12-07-13 04:09 AM
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  1. crucial bbq's Avatar
    BB10 vs. Android: The Facts.

    Hmmmm....the facts:

    1. Fact: some people like BB10.
    2. Fact: some people like Android.
    3. Fact: more people use Android.
    4. Fact: the best OS is the OS that does what the end-user needs/wants it to do in the best manner that is needed/wanted. It is totally subjective. BB10 is not better than Android. Android is not better than BB10. BB10 is better than Android for some people. Android is better than BB10 for some people. Outside of that, it is all personal opinion. I don't like Android. I do not think it sucks as I can understand why it is popular; it's just not for me.

    Too many confuse opinion with fact. It would be nice if others shared my perspective.
    12-01-13 11:48 PM
  2. NursingNinja's Avatar
    Good points, but are you saying that BB integrates with Microsoft Outlook better than any other os including Microsoft Windows Phone 8? lol
    Can't say I have ever used one. Are these used in the workplace? Never seen that done, but I've worked at the same place for the past six years so this might be my problem.

    Posted via CB10
    12-01-13 11:52 PM
  3. Saiga's Avatar
    <p>
    Yeah. I'll let the debate move on. Just remember, one of the big issues has always been for many(not all of you) the need for more apps while some(not all of us) were making a villain out of a company that capitalized on that need and created a ish load of apps for BB. So, here we are with Android apps on our BlackBerries. Those of us that already have Androids, cool. What I find amusing are those that swore to hate Android until the end of time........but, you're utilizing the apps. Go figure. Just an observation.</p>
    It falls back to the first rule of CrackBerry - "If BlackBerry ain't got it, we don't need it!"

    The moment BlackBerry gets it - "this is the greatest thing evar!", "better Android than Android", "look at the launcher I'm running, isn't it cool?"

    The same people who made the above comments used to say they didn't need apps. Lol
    12-01-13 11:56 PM
  4. ToddJack's Avatar
    And rooting and sideloading are quite different, BTW. The one is more about adding on; the other is taking full control.

    You can't really compare the two. Rooting encompasses sideloading, abs then some.
    Correct, That was the key feature for me. My S3 is stock from Samsung, but I wanted to have total control over my Tab 2 to do as I wished. I sideloaded for my Blackberry & Playbooks because I had no chose if I wanted worthwhile apps at the time, not to totally control my phone or tablet. and yes most users do not attempt to root their phones or tablets.
    12-01-13 11:56 PM
  5. Tre Lawrence's Avatar
    That's exactly what I hate. The whole argument that "if only people knew about BlackBerry 10, they'd love it!".

    Dave can clam that he converted people to BlackBerry 10 all he wants, but I tried it every since if still looked like the PlayBook, and only saw a platform that simply didn't meet my needs. BlackBerry OS7, a OS Dave has never even owned according to his own statements, met my needs better than BB10 does. How many other people have tried BB10 and simply didnt like it? We can't say for sure, but I bet it was quite a few. The notion that people will fall in love with BB10 if they try it is just silly. The Hub (aka the same thing I had on my 7250) and gestures simply aren't enough to sway people to a whole new platform. The abysmal sales of BlackBerry 10 devices pretty much prove that.
    This is harsh, but I agree. I've said it a few times, especially in the threads calling for the CMO's head: it isn't that people don't know about BB10; for the techies I know (admittedly, a small number), BB10 was exceptionally intriguing, but most felt it wasn't enough of a workhorse to be a daily driver.

    Think about this: BBRY hasn't been able to convert most legacy BBOS users to BB10. That pretty much tells the story.

    I'm not saying that BB10 is not a good option for a good amount of people, but it's hard work pulling in mostly satisfied customers from competing platforms. The hub would probably not outshine, say, Google Now in the minds of a power user.
    Saiga likes this.
    12-01-13 11:58 PM
  6. Tre Lawrence's Avatar
    BB10 vs. Android: The Facts.

