04-05-14 08:45 PM
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  1. TgeekB's Avatar
    I agree with this. Except that I'd probably recommend a different brand simply based on the Surface Pro 2's price point. Asus and Dell have some really nice devices at better prices. Especially Asus, their prices give the most bang for the buck ($399 for the Asus T100 is a really great deal for what you get).
    That does look like a great deal. Now you've got me thinking.....

    Blackberry is in no shape to enter this market, not now.

    Posted via my Nexus 10.
    04-05-14 07:46 AM
  2. ajst222's Avatar
    I agree with this. Except that I'd probably recommend a different brand simply based on the Surface Pro 2's price point. Asus and Dell have some really nice devices at better prices. Especially Asus, their prices give the most bang for the buck ($399 for the Asus T100 is a really great deal for what you get).
    It depends on what you're looking for. The Surface Pro 2 is high end while the Asus T100 is low end. But that's the good thing...there's plenty of choice.

    Photo a Day: C002B5A07, my amateur photography Channel
    04-05-14 07:57 AM
  3. keypad's Avatar
    I think a tablet will come to market, but it will be aimed at enterprise and medical organisations.

    I feel your pain as I would love a BlackBerry Tablet to be available to the general public this summer for a price under �200.

    But then I would also like to see Foxconn produce a Smartwatch fitness band for BlackBerry 10 smartphones also and many on the forums say that is a bad idea.

    Keep pushing though.

    It's the only way great products ideas services, surface in the end.

    Posted via CB10
    04-05-14 08:04 AM
  4. keypad's Avatar
    Sorry about the funky post, I don't know what's happening here???

    Posted via CB10
    04-05-14 08:09 AM
  5. DenverRalphy's Avatar
    It depends on what you're looking for. The Surface Pro 2 is high end while the Asus T100 is low end. But that's the good thing...there's plenty of choice.
    Yeah, technically speaking, the T100 is low end (realistically I'd classify it as mid range based on its performance). But it's a rather impressive little device, and the price is just crazy good for what you get, especially since it also includes the keyboard dock. Asus and Dell both have higher end devices too, which can be found for under $800 - $1k including the keyboard/desk docks in the package.
    04-05-14 08:27 AM
  6. ajst222's Avatar
    Yeah, technically speaking, the T100 is low end (realistically I'd classify it as mid range based on its performance). But it's a rather impressive little device, and the price is just crazy good for what you get, especially since it also includes the keyboard dock. Asus and Dell both have higher end devices too, which can be found for under $800 - $1k including the keyboard/desk docks in the package.
    Yes. Dell's Venue Pro 11 starts out with an Atom (low end processor) with 2GB of RAM and goes up to the i5 with 4GB. Has a dock as well. However for me as I'm currently looking for a new laptop for college I would prefer something with 8GB of RAM as I run things like Photoshop and Lightroom plus I multitask. The Surface Pro 2 is on my list. There's a lot out there and that's another reason why I'm a fan of Windows.

    Photo a Day: C002B5A07, my amateur photography Channel
    04-05-14 08:33 AM
  7. early2bed's Avatar
    I think a tablet will come to market, but it will be aimed at enterprise and medical organisations.
    Why, because enterprise users have to use whatever is issued to them and medical customers are used to paying a lot more for less? This reminds me when HP actually promoted to touchpad for use in medical applications simply because it didn't not have a metal casing and could be used near an MRI scanner. No matter that probably less than 1% of medical professionals work anywhere near an MRI machine.

