[Sith_Apprentice]

"RIM is developing BES 10, which will support existing BlackBerry devices, including the BlackBerry PlayBook tablet and new devices running on the BlackBerry 10 platform. BES 10 will be the ultimate management solution for all BlackBerry platform devices, as well as iOS and Android devices. BES 10 will launch simultaneously with the first BlackBerry 10 devices in Q1 calendar 2013.
"For existing BES customers, RIM will provide an upgrade to BES 10 in order to ensure that our enterprise customers have the most up-to-date technology available to manage their devices."

Link is here First Official Details on 'BlackBerry Enterprise Server (BES) 10,' From RIM | CIO Blogs

[cgk]

That's from before BGR printed their updated article and the 'clarification' from RIM.

[sleepngbear]

Has the basic premise of this thread not been effectively debunked? Why is it still here.

[JasW]

Has the basic premise of this thread not been effectively debunked? Why is it still here.

Uh, because people are engaging in a meaningful and enlightening exchange within it?

Nothing's been debunked. We are waiting for an official spokesperson from RIM's Debunking Department to debunk and clarify.

[_StephenBB81]

Uh, because people are engaging in a meaningful and enlightening exchange within it?

Nothing's been debunked. We are waiting for an official spokesperson from RIM's Debunking Department to debunk and clarify.

Very much so, The whole debate is still as clear as mud.

BGR's sources are hit and miss, and RIM isn't a fan so they aren't about to reach out to BGR to clarify things, where as Al S. is more likely to actually get facts and ask the questions that can get answers.

THAT said, I still would like to hear more info from a NON journalist, either RIM PR, so waiting to here from some BES people who have pushed the question up the chain

[njblackberry]

Thank you.

[sleepngbear]

Uh, because people are engaging in a meaningful and enlightening exchange within it?

Nothing's been debunked. We are waiting for an official spokesperson from RIM's Debunking Department to debunk and clarify.

Really. I see a lot of the same BS arguments about what RIM should and shouldn't be doing. We aren't going to get any more clarity on the subject until RIM gets around to providing it themselves, and that surely is not going to happen on this thread. Not to mention that this still isn't news.



You're welcome.

[njblackberry]

Welcome for what? So far, you have offered nothing to this thread except "this isn't news" as clearly people are interested in getting to the bottom of this mess. Now, if you can add something to the thread, or know anyone at RIM who can help clear this up, I fail to see what you should be thanked for.

So far, you are just trying to bully people. Or am I misinterpreting your helpful "this still isn't news". Which is nothing more than your opinion.

[lnichols]

Very disappointed in the messaging from RIM. In one statement in reply to BGR they clearly implied that BES10 will do it all with one server, and now they backing back off when BGR questions them directly. RIM it is time to stop with you incoherent messaging that has plagued you for years, and be clear on things. It is a simple question, will a BES10 server, with no other RIM servers of any kind, be able to manage BBOS 4.X through 7 phones, Playbook, and BB10 devices? People making decisions on the future of how the company will go with MDM and BYOD need to know this type of thing now.

[cgk]

Aren't we see a pattern here and it's nothing to do with product or the technical merits of the platform - it's to do with marketing and communications - From the dismal 'wake up' campaign to the way that the big PR push was derailed by the 'death spiral' quote* to this recent confusion it indicates that they need to get rid of some of the dead weight.

* Which I don't blame Heins for - his media handler should have stepped in

[_StephenBB81]

Very disappointed in the messaging from RIM. In one statement in reply to BGR they clearly implied that BES10 will do it all with one server, and now they backing back off when BGR questions them directly. RIM it is time to stop with you incoherent messaging that has plagued you for years, and be clear on things. It is a simple question, will a BES10 server, with no other RIM servers of any kind, be able to manage BBOS 4.X through 7 phones, Playbook, and BB10 devices? People making decisions on the future of how the company will go with MDM and BYOD need to know this type of thing now.

Anyone in that position should be reaching out for a direct answer from their RIM Rep, not waiting for a press release,
because the official response from RIM SHOULD BE "We do not comment on rumors" and it should be dropped, it isn't big media, and those that it really matters to should have contacts to get the right answers from.

[diegonei]

Actually this really isn't news and it has been pointed a few times in this thread...

[OniBerry]

Actually this really isn't news and it has been pointed a few times in this thread...

HA! Maybe not at the beginning, but it sure as heck is now.

[cgk]

Actually this really isn't news and it has been pointed a few times in this thread...

Then the crackberry boys must be a little behind because Chris just posted on twitter:


This post about BlackBerry 10 and BES was supposed to be simple. It took us 2 days to nail down the truth

[sleepngbear]

Welcome for what? So far, you have offered nothing to this thread except "this isn't news" as clearly people are interested in getting to the bottom of this mess. Now, if you can add something to the thread, or know anyone at RIM who can help clear this up, I fail to see what you should be thanked for.

