[JeepBB]

But at least they kept the same UI for a unified experience.

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Yes, and I reckon that might have helped sales. WP8 is undoubtedly better than WP7, but the familiar UI helps to soften the new OS blow.

A trick unavailable to BB unfortunately.

I have to agree with cgk, bbos ain't the future, but then neither is bb10.

Once Jakarta's story is told, and I expect it to fail - Too expensive, no ecosystem - then I reckon BB will give the HW business to foxconn and focus on software and enterprise.

We'll see in a few months I guess.

JBB

[kbz1960]

Are you having a laugh? Did you read the Original Post and click on the Links?


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You mean this one?

UK smartphone ownership sees Android and iPhone on par | T3

Where it says "Meanwhile BlackBerry figures have decreased to just 7 per cent, although BlackBerry has continued to report serious losses, so it comes as no big surprise."

[belfastdispatcher]

Yes, and I reckon that might have helped sales. WP8 is undoubtedly better than WP7, but the familiar UI helps to soften the new OS blow.

A trick unavailable to BB unfortunately.

I have to agree with cgk, bbos ain't the future, but then neither is bb10.

Once Jakarta's story is told, and I expect it to fail ... Too expensive, no ecosystem ... Then I reckon bb will give the HW business to foxconn and focus on software and enterprise.


We'll see in a few months I guess.



JBB

In my opinion BB could maintain a relatively small but sustainable BBOS user base that would at least prop up their revenues, but not without some new BBOS devices.


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[belfastdispatcher]

You mean this one?

UK smartphone ownership sees Android and iPhone on par | T3

Where it says "Meanwhile BlackBerry figures have decreased to just 7 per cent, although BlackBerry has continued to report serious losses, so it comes as no big surprise."

Yes, that's what this thread is about. More info in the second link if you download the PDF.

Come in man, do I have to do everything for you?

FYI, I did not start this thread.


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[MarsupilamiX]

Are you having a laugh? Did you read the Original Post and click on the Links?


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I don't see numbers, specifically talking about BBOS ownership, worldwide, and the years of 2006-2014.

Do you?

Yes, and I reckon that might have helped sales. WP8 is undoubtedly better than WP7, but the familiar UI helps to soften the new OS blow.

A trick unavailable to BB unfortunately.

I have to agree with cgk, bbos ain't the future, but then neither is bb10.

Once Jakarta's story is told, and I expect it to fail ... Too expensive, no ecosystem ... Then I reckon bb will give the HW business to foxconn and focus on software and enterprise.

We'll see in a few months I guess.

JBB

WP7 sales were pretty much non existant, back then.
I really doubt that keeping the same UI really helped them, since their installed WP7 userbase was so incredibly small.

A unified look between the UI of MS' phones, desktops, tablets, notebooks and consoles, is something I would much rather associate as a reason for better WP8 sales (well and their price obviously) as to have the same look as WP7.
Not to forget that WP7 devices weren't able to upgrade to WP8, which screwed a lot of early adopters.

In my opinion BB could maintain a relatively small but sustainable BBOS user base that would at least prop up their revenues, but not without some new BBOS devices.


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And then you woke up, and understood that we are already in 2014...
Obviously BlackBerry would need to downsize even more and they would have less than 1% marketshare then.

Which leaves us with the option I already gave you last year.
BBOS devices for something around 1.5 to 2 thousands dollar a piece.

If BlackBerry is able, to reliably sell 15-20 million devices a year, for 1500$ each, I would agree with you.

Yes, that's what this thread is about. More info in the second link if you download the PDF.

Come in man, do I have to do everything for you?

FYI, I did not start this thread.

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No, you just said that the userbase hasn't declined, until BB10 hit the shelves.
Can you prove that?

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[belfastdispatcher]

RIM Q4 2012:

http://www.engadget.com/2012/03/29/r...ns-from-compa/

"Large and growing base of more then 77 million subscribers"

Happy now?


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[kbz1960]

RIM Q4 2012:

RIM announces Q4 2012 earnings, Jim Balsillie resigns from board, company plans to refocus on enterprise

"Large and growing base of more then 77 million subscribers"

Happy now?


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And this is on topic about the UK how?

[MarsupilamiX]

RIM Q4 2012:

http://www.engadget.com/2012/03/29/r...ns-from-compa/

"Large and growing base of more then 77 million subscribers"

Happy now?


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That's from March 2012, not 2013.
And you never wondered why Balsillie left the company, even though BBOS did so well?

Or why they had about 150 million losses that quarter, even though they "have a record high" userbase?

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[belfastdispatcher]

RIM Q1 2013: 78 million and growing.


http://www.marketwired.com/press-rel...mm-1675174.htm


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[belfastdispatcher]

And this is on topic about the UK how?

The only person who's talking specific BBOS user base numbers for UK is you.

I'm still not sure why or who with you're arguing.

The fact is, up to the end of 2012 the user base was still growing. When BB10 got released it dropped like a brick.




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[MarsupilamiX]

RIM Q1 2013: 78 million and growing.


http://www.marketwired.com/press-rel...mm-1675174.htm


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That's june 2012.
Still. An adjusted loss of 200 million.
No BB10 in sight and only 1 million added in one quarter.