    The niche customers are the ones that need niche apps so they are much more likely to pick the platform with the largest app catalog.
    Troy Tiscareno likes this.
    04-05-14 08:39 AM
  8. DenverRalphy's Avatar
    Yes. Dell's Venue Pro 11 starts out with an Atom (low end processor) with 2GB of RAM and goes up to the i5 with 4GB. Has a dock as well. However for me as I'm currently looking for a new laptop for college I would prefer something with 8GB of RAM as I run things like Photoshop and Lightroom plus I multitask. The Surface Pro 2 is on my list. There's a lot out there and that's another reason why I'm a fan of Windows.
    Still sipping my coffee, so my head is still a bit fuzzy, so I may be mistaken... But doesn't the Pro 11 also have additional memory with the keyboard dock attached? Like I said, I could be mistaken though. I think I may have to venture over to WPCentral and catch up a bit.
    04-05-14 08:41 AM
  9. sinsin07's Avatar
    The Surface Pro 2 is a fantastic tablet, or should I say Ultrabook, because that's really what it is...just in a tablet body. You have the power of a laptop all with the convenience of a tablet. If you want to talk about how it's different from say the iPad Air, PlayBook, Nexus, Note, etc is because it's a real computer. It's not really a fair comparison. A true comparison would be with the Surface 2. But for a true "prosumer" (God I hate that word), the Surface Pro 2 would be the ideal choice BECAUSE it's a computer and not a tablet.
    Here is another differentiator:
    "Windows 8 has a special version of Windows Defender, which is far more secure and stronger than prior versions and certainly better than Microsoft Security Essentials as well as the original Windows Defender used in Vista. That being said, it is not perfect and there are viruses it cannot defend against or if it can defend against them, it has trouble defeating them completely. It is certainly unable to completely remove a Rootkit and thus far, Kaspersky's TDSSKiller is the only option I have found in that regard that completely removes a rootkit forever.

    In regards to your question, "Does Surface Pro need anti-virus protection beyond what Windows 8 provides?" This is really something that is up to you and depends on what type of Internet browsing you do. If you are continually going to dangerous sites and visiting sites that are known to be corrupted with dangerous items, then yes, you definitely need something beyond Windows Defender. If you do light browsing to well-known and secure sites, don't click on the pop-ups that say, "Click here for the best male/female enhancement!" and in general, do not visit places that Google or Bing shows in a search result as dangerous, then you will be okay."

    Microsoft Community

    It's running Windows.

    A level of complexity that a tablet doesn't have.

    On a tablet, either the app works or it doesn't.
    • There is no tweaking of the registry.
    • There are no driver updates to worry about.
    • No virus definitions to update.

    The weight of the Surface Pro is also a drawback, along with the lack of cellular (although that will change in the future.)

    Enterprise has not gravitated to tablets, namely the iPads, because they are looking for a laptop replacement.

    They are looking for a single purpose tool that can get a task done without the complexity of Windows.
    04-05-14 08:48 AM
  10. ajst222's Avatar
    Still sipping my coffee, so my head is still a bit fuzzy, so I may be mistaken... But doesn't the Pro 11 also have additional memory with the keyboard dock attached? Like I said, I could be mistaken though. I think I may have to venture over to WPCentral and catch up a bit.
    I don't believe so. The Dell Venue Pro 11 is just a tablet with an optional dock. You may be thinking of the HP Spectre

    Photo a Day: C002B5A07, my amateur photography Channel
    DenverRalphy likes this.
    04-05-14 08:48 AM
  11. ajst222's Avatar
    There is another difference:
    "Windows 8 has a special version of Windows Defender, which is far more secure and stronger than prior versions and certainly better than Microsoft Security Essentials as well as the original Windows Defender used in Vista. That being said, it is not perfect and there are viruses it cannot defend against or if it can defend against them, it has trouble defeating them completely. It is certainly unable to completely remove a Rootkit and thus far, Kaspersky's TDSSKiller is the only option I have found in that regard that completely removes a rootkit forever.

    In regards to your question, "Does Surface Pro need anti-virus protection beyond what Windows 8 provides?" This is really something that is up to you and depends on what type of Internet browsing you do. If you are continually going to dangerous sites and visiting sites that are known to be corrupted with dangerous items, then yes, you definitely need something beyond Windows Defender. If you do light browsing to well-known and secure sites, don't click on the pop-ups that say, "Click here for the best male/female enhancement!" and in general, do not visit places that Google or Bing shows in a search result as dangerous, then you will be okay."

    Microsoft Community

    It's running Windows. A level of complexity that a tablet doesn't have.

    On a tablet, either the app works or it doesn't. There is no tweaking of the registry. There are no updated drivers to fix the issue.

    No virus definitions to update.

    The weight of the Surface Pro is also a drawback, along with the lack of cellular (although that will change in the future.)

    Enterprise has not gravitated to tablets, namely the iPads, because they are looking for a laptop replacement.

    They are looking for a single purpose tool that can get a task done without the complexity of Windows.
    So then why not the Surface 2? Runs Windows 8.1 RT, a tablet OS, and is not full Windows.

