[neteng1000]

RIM's demise stems from arrogance | CanadianBusiness.com

[neteng1000]

When Apple told everyone that their product was the best and everyone had to have it, everyone followd like sheep. When RIM does the same thing, it's arrogance...LOL

[Superfly_FR]

It's about RIM in its former 2CEO's management, as I read it.
Conclusion is not that bad ...

This magazine has been a fervent champion of RIM, even as others lost confidence. Just five months ago, we wrote there were many signs “RIM watchers are wrong about their terminal diagnosis.” This still holds. There is no reason to believe the company will die. But the cost of its arrogance is that it will emerge from its current tribulations as a shrunken, anemic version of its former self. For the good of Canada, we can hope that RIM manages the great transformation that Heins promises. But our optimism has its limits. We can now only celebrate what it once achieved and mourn what could have been.

[amazinglygraceless]

RIM's demise stems from arrogance | CanadianBusiness.com

It's the same old song over and over again....

Must have been written by a fanboy who just graduated highschool. I said it once, I say it again. We Candians are our worst enemies. We are sabotaging ourselves. You would think we would do whatever we could to protect our assets……

Did you read a different article because this one is by and large laudatory of RIMs accomplishments and successes, it"s value to Canada, and ends on a fairly optimistic note.

[neteng1000]

Yeah maybe I should read more carefully next time. LOL

I got mad after reading the first two paragraphs and posted it. It's still the same old song though.

[amazinglygraceless]

When Apple told everyone that their product was the best and everyone had to have it, everyone followd like sheep. When RIM does the same thing, it's arrogance...LOL

...and again you missed the point. The arrogance did not come in the form of what Apple did or did not say. It came in the form of RIM dismissing the iPhone out of hand.

After the Apple iPhone was introduced at WWDC in 2007 by Steve Jobs, the long nearly 6 month wait for the device gave the media plenty of time to get reactions from BlackBerry executives like Jim Balsillie. "[Apple and the iPhone is] kind of one more entrant into an already very busy space with lots of choice for consumers … But in terms of a sort of a sea-change for BlackBerry, I would think that's overstating it."– Jim Balsillie, February 2007.

Two months later, Balsillie is back for more comments on the Apple iPhone, which had not yet been released, ""Again, I have said this before and I will say it again; Apple has done the industry an enormous favour because they basically told the world to expect a media player [the iPod] as a software feature on a good smartphone. As the leading smartphone appliance company and platform company, we could not buy that kind of validation for $100m" –Jim Balsillie, April 2007.

BUT Mr Balsillie did actually say something once that made sense:

""No other technology company other than Apple has successfully transitioned their platform. It's almost never done, and it's way harder than you realize. This transition is where tech companies go to die."-Jim Balsillie, April 2011.

Source: They said what? Great quotes from Jim Balsillie and Mike Lazaridis

[trsbbs]

When Apple told everyone that their product was the best and everyone had to have it, everyone followd like sheep. When RIM does the same thing, it's arrogance...LOL

Apple actually produced the product. RIM has yet to do this.

Simple.

Tim.

PS, I agree. Mike and Jim thought their sh1t didn't smell.
Thor isn't as bad. He has his own credibility issues.

[berklon]

Arrogance as well as lack of forward thinking.

It's really unbelievable that just a few weeks ago Apple celebrated their 5th anniversary of the iPhone release, and here we are STILL waiting for RIM to release a product that competes with it... and that it's still 6-9 months away.

In the world of technology, things move fast. And in the mobile world specifically - they move extremely fast. A single year is a lifetime - being 5+ years behind is mind-blowing.

[ColdFistOfTruth]

Arrogance as well as lack of forward thinking.

It's really unbelievable that just a few weeks ago Apple celebrated their 5th anniversary of the iPhone release, and here we are STILL waiting for RIM to release a product that competes with it... and that it's still 6-9 months away.

In the world of technology, things move fast. And in the mobile world specifically - they move extremely fast. A single year is a lifetime - being 5+ years behind is mind-blowing.