    Hmmmm....the facts:

    1. Fact: some people like BB10.
    2. Fact: some people like Android.
    3. Fact: more people use Android.
    4. Fact: the best OS is the OS that does what the end-user needs/wants it to do in the best manner that is needed/wanted. It is totally subjective. BB10 is not better than Android. Android is not better than BB10. BB10 is better than Android for some people. Android is better than BB10 for some people. Outside of that, it is all personal opinion. I don't like Android. I do not think it sucks as I can understand why it is popular; it's just not for me.

    Too many confuse opinion with fact. It would be nice if others shared my perspective.
    Well said. Makes sense.
    12-01-13 11:59 PM
  7. NursingNinja's Avatar
    BB10 vs. Android: The Facts.

    Hmmmm....the facts:

    1. Fact: some people like BB10.
    2. Fact: some people like Android.
    3. Fact: more people use Android.
    4. Fact: the best OS is the OS that does what the end-user needs/wants it to do in the best manner that is needed/wanted. It is totally subjective. BB10 is not better than Android. Android is not better than BB10. BB10 is better than Android for some people. Android is better than BB10 for some people. Outside of that, it is all personal opinion. I don't like Android. I do not think it sucks as I can understand why it is popular; it's just not for me.

    Too many confuse opinion with fact. It would be nice if others shared my perspective.
    Your conclusion assumes all things are equal. It is entirely possible and even likely that people will often like or prefer things that are inferior in nature or even detrimental to their health.

    Simply stating that more like android doesn't make it better or equal. The quality of the OS does. Sometimes good products fail simply because consumers don't know any better.

    Basically my point is that the quality of the os is a separate issue from consumer preference.

    Posted via CB10
    12-02-13 12:01 AM
  8. mnc76's Avatar
    Come on Dave, because a few people have been converted you speak for the masses? How many people have been converted away from Blackberry 10
    Or tried it and hated it and went to another OS. This holds true for every platform and Blackberry isn't the only one "converting" users.
    You missed the point of what he was saying.

    Someone said that "Android fans" are confident that Android is better.

    Dave pointed out that the poster was "speaking for the masses" with a blanket statement. He then gave some personal examples of people who switched from Android to BB10 to backup his point that not all Android users prefer android over BB10.

    He never "spoke for the masses". In fact, his point was AGAINST the notion of "speaking for the masses".

    In addition to this, he never said that ONLY BlackBerry has converted users. (which is clearly not the case)

    Personally, I know 2 people who work for Telus (a national carrier) in Canada that get to use any phone they wish for work. They both tried BB10 (Q10s, since they are constantly writing long emails on the go), but couldn't stick with it due to the lack of apps (mainly social, sports, video, free game apps, and random productivity apps). (surprisingly, the small screen didn't bother them as much as I assumed it would)

    Their desire to have a single "everything phone" trumped having a phone that excelled in messaging but lacked in personal apps.

    In short, they preferred the BB10 OS over Android, but couldn't jump the app gap.

    Posted via CB10
    Dave Bourque and RedFoxOne like this.
    12-02-13 12:14 AM
  9. crucial bbq's Avatar
    Hi Guys

    While BB10 is a huge upgrade, it comes up short for what the vast majority of mobile device users want apps, flexibility, & platform stability . I left blackberry in Aug of this year for an Samsung android phone (S3) and Samsung tablet 2 after having had a blackberry phone and 2 blackberry playbooks. the fact that blackberry users have to rely so heavily on android apps (side loading or in BB store) speaks volumes. Most people are not going to want to deal with the process of side loading android apps on their blackberry mobile devices and even then those android apps may not work correctly. As far as Flexibility goes, I rooted my android tablet a week after it came in the mail, this process allows me to move apps to my sdcard to save space or delete bloatware that came with the Tab 2, I can also select what version of android I want to load and run. I could also do this same process with my Samsung phone. This is no such option with a blackberry phone or tablet that I know of ( Please correct me if I'm wrong). finally platform stability, I've read tons of post on Crackberry on how unstable android mobile devices are or were. I have had almost no issues with my Samsung devices, they are extremely reliable. My blackberry phone locked up every blue moon but not enough to bother me at all. My playbook's was a whole different experience, probably because most of the apps in BB world were ported older android apps. I loved blackberry but the android platform is just plain better and has a future.
    Seriously dude? You claim that "Most people are not going to want to deal with the process of side loading android apps on their blackberry mobile devices and even then those android apps may not work correctly" and then follow up with "As far as Flexibility goes, I rooted my android tablet ...". Side-loading Android apps onto a BB10 handset is a heckofalot easier for the average user to do than rooting an Android handset. And once the average user does root their Android handset, moving files is not exactly second nature you know.