    Photo a Day: C002B5A07, my amateur photography Channel
    04-05-14 08:52 AM
  12. donnation's Avatar
    Enterprise ready, similar user interface to BB10, more great apps than any other platform, good screen size, works with BB HotSpot for remote access, great connectivity (USB port), runs Microsoft Office perfectly. That's more than enough reasons but the best of all it doesn't give money to Apple.
    You prefer giving money to Microsoft? What's the difference?
    04-05-14 08:52 AM
  13. ajst222's Avatar
    You prefer giving money to Microsoft? What's the difference?
    A company is a company. I'll buy from whoever as long as I like the product. That's how I see it.

    Photo a Day: C002B5A07, my amateur photography Channel
    TgeekB likes this.
    04-05-14 08:54 AM
  14. donnation's Avatar
    A company is a company. I'll buy from whoever as long as I like the product. That's how I see it.

    Photo a Day: C002B5A07, my amateur photography Channel
    Agreed.
    04-05-14 08:54 AM
  15. Wiki Cydia's Avatar
    Enterprise ready, similar user interface to BB10, more great apps than any other platform, good screen size, works with BB HotSpot for remote access, great connectivity (USB port), runs Microsoft Office perfectly. That's more than enough reasons but the best of all it doesn't give money to Apple.
    Good point. I'd much rather give $900 to Microsoft.

    /s

    You prefer giving money to Microsoft? What's the difference?
    Well, you know, Microsoft is for the common man. Or something. Wait who am I kidding? There's really no difference between Microsoft, Apple, Facebook, Google, etc.
    04-05-14 08:59 AM
  16. Wiki Cydia's Avatar
    The reason BB is failing in the US is actually pretty simple ------

    They forgot who buys phones and to MARKET.
    Ah. So, for several years now, BBRY has "forgotten" to market. That's not exactly an endorsement, since that oversight has created huge problems for the company.

    I know of a large law firm who just moved from BB to Iphones against the wishes of the partners because the "younger" employees and the young IT guy wanted a "cool" phone. It is all about MARKETING.
    Law firms are owned and controlled by partners, so your story doesn't make any sense unless the partners who wanted to stick with BBRY were overruled by more senior partners advocating the change. Trust me on that.
    04-05-14 09:00 AM
  17. donnation's Avatar
    And to Blackberry getting into the tablet game again, who would buy it? Companies aren't going to scrap whatever tablet they've invested in just to see if BB produces a halfway functional tablet.

    The original Playbook was so freaking awful when it launched it was embarrassing. I purchased 3 at launch only to sell them because the OS was so bad. I read Kevin's review of the Playbook recently. I can't believe I bought it. He basically said it was no where close to being ready to launch and to pass on it, but I bought it anyway because I got caught up in the hype of "the first professional tablet." It was a joke and BB should be ashamed they ever released it in its original form. I don't know many people that would risk purchasing a tablet again from them, no matter what promises came with it.
    04-05-14 09:04 AM
  18. ajst222's Avatar
    And to Blackberry getting into the tablet game again, who would buy it? Companies aren't going to scrap whatever tablet they've invested in just to see if BB produces a halfway functional tablet.

    The original Playbook was so freaking awful when it launched it was embarrassing. I purchased 3 at launch only to sell them because the OS was so bad. I read Kevin's review of the Playbook recently. I can't believe I bought it. He basically said it was no where close to being ready to launch and to pass on it, but I bought it anyway because I got caught up in the hype of "the first professional tablet." It was a joke and BB should be ashamed they ever released it in its original form. I don't know many people that would risk purchasing a tablet again from them, no matter what promises came with it.
    I bought the PlayBook at launch because I waited so long for it. Paid full price :/. The term "buyer's remorse" on Wikipedia should have a picture of the PlayBook on it. As you said. BlackBerry should really have been ashamed and embarrassed to release a device in that condition.

    Photo a Day: C002B5A07, my amateur photography Channel
    04-05-14 09:09 AM
  19. ajst222's Avatar
    What I think might be a better solution (assuming BlackBerry sells some phones) is create a Bridge app for Android, iOS, and Windows. That way those with BlackBerry phones can have a tablet that plays well with their phones.

    Photo a Day: C002B5A07, my amateur photography Channel
    04-05-14 09:10 AM
  20. sinsin07's Avatar
    So then why not the Surface 2? Runs Windows 8.1 RT, a tablet OS, and is not full Windows.

    Photo a Day: C002B5A07, my amateur photography Channel
    Does it have a registry?
    Is it susceptible to the same kind of virus threats as the Surface Pro 2?

