04-28-11 03:50 PM
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  1. zorba3726's Avatar
    04-18-11 04:28 PM
  2. _StephenBB81's Avatar
    I wonder how many people would want the iPhone if they were not permitted to use Apps!

    because that is what is going to happen if they let the iPhone in.
    04-18-11 05:26 PM
  3. i7guy's Avatar
    Along with these demands, maybe the government workers should be demanding they drive Maseratis instead of the Ford Focus (or whatever they drive).

    The GAO should be looking at ROI not APPs.
    04-18-11 05:33 PM
  4. TheMarco's Avatar
    Idiots. These phones are for WORK and BB's happen to be the only secure phones for email. Incredible, this stuff. I'd like to see my employer's reaction if I start 'demanding' something. Heck, I don't even have a phone from my employer.

    Wow, just wow.
    04-18-11 05:55 PM
  5. rollingrock1988's Avatar
    If the government gives in to this, I foresee another "shellacking" for the democrats.
    04-18-11 05:56 PM
  6. _StephenBB81's Avatar
    Idiots. These phones are for WORK and BB's happen to be the only secure phones for email. Incredible, this stuff. I'd like to see my employer's reaction if I start 'demanding' something. Heck, I don't even have a phone from my employer.

    Wow, just wow.
    Ok I very much disagree that the BB is the only secure phone for email.
    ALL phones are only as secure as the Admin who is managing their email,


    BUT! I would very much like to take the most vocal people about wanting iPhones/Androids, and put them on Locked down devices like their blackberry's are, No access to Google Apps (gmail/gtalk) no access to App worlds, or itunes.


    I'm sorry but if you are limited to only email, and the productivity apps provided by your employer, why the heck would you fight for a BIG touch screen? I could maybe see fighting for a landscape slider phone for the big touch screen, or fighting for an iPad when it was the only tablet, but with the Playbook being pushed out, I expect the complaining for tablets will be reduced, and a few vocal people put on locked iPhones/Androids who have to move around a lot and are not at desks they will soon be less vocal, think how bad it would be to have to use an Android out of the box, no new apps no customizing settings? best part of Android is customizing.
    andyahs likes this.
    04-18-11 06:04 PM
  7. lnichols's Avatar
    iPhone's IPSEC client is not FIPS approved. Blackberry phones talking to BES are approved. They can wish them all they want, but in the end the phone, both hardware and software, has to meet security requirements.
    04-18-11 06:34 PM
  8. greggebhardt's Avatar
    I just love the way the government employees DEMAND something.

    I sure hope they do not give them to the DOD as iPhones are not secure!
    04-19-11 06:20 AM
  9. Stides's Avatar
    I just love the way the government employees DEMAND something.

    I sure hope they do not give them to the DOD as iPhones are not secure!
    I am not a federal employee, but I don't think they are demanding iphones and android phones. The article headline is made to grab attention. I doubt there is a coup of federal employees screaming for iphones and fart apps. It would not be a stretch to imagine they are inquiring about being able to use their own phones or get other devices. If they are forced to carry a phone (which many see as a cool thing because they get a free berry, but it is really a leash) and basically be accessible 24/7 it is only natural they they would like to have the device of their choosing from their employer or be able to use their own device so they don't have to carry two. I know several young hard working federal employees that make 50k a year, don't get overtime, and can barely pay back their student loans. I am certain some are grossly overpaid but the majority of worker bees are doing two jobs due to layoffs and haven't received a raise in 3 years.

    This is a problem RIM has to deal with as the perception of these other phones being cool and productive grabs the public mind share.
    1magine likes this.
    04-19-11 09:13 AM
  10. iN8ter's Avatar
    I wonder how many people would want the iPhone if they were not permitted to use Apps!

    because that is what is going to happen if they let the iPhone in.
    How many people will want Blackberries if they aren't permitted to use Apps?

    You really think people will prefer a Locked Down Blackberry to a Locked Down iPhone... If you do, you can't be serious...
    Last edited by N8ter; 04-19-11 at 11:20 AM.
    04-19-11 11:17 AM
  11. iN8ter's Avatar
    Ok I very much disagree that the BB is the only secure phone for email.
    ALL phones are only as secure as the Admin who is managing their email,


    BUT! I would very much like to take the most vocal people about wanting iPhones/Androids, and put them on Locked down devices like their blackberry's are, No access to Google Apps (gmail/gtalk) no access to App worlds, or itunes.


