly, and you have a customer..

Posted via CB10 on my Z10STL100-1/10.2.1.1055

Already did that 2 times! Works like a charm!

CB10 from the amazing Z10

[m1kr0]

That's share prices not company profits.

Yes BD, I'm sure you understand that the stock price is an indication of investor confidence based on the profitability of a company amongst other factors. The investors had their doubts already back in 2010.

Posted via CB10

[belfastdispatcher]

Yes BD, I'm sure you understand that the stock price is an indication of investor confidence based on the profitability of a company amongst other factors. The investors had their doubts already back in 2010.

Posted via CB10

That could be true, I don't know, but what I do know is when BlackBerry decided to go for OS10 ie when they bought QNX they were in no way bleeding money, they were still making pretty decent profits. Are you saying I'm wrong?

[kbz1960]

That could be true, I don't know, but what I do know is when BlackBerry decided to go for OS10 ie when they bought QNX they were in no way bleeding money, they were still making pretty decent profits. Are you saying I'm wrong?

Maybe they weren't bleeding money but their user base was getting smaller.

[belfastdispatcher]

Maybe they weren't bleeding money but their user base was getting smaller.

Nope, wrong, the user base kept growing up until it hit around 80 millions shortly before BB10 was released.

[belfastdispatcher]

Maybe they weren't bleeding money but their user base was getting smaller.

Here's the numbers. Please note when the iPhone was released RIM had only 10 million subscribers. In 2012 they had 78 millions.

[LostOnThePianoRoll]

At the same time apps were never crashing, they would slow down the OS and you'd know it would need a reboot but after seeing how on Bb10 and iphone 5 apps can crush and quit so randomly it makes BBOS lol stable.

I haven't had a day where both my Q10 and iphone 5 haven't crashed an app.

That's a feature in not a bad point in the new OS, that a bad app can't bring the whole OS down like the old one... a bad process is killed..

Posted via CB10 on my Z10STL100-1/10.2.1.1055

[m1kr0]

That could be true, I don't know, but what I do know is when BlackBerry decided to go for OS10 ie when they bought QNX they were in no way bleeding money, they were still making pretty decent profits. Are you saying I'm wrong?

I'm not saying you are wrong and I'm not saying you are right, I'm saying the market spoke and the investors decided. Now for them I can't answer....

Posted via CB10

[kbz1960]

Here's the numbers. Please note when the iPhone was released RIM had only 10 million subscribers. In 2012 they had 78 millions.

There weren't as many people buying smartphones then as now. Now look at what iPhone did from that point on and compare that to what BlackBerry did from that point on. And for some of that time I'm not sure if the iPhone was a global phone. I'm not saying iPhone is better because of that both have their good and bad points.

[belfastdispatcher]

That's a feature in not a bad point in the new OS, that a bad app can't bring the whole OS down like the old one... a bad process is killed..

Posted via CB10 on my Z10STL100-1/10.2.1.1055

It's a feature until you see all your work gone and you have to start over.

[belfastdispatcher]

There weren't as many people buying smartphones then as now. Now look at what iPhone did from that point on and compare that to what BlackBerry did from that point on. And for some of that time I'm not sure if the iPhone was a global phone. I'm not saying iPhone is better because of that both have their good and bad points.

The iphone gaining more users doesn't mean that BB was loosing users, they both kept growing, one just at a much faster rate.

[mkelley65]

I just read about supporting BB7 indefintely, and it makes me wonder, why did BB need to change OS's at all? I mean, there are a lot of things I like about bb10, but when I look at my 9900, I don't really see why they couldnt have modified the OS instead of creating a whole new one and burning a whole 2-3 years doing so.

For those of you that know a bit more of what would be involved, would it have been easier to:

introduce the peek and flow concepts to BBOS,
make BBOS crash less
and upgrade the ram and cpu to work at an acceptable speed?

I love BB10, but when I loook at my 9900, I think all it needed was a LOT more speed (ram and cpu), some more stability, a non crappy camera, and a lot more apps. How hard would it have been for them to do this instead of building a whole new os?

Or did they really just hit a wall with the OS and they couldnt improve it anymore? It seems unfortunate for BB to have two OS's to support.

Indefinitely does not mean forever. It only means they haven't determined an end of life date YET. BBOS is old, slow, dated, and no one was coding for it. BBOS is the reason BlackBerry is in the state it is in now. A change was needed. QNX/BB10 is the future and gives BlackBerry more options. The sooner legacy devices go away and they focus on the future the better off they will be.