If I stand back and look at the big picture, it seems to me that RIM is attempting to copy the Apple model, but using the Mac OS 9 -> Mac OS X transition strategy:

* buy a company with a better OS approach
* layer the corporate value-add over top
* end up in a MUCH better place

The problem is, as someone else unknowingly-wisely noted in another thread, that the OS 9 -> OS X transition took Apple far longer than RIM realistically has to evolve its platform.

EDIT: I forgot to add that Apple was also in a much different position: being in second place (which is functionally equivalent to last) they didn't have the pride which blinded them to the problems. Instead they were motivated as , and tying that back into the article above, that sticky pride thing cost RIM a TON of time which is the one thing they didn't have to waste and that may be another HUGE differentiating factor in the outcome for RIM

(Apple's MOBILITY story started on top of OS X, so they already had their "QNX" piece done)

I've said before that Apple was successful because of the lowered expectations and pressures; that's not luxury that RIM has but those are the rules.

If the analogy of Apple's desktop OS transformation is apt for RIM's platform transition, then it's a huge concern because it really becomes of a story of scoring before the clock runs out. And once the buzzer rings, if RIM hasn't scored (shipped an AWESOME product), RIM is ****ed. Game over.

-CFOT

[houshinto#IM]

Arrogance as well as lack of forward thinking.

It's really unbelievable that just a few weeks ago Apple celebrated their 5th anniversary of the iPhone release, and here we are STILL waiting for RIM to release a product that competes with it... and that it's still 6-9 months away.

In the world of technology, things move fast. And in the mobile world specifically - they move extremely fast. A single year is a lifetime - being 5+ years behind is mind-blowing.

Really generalizing here. That and being either ignorant or purposely misleading.

RIM has closed the gap considerably on multiple fronts. Don't even go with the "dead-horse" apps argument. It's being addressed even if you don't think it is.

They still have A LOT of work to do but they've been working much harder then people give them credit for. The OS7 devices are very comparable to Apples iPhone 4 in terms of hardware.

BB10 will bridge that gap even further if not match/surpass it.

Either way, "thanks" for hating.

[Knightcrawler]

Rim arrogant? Ya don't say.

[kbz1960]

Steve Jobs had to be the most arrogant sob alive. I guess it is acceptable you're an azz if you produce something.

[dbmalloy]

THis has got to be one of the most unwieldly posts I have every seen on this forum... Starts with a false permise.... Aritlcle was not what was denoted by OP... then degenerate into a useless "what Apple does verus What RIMi is doing"......

Again no one has seen a completed BB10 Phome and OS... so how can you even compare concepts or stregies.... RIM has offered only demo's and talking points....

Whether Apple had created a great product or not does not matter. It is a personal taste issue not a reality issue... this is where Apple excells.....marketing.....

Does not matter how good BB10 is.... it is marketing that is make or break BB10....

[Rickroller]

Really generalizing here. That and being either ignorant or purposely misleading.

RIM has closed the gap considerably on multiple fronts. Don't even go with the "dead-horse" apps argument. It's being addressed even if you don't think it is.

They still have A LOT of work to do but they've been working much harder then people give them credit for. The OS7 devices are very comparable to Apples iPhone 4 in terms of hardware.

BB10 will bridge that gap even further if not match/surpass it.

Either way, "thanks" for hating.

While the app issue might be getting addressed..this doesn't mean its going to be resolved. We have yet to see if any of the big name developers will be jumping on board or not..and quite frankly a bunch of potential amateur devs building for BB10 wont solve their problems. The Playbook is proof of this..

[Masahiro]

That's a rather hyperbolic title, considering RIM is...not dead? It also seems a little pointless talking about the arrogance of the old management when they're already gone (except Mike) and are no longer relevant.

[Dunt Dunt Dunt]

THis has got to be one of the most unwieldly posts I have every seen on this forum... Starts with a false permise.... Aritlcle was not what was denoted by OP... then degenerate into a useless "what Apple does verus What RIMi is doing"......