    I'm sorry but if you are limited to only email, and the productivity apps provided by your employer, why the heck would you fight for a BIG touch screen? I could maybe see fighting for a landscape slider phone for the big touch screen, or fighting for an iPad when it was the only tablet, but with the Playbook being pushed out, I expect the complaining for tablets will be reduced, and a few vocal people put on locked iPhones/Androids who have to move around a lot and are not at desks they will soon be less vocal, think how bad it would be to have to use an Android out of the box, no new apps no customizing settings? best part of Android is customizing.
    It's not just about the lock down. The phones are better. Even if you couldn't install apps on the iPhone, the browser is a ton better than the BB browser and using sites like Facebook and Twitter in Safari is almost (but not) as good as using an app in many cases.

    Plus, just because email has to be secure doesn't mean the entire device must be locked down like Queen Elizabeth's panties.
    04-19-11 11:19 AM
  12. iN8ter's Avatar
    I am not a federal employee, but I don't think they are demanding iphones and android phones. The article headline is made to grab attention. I doubt there is a coup of federal employees screaming for iphones and fart apps. It would not be a stretch to imagine they are inquiring about being able to use their own phones or get other devices. If they are forced to carry a phone (which many see as a cool thing because they get a free berry, but it is really a leash) and basically be accessible 24/7 it is only natural they they would like to have the device of their choosing from their employer or be able to use their own device so they don't have to carry two. I know several young hard working federal employees that make 50k a year, don't get overtime, and can barely pay back their student loans. I am certain some are grossly overpaid but the majority of worker bees are doing two jobs due to layoffs and haven't received a raise in 3 years.

    This is a problem RIM has to deal with as the perception of these other phones being cool and productive grabs the public mind share.
    I don't think they are demanding them. I think in most cases they already have them. They are just tired of double fisting and want to migrate over. Also, there is technology to allow secure messaging on other platforms.

    Good Technology - Pretty sure it works for Android, iPhone, and iPad... They have Good for Government
    04-19-11 11:23 AM
  13. i7guy's Avatar
    It's not just about the lock down. The phones are better. Even if you couldn't install apps on the iPhone, the browser is a ton better than the BB browser and using sites like Facebook and Twitter in Safari is almost (but not) as good as using an app in many cases.

    Plus, just because email has to be secure doesn't mean the entire device must be locked down like Queen Elizabeth's panties.
    Agreed the browser is better. But imo the iphone as a phone is not better than blackberries.

    Remember this is the government while change is inevitable it moves along glacially.

    Posted from my CrackBerry at wapforums.crackberry.com
    04-19-11 01:17 PM
  14. rollingrock1988's Avatar
    Agreed the browser is better. But imo the iphone as a phone is not better than blackberries.

    Remember this is the government while change is inevitable it moves along glacially.

    Posted from my CrackBerry at wapforums.crackberry.com
    But will the government really change. They are trying new technologies out, but when the BBs come out, isn't it safe to say that this might hinder change? (at least change to other platforms.)

    Also, with the technology that RIM is coming up with- separate contact lists (keeping business info separate and therefore secure,) wouldn't it also be safe to assume that the government might allow employees to purchase a blackberry of their choice so that they can have a personal phone that allows for up to date technology (no flames or arguments- QNX is sweet and they have nice hardware coming. leave it at that please.) and security for their work life?

    Just a thought.
    04-19-11 01:27 PM
  15. _StephenBB81's Avatar
    How many people will want Blackberries if they aren't permitted to use Apps?

    You really think people will prefer a Locked Down Blackberry to a Locked Down iPhone... If you do, you can't be serious...
    Umm my 9300 has Zero apps, and is heavily used, NO BB in our company on the BES has any apps installed, we use them heavily.

    From an email handling standpoint as a corporate user, the BB is FAR better than the iPhone, and this is Corporate talk here, not joe blow, but 5000+ device rollouts

    It's not just about the lock down. The phones are better. Even if you couldn't install apps on the iPhone, the browser is a ton better than the BB browser and using sites like Facebook and Twitter in Safari is almost (but not) as good as using an app in many cases.

    Plus, just because email has to be secure doesn't mean the entire device must be locked down like Queen Elizabeth's panties.
    Sorry but the iPhone's speaker phone isn't as good, the Battery life isn't as good, the reception isn't as good, how is it a better phone? as a business user my browser time on my mobile device is less than 2h a week during the work week, but I spend 2-3h a day talking, and 50-150 emails a day with less than 2 truncated emails a week. which makes the next argument you want to make null.
    04-19-11 01:30 PM
  16. vrs626's Avatar
    the Battery life isn't as good
    Compare a Verizon iPhone to a Verizon Bold 9650 and you'll want to change your statement.
    04-19-11 02:36 PM
  17. i7guy's Avatar
    I've got two viphones I agree the quality is not above BBs. The iphones strong point is not voice quality.