Compared to the rest of the market, this is much rather poof for them doing bad, than good....

You really don't see that?
Compare the quarterly reports from Samsung and Apple, in the same period.

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[belfastdispatcher]

RIM Q3 2013: 80 million subscribers.


http://bgr.com/2012/09/27/rim-q2-201...report-163097/


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[belfastdispatcher]

September 2012:

"RIM refutes reports of subscriber losses, says people are still buying BlackBerry phones"

http://news.yahoo.com/rim-refutes-re...190543411.html


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[kbz1960]

RIM Q1 2013: 78 million and growing.


Research In Motion Reports First Quarter Fiscal 2013 Results


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Since you are the one that brought it up......... what does this have to do with the UK?

[cgk]

Once Jakarta's story is told, and I expect it to fail ... Too expensive, no ecosystem ... Then I reckon bb will give the HW business to foxconn and focus on software and enterprise.


We'll see in a few months I guess.



JBB

I would think it is a 'try before you buy' deal - if Foxconn make good progress, they buy, if they don't, they say "thanks but no thanks".

[belfastdispatcher]

So can we agree that up to the end of 2012 the BBOS user base was still growing? Not by much but certainly wasn't dropping.

Can we agree and move on?

Thank you.


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[Superfly_FR]

I strongly suggest anyone interseted abour market share V.S installed base to read this. I've just done it, should avoid me some basic mistakes or confusions I made earlier. Take a cup of coffee, it's a long read but filled with example even a foreigner can understand (funny enough you'll find many classic sentences we read litterally here).
Why an 80% market share might only represent half of smartphone users | Technology | theguardian.com

P.S: the brand quoted in the title are not the subject, just illustrations, it's not a pro/con paper.

[MarsupilamiX]

So can we agree that up to the end of 2012 the BBOS user base was still growing? Not by much but certainly wasn't dropping.

Can we agree and move on?

Thank you.


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You said that it declined after BB10 was available.
And this isn't correct. Between the 3rd and 4th quarter of 2012, the loss begun.

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[Dunt Dunt Dunt]

Not sure why this is being argued so hotly. A poll that consisted of 450 Smartphone users I think we all can agree is not a "real" indicator of where the user base or market share is. I'd put more faith in statcounter.....

We all know that YES the UK market is still one of BlackBerry's strongest. And YES we all know that even there BlackBerry is quickly becoming a percentage that is irrelevant either way you want to count them. But hey that are number #3 so Hip Hip Hurry!

[belfastdispatcher]

March 2013 user base: 76 million, two months after BB10 launch.

Can we agree now?

http://press.blackberry.com/content/...ss_Release.pdf


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[MarsupilamiX]

March 2013 user base: 76 million, two months after BB10 launch.

Can we agree now?

http://press.blackberry.com/content/...ss_Release.pdf

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Again, the first decline considering the userbase, was in the last quarter of 2012, before BB10 was available.
What's not to understand there?

And again, the loss after BB10 was introduced, has far less to do with BB10 not being like BBOS than with Android and iOS being better for most people, than BB10 and BBOS.

Compared to the competition, BBOS is an anachronism, and no number after the OS (be it 7, 8 or 9), would have changed that.
The losses in terms of userbase, happened because BB10 wasn't a suitable alternative to iOS and Android.
It has nothing to do with BBOS being so awesome as marketshare and financial losses prove, through the entirety of 2012.

Posted via CB10

[ray689]

you are not mention anything before about built it from the ground up

but who cares it being build from the ground....BB engineers sure make a fantastic job make a great OS from the ground, maybe if it is only OS vs OS , BB10 will come on top against other competitors..but in the end people want ecosystem and apps, brand recognition, after sales services, hardware specs etc.

I did make that exact statement as to why BBOS user base is higher and why it was selling what it was when there wasn't competitors to it like there is today.
And I thanked your post by accident.

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[belfastdispatcher]

The question remains, what will Blackberry do about the user base made up of almost entirely of BBOS devices?

Can they maintain it without new BB7 devices?


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[belfastdispatcher]

So BD...if BlackBerry abandons BB10 all together and just goes back to BBOS, you feel that they will be okay and make a comeback in the market? Do you really honestly believe that? If you actually do then you are likely the most delusional person on the forum.
Keep in mind that how BB10 has done so far has no bearing on how hated by the vast majority of the market BBOS is.

Posted via CB10

I don't believe that, I never said I do. But abandoning BB10, for consumers at least, and maintaining their BBOS users base that appears to be sustainable will buy them some time to figure out a better product.

At the end of the day BB10 is not selling, BBOS is not the problem here, BB10 is.

The only think propping them up now IS BBOS


In the first quarter of BB10 sales were 1 million

Third quarter 1.6 million

I mean what more proof do you want?

I see more BBOS devices as a short term solution or a parallel solution.


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[belfastdispatcher]

Thank you. Common sense just isn't that's common as they say.

Posted via CB10

And throwing billions at a product that sales in less then 2 millions in 3 months is common sense to you?

Nobody would argue if BB10 was a success, but it's a failure.




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