[avt123]

You know what will be funny, hopefully...is the same peeps that started out on a Rim device and got tired of it and went to another platform all to dog BB's in general...eventually come back to say how much BB has come through, blah, blah, blah...I can see it now...I really can.

By the way, speaking of multi-tasking, my BB has "true" multi-tasking, lol!

Posted from my CrackBerry at wapforums.crackberry.com

That probably will happen. It will happen because most of the people here saying negative things about RIM aren't saying they will never buy a RIM device ever again. Most of them are saying they want to see more from RIM and a newer OS and upgraded hardware. If RIM does it they may return.

[JRZLocal]

I would like to see more from RIM on Verizon. I don't know why Att and Tmo seem to get more love from RIM maybe because Canada uses GSM who knows. I do know that if Verizon does get iphone, its doom and gloom for bb on big red. Android sales won't be affected as greatly, sure initailly ppl may flock to iphone, but its just 1 iphone vs a team of Droids.

Posted from my CrackBerry at wapforums.crackberry.com

[lssanjose]

I was asked what would make me comeback, and I answered: A device with hardware worth my while; and similar openness to Android.

[Stides]

Its sad S2 is the highest RIM offering on Verizon. My tour was a disaster, all 4 of them. But I see nowhere to go other than to wait this out.

s2 works like a charm. I would like a better browser but the current version works okay. With android and iphone the grass is greener, imo.

So what to do. What I really want is a trackpad on the device.

I have until April 2011 to see what I want to do.

Posted from my CrackBerry at wapforums.crackberry.com

I would say the Bold 9650 is RIM's flagship on VZW. It's newer, has more app memory and is getting os 6 unlike the S2. However, no doubt the lack of a new touch screen blackberry for VZW is hurting RIM's sales on that carrier.

[dutchtender]

I find it interesting that you worded that like you did. Just in the latest PB video with Mike, he's actually indicated that the PB's principal idea is to "bring the web to the people" and that they're wanting to embrace the web and all that is has to offer... which is his reason for why RIM is embracing Flash, Air, etc. and Apple is not.

in Mike's "world" the "people" who have bought iphone and android have not had "the web" "brought" to them yet.

[JRSCCivic98]

in Mike's "world" the "people" who have bought iphone and android have not had "the web" "brought" to them yet.

Technically speaking neither have people who've bought a BB because RIM's ain't brought isht to market that can do proper web rendering.

[EnergyPlus]

I've long said that "I don't care" about Android this and iPhone that, all I cared about was what MY phone could do for ME. That being said, it's baffling how RIM could allow such a lead to simply VAPORIZE like it has. I wonder when Mike L is going to vaporize?

[i7guy]

I've long said that "I don't care" about Android this and iPhone that, all I cared about was what MY phone could do for ME. That being said, it's baffling how RIM could allow such a lead to simply VAPORIZE like it has. I wonder when Mike L is going to vaporize?

I agree. There will come a point though when I may want my phone to do more.

RIM isn't quite vaporizing. Stock is going up and it has had a good quarter. The financial report is being release on Dec 16, so we'll here how the quarter is.

[JRSCCivic98]

I think it's pretty much a given that RIM has become the water vendor of the mobile industry. The recipe doesn't change, just the packaging and the sales pitch. Lol

They'll continue to sell no matter what because people seem to buy it for no good reason.

Posted from my CrackBerry at wapforums.crackberry.com

[i7guy]

BES is dang good reason.

Posted from my CrackBerry at wapforums.crackberry.com

[the_sandman_454]

BES is dang good reason.

Posted from my CrackBerry at wapforums.crackberry.com

But I suspect the enterprise market is not only not nearly as big as the consumer market, but additionally, is a fairly established/stable market unlike the rapidly expanding consumer market. Other platforms want to take a serious bite out of that market for themselves. RIM can't afford to let the others do that, since this market is their apparent focus.

Folks here can say what they want about the suitability of devices other than BB for the enterprise role, but Apple and the Android device makers definitely want it and they're already making strides toward positioning themselves to grab a chunk out of RIM's marketshare there too.

