09-03-16 08:29 AM
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  1. ohaiguise's Avatar
    As a long time Blackberry user, I feel Chen is not killing Blackberry at all. That was done years ago when the founding fathers failed to see the market change and fell into complacency. Being here from the USA, I have seen the brand all but disappear from the landscape and this has nothing to do with Mr Chen.

    I personally feel if it wasn't for Mr Chen taking over and rebuilding the company, they would have went the way of the dodo bird. I would rather have the company still be around developing software then the alternative. Just my two cents.
    I wouldn't care about BB at all if they stopped making devices.
    Asvertus likes this.
    07-21-16 06:02 AM
  2. IndianTiwari's Avatar
    As a long time Blackberry user, I feel Chen is not killing Blackberry at all. That was done years ago when the founding fathers failed to see the market change and fell into complacency. Being here from the USA, I have seen the brand all but disappear from the landscape and this has nothing to do with Mr Chen.

    I personally feel if it wasn't for Mr Chen taking over and rebuilding the company, they would have went the way of the dodo bird. I would rather have the company still be around developing software then the alternative. Just my two cents.
    Very well said Ronald . Have a nice day !
    07-21-16 06:15 AM
  3. DenverRalphy's Avatar
    If by 'restructuring' you mean firing so many people that costs come down low enough to compensate for falling revenue LULZ
    Actually, yes. That would be a part of it. Along with realigning the focus of the company.
    07-21-16 06:46 AM
  4. thurask's Avatar
    I wouldn't care about BB at all if they stopped making devices.
    Not being cared about is certainly better than out of business...
    Dunt Dunt Dunt likes this.
    07-21-16 07:17 AM
  5. Nikola Stojic's Avatar
    Thorsten Heins would still be better CEO, hell even Steve Ballmer would be better CEO for BB now. The CEO should be there to deliver and inspire. Thorsten made some mistakes, but I don't think Chen or anyone else could handle the transition to new OS and platform any better. That's not how you build customer oriented company and earn the bucks that come with it. BB10 problem is the damn marketing, which Android is swimming in. Android is not better platform. If BB10 became successful it would eventually go open source and be similar to what is Android right now, without having to use 3GB of ram and more each year to hold the unoptimized system that is Android.
    07-21-16 07:46 AM
  6. Dunt Dunt Dunt's Avatar
    Thorsten Heins would still be better CEO, hell even Steve Ballmer would be better CEO for BB now. The CEO should be there to deliver and inspire. Thorsten made some mistakes, but I don't think Chen or anyone else could handle the transition to new OS and platform any better. That's not how you build customer oriented company and earn the bucks that come with it. BB10 problem is the damn marketing, which Android is swimming in. Android is not better platform. If BB10 became successful it would eventually go open source and be similar to what is Android right now, without having to use 3GB of ram and more each year to hold the unoptimized system that is Android.
    I bet Chen would have looked a lot harder at why the PlayBook failed, and why users that did buy it weren't happy with it. Might have lead them to Android sooner.

    Thor was not a good CEO, he was Mike and Jim's boy at BlackBerry and carried on their plans... which lost the company BILLIONS. Not really sure what happened at Powermat.... but two failed CEO positions are enough to see he needs a different line of work.

    BB10 go open source... sorry but has BBOS ever been open sourced? Google did the open sourced thing to get developers and users interested in the Platform. They knew they were late and needed something to help them build their userbase. Today Android is much less open source than it once was. But BB10, being open sourced is not something a company that is focused on security is going to do. First thing BlackBerry did with QNX is to try and shut down their open source programs....
    07-21-16 08:04 AM
  7. sorinv's Avatar
    Chen needs to spend some time in Turkey now or should have lived for a few years under Mao in his re-education camps.
    Then he would stop making ignorant statements and looking like an NSA mole trying to kill any semblance of privacy and security left for the public.
    07-21-16 09:02 AM
  8. eiruvrav's Avatar
    As a long time Blackberry user, I feel Chen is not killing Blackberry at all. That was done years ago when the founding fathers failed to see the market change and fell into complacency. Being here from the USA, I have seen the brand all but disappear from the landscape and this has nothing to do with Mr Chen.

    I personally feel if it wasn't for Mr Chen taking over and rebuilding the company, they would have went the way of the dodo bird. I would rather have the company still be around developing software then the alternative. Just my two cents.
    I couldn't agree with you more! Your two cents plus my two cents will make it four

    Posted via CB10
    bakron1 and IndianTiwari like this.
    07-21-16 09:08 AM
  9. conite's Avatar
    Chen needs to spend some time in Turkey now or should have lived for a few years under Mao in his re-education camps.
    Then he would stop making ignorant statements and looking like an NSA mole trying to kill any semblance of privacy and security left for the public.
    And if your family was killed because the authorities did not gain legal access (with a warrant) to criminal communications, would you feel the same?