    Android has a future, Google Android does not. Amazon forked Google Android, which somehow violated Google's "open" policy. And, either with a new forked version of Android, or Tizen, either way Samsung are very seriously going to be off Google Android by the end of 2014. And who is to say that LG and HTC, in the least, don't fork their own versions of Android and violate Google's open policy as Amazon did. Hmmm....Nokia dropped Meego for Windows, too. Things change, and with Firefox, Sailfish, and Ubuntu all going mobile (handsets), along with Tizen, Android as you know it today may not be the same Android a year from now.
    Dave Bourque and RedFoxOne like this.
    12-02-13 12:19 AM
  10. tdawg00's Avatar
    Your conclusion assumes all things are equal. It is entirely possible and even likely that people will often like or prefer things that are inferior in nature or even detrimental to their health.

    Simply stating that more like android doesn't make it better or equal. The quality of the OS does. Sometimes good products fail simply because consumers don't know any better.

    Basically my point is that the quality of the os is a separate issue from consumer preference.

    Posted via CB10
    Did you really cherry pick his post like that to make your argument???!
    12-02-13 12:20 AM
  11. tdawg00's Avatar
    Seriously dude? You claim that "Most people are not going to want to deal with the process of side loading android apps on their blackberry mobile devices and even then those android apps may not work correctly" and then follow up with "As far as Flexibility goes, I rooted my android tablet ...". Side-loading Android apps onto a BB10 handset is a heckofalot easier for the average user to do than rooting an Android handset. And once the average user does root their Android handset, moving files is not exactly second nature you know.

    Android has a future, Google Android does not. Amazon forked Google Android, which somehow violated Google's "open" policy. And, either with a new forked version of Android, or Tizen, either way they are very seriously going to be off Google Android by the end of 2014. And who is to say that LG and HTC, in the least, don't fork their own versions of Android and violate Google's open policy as Amazon did. Hmmm....Nokia dropped Meego for Windows, too. Things change, and with Firefox, Sailfish, and Ubuntu all going mobile (handsets), along with Tizen, Android as you know it today may not be the same Android a year from now.
    Android is maintained, develop and distributed by Google (AOSP)... No matter what happens to it, it comes from Google. Amazon version Android is based off AOSP. BB Android Runtime... Again AOSP... Who maintains AOSP? Google.
    12-02-13 12:25 AM
  12. tdawg00's Avatar
    Seriously dude? You claim that "Most people are not going to want to deal with the process of side loading android apps on their blackberry mobile devices and even then those android apps may not work correctly" and then follow up with "As far as Flexibility goes, I rooted my android tablet ...". Side-loading Android apps onto a BB10 handset is a heckofalot easier for the average user to do than rooting an Android handset. And once the average user does root their Android handset, moving files is not exactly second nature you know.

    Android has a future, Google Android does not. Amazon forked Google Android, which somehow violated Google's "open" policy. And, either with a new forked version of Android, or Tizen, either way Samsung are very seriously going to be off Google Android by the end of 2014. And who is to say that LG and HTC, in the least, don't fork their own versions of Android and violate Google's open policy as Amazon did. Hmmm....Nokia dropped Meego for Windows, too. Things change, and with Firefox, Sailfish, and Ubuntu all going mobile (handsets), along with Tizen, Android as you know it today may not be the same Android a year from now.
    What is Google Android btw?? Nexus phones? Developer phones? Because most of the phones sold are not pure Android.
    12-02-13 12:26 AM
  13. Iggy City's Avatar
    I didn't think this was going to last this long.
    That's what she said.
    12-02-13 12:26 AM
  14. Unbiased Tech's Avatar
    Can't say I have ever used one. Are these used in the workplace? Never seen that done, but I've worked at the same place for the past six years so this might be my problem.