Again no one has seen a completed BB10 Phome and OS... so how can you even compare concepts or stregies.... RIM has offered only demo's and talking points....

Whether Apple had created a great product or not does not matter. It is a personal taste issue not a reality issue... this is where Apple excells.....marketing.....

Does not matter how good BB10 is.... it is marketing that is make or break BB10....

True no one has really seen a finial BB10 Device or the finial OS.

But RIM is where they are today, not because of BB10 but because of decisions they have made for the last five years. Their downfall has been a very slow one. And most frustrating to many that have been here for a while is that you could see them ignoring Apple and Android devices and staying with their original "master plan" - they were the smartphone business back then and felt (like some here do) that the "iToys" and cheap "droid" didn't matter to people that wanted a true smartphone. And that was their arrogance.

BB10 might be great, developers may create 1000 of wonderful new apps, RIM may find a partner to provide them with a "one stop" content store - and people may flock back to BlackBerry. That doesn't change that thing could have been much better if five years ago Jim & Mike had realized that Apple and Android had features that people wanted and that RIM needed to dump their "master plan" and get innovate again.

[OzarkaTexile]

When Apple told everyone that their product was the best and everyone had to have it, everyone followd like sheep. When RIM does the same thing, it's arrogance...LOL

All companies claim their product is the best. The market decides who wins.

[sosumi11]

Whether Apple had created a great product or not does not matter. It is a personal taste issue not a reality issue... this is where Apple excells.....marketing.....
Does not matter how good BB10 is.... it is marketing that is make or break BB10....

Are you serious? Good marketing cannot magically win awards.

2008 British Technology Awards
Best Mobile Technology : Apple iPhone
Gadget of the Year : Apple iPhone
Most Stylish Technology: Apple iPhone
Technological Innovation of the Year : Apple iPhone

Time Magazine
2007 Invention of the Year: Apple iPhone

Popular Science
Grand Award Gadget of the Year: Apple iPhone

UK's The Gadget Show
Gadget Show’s Gadget of the Decade: Apple iPhone

2008 Creativity Awards
Grand Prix Winner: Apple iPhone

Also awards from PC Magazine, Wired, Engadget, etc.

[houshinto#IM]

Are you serious? Good marketing cannot sell a bad product.

2008 British Technology Awards
Best Mobile Technology : Apple iPhone
Gadget of the Year : Apple iPhone
Most Stylish Technology: Apple iPhone
Technological Innovation of the Year : Apple iPhone

Time Magazine
2007 Invention of the Year: Apple iPhone

Popular Science
Grand Award Gadget of the Year: Apple iPhone

UK's The Gadget Show
Gadget Show�s Gadget of the Decade: Apple iPhone

Also awards from PC Magazine, Wired, Engadget, etc.

What do you think Tech Blogs have become? Like most media it's not about expertise and integrity of content. It's just another form of advertising with technical knowledge.

Not to say that Apple products are crud, but marketing is their bread and butter. Their products when compared to other competitors are not revolutionary nor unique.

[sosumi11]

What do you think Tech Blogs have become? Like most media it's not about expertise and integrity of content. It's just another form of advertising with technical knowledge.

Not to say that Apple products are crud, but marketing is their bread and butter. Their products when compared to other competitors are not revolutionary nor unique.

Apple has always produced great marketing, but during the pre-iPod years, nobody cared. Only Apple fanatics bought Apple products.

Ads only work if people pay attention to them. Nobody was interested in Macs after Microsoft won the lawsuit in 1992. Mac sales were flat from 1994 through 1999. It took the iMac to bring life back into Macs, and then the iPod. Sales went from ~500,000/qtr to over 5,000,000/qtr. And you say innovation has nothing to do with it?

When Apple announced the iPhone at Macworld in 2007, CES was going on in (sic) San Francisco. Every reporter in the world that was covering CES was told they were covering the wrong show. Apple did not spend one dollar for this kind of exposure.