    I'm not saying I have all the answers, but I know it involves some type of reasonable balance.

    I didn't have absolute privacy from authorities before the electronic age, so I wouldn't expect absolute privacy now.
    light_barer likes this.
    07-21-16 09:19 AM
  10. app_Developer's Avatar
    And if your family was killed because the authorities did not gain legal access (with a warrant) to criminal communications, would you feel the same?
    .
    Where my family is from many, many families died because the "authorities" had such access.
    07-21-16 09:22 AM
  11. conite's Avatar
    Where my family is from many, many families died because the "authorities" had such access.
    I understand that. That's why I believe a balance exists somewhere. I'm sure BlackBerry's response to a tin pot dictator would be different than to Canadian authorities with a warrant.

    Again, I come back to reasonable expectation of privacy from authorities. When I use the phone, I could be tapped. If I shift to electronic, is it reasonable that I now can communicate with complete impunity?
    Last edited by conite; 07-21-16 at 09:39 AM.
    07-21-16 09:24 AM
  12. app_Developer's Avatar
    I understand that. That's why I believe a balance exists somewhere. I'm sure BlackBerry's response to a tin pot dictator would be different than to Canadian authorities with a warrant.
    So now a private technology company is deciding which courts are legitimate and which aren't? Yuck.

    And what if BB is acquired by Oracle (just to name a random big company not in Canada)? Burn the keys?

    If my children are sending me pictures or their location, I want actual end to end semantic security, without anyone in between.

    It just seems absurd that Chen's stated definition of privacy includes a locked bootloader so I can't install CM on a Priv ever, but it doesn't include end to end encryption. That is a very warped definition of privacy, IMO.

    (ignoring BBM protected for a moment, since Chen seems to be ignoring it also when he repeats this particular sound bite)
    07-21-16 09:37 AM
  13. conite's Avatar
    So now a private technology company is deciding which courts are legitimate and which aren't? Yuck.

    And what if BB is acquired by Oracle (just to name a random big company not in Canada)? Burn the keys?

    If my children are sending me pictures or their location, I want actual end to end semantic security, without anyone in between.

    It just seems absurd that Chen's stated definition of privacy includes a locked bootloader so I can't install CM on a Priv ever, but it doesn't include end to end encryption. That is a very warped definition of privacy, IMO.

    (ignoring BBM protected for a moment, since Chen seems to be ignoring it also when he repeats this particular sound bite)
    You misunderstand me.

    I'm not advocating any particular course of action. I simply believe that the correct answer does not involve an absolute.
    07-21-16 09:42 AM
  14. conite's Avatar
    It just seems absurd that Chen's stated definition of privacy includes a locked bootloader so I can't install CM on a Priv ever, but it doesn't include end to end encryption. That is a very warped definition of privacy, IMO.
    Agreed. But his target market is BYOD and enterprise devices that work within a EMM solution. So, it's a bit of a red herring anyway.
    app_Developer likes this.
    07-21-16 09:48 AM
  15. Dunt Dunt Dunt's Avatar
    I understand that. That's why I believe a balance exists somewhere. I'm sure BlackBerry's response to a tin pot dictator would be different than to Canadian authorities with a warrant.
    It's a very slippery slope... no real right or wrong answer. Because there is no real "perfect" governmental system. Rights only get you so far in peacetime.... you have a war break out or a nuclear attack in the US take place and rounding up Japanese and putting them in internment camps for their own protection might not be a thing of the past.

    Just think Chen shouldn't jump on a soapbox and try to paint Apple as the bad guy with how they are implementing encryption. If ISIS gets themselves a BES12 Server or pays for BBM Protected... is BlackBerry somehow going to unlock encrypted messages for goverments (they say they don't have a way to do it)? Is just the fact that BlackBerry's customers have to pay more and have some technical know how give them the right for government free encrypted communication?

    Plus those that taught a BlackBerry protected them from their goverment, or even criminals.... they were a big part of BlackBerry's userbase. Thanks to Chen and BlackBerry's efforts to "help", most are now using more secure platforms.....

    Just think it's better to not say anything!
    app_Developer likes this.
    07-21-16 09:50 AM
  16. app_Developer's Avatar

    Just think it's better to not say anything!
    That's exactly what I would tell Chen. Dude, redirect that Apple talking point to /dev/null. Nothing to be gained by it, and it's just not on point right now.