I would suspect that most of the sales we're discussing that RIM lost were probably lost in the consumer market, making BES relatively irrelevant for the purposes of the discussion...

[i7guy]

Of course apple and google want a piece of the enterprise market. Andriod is to new and to unproven and can't be locked down as far as I know, to an extent a CTO could actually get a nights' sleep. iphone is kinda the same way.

I can see why people might want a droid or even an iphone over an s2. (not me, I have few real wants with a smartphone. I'm an email and tether hound and the s2 is perfect). RIM does need to give their next generation phones some pizzaz.

[i7guy]

I think it's pretty much a given that RIM has become the water vendor of the mobile industry. The recipe doesn't change, just the packaging and the sales pitch. Lol

They'll continue to sell no matter what because people seem to buy it for no good reason.

Posted from my CrackBerry at wapforums.crackberry.com

Actually people buy RIM products for their own reasons, of which, you no nothing about.

[the_sandman_454]

Actually people buy RIM products for their own reasons, of which, you no nothing about.

. And there are relatively less people buying RIM for any reason per the data provided.

This tells us that RIM is not meeting the needs of the average consumer, or else the sales of RIM devices wouldn't have dropped. That's how the free market works, people vote with their wallets, and in order to stay viable in the long run, a company needs to produce devices consumers want, not what the company wants or thinks is "good enough".

[the_sandman_454]

Of course apple and google want a piece of the enterprise market. Andriod is to new and to unproven and can't be locked down as far as I know, to an extent a CTO could actually get a nights' sleep. iphone is kinda the same way.

I can see why people might want a droid or even an iphone over an s2. (not me, I have few real wants with a smartphone. I'm an email and tether hound and the s2 is perfect). RIM does need to give their next generation phones some pizzaz.

Well my understanding is that Android can now be remotely administered including wipe via the cloud without the need for something like BES. Even assuming the Androids and Apples aren't ready for prime time in the enterprise market yet, they're gunning for RIM hard. It is foolish to think these companies aren't working on determining and implementing features they need to get the business world to rely on them.


Wifi hotspot sure is convenient for tethering, and available on stock Androids, and jailbroken iOS devices. That's another feature RIM should add some day.

Besides, the average BB user here is a rare creature indeed. The hardcore fan base that won't leave no matter what. This is a small segment of the consumer market. BB can continue to cling to this segment by doing the same old thing they've done the last 3-4 years, and maybe even continue to watch it hemmorhage some more as more hardcore folks get sick of hardware that can't keep up, a less than exciting web interface, and other limitations of the device software and BIS itself.

Or, they can actively compete with the other devices and probably win back a lot of former users.

[r.santa1]

I have had better data and hardly a dropped call w my 9700 on att...the iphone4 i have had for a few months has dropped a ton of calls..maybe it is the iphone and not att???
Verizon (ihave 4 lines with them also) is not that much btter people...

[the_sandman_454]

I have had better data and hardly a dropped call w my 9700 on att...the iphone4 i have had for a few months has dropped a ton of calls..maybe it is the iphone and not att???
Verizon (ihave 4 lines with them also) is not that much btter people...

I'll see that, and raise you the fact that my Tour dropped more calls in a month than my D2 has since I got it in September, and I have been making a lot more calls these past few months.

[i7guy]

I'll see that, and raise you the fact that my Tour dropped more calls in a month than my D2 has since I got it in September, and I have been making a lot more calls these past few months.

Not buying BB drops calls. I has a bunch of issues with my tour dropped calls wasn't one of them.

Posted from my CrackBerry at wapforums.crackberry.com

[i7guy]

Well my understanding is that Android can now be remotely administered including wipe via the cloud without the need for something like BES. Even assuming the Androids and Apples aren't ready for prime time in the enterprise market yet, they're gunning for RIM hard. It is foolish to think these companies aren't working on determining and implementing features they need to get the business world to rely on them.


Wifi hotspot sure is convenient for tethering, and available on stock Androids, and jailbroken iOS devices. That's another feature RIM should add some day.

