[mysticmeg]

Blasterds! We should just like shoot the haters and tell em to do one!

[pantlesspenguin]

Not all Android/iPhone users here are haters. Not in the slightest. From what I've seen, most of the Android/iPhone users that still post here do so because we're former BB users and want to see the platform grow and for new and innovative handsets to come out. And, this is where we're used to posting, we have friends here, we've seen that civil discussions CAN take place here, etc. From what *I've* seen, Android/iPhone users don't get in a tizzy until we see someone post something untrue of what the OS can do, or they throw out insults like "iToy" etc. We state a correction, then all of a sudden we're "haters" and "trolling?" Granted I know there have been some actual trolls, but to stereotype everyone who uses a different device as one just isn't right.

[belfastdispatcher]

Not all Android/iPhone users here are haters. Not in the slightest. From what I've seen, most of the Android/iPhone users that still post here do so because we're former BB users and want to see the platform grow and for new and innovative handsets to come out. And, this is where we're used to posting, we have friends here, we've seen that civil discussions CAN take place here, etc. From what *I've* seen, Android/iPhone users don't get in a tizzy until we see someone post something untrue of what the OS can do, or they throw out insults like "iToy" etc. We state a correction, then all of a sudden we're "haters" and "trolling?" Granted I know there have been some actual trolls, but to stereotype everyone who uses a different device as one just isn't right.

I've always enjoyed our debates but it goes the other way too, many have left older blackberry models behind to move to android/iphone, and they're not aware of the newer models capabilities. Browser for example is no longer slow starting with oS6 and even faster with OS7.

Posted from my CrackBerry at wapforums.crackberry.com

[ichat]

I've always enjoyed our debates but it goes the other way too, many have left older blackberry models behind to move to android/iphone, and they're not aware of the newer models capabilities. Browser for example is no longer slow starting with oS6 and even faster with OS7.

Posted from my CrackBerry at wapforums.crackberry.com

Thats why the troll should always learn from the beginning that 'thinking before you speak' is a bit better than blurting out a bunch of crap

[pantlesspenguin]

I've always enjoyed our debates but it goes the other way too, many have left older blackberry models behind to move to android/iphone, and they're not aware of the newer models capabilities. Browser for example is no longer slow starting with oS6 and even faster with OS7.

Posted from my CrackBerry at wapforums.crackberry.com

Indeed. Sometimes when I'm bored and out on the town I'll duck into a mobile store and play with phones. I've gotten to play w/ the 9850 some, but still haven't found a working 9900/9930 model .

[pantlesspenguin]

Thats why the troll should always learn from the beginning that 'thinking before you speak' is a bit better than blurting out a bunch of crap

Wouldn't that include BB users who call iPhone "iToy" and say that Android/iPhone devices are good for media but not productivity, etc?

[CracklePot]

I also hang out in a developers forum called Stack Overflow. Wonderful forum.

One thing I like about that forum is that there is a way to 'downvote' posts. This allows the community at large to police itself.

I'm frequently looking for the 'Don't Like' or 'Downvote' button, especially in the Playbook forum.

I have indeed found the Ignore feature to be quite useful, but that doesn't provide any real feedback to the individual.

I'm also a Ham Radio operator. Every day there are kids who, unbeknownst to their parents, jump on the radio and whistle endlessly over top of a group trying to talk.

They only do it because there's something wrong at the core of their being - a certain meanness from which they derive perverse pleasure.

I doubt those kinds of people only hang out on the air waves.

[NFLPLAYBOOK]

Yeah I agree There seems to be a negative comment in every post.

[Foppa_21]

... also, i'd like to do some due diligence by sharing what is outside the BB world to help others see that there are in fact, better options.

... i think this is caused by the strong brand loyalty that blackberry fans still have... even if it is clear that their choice is not on par with the competition.

... ultimately, once you truly open your mind to what's out there, accepting the reality that RIM's products are not exactly on par with what's out there, becomes clearer.

Seriously? You feel it's your responsibility to come to a BB enthusiasts site and tell us there are better choices than the one we made. And you feel we've come to CB looking for "outside" opinions on why other platforms are better? Not to mention you�re implying that we�re unable to make our own decision about what�s best for our smart phone needs and so you�re going to �open our eyes?� I mean, really?