    Where I work I never go on stage outside of our walls, and sometimes not even inside, without at least a quick review with comms. I don't understand how the CEO of BB doesn't do that.
    Dunt Dunt Dunt likes this.
    07-21-16 09:58 AM
  17. conite's Avatar
    That's exactly what I would tell Chen. Dude, redirect that Apple talking point to /dev/null. Nothing to be gained by it, and it's just not on point right now.
    I would agree with this.

    Chen must believe he gets points for this. I wonder what he (thinks he) knows that we don't?
    07-21-16 10:03 AM
  18. app_Developer's Avatar
    I would agree with this.

    Chen must believe he gets points for this. I wonder what he (thinks he) knows that we don't?
    I think the FBI v Apple case hit the news. Chen decided to grab the opportunity to get in the news cycle. (Right general idea, but terrible aim)

    And since then nobody apparently has told him to stop and so he just keeps repeating it.

    I've seen bosses of mine make mistakes like that. That's not a huge deal, but I've also seen the leadership team around them react, close in, stop and repair. That part seems to be missing here?
    07-21-16 10:12 AM
  19. ohaiguise's Avatar
    Not being cared about is certainly better than out of business...
    And you care why?

    Employee or shareholder?

    Am I right in thinking that BIS subscribers still give BlackBerry more than Priv users or Good users?!
    07-21-16 10:17 AM
  20. conite's Avatar
    And you care why?

    Employee or shareholder?

    Am I right in thinking that BIS subscribers still give BlackBerry more than Priv users or Good users?!
    He's talking from BlackBerry's perspective. They would rather be in business than to be not cared about.

    As to your second unrelated topic, I'm not sure we know enough granular information anymore.
    07-21-16 10:28 AM
  21. Jerry A's Avatar
    I think the FBI v Apple case hit the news. Chen decided to grab the opportunity to get in the news cycle. (Right general idea, but terrible aim)

    And since then nobody apparently has told him to stop and so he just keeps repeating it.

    I've seen bosses of mine make mistakes like that. That's not a huge deal, but I've also seen the leadership team around them react, close in, stop and repair. That part seems to be missing here?
    But is there anything to really repair. He snipes at Apple with half-truths. Which in turn gets BlackBerry press about anything other than how badly their phones are not selling.

    Technical facts are irrelevant. It's all about getting the soundbite out there.
    07-21-16 10:44 AM
  22. Dunt Dunt Dunt's Avatar
    But is there anything to really repair. He snipes at Apple with half-truths. Which in turn gets BlackBerry press about anything other than how badly their phones are not selling.

    Technical facts are irrelevant. It's all about getting the soundbite out there.
    What's the soundbite he is getting out there? That Apple is going to far with their security? Or that BlackBerry will help your goverment to hack your phone?

    I guess keeping the BlackBerry name in the conversation is a good thing, but think it waters down the idea that BlackBerry is all about security.
    MikeX74 likes this.
    07-21-16 11:03 AM
  23. Jerry A's Avatar
    What's the soundbite he is getting out there? That Apple is going to far with their security? Or that BlackBerry will help your goverment to hack your phone?

    I guess keeping the BlackBerry name in the conversation is a good thing, but think it waters down the idea that BlackBerry is all about security.
    I think he's going for the "Apple supports terrorists" take. That's why he was so eager to point out how cooperative BlackBerry is with governments.

    Of course, when you unwind the technical details we see where this falls apart.

    But that unwinding isn't going to happen as part of a quick soundbite story.
    07-21-16 11:06 AM
  24. ohaiguise's Avatar
    He's talking from BlackBerry's perspective. They would rather be in business than to be not cared about.

    As to your second unrelated topic, I'm not sure we know enough granular information anymore.

    However, I don't think BlackBerry in a position to be thinking that way yet - if they did they'd be abandoning millions of customers and probably half of their revenue.

    This man Chen talks down the devices made by his own company and prefers to discuss Apple, what is his problem?
    07-21-16 11:25 AM
  25. Dunt Dunt Dunt's Avatar
    However, I don't think BlackBerry in a position to be thinking that way yet - if they did they'd be abandoning millions of customers and probably half of their revenue.

    This man Chen talks down the devices made by his own company and prefers to discuss Apple, what is his problem?
    His problem is he accepted a job that was much more than he expected it to be.... he taught the turnaround would be over by now and that he would have gotten his bounce and would be moving on to his next success... Instead he probably see a few more years of hard work and little appreciation for what he has done.
    07-21-16 11:32 AM
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