[trsbbs]

Discussing with a few of our sources regarding PlayBook OS 2.0, QNX, BES, and BIS we�ve learned quite a bit. The BES we�ve come to know with BlackBerry OS is essentially dead. RIM has had to completely re-do everything in order to support QNX. With that said, BES will no longer be integrated in the way it was before. There will be separate software for BES support and it will be coupled with Brezel (ubitexx) to allow for ActiveSync.

The use of this software opens up the ability for RIM to additionally manage iOS and Android devices (smart move?). Although this seems like a fair solution for BES, we�ve heard RIM has yet to come up with one for BIS. Until RIM can get BIS ready for QNX, we�re told the BlackBerry native e-mail will be more like that which is found on an Android or iOS device (Pop3, IMap, EAS integration). This means that the BlackBerry e-mail on QNX will no longer be the true push e-mail that has made RIM�s BlackBerry what it is today. There will no longer be data centers to poll the mail boxes and see if there are new messages.

We aren�t certain if this will stay as the permanent solution to native e-mail. We�re hopeful RIM will create a solution for allowing true push e-mail on QNX devices, but the technology to integrate it doesn�t appear to be available on the QNX platform. Assuming the information we�ve been given is accurate, RIM cannot stand to lose one of the last few features that separates a BlackBerry from the rest of the pack. How do you think this will impact RIM and the future of BlackBerry?

Exclusive: BlackBerry Email on QNX Might Not be Push | N4BB - News for BlackBerry - leaks, rumors, videos, faqs, reviews

[trsbbs]

Speculation at best, but interesting. If it is true it would affect the whole realm of QNX powered phones and tablets.

Hope there is a will and a way to work around this.

BB wouldn't be BB without it.

Tim

[papped]

Nm, reread it...

This seems like an issue for BES users considering normally they want to admin the entire device, which would not longer work... So I kinda doubt this.

[ADGrant]

EAS is push email and it can sync calendars and address books. Much better than BIS IMHO. However, no BIS may mean no BBM which could be another shot in the foot for RIM.

[katiepea]

the fact that they want to use active sync really makes me think they're going to open up services such as BBM to other platforms, which i believe would be greatly beneficial to RIM

[tumer]

Cx has already stated that no bbm rumors are BS!!!!!!

[trsbbs]

Cx has already stated that no bbm rumors are BS!!!!!!

Who is Cx?

Tim

[Jake Storm]

Who is Cx?

Tim

Crucial Extreme, one of our beloved mods.

[southlander]

If RIM could have a QNX phone out in the very short term without BIS push email but supporting EAS and IMAP, I think as a consumer sell -- that's a plus. The key being *soon*. Time matters and 80 percent or more of consumers are not going to care about "true" push vs other email methods. If they did RIM would be doing better.

Corporate users are all together different.

I'd say if RIM got the QNX phones out without BIS and pushes them to consumers in the near term while selling the OS7 devices to companies that really need BIS/BES for now, that would be smarter than delaying QNX to make it match the old OS exactly.

No BBM.. Not an option to sell globally. Maybe in North America. And even then.. I'd say BBM is a must due to the apps integration that's coming.

Sent from my BlackBerry 9930 using Tapatalk

[CrackedBarry]

Some analysts have been advocating for awhile that RIM get out of the handset business, and either concentrate on the Enterprise or become a software and solutions company.

It actually makes sense, and could save RIM as an independent company.

Look at it this way: RIM has basically already lost the battle for the handset market. The Enterprise market is vanishing and their marketshare is already in the single digits. Though there's a small chance that they could survive as a niche manufacturer with a market share of 5-10% how long would it be, before their market completely collapsed, or they got bought out?

The Playbook was a last ditch effort to turn BB into a consumer platform and turn RIM into somethingvresembling Apple, but let's be honest. It failed. All that's left is the firesale later this year, before RIM quietly either drops the Playbook, or tries to merge it with their QNX phone.

So right now, RIMs handset business is basically a weight around their neck, that prevents them from doing what could be their only future: Turn BBM into a crossplatform solution supporting
iPhones, Android and WP7 as well as develop BES into a crossplatform product for the Enterprise.

Combine those too with consulting and concentrate on enterprise solutions, and RIM could have a winner.

And it doesn't mean the complete end of RIM handsets, they could take out an Android or WP7 license and concentrate on a couple of high-margin keyboard handsets aimed at the business world and typing traditionalists.

Killing off their own OS is a necessity, but it could secure a future for them.

[CrackedBarry]

I'd say if RIM got the QNX phones out without BIS and pushes them to consumers in the near term while selling the OS7 devices to companies that really need BIS/BES for now, that would be smarter than delaying QNX to make it match the old OS exactly.

Two problems with that scenario:

One: Consumers have little interest in an app-free medialess device. We saw that with the Playbook fiasco.

Two: The corporate world don't mind paying a premium, but they expect the solution to last a good while. At least three years. There aren't many CIOs who'd drop a pretty penny at a platform that'll be obsolete next year when QNX is introduced.

[ADGrant]

OS7 won't be obsolete if QNX does not support BES and the only CIOs buying BBs are ones who already have BES or plan to buy int.

[southlander]

Two problems with that scenario:

One: Consumers have little interest in an app-free medialess device. We saw that with the Playbook fiasco.

Two: The corporate world don't mind paying a premium, but they expect the solution to last a good while. At least three years. There aren't many CIOs who'd drop a pretty penny at a platform that'll be obsolete next year when QNX is introduced.