    Posted via CB10
    Well considering that Microsoft created and owns Outlook and WP8 I think it's a bit of a stretch to say BlackBerry handles Outlook better than every other os. Now I'm not sure about Android and IOS, but I think it's safe to say that Microsoft is best at what they own lol.

    Posted via CB10
    12-02-13 01:08 AM
  15. bp3dots's Avatar
    I don't agree.
    I believe that Chancellor of Germany' BB10 is more difficult to hack into than the Z10 I own, even though my technology experience is higher (imho of course).

    But we share the same vision - that's why I won't likely root a device and keep personal info on that smartphone.
    No, I'm not a security crazy that my identity can be stolen - I don't care that much.
    My beloved one cancels credit card every two years on average after a bank call to highlight suspicious transactions.
    I tried android (and I still have it) and BB10 and my personal preference is BB10 today even though the platforms are very close to each other.
    I don't think you understand what I'm saying.

    If anyone, even the Chancellor of Germany, goes and installs shady software, malware, etc. they're putting themselves at risk, regardless of how secure the platform is under normal use. That is a constant across all platforms and is pretty much undisputed.

    In your twitter example, you describe what sounds like installing untrusted apps that did things you didn't want. That's not a weakness of the platform, its a weakness in the user. (Plenty of people can make that mistake, its not a personal shot at you)

    I have never disputed that BB has excellent security, but there is still opportunity for breaches, especially if not on BES.. (But then, a locked down iOS or Android device would also enjoy that distinction)
    12-02-13 01:36 AM
  16. stackberry369's Avatar
    The official Twitter client has never asked for donations, so I'm not sure what you were downloading. And yes, it does ask permission to use your contacts.to link them with Twitter handles (if they have one) but I've never seen a warning for use in marketing. (That may all be in one message, I never hit 'Yes' to that part, and never read it all the way through) It does also inquire about GPS.

    I believe Touchwiz and Sense phones have Twitter clients preinstalled, so they don't need a separate install, and they behave just like the official one as far as permissions go.

    I am aware of the "all in" for permissions, though I've never seen it as an issue. Any app that asks for anything I don't want it to have I wouldn't install anyway. I also made no comment about platforms being less or more secure, only that the user is the weakest point in any.
    My note 3 didnt come with Twitter or Facebook pre installed.

    sent from my galaxy note 3
    12-02-13 01:43 AM
  17. bp3dots's Avatar
    My note 3 didn’t come with Twitter or Facebook pre installed.

    sent from my galaxy note 3
    Might just be Sense then, Though I could swear my GS3 had a facebook one at least, because it annoyed me by always asking to sign in. Might not be around anymore though.

    Do you remember if there was just a sign in during setup to link contacts?
    12-02-13 01:51 AM
  18. qbnkelt's Avatar
    It falls back to the first rule of CrackBerry - "If BlackBerry ain't got it, we don't need it!"

    The moment BlackBerry gets it - "this is the greatest thing evar!", "better Android than Android", "look at the launcher I'm running, isn't it cool?"

    The same people who made the above comments used to say they didn't need apps. Lol

    I KNOW!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

    If there was ever evidence of that mentality, it is now. "Who needs Apps????" "Apps are for immature teenage girls" "Who needs Instagram?" "Use the browser!!!"

    And now......

    "WHOA!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! THE APP GAP IS CLOSED!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! I JUST DOWNLOADED 150 GAZILLION APPS FROM 1MOBILE!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! PAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAATTTTTTTTTTTTTTAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA YYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYY!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!"

    Oh!!!!!!!!!!! and then they try to convince me, who have always stressed security, that it is worth it to put my phone at risk by going to an APK grabber just so that I can get the apps I'VE ALREADY GOT on my iPhone and my SGIII on the BlackBerry whose principal value to me is SECURITY. No......I want BLACKBERRY APPS on my BLACKBERRY.