Let's make a parallel with another polarizing topic from the sports world that sparks intense debate � Tim Tebow: is he, or is he not, an NFL-caliber quarterback? When these debates happen on a player-neutral site, such as ESPN, it�s totally appropriate and acceptable. But I can�t image being the kind of person that felt it was my responsibility to go on a Tebow Fan site and tell them why they are wrong to support Tebow. They don�t want my opinion, or care about my opinion, regardless of how factual I feel it is.

If we (BB users) want to learn more about other platforms, there are plenty of ways to do so. All we have to do is click on one of the Mobile Nations links at the top of the page. And when someone comes to your platform�s site asking questions and looking for insight, give it your best sales pitch. Smother them with your knowledge and experience. But you don�t need to do it here on Crackberry as it�s not wanted.

[houshinto#IM]

With regards to OP`s original sentiments, I have to agree, the tone of crackberry has changed. The purpose hasn't changed, but you'd think differently if you judge merely on the forums alone.

This is a site full of negative spam. A lot of comments have no constructive elements other then to either criticize or undermine anything RIM related. A lot of New/infrequent posters typically engage in this type of negative sniping. I call them "Drive-Bys".

Any positive or general announcement is peppered with skepticism, negativity, and anecdotes of disappointment.

There is a echo chamber that has developed here. Negativity is amped and echoed while the positive/encouraging is lost in the noise.

As if raining down negativity on virtually every topic is what constitutes an open, debating, and progressive forum. I don't think so. This is a flogging ground, a shooting gallery if you will. The "ninnies" all wait for the next duck, announcement or forum topic, to come up before lambasting or hijacking the discussion into a RIM disappoints, is doomed, or isn't relevant rant.

It's hard to ignore the fact that for any new or casual visitor to the site the overwhelming theme is negative and unhappy.

What's funny to me is that it's actually become a point of contention if you happen to be a happy blackberry user or an advocate to blackberry products. You're pretty quickly labelled as ignorant, in denial, or a fanboy.

I actually don't even bother to recommend this as a enthusiasts site anymore, to family, friends, or the average consumer, as they are usually turned off by "all the unhappy people, the myriad of complaints, and overall depressing tone".

For those who just say ignore it or have the arrogance to blame the visitor or forum members for not being immune, I'd say you're negligence and silence helps continue to negative perception so you're an accomplice not just a by-stander.

This site is still the best resource for troubleshooting and technical information. That and the dedicated news updates from the Mods is probably it's only redeeming quality at this point.

[lnichols]

I'm fine with people who currently own or are currently issued Blackberry devices expressing dissatisfaction with the phones or tablets that they use. But IMHO, if you chose to leave and go to another platform, then you shouldn't be hanging around Crackberry providing thoughtless one-liners and bashing on the platform. You left the platform, now leave the forum tied to the platform and go to a forum that supports your platform. We don't need to be converted to your new religion. I would like to see the other device forums on Crackberry be removed completely and just link to the forums of the Mobile Nations sites for the respective device.

[TgeekB]

I really believe that if we would learn to not attack back, most of the people starting these threads would eventually go away. Unfortunately, they become some of the largest threads until eventually shut down by the mods. The OP wins and then starts another one. Why don't we make an effort to ignore them and talk with ourselves about BB, how it helps us, how we can make it better, etc.

[reeneebob]

Not all Android/iPhone users here are haters. Not in the slightest. From what I've seen, most of the Android/iPhone users that still post here do so because we're former BB users and want to see the platform grow and for new and innovative handsets to come out. And, this is where we're used to posting, we have friends here, we've seen that civil discussions CAN take place here, etc. From what *I've* seen, Android/iPhone users don't get in a tizzy until we see someone post something untrue of what the OS can do, or they throw out insults like "iToy" etc. We state a correction, then all of a sudden we're "haters" and "trolling?" Granted I know there have been some actual trolls, but to stereotype everyone who uses a different device as one just isn't right.

Co-signed.

I sell phones. It's what I do. I still recommend and sell BB to customers everyday if that is the best phone for what they need to do. I sell a lot of iPhones. I sell Android. I post here because of relationships I have with people here, because it's by far the busiest and most helpful of the smartphone forums (precentral a close second but tipb and androidcentral are very cliquey and can be rude when your question isn't outright ignored), and because I need to stay up to date to help customers. I also want RIM to succeed as they are a Canadian company.

