[Superdupont 2_0]

The iPhone is currently better. Chen just bends over for the Governments.

And yes, they can log your info, your bbm messages can also be unscrambled, since they don't use any encryption, just a common key.

The only way they are more protected is with full BES. Otherwise they are just as weak of a target.

Posted via -sigh- Priv. Guess we have to get used to Android guys....

On BB10 your BBM messages are actually encrypted twice.
1st layer is the "scrambeling" with 3DES, this key is on all devices.
2nd Layer is TLS with Certificate Pinning, BBRY holds the key.

Now, iMessage is basically better, because it has E2E encryption, but last time it was checked there was no certificate pinning (yet).
iMessage Privacy

If you sign up to BBM Protected you can have a 3rd layer of encryption, which is then E2E.

Apple "logs" a lot more info when you use iCloud, because Apple has the keys for iCloud.
And of course they hand all this info (pictures, vids, contacts, e-mails, notes, calendar, iMEssage etc etc....) over to LEA by proper court order, so what is your point now?
BBRY has no cloud service, BBRY can't pass this big amount of data, because they don't have it.

[anon(9710735)]

No it's not.

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[sorinv]

This, exactly!

I feel like some people's hate for Android makes them write some rather stupid things, funny thing is before all this happened with the FBI there were many "know-it-alls" around here claiming iOS wasn't secure, lol, now some of them have changed their tune.

Apple and BlackBerry Priv (unlike BB10 phones) sync all your data unencrypted in Apple's and Google's cloud, respectively.
If Apple and BlackBerry really cared about the privacy and security of their users' data, they would at least warn them about not using cloud services to backup their phones.

[ALToronto]

It's only with iOS9 that Apple has caught up to BlackBerry. The Jennifer Lawrence hack made them wake up and create the 10 attempts limit. Plus, there are now so many ex-BlackBerry execs and lower level employees working at Apple, security was bound to get better.

However, is iCloud data encrypted or simply password protected? I wonder why the FBI isn't getting a court order for the San Bernardino terrorists' iCloud backups - they were able to get similar data from BlackBerry when they were catching mobsters. Yes, I know BlackBerry doesn't have a cloud, but the data is stored on its servers, which is pretty much the same.

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[sorinv]

It's only with iOS9 that Apple has caught up to BlackBerry. The Jennifer Lawrence hack made them wake up and create the 10 attempts limit. Plus, there are now so many ex-BlackBerry execs and lower level employees working at Apple, security was bound to get better.

However, is iCloud data encrypted or simply password protected? I wonder why the FBI isn't getting a court order for the San Bernardino terrorists' iCloud backups - they were able to get similar data from BlackBerry when they were catching mobsters. Yes, I know BlackBerry doesn't have a cloud, but the data is stored on its servers, which is pretty much the same.

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Apple already gave them the stored data but it was from an October 2015 back-up. The icloud is obviously not encrypted.
If you use cloud services your data is no longer private.
Same goes for Priv backed up in Google cloud.

The question we should ask is how come that this was a company phone, yet its content was stored unencrypted in Icloud?!?
There are a lot of inconsistencies in this story.

[donnation]

It's only with iOS9 that Apple has caught up to BlackBerry. The Jennifer Lawrence hack made them wake up and create the 10 attempts limit. Plus, there are now so many ex-BlackBerry execs and lower level employees working at Apple, security was bound to get better.

However, is iCloud data encrypted or simply password protected? I wonder why the FBI isn't getting a court order for the San Bernardino terrorists' iCloud backups - they were able to get similar data from BlackBerry when they were catching mobsters. Yes, I know BlackBerry doesn't have a cloud, but the data is stored on its servers, which is pretty much the same.

Posted via CB10 from my awesome Passport

The 10 attempts limit has been around years before iOS 9.

[donnation]

Apple and BlackBerry Priv (unlike BB10 phones) sync all your data unencrypted in Apple's and Google's cloud, respectively.
If Apple and BlackBerry really cared about the privacy and security of their users' data, they would at least warn them about not using cloud services to backup their phones.

They actually do. You don't have to use the cloud to backup your data. You can back it up directly to your computer or choose to not back it up in the cloud at all.

[sorinv]

They actually do. You don't have to use the cloud to backup your data. You can back it up directly to your computer or choose to not back it up in the cloud at all.

I know you have the option to not store in the cloud, but certainly BlackBerry does not even warn you that Google data mines you, let alone tell you not to register with Google and back up your Priv in Google cloud.
Blackberry sends you to Google to create an account to update your BlackBerry apps on the priv.
If they cared about privacy, they would provide a way to download those apps directly from BlackBerry and let the user decide if they want to use Google Play store or not. They would also warn the user not to back up their phone in Google cloud if they want their data encrypted and private...

[ALToronto]

The 10 attempts limit has been around years before iOS 9.

Thanks for the clarification, I was confusing phone and iCloud logins.