So far, you are just trying to bully people. Or am I misinterpreting your helpful "this still isn't news". Which is nothing more than your opinion.

Bully???? Oh you slay me.

Well I can't tell you how relieved I am that all you Sherlock's are hot on the case. I'm sure you'll get to the root of this mystery in no time.

Meanwhile, here's what the rest of the world knows, and despite all your best efforts is all we're going to know, until RIM decides to let us know exactly what they're going to release and when. Anything else is rehashing of tired old whine fodder.

Clearing up the confusion: BES and BlackBerry 10 | CrackBerry.com

[ADGrant]

As noted we initially brought in Good due to demand and BYOD as we like the container approach. Users however HATE it. They want our data in all these little Apps to use as they wish. I wish I could send the hate mail we get, we've had a number beg for a Blackberry back and now that we refreshed all devices to the 9900 series there are ZERO complaints about Blackberry. Good is secure, I'll give them that. Good's been tossed around by every company the last 10 years. We had the G100 years ago and the Good server seems to be the same code from back then just hacked together with new features. Someone posted about RIM's enterprise data need and while that is true it's also not the whole story.

...

2. Verizon DOES require an enterprise data plan when using Good on Android. This alone has pretty much stopped Android adoption dead at our company. Good and Verizon have been "working on it" for over a year now. Their no dummies though, it's a revenue stream. The kicker is this is sticking it to our BYOD Android users as their actually seeing a data plan increase if they want to use their device. We don't stipend as we provide a fully paid Blackberry (with any features they require) so their want is not our need.
...

Side note - I've been trending RIM / Good metrics internally for the past year and while our RIM base is growing smaller it's not as much as management thought and some months we actually add more BB users than Good. We'll see how iPhone 5 impacts this but the big thing are people are locked into 2 year contracts and most only get a device at that point, RIM needs a competitve device.

In our company the choices are BYOD with Good or a tightly locked down Blackberry (Verizon 9900 with no camera). The BBs have no BBM access, no app installs, no memory card access and OTA upgrades are also not allowed. Loading company data into personal devices or apps is strictly forbidden. We even lock down the USB ports on desktop machines and scan every outgoing email for company data (emailing corporate data to a personal account can result in termination of employment). Our company is never going to allow EAS to iPhones and Android.

Verizon users in our company are also keeping their BBs due to a zero stipend policy.

[njblackberry]

Bully???? Oh you slay me.

Well I can't tell you how relieved I am that all you Sherlock's are hot on the case. I'm sure you'll get to the root of this mystery in no time.

Meanwhile, here's what the rest of the world knows, and despite all your best efforts is all we're going to know, until RIM decides to let us know exactly what they're going to release and when. Anything else is rehashing of tired old whine fodder.

Clearing up the confusion: BES and BlackBerry 10 | CrackBerry.com

Thank you oh wise and impotent one for reposting something that had been posted 16 minutes before. Judging by the tone of some of the comments in this (and other threads) THAT'S NOT NEWS. After all, it was already posted.

Oh well. I'm sure RIM will have an opportunity to clarify in the months ahead.

Good luck with that.

[shabbs]

Well, I'm bummed with the BES 10 clarification from RIM. Hopefully they have some very aggressive pricing for it to not be a factor. I don't think maintaining a legacy BES 5 server will scare off the big corps. It may be a factor for the smaller guys. I guess we'll find out in due time...

[louzer]

There's a huge storm brewing here, but if you step back, you'll see it's just a tempest in a tea cup. Everyone's getting all hot under the collar, but the fact is that BGR made a post and Crackberry's got a heated argument going.

To me, it's fairly simple. If you are an enterprise user, ask your rep. If not, but this is a meaningful issue to you, then send an email to RIM. There's a lot of speculation based on speculation going on here and people's feelings seem to be getting hurt. Instead of arguing, be proactive and get some more information. If you do get information, then post it here and then someone will click the "News Tip" button. Then we've got news.

I've said it before and I'll say it again. It's going to be a long wait to BB10 - 5000 and counting!

**Updated**
See that. New information!

[Sith_Apprentice]

RIM will be having discussions with their Enterprise and Government customers about the future of BES and BlackBerry MDM. This will almost certainly be under NDA so you are VERY unlikely to hear anything here about it any time soon. Even though CB has great contracts within the company, NDA information (while Kevin likely gets it) is still NDA and he has to walk a thin line to reveal as much as he can without violating that. Same goes for everyone on the CB team.

[cynicalreader]

My take on this discussion to date:

BGR says BES 5 will not be developed beyond 5.04. True, but not news, fully expected, any company would do the same and product will be "maintained" - with patches as necessary. Not news, fully expected.