I have been called a troll for correcting misinformation.

Is that right or fair?


Sent from my iPhone 4 using Tapatalk

[Laura Knotek]

Some of these "former" blackberry owners are the most active people on this forum though, that is not right. They also base their opinions on the last BB they had, some the 9000 or even older. If they're not bashing BB they are vehemently defending other platforms at the slightest sign of negativity towards them. It's as if they have alarm bells ringing every time something negative is said.

Until BlackBerry increases market share in English-speaking countries, there will not be a lot of active users on the forums who are current users.

The former users are just not being replaced by active new users, given the decline of market share in North America. Granted, market share is the UK has increased slightly in recent times. However, most of the market share increase has been in countries that do not speak English (exception being India/some Middle Eastern countries). The new users from the countries that do not speak English really cannot interact with posters here, since folks who speak English probably do not speak their languages.

[IslandCombat]

i've been a really long time lurker and just recently started posting. What I can tell is this: RIM hasn't given us much to be excited about in the past while, so its pretty much natural to choose the complaint side instead, as it at least keeps conversations going. Once the new BBX phones are getting close to release I think it will swing back the other way again. The people need something to be excited about before they are going to start turning the frowns upside down.

[texazzpete]

What negative spam?
As far as i'm concerned, the 'negative' people are actually helping more. This site is filled with RIM worshipping drones...it's almost as bad as TUAW where opinions that are even mildly critical of Apple are downvoted.

I've used a BB for 2 years with mixed emotions. So far it hasn't been a perfect experience and I really blame you guys with your rose tinted view of RIM for the company's lethargy and current travails. Since when did it become acceptable to have to remove your battery every so often to get the phone to run smoothly? You guys put up with years of 'battery pulls' without complaints so RIM happily kept stuffing their phones with anaemic RAM chips.
It is perhaps this blind RIM worship that led the inept leadership to come out with the thoroughly outdated Torch 9800 as a flagship phone in late 2010.

Now, I've since traded my 9780 for a Bold 9930. While i love the build quality and responsive touchscreen, the battery life is atrocious! I have friends who have sold their 9930s and switched back to the 9700 or 9780. I head to the Crackberry forum in desperation (hoping to find a solution) and one of the very first posts i see is from a smug 9900 owner deriding everyone who has had battery life complaints!

You guys NEED to pass the message of tough love on to RIM. All the RIM worship here will not help save your beloved company.

[_StephenBB81]

Not all Android/iPhone users here are haters. Not in the slightest. From what I've seen, most of the Android/iPhone users that still post here do so because we're former BB users and want to see the platform grow and for new and innovative handsets to come out. And, this is where we're used to posting, we have friends here, we've seen that civil discussions CAN take place here, etc. From what *I've* seen, Android/iPhone users don't get in a tizzy until we see someone post something untrue of what the OS can do, or they throw out insults like "iToy" etc. We state a correction, then all of a sudden we're "haters" and "trolling?" Granted I know there have been some actual trolls, but to stereotype everyone who uses a different device as one just isn't right.

I agree, and disagree, it is a pretty equal from the people who use the other platforms for their blatant disreguard for BlackBerry and often their users, as those who wish to see BlackBerry succeed and remain here to help maintain and build the community.

There some of the mildly aggressive posters don't even realize it I think
But think of it like this. go to a Ford Forum, and ALWAYS Bring up what your 2010 chevy can do. And what your 1988 Ford couldn't do.
You don't mean it in a harsh way, but do you go to a Ford Site to read about what a Chevy can do? yet so many threads a person asks about a BlackBerry, and some useful information is passed along from a Former BlackBerry user, but with that useful information also comes a blurb about "but I don't use BlackBerry anymore cause my Android/iPhone does this so much better"
it's a passive aggressive comment, that once or twice doesn't seem bad, but the fact that 30-40% of the most active posters post something along those lines every day, it makes the forum a less welcoming place.

There are a few Posters who are experts in passive aggressive conversation, and I am taken aback when I read a post that doesn't contain it. I wouldn't label them a troll at all.