    It is a very interesting study in human nature.
    12-02-13 03:14 AM
  19. NaijaBerry's Avatar
    I would like to think of this not as BB10 Vs Android, but BB10 + Android, the potential for a very perfect union. As a user of both platforms and having recently updated to 10.2.1, I can say that all the apk's I've installed on my Q10 work so much better than on my S3. I also thought why bother doing this, why not just buy an Android phone? Well, I have both and use them both dedicatedly daily. Which is better my Q10 or S3? While this is a topic of hot debate and is subjective, which one is better can only be based on hard facts, and in this case popular demand and sales, so Android wins no contest!

    However, with 10.2.1 and the ease of installation of APK's, the experience of Android on BB10 really is something you do not want to ignore, I mean it works seamlessly! I was tending towards the puritanical end of things with BlackBerry vs Android believing we should keep BlackBerry as it is and choose what you like, but my experience so far has me totally converted to my beloved BlackBerry once again! I will always have two phones, one has to be a qwerty and the other a full touch so I can enjoy the best of both worlds hardware wise. Now that I'm gearing up to upgrade my full touch which is an Android phone, I was considering the Nexus 5, but now with 10.2.1 and the hope for better OS builds for BB10, why not get a Z30 and still enjoy the Android side of things on it?
    12-02-13 04:58 AM
  20. --TommesJay--'s Avatar
    But I thought that isn't a universal Android feature, no?
    Exactly. But anyhow, as I said, that was sarcasm on my part, because IMO, split screening on Samsung devices isn't this hell of an everyday feature and it doesn't make up for other shortcomings. But that's just me and my personal requirements on a phone.

    Posted via CB10
    12-02-13 05:10 AM
  21. --TommesJay--'s Avatar
    I can say that all the apk's I've installed on my Q10 work so much better than on my S3.
    Wow, that's really a strong claim and that'd be news to me. I mean I'm running 10.2.1 on my Z10 and some APKs I've tested are nothing I'd describe a good experience. So in conclusion, are you telling me that Android apps are this 'bad' in general, even on Android devices? Wow, that'd really grind my gears.



    Posted via CB10
    12-02-13 05:14 AM
  22. --TommesJay--'s Avatar
    I don't think you understand what I'm saying.

    If anyone, even the Chancellor of Germany, goes and installs shady software, malware, etc. they're putting themselves at risk, regardless of how secure the platform is under normal use. That is a constant across all platforms and is pretty much undisputed.

    In your twitter example, you describe what sounds like installing untrusted apps that did things you didn't want. That's not a weakness of the platform, its a weakness in the user. (Plenty of people can make that mistake, its not a personal shot at you)

    I have never disputed that BB has excellent security, but there is still opportunity for breaches, especially if not on BES.. (But then, a locked down iOS or Android device would also enjoy that distinction)
    The point with our fellow chancellor's Z10 is, as far as I know, the only thing she can screw up through malware is her personal side of the phone, not the encrypted and SecuSmart chip equipped business side of the phone (BlackBerry balance).

    Posted via CB10
    12-02-13 05:19 AM
  23. berryaddictnoza's Avatar
    Surface does true multi tasking, soon windows phones will knock out the cheap Linux android phones.

    Posted via CB10
    While I love the UI for multitasking on the Surface, it will not run some stuff in the background, example; it won't play a Crackberry podcast while swiping over to work on Evernote, BB 10 does this no problem. I do have the Surface RT though, I would suspect the Surface Pro would true multitask as it's full on Windows 8.
    Last edited by berryaddictnoza; 12-02-13 at 08:16 AM.
    12-02-13 05:47 AM
  24. George Jenkinson's Avatar
    You make a good point, but on that basis, Apple wouldn't be slugging it out with Android for #1 spot.
    12-02-13 06:19 AM
  25. George Jenkinson's Avatar
    Good points, but are you saying that BB integrates with Microsoft Outlook better than any other os including Microsoft Windows Phone 8? lol
    In my experience, my Windows Phone 8 receives emails after my Z10 and both are linked to same addresses! I am using Outlook Web App on the pc, but that ought not to make a difference. I can't understand why - WP8 ought to win hands down, no questions. Mine doesn't though...
    12-02-13 06:25 AM
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