    Posted from my CrackBerry at wapforums.crackberry.com
    04-19-11 03:30 PM
  18. _StephenBB81's Avatar
    Compare a Verizon iPhone to a Verizon Bold 9650 and you'll want to change your statement.
    you can swap out your 9650 battery on a plane to continue your work day when you land.

    though it is good to know the battery life on an iphone for verizon is comparable to that of the bb, would be worth investing in an extended batter case or 2 if i was forced to take an iphone
    04-19-11 03:39 PM
  19. 1magine's Avatar
    Most gov't employees required to carry BBs are not CIA operatives. They are congressional aides, justice dept suport staff and attorneys, etc. Most are allowed apps, just like most BES allow some apps. Permissions may be locked down to some extent - IE - FB and other aps may not be allowed to access Calendar or Contacts; most apps are not allowed to have permissions set to freely access the web (ie. Endomondo must always ask for permission to upload a run).

    Most in this thread have already hit on the truth of the matter; which is for many years employees have been told they must carry a mobile device to have access to emails and documents outside of the office. Until 2-3 years ago, BB provided the only secure push e-mail. That is no longer the case. As noted in a prior post in this thread, the server, e-mail and devices are as secure as the administrator makes them. As all the large publishing houses have done, and most investment houses and law firms are now looking to do, they are considering whether other devices might meet their needs and possibly save some money. Why have your employee, (especially low level aides) who are vastly underpaid carry 2 devices everywere? If they want a DX, and they'll pay for a DX that's one less device on Congressperson's X budget (a a few tax dollars saved), and if we can move all of this office's personel to a exchange, we don't have to buy a BES license, and operate a BES server. Gee? All these dollars add up. And underpaid employees are happier. IMO it's hard to convince the new generation of IT specialists that they can not find a way to secure much more powerful devices, and its getting harder for those on the Hill to justify the expense of supporting RIM.
    04-19-11 03:44 PM
  20. 1magine's Avatar
    As such a high ranking IT admin, you are probably aware that there are plenty of controls that can be set through Exchange to lock down devices. Remote lock, remote p/w reset/ remote wipe, forced encryption (which btw makes rooting worthless on the device, as anything retrieved is encrypted and unusable)....
    04-19-11 03:59 PM
  21. avt123's Avatar
    I've got two viphones I agree the quality is not above BBs. The iphones strong point is not voice quality.

    Posted from my CrackBerry at wapforums.crackberry.com
    The VZW iPhone has better voice quality than any BB I have ever used. Same goes for my Droid X.
    04-19-11 04:13 PM
  22. 1magine's Avatar
    Wow. OK - not just about Angry Birds. Or games. And if you don't understand the need to keep employees happy -you don't understand security at all. Why take on a new system? For the same reason the gov't finally gave up the stables. Horses and carriages worked excellent and broke down far less often than them new fangled internal combustion engines (which by the way were considered very dangerous at the time). Times are changing. Many had hoped RIM would keep up. They haven't. Will gov't drop BES in any small measure? Not in this decade. Nor would I argue they should at present. And I haven't. I merely explained the thinking of many. The infrastructure is already too well built up. Like moving an air craft carrier, it will take time to make any change.

    W/r/t CIA - I'm not going to deep into this side conversation; suffice to say, those agents out in the field are not using BB's. Analysts and support staff are. And BES should not be moved out of VA. But you do understand that para-military personnel are not using any form of BB?
    04-19-11 04:20 PM
  23. 1magine's Avatar

    What I'm saying is that agencies that have a mission to protect and to maintain the integrity of infrastructure, data, and employees who are targets do not have an employee's happiness as a consideration. The mission is protecting. While it is true that disenfranchisement can lead to espionage it is illogical to endanger an entire agency to save one employee from going Hanssen.

    And there is no advantage to the government and to infrastructure to change away from BES when social and industrial espionage are rampant.
    And don't understimate the worth of a good analyst. They're worth their weight in gold.
    All of this, I could not agree with more. I was merely extrapolating the arguments made by and for low level gov't employees using their devices.

    That's not to say that we can't slim down gov't spending by begining to find solutions to allow splitting off those w/o access to sensitive information from the same systems as those with higher level clearances. I do believe its time to start unwinding some of the unnecessary infrastructure.
    04-19-11 04:39 PM
  24. scorpiodsu's Avatar
    I don't care what anyone says, if they don't think eventually some federal agencies will use other platforms then that's being a little naive. Not saying anytime soon. Not saying they should. But that doesn't mean they won't. We can argue all day about what we think is best. But that really doesn't matter. Eventually iOS and Android will penetrate federal agencies. Again, not saying it's a good idea but just because they aren't "secure" enough now doesn't mean they won't be later. Just basing what we think the future will be on the present is probably not the best thing to do because things do change.
    04-19-11 04:42 PM
  25. _StephenBB81's Avatar
    wow...that was almost as good as sex....
    Though it was good,

    clearly you've never met me to compare it to my specialty
    04-19-11 05:15 PM
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