[_StephenBB81]

Wouldn't that include BB users who call iPhone "iToy" and say that Android/iPhone devices are good for media but not productivity, etc?

IF!! they said it on a iPhone or Android site it would be uncalled for.

BUT Go to an Edmonton Sports Bar and Call the Calgary Flames a bunch of flaming losers, even in 2005 when they won their division, Part of what happens in a fan sight is people talk down about the competition,

You don't boost up and talk about the people you want to beat! unfortunately you're not allowed to be a Fan in this fan site anymore everyone must love everything.

[pantlesspenguin]

IF!! they said it on a iPhone or Android site it would be uncalled for.

BUT Go to an Edmonton Sports Bar and Call the Calgary Flames a bunch of flaming losers, even in 2005 when they won their division, Part of what happens in a fan sight is people talk down about the competition,

You don't boost up and talk about the people you want to beat! unfortunately you're not allowed to be a Fan in this fan site anymore everyone must love everything.

But in THIS case, the case about mobile technology, what's the point in bashing another platform/users of that platform? I'm all for the other platforms innovating and coming up with awesome features because that means that every other platform will then have to top that and come up with their own selling points. Just because I use an Android device now doesn't mean that a kick-**** QNX/BBX device, iPhone, etc won't sway me toward that platform on down the line . Innovation is a GOOD THING, and we should be celebrating what a certain platform does well, because that can only bode well for us consumers in the long run.

[houshinto#IM]

What negative spam?
As far as i'm concerned, the 'negative' people are actually helping more. This site is filled with RIM worshipping drones...it's almost as bad as TUAW where opinions that are even mildly critical of Apple are downvoted.

I've used a BB for 2 years with mixed emotions. So far it hasn't been a perfect experience and I really blame you guys with your rose tinted view of RIM for the company's lethargy and current travails. Since when did it become acceptable to have to remove your battery every so often to get the phone to run smoothly? You guys put up with years of 'battery pulls' without complaints so RIM happily kept stuffing their phones with anaemic RAM chips.
It is perhaps this blind RIM worship that led the inept leadership to come out with the thoroughly outdated Torch 9800 as a flagship phone in late 2010.

Now, I've since traded my 9780 for a Bold 9930. While i love the build quality and responsive touchscreen, the battery life is atrocious! I have friends who have sold their 9930s and switched back to the 9700 or 9780. I head to the Crackberry forum in desperation (hoping to find a solution) and one of the very first posts i see is from a smug 9900 owner deriding everyone who has had battery life complaints!

You guys NEED to pass the message of tough love on to RIM. All the RIM worship here will not help save your beloved company.

Yes, Negative Spam, comments that contribute nothing but to highlight an opinion that RIM products are crap and they have no hope. If you can't find them littered about the forums then I really have to question if you even read them.

There's a difference between offering constructive criticism and RIM bashing.

Battery pulls? I and a lot of others stopped doing that the moment we knew we could Alt, Shift, Del to "reset" without battery pulls.

Every platform has it's issues. Would I accept a phone that drops calls on a more frequent basis then it's competitors and that gives me almost no choice or control aside from opening and closing apps? Would I accept a slew of phones that require me to carry multiple batteries or have OS problems that would crash my phone prompting a total reinstall?

You seem to be very embittered by the posters who were deriding you about your 9900. While I'm sorry that the 9900 battery did not meet your requirements, or you get a bad battery perhaps?, plenty of people commented on that fact and that's fine. It's when you start trashing RIM as a whole.

RIM sucks cause of a bad battery for the 99XX series? Come on....Please write off Android under that sole rubric.

RIM worshiping drones? I don't think so even the most ardent "RIM worshiper" will still admit there are areas of improvement, and there are lots like with ANY company, but what's wrong with showing their enthusiasm by stating their love for their blackberry.

We're not blind, rather detractors are usually quite blind with their bitterness and loathing towards RIM.

As if they personally betrayed you and wanted to screw you? Get over yourselves. The same goes for me if I'm ever arrogant enough to think that RIM caters these devices solely to MY needs.

RIM got the message a while ago but I doubt the vindictiveness that members and the media at large has it made it capable for them to redeem themselves.