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[TgeekB]

They actually do. You don't have to use the cloud to backup your data. You can back it up directly to your computer or choose to not back it up in the cloud at all.

More misinformation being spread around here about the hated Apple. Thanks for pointing out the truth.

[kg4icg]

Actually Apple is just drumming up press for itself after what's been happening in the last few weeks with there products. This isn't the first time Apple has been asked to do this and it won't be the last. Apple just making a fuss about opening up a phone that didn't belong to a private citizen, but was a local government owned device that somehow got IT policies circumvented, no different when students of the LA school district did the same with those iPads. Apple security is not all that it can be. The first devices that always fall at white and black hat events are Apple and Android. Most times Apple being the quickest to hack. This would be a non issue if Apple wasn't looking at a class action suit coming there way because of error 53.

[TgeekB]

Actually Apple is just drumming up press for itself after what's been happening in the last few weeks with there products. This isn't the first time Apple has been asked to do this and it won't be the last. Apple just making a fuss about opening up a phone that didn't belong to a private citizen, but was a local government owned device that somehow got IT policies circumvented, no different when students of the LA school district did the same with those iPads. Apple security is not all that it can be. The first devices that always fall at white and black hat events are Apple and Android. Most times Apple being the quickest to hack. This would be a non issue if Apple wasn't looking at a class action suit coming there way because of error 53.

Then why can't the FBI get into it?

[kg4icg]

Then why can't the FBI get into it?

Why don't you go ask the FBI instead of taking Apple's word on the matter. After all, Apple is just doing this to protect there profit margin which is pretty hefty.

[TgeekB]

Why don't you go ask the FBI instead of taking Apple's word on the matter. After all, Apple is just doing this to protect there profit margin which is pretty hefty.

Wrong. The FBI said they can't get into it. You make it sound like Apple made this up.

[kg4icg]

That is why they are asking for Apple's help like they have done in the past, but Apple is grandstanding on a issue for which legislation is being debated on, and not just in this country.

[TgeekB]

That is why they are asking for Apple's help like they have done in the past, but Apple is grandstanding on a issue for which legislation is being debated on, and not just in this country.

Apple took a stance, like it or not. Who are you or I to think we know why? Just because you hate Apple doesn't mean they're doing it as a publicity stunt. Let it ride out and we'll see what happens in the end.

[Troy Tiscareno]

Apple and BlackBerry Priv (unlike BB10 phones) sync all your data unencrypted in Apple's and Google's cloud, respectively.

Google's entire cloud data is stored encrypted since 2014. Previously the encryption was stripped off at the gateway (once it got safely transported to Google's inner servers), but since the NSA was discovered to have hacked in, Google has encrypted all of the data in storage. Of course, if you have the account login, you can get to your data just fine.

[sorinv]

Google's entire cloud data is stored encrypted since 2014. Previously the encryption was stripped off at the gateway (once it got safely transported to Google's inner servers), but since the NSA was discovered to have hacked in, Google has encrypted all of the data in storage. Of course, if you have the account login, you can get to your data just fine.

Well, Apple obviously still does not, or else Apple would not have unveiled as much now.
Are you saying that Google could not have delivered the data if it had been stored in their cloud, just like apple did, if faced with a warrant?

[kg4icg]

Heck if Apple can force your device to take a update no matter what encryption your using and pull apps out of the app store and off your device because they are causing problems, they can certainly do what the FBI is asking

[Alain_A]

Heck if Apple can force your device to take a update no matter what encryption your using and pull apps out of the app store and off your device because they are causing problems, they can certainly do what the FBI is asking

so,you are ok for apple to create a back door in all iPhone?

[kg4icg]

You already have a back door. Apple just doesn't want to use it for any other purpose but there own. That's what people haven't realized yet. If they can force updates and pull apps off your device .

[Alain_A]

You already have a back door. Apple just doesn't want to use it for any other purpose but there own. That's what people haven't realized yet. If they can force updates and pull apps off your device .

How do you know that all iPhone have a back door? if that's the case. How come the fbi is requesting to make the phone weaker?

[TgeekB]

No one is forced to use a particular brand (except for work) so why all the anxiety?

[AnimalPak200]

I read something today that seemed to clear a few things up:

The iPhone in question was regularly backing itself to icloud, and Apple provided the FBI with access to icloud backup data on their servers.

However at some point the FBI changed the password or pin on the account, and that requires the icloud connection to be reauthenticated on the device.

Once they did that, they basically lost access to any new device data that would have otherwise been automatically backed up to icloud.

So... now they're asking for a way to break into the device.


Sounds like Apple did collaborate in the way they can (provide access to their server data), and the investigators messed up.

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[Alain_A]

Sounds like Apple did collaborate in the way they can (provide access to their server data), and the investigators messed up.
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Apple helped, investigators screwed up, then fbi went it court against apple....then the fbi is abusing.