BGR says BES 5 will not be compatible with BES 10. True, but not news, fully expected, anyone who has been reading about this knows and understands why this is the case.

RIM issues a statement:

RIM reached out to CIO�s Al Sacco to clear up BGR�s apparently inaccurate report. RIM�s Senior PR Manager Gene Nakonechny states:
�RIM is developing BES 10, which will support existing BlackBerry devices, including the BlackBerry PlayBook tablet and new devices running on the BlackBerry 10 platform."

This is really really big news and totally unexpected. Good news for RIM since having one BES to support all would be wonderful.

BGR and Cnet get back to RIM and ask WTF???????

RIM clarifies that despite the statement by Gene Nakonechny you do need BES 5 for current devices and BES 10 for BB10 devices.

Conclusion - there was no issue and no news until Gene Nakonechny decided to send out a statement that now appears to have been just plain wrong. The summary here on Crackberry Clearing up the confusion: BES and BlackBerry 10 | CrackBerry.com is clear and summarizes well what anyone who was following RIM knew already. Question is, why does a fan site end up doing RIM's job in providing clear direction and guidance. No, you don't just call up your rep on this. An official RIM spokesperson issued a public statement. It was wrong. It is RIM's responsibility to set the record straight. Other question is why did this Gene fellow cause all this thrashing. All he ended up doing was making RIM look like it can't get any public message straight.

[_StephenBB81]

My take on this discussion to date:

BGR says BES 5 will not be developed beyond 5.04. True, but not news, fully expected, any company would do the same and product will be "maintained" - with patches as necessary. Not news, fully expected.

BGR says BES 5 will not be compatible with BES 10. True, but not news, fully expected, anyone who has been reading about this knows and understands why this is the case.
NOT TRUE, BES5 Will be compatible with BES10, they can be run under the same screen, BBOS4-7 is not compatible with BES10

RIM issues a statement:

RIM reached out to CIO’s Al Sacco to clear up BGR‘s apparently inaccurate report. RIM’s Senior PR Manager Gene Nakonechny states:
“RIM is developing BES 10, which will support existing BlackBerry devices, including the BlackBerry PlayBook tablet and new devices running on the BlackBerry 10 platform."

This is really really big news and totally unexpected. Good news for RIM since having one BES to support all would be wonderful.

BGR and Cnet get back to RIM and ask WTF???????

RIM clarifies that despite the statement by Gene Nakonechny you do need BES 5 for current devices and BES 10 for BB10 devices.

Conclusion - there was no issue and no news until Gene Nakonechny decided to send out a statement that now appears to have been just plain wrong. The summary here on Crackberry Clearing up the confusion: BES and BlackBerry 10 | CrackBerry.com is clear and summarizes well what anyone who was following RIM knew already. Question is, why does a fan site end up doing RIM's job in providing clear direction and guidance. No, you don't just call up your rep on this. An official RIM spokesperson issued a public statement. It was wrong. It is RIM's responsibility to set the record straight. Other question is why did this Gene fellow cause all this thrashing. All he ended up doing was making RIM look like it can't get any public message straight.

So I disagree with your response. BES10 still can manage the legacy devices, but you need BES5 as a Plugin, once you're running BES5 you manage everything through BES10,

Gene Nakonechny was factually correct, yet was clear as mud in the implementation of how to use BES10. and was leaving out the requirement of BES5.

Glad we got the clarification that wasn't covered in PR garbage.

[cynicalreader]

Some takeaways from all this:

Where is Frank Boulben in all this? - He appears to be an affable, clear headed guy who was going to ensure that RIM now puts out clear, unambigous, consistent messages. I think it is time that Frank takes a closer look at the PR department.

Second conclusion, RIM should turf its PR department and just subcontract Crackberry to handle public pronouncements. Certainly CB has the requisite experience in dealing with the public and based on items such as its summary of what is really happening with RIM and BES 5 and 10, it does a much better job of representing RIM publicly than RIM does itself.

[Sith_Apprentice]

The problem with RIM, is they are tied up with the legal department entirely too much. Its a "you cant say that" type of atmosphere, even when simply clarifying. RIM has not, until now, spoken publicly about BES10, though again, they do under NDA. They either need to lock down the leaks internally, or they need to be much more open with the media (and blogs)


side note, just received this error when posting:

"This forum requires that you wait 30 seconds between posts. Please try again in 2156 seconds."

[cynicalreader]

Gene Nakonechny was factually correct, yet was clear as mud in the implementation of how to use BES10. and was leaving out the requirement of BES5.

Thanks for the catch at the top, yes pre BB10 DEVICES not compatible with BES 10 (not enough caffeine yet )

But ya gotta admit, that was not exactly a minor detail that Gene left out.