Kinda hard to do when you're punished with constant bad press and savaged beyond reason in stock price.

It's called a measured response and people have been overtly punishing.

[houshinto#IM]

The day pro and con debates cease to exist and everyone begins pumping sunshine up each other's rears, this place will be a useless place to exchange opinions, ideas and information. Censorship is very ugly.

Pro and Con, so American and polarizing?

This is not a debate about pro and con. Even the most Pro member will contribute to the areas that RIM can improve or fix. A con will only bash and write off any attempts as pointless.

This isn't censorship, this is a debate about whether this place is becoming to complacent with negative spammers.

I think people don't really get that you can be constructively critical of RIM yet still be a user of their devices and an enthusiast.

This site will never be useless, even if they took the forums down completely.

[Jake2826]

I think the Crackberry Management needs to make a decision on the FOCUS of the website. Is it an "Enthusiasts Community" or is it simply "A place to talk about all things Blackberry." In some ways, it's a difficult topic to talk about. Does the management focus more on catering to a smaller base of enthusiastic Blackberry Supporters or do they try to net as many people as they can with a community based around people who just want to talk about anything related to Blackberry. It's a subtle difference, but a difference that can have a huge impact on the tone of the website.

[reeneebob]

BUT Go to an Edmonton Sports Bar and Call the Calgary Flames a bunch of flaming losers, even in 2005 when they won their division,

You are so wrong.

Clearly BOTH Edmonton and Calgary are flaming losers. The Leafs are the fungus growing on the bottom of the flaming losers.

Of course, I'm a Sens fan.

[Caymancroc]

Most of the haters just want attention. Don't give it to them!

I would say some of the "haters", as you call them, are like me. I once loved my BB. I want(ed) RIM to succeed (I say "wanted" because I believe they are about done). I complain because they can (could have) do(ne) so much better.

As a consumer of a product you have the right to complain, especially if you have given so much money to RIM over the years as my company and I have. It saddens me they are failing. I was first in line to get a Playbook, first to get many of their phones, been using BB phones for 8 or so years now I would guess. Used to be a huge fan. The Playbook was a miserable flop. I returned it after troubleshooting it for many many hours. What a half-baked garbage piece of equipment. My iPad is flawless right out of the box.

I think some of the "haters" are just truly frustrated. How many years have we been doing battery pulls? Why can't BB Maps work right? Why can't I have a front facing camera or a decent camera for that matter? It is all garbage. There are so many ways to improve the device. iPhone has beat them though. They are the king.

The good thing is that when people visit here and are considering a Blackberry they see the problems with the device ahead of time. People complain when they are pissed off and usually don't comment when they are happy. It is good to alert people to the potential negatives of BB before they buy.

To finish, I can honestly say I believe RIM is done. The iPhone 4S cannot be matched and QNX is too little too late. I also, for the first time, would not recommend someone getting a BB phone. A friend of mine asked me about my BB 9780 recently and I told him to get an iPhone. He did and he loves it. I am glad I didn't tell him to get a BB because he would likely be on here complaining with the rest of us.

[dodger_moore]

I want(ed) RIM to succeed (I say "wanted" because I believe they are about done). I complain because they can (could have) do(ne) so much better.

The Playbook was a miserable flop. I returned it after troubleshooting it for many many hours. What a half-baked garbage piece of equipment. My iPad is flawless right out of the box.

It is all garbage. There are so many ways to improve the device. iPhone has beat them though. They are the king.

It is good to alert people to the potential negatives of BB before they buy.

To finish, I can honestly say I believe RIM is done.

The iPhone 4S cannot be matched and QNX is too little too late. I also, for the first time, would not recommend someone getting a BB phone. A friend of mine asked me about my BB 9780 recently and I told him to get an iPhone. He did and he loves it. I am glad I didn't tell him to get a BB because he would likely be on here complaining with the rest of us.

A perfrect demonstration of passive aggressive negativity, well done!

Just look at what an ugly, unhelpful post you have written. I would prefer it if you left the forum or brightened up your act. You have blind faith for your beloved iPhone but trash talk all things BB, such a hypocrite. You have the blinkers on if you think there is only one phone out there for everybody.

Putting you on ignore wouldn't do enough - unless of course we all put you on ignore...