Apple innovated themselves out of trouble. They did not use marketing lights and mirrors.

Innovation sells.
Marketing just gets the word out.

Oh, one more thing. Apple has always used the same ad agency since 1976 (McKenna/Chiat/Day), with the exception of BBDO during the Steve Job-less years.

[Dunt Dunt Dunt]

What do you think Tech Blogs have become? Like most media it's not about expertise and integrity of content. It's just another form of advertising with technical knowledge.

Not to say that Apple products are crud, but marketing is their bread and butter. Their products when compared to other competitors are not revolutionary nor unique.

I agree that today's iPhone as a device is not revolutionary or unique. (but you have to admit that five years ago it was)

Many people don't just buy an iPhone because it is an iPhone - they are buying a device that can access Apple's "unique" Ecosystem. And no one else has created an ecosystem that can match that of the one the iPhone can access.

I think the Ecosystem is more important than the device, and one reason that I expect that Amazon will do well once they release a phone.

[PineappleUnderTheSea]

Many people don't just buy an iPhone because it is an iPhone - they are buying a device that can access Apple's "unique" Ecosystem. And no one else has created an ecosystem that can match that of the one the iPhone can access.

I think the Ecosystem is more important than the device, and one reason that I expect that Amazon will do well once they release a phone.

I agree. I actually read the Jobs biography, and it is clear that an ecosystem was the grand vision from the time the iPod was engineered. Otherwise all you'd have would be an iPod, which was cool looking with its click wheel and all, but in the end it would have been another MP3 player. This is where Microsoft went wrong with the Zune, they thought that the device mattered. iTunes is really what led to the whole Marketing push, and once that got going it became easy for people to buy an iPhone, then an iPad, because really you were buying into an ecosystem, as mentioned.

Too bad RIM didn't have that vision back then (then again, no one did but Apple). It's hard not being first to market, you usually don't get a huge piece of the pie (the exception here is the Android ecosystem, but it is doing well because it is a free OS...can't argue with free).

[khanig]

Really generalizing here. That and being either ignorant or purposely misleading.

RIM has closed the gap considerably on



multiple fronts. Don't even go with the "dead-horse" apps argument. It's being addressed even if you don't think it is.

They still have A LOT of work to do but they've been working much harder then people give them credit for. The OS7 devices are very comparable to Apples iPhone 4 in terms of hardware.

BB10 will bridge that gap even further if not match/surpass it.

Either way, "thanks" for hating.

This is khanig, by the way. Don't know why I don't have a separate message window. Anyway, I just wanted to say that I was really upset that BB was going to delay. I was all ready to jump to SGIII, but...I may wait and see how this all shakes down. Yeah, I know RIM seems doomed. But I remember when Apple stock dropped to ten bucks and everyone said they were through. Now look at them. And no, this dumbass didn't buy at ten!! Anyway, let's see what happens. The Canon thing looks interesting and BB has a great phone. Just admit it; the company drives us nuts, but the damn phone ALWAYS works! It doesn't matter rto RIM what I think! But, I'm going to hang in there and see what happens. You never know. BB 10 could be a mess...or amazing.

[khanig]

Something else too. I wonder if RIM execs listened to postings on Crackberry. I mean, people were really mad at RIM. Maybe we had an affect. At least, I'd like to think so. Who knows!!!

[Thunderbuck]

Something else too. I wonder if RIM execs listened to postings on Crackberry. I mean, people were really mad at RIM. Maybe we had an affect. At least, I'd like to think so. Who knows!!!

I think RIM is paying much closer attention to its enthusiast community, if that's what you mean.

It struck me when Kevin was talking about being at the Shareholders meeting a few weeks ago, and sat behind Mike Lazaridus, and commented that he'd never been that close to Mike before.

Contrast that to the new CEO, with whom Kevin has now had the chance to meet privately a few times.

It isn't a huge thing, but it's a detail that tells me that the company is consciously doing things differently.