Besides, the average BB user here is a rare creature indeed. The hardcore fan base that won't leave no matter what. This is a small segment of the consumer market. BB can continue to cling to this segment by doing the same old thing they've done the last 3-4 years, and maybe even continue to watch it hemmorhage some more as more hardcore folks get sick of hardware that can't keep up, a less than exciting web interface, and other limitations of the device software and BIS itself.

Or, they can actively compete with the other devices and probably win back a lot of former users.

Android may be remotely administered but it is critical vulnerabilities that have to be resolved. Bes though is much more than that.

I don't really care about the hotspot feature I can use my laptop for that. One still has to pay for the tether plan.

I'm not a hardcore user I just don't see anything better for my purposes. That's a big distinction.

Posted from my CrackBerry at wapforums.crackberry.com

[avt123]

Not buying BB drops calls. I has a bunch of issues with my tour dropped calls wasn't one of them.

Posted from my CrackBerry at wapforums.crackberry.com

You are saying BBs don't drop calls? My 8330 always dropped calls on Sprint..like at least 10 a day (that's why they waived my ETF). My Bold 9000 use to drop calls as well, a few a week. Same with all 5 9700s I went through in a few weeks. I have dropped calls. AT&T has great coverage in my area. I dropped more calls with my iPhone 3G and 3GS though. I dropped one or two calls with my Droid and have not dropped ANY calls with my Droid X since I got it on release day.

BBs drop calls. I don't understand what's so hard to believe. Every device can drop calls. I am enjoying the dual antenna design in my DX though. Highest call quality and signal strength out of any device I have ever used. including all the new BBs. Are you going to say no one beats BB in call quality and signal strength as well?

[lssanjose]

Dropped calls occurred for almost every phone I had. Even my storm 2 dropped calls. Then again, some of you may accuse me of lying because we're going anecdotal here.

[doubledecker]

wow lets all spam his post. How are they doin on AT&T?

[JRSCCivic98]

Well my understanding is that Android can now be remotely administered including wipe via the cloud without the need for something like BES. Even assuming the Androids and Apples aren't ready for prime time in the enterprise market yet, they're gunning for RIM hard. It is foolish to think these companies aren't working on determining and implementing features they need to get the business world to rely on them.


Wifi hotspot sure is convenient for tethering, and available on stock Androids, and jailbroken iOS devices. That's another feature RIM should add some day.

Besides, the average BB user here is a rare creature indeed. The hardcore fan base that won't leave no matter what. This is a small segment of the consumer market. BB can continue to cling to this segment by doing the same old thing they've done the last 3-4 years, and maybe even continue to watch it hemmorhage some more as more hardcore folks get sick of hardware that can't keep up, a less than exciting web interface, and other limitations of the device software and BIS itself.

Or, they can actively compete with the other devices and probably win back a lot of former users.

They're not. If Android cannot be wiped with the AS policy enforcement and at least a password set on it via the same fassion, they won't be let into the enterprise. Some Android handsets can have 3rd party apps loaded on them to facilitate this, but native ActiveSync capabilities aren't implemented across the board yet and that's the big problem with them.

[K Bear]

You know what will be funny, hopefully...is the same peeps that started out on a Rim device and got tired of it and went to another platform all to dog BB's in general...eventually come back to say how much BB has come through, blah, blah, blah...I can see it now...I really can.

By the way, speaking of multi-tasking, my BB has "true" multi-tasking, lol!

Posted from my CrackBerry at wapforums.crackberry.com

I think there are enough people, like myself, who wouldn't go back to Blackberry if they were paid to use the device for personal use.

[dutchtender]

I agree. There will come a point though when I may want my phone to do more.

RIM isn't quite vaporizing. Stock is going up and it has had a good quarter. The financial report is being release on Dec 16, so we'll here how the quarter is.

but those calls reflect on what happened not what is going to happen. they are backwards looking. that's why you can't just look at financial statements to pick out good investments. investing is really about figuring out what will happen next. you can't lose most of your business at the largest carrier in the US and just pretend it's not a big deal by saying look how well we are doing in JAVA Indonesia...Rim has stopped reporting key metrics that are starting to reflect badly on the company. that's a sign of a company back on it's heels.