Yes. I am assuming RIM will improve the apps situation. Maybe with Android apps player. But the player has to be seamless and fast. Which I am doubting based on some quotes from RIM lately. The apps player would have to be perfect. And all the popular apps would need to be in App World. Sounding like an impossible scenario more and more.

[katiepea]

it's not written in stone that qnx handsets will fail, though it seems more likely that they would instead of the opposite. that said, if they just opened up bbm to multiple platforms NOW they could generate a TON of revenue, people would pay for bbm, i would, and i'm currently on android. if you ask every single person what they miss about blackberry after having switched, they'll tell you BBM, keyboard sure, but BBM first. get everyone using bbm, take out all other other wannabe's and you'll be generating a LOT of buzz. everyone will remember why they loved RIM, and you'll have hype for qnx, i can't think of a better maneuver to get people excited about qnx and RIM's future. and in the process you'll be making google and apple look behind the times, neither of those platforms have anything remotely comparable to BBM, iMessage doesn't cut it.

[southlander]

it's not written in stone that qnx handsets will fail, though it seems more likely that they would instead of the opposite. that said, if they just opened up bbm to multiple platforms NOW they could generate a TON of revenue, people would pay for bbm, i would, and i'm currently on android. if you ask every single person what they miss about blackberry after having switched, they'll tell you BBM, keyboard sure, but BBM first. get everyone using bbm, take out all other other wannabe's and you'll be generating a LOT of buzz. everyone will remember why they loved RIM, and you'll have hype for qnx, i can't think of a better maneuver to get people excited about qnx and RIM's future. and in the process you'll be making google and apple look behind the times, neither of those platforms have anything remotely comparable to BBM, iMessage doesn't cut it.

Well the interesting thing is -- it is the integration of BIS/BES services like BBM that seems to be a holdup for RIM moving to QNX. I wonder how hard it would be technically to make iOS and Android (and WP) handle BBM? RIM's not exactly explaining what it is that is so hard about it that I know of. PlayBook's been out since April and it still has nothing that talks to BIS or BES. Right?

[CrackedBarry]

^^^ Quite right...

Heck, even with a seamless app player with perfect multitasking, neither games nor tablet apps will be available. Only Android phone apps, and probably in limited numbers.

As for phone apps running on tablets, I've seen it done in two ways. On the HP Touchpad you have the app running in a little window in the middle of the screen, which frankly looks awful. In Android 3.2 the app runs full screen, and somehow they've blown it up, while still making it look really good in most apps.

The only thing that could make a difference on the app front now is a massive investment from RIM directed at software houses and developers. Tens of millions of dollars, and even that should have been initiated a year ago when the PB was still in development.

Even the Touchpad had a better app catalogue which really says something.

[katiepea]

Well the interesting thing is -- it is the integration of BIS/BES services like BBM that seems to be a headache for RIM moving to QNX. I wonder how hard it would be technically to make iOS and Android (and WP) handle BBM? RIM's not exactly explaining what it is that is so hard about it that I know of.

i dunno, but if they're switching from BIS/BES to active sync on qnx, i see absolutely no reason why they couldn't multiplatform it, in fact i'd be willing to bet that's exactly what they're planning on doing.

[ssbtech]

I would hate to see RIM get out of the handset business. The rest are junk, IMO. Big, bulky, and very few have decent keyboards. Show me something comprable to the Torch from another manufacturer.

No BIS/BES on QNX seems crazy to me. I'm sure they'll figure it out, if not, that's another shot in the foot.

[Economist101]

I would hate to see RIM get out of the handset business. The rest are junk, IMO. Big, bulky, and very few have decent keyboards. Show me something comprable to the Torch from another manufacturer.

OEMs don't feel like they need to compete with every RIM device, just those that are most successful. Examples are the Curve and Bold.

[ssbtech]

I'm amazed the Torch isn't quickly becoming one of the better selling phones.

Who wants to be confined to such a small screen with a Curve/Bold?

[Economist101]

Who wants to be confined to such a small screen with a Curve/Bold?

The people that buy them. The same question comes up about physical keyboards. Who wants to be "confined" to them? All the folks that buy them. It's a lot easier to change your product than it is to change customer tastes. It's why we have all-touch BlackBerry devices now that weren't there in 2007 or prior.

[ssbtech]

The people that buy them. The same question comes up about physical keyboards. Who wants to be "confined" to them? All the folks that buy them. It's a lot easier to change your product than it is to change customer tastes. It's why we have all-touch BlackBerry devices now that weren't there in 2007 or prior.

That's what people bought because that's all RIM had available. Well, I suppose there was the Storm but that surepress thing was silly.

I suppose it is good to have choice - personally I won't buy another phone without a physical keyboard, but even with one I'm not confined to it. I have a choice between an on-screen keyboard or a physical one.

[Rootbrian]

I don't think the article has much solidness in it. The only way I will believe or accept it as truth/fact is if I see it for myself or see others show it in videos/screenshots of the device and e-mail in action. I highly doubt data centers will be abandoned. BIS/BES just needs to be rewritten for QNX/Linux and things will be rolling again.
Hey, if they get a Linux client of BES, we won't need windows anymore.

Posted from my CrackBerry at wapforums.crackberry.com

[inicophone]

I find it very hard to believe that the QNX BlackBerry won't support push email. It will. It's like saying it won't have BBM. It will.

BIS/BES are here to stay.

[katiepea]

I don't think lack of bes/bis means lack of the functions it provides, I could see rim moving onto something else that allows them more flexibility in other markets

Posted from my CrackBerry at wapforums.crackberry.com