    This pretty much sums up Enterprise view on Surface RT (Restricted Technology LOL) 2:
    "And that matters because when Microsoft released Windows 8 it also launched Windows RT: the version of Windows that runs on ARM devices such as iPad-like tablets with smartphone-like all-day battery life. The thought of being able to run Windows on a thin-and-light touchscreen tablet seems compelling in the abstract. Windows in your pocket.
    Unfortunately the reality doesn't live up to the concept. Windows RT devices such as the original Surface RT are hobbled by two major problems: they offer only half the experience of full Windows, and it's the worst half. And because that means you don't have the desktop you can't run traditional third-party software. Windows RT is only the unloved Modern UI, which means the only software you can install has to be found in the Windows App Store. Microsoft does, to its credit, include a version of Office with all RT devices, but the Windows App Store is a moribund place and so the version of Windows on tablets such as the Surface 2 is a pale imitation of full Windows.
    (The only way you can access your RT PC's file structure is to boot up the Office apps. This - weirdly - enables a pretend 'Desktop' environment which exists only to fun Office apps. From here you can find out where things are stored and how much storage you have to play with. Otherwise you are in Fisher Price land: very simple to use, but limited.)
    None of which makes Windows RT devices bad devices, but you have to question the need for them in a world in which iPad and Android tablets can offer similar functionality and performance with much better third-party support. And if you want a proper Windows 8 tablet you can always opt for Microsoft's own excellent Surface Pro 2 - a little heavier and bulkier, without the same battery life as an RT tablet, but a truly portable device that offers true power PC performance and software support.
    Surface 2 review - Microsoft's latest RT tablet a stylish performer... but what's the point?"


    Exactly.
    Surface 2?
    What is the point.

    Another tidbit:
    Microsoft Technet: What antivirus software should I use on a Surface unit?
    04-05-14 09:14 AM
  21. trueberrian's Avatar
    After reading this thread I think that Blackberry is more or less screwed. I never thought I would say that but I feel that way now. I own a z10 and will buy blackberry over any other phone at this point. However, the catch-22 the company is in is really bad. They do need to be a player in the tablet market but they simply can't at this point. They can barely survive as is and taking this risk with such a high probability of failure will kill the company. The PlayBook fiasco was terrible for them and may have been one of the final nails in the coffin if JC can't turn this around. The company needs to focus on smartphones and becoming relevant again. Unfortunately they have to let the tablet market go. BlackBerry needs to invent again. I feel the only way for BlackBerry to get back on top is to do something that is revolutionary. I don't know what that product could be, but I hope they can figure it out.

    Posted via CB10
    Troy Tiscareno likes this.
    04-05-14 09:21 AM
  22. ajst222's Avatar
    Does it have a registry?
    Is it susceptible to the same kind of virus threats as the Surface Pro 2?

    This pretty much sums up Enterprise view on Surface RT (Restricted Technology LOL) 2:
    "And that matters because when Microsoft released Windows 8 it also launched Windows RT: the version of Windows that runs on ARM devices such as iPad-like tablets with smartphone-like all-day battery life. The thought of being able to run Windows on a thin-and-light touchscreen tablet seems compelling in the abstract. Windows in your pocket.
    Unfortunately the reality doesn't live up to the concept. Windows RT devices such as the original Surface RT are hobbled by two major problems: they offer only half the experience of full Windows, and it's the worst half. And because that means you don't have the desktop you can't run traditional third-party software. Windows RT is only the unloved Modern UI, which means the only software you can install has to be found in the Windows App Store. Microsoft does, to its credit, include a version of Office with all RT devices, but the Windows App Store is a moribund place and so the version of Windows on tablets such as the Surface 2 is a pale imitation of full Windows.
    (The only way you can access your RT PC's file structure is to boot up the Office apps. This - weirdly - enables a pretend 'Desktop' environment which exists only to fun Office apps. From here you can find out where things are stored and how much storage you have to play with. Otherwise you are in Fisher Price land: very simple to use, but limited.)
    None of which makes Windows RT devices bad devices, but you have to question the need for them in a world in which iPad and Android tablets can offer similar functionality and performance with much better third-party support. And if you want a proper Windows 8 tablet you can always opt for Microsoft's own excellent Surface Pro 2 - a little heavier and bulkier, without the same battery life as an RT tablet, but a truly portable device that offers true power PC performance and software support.
    Surface 2 review - Microsoft's latest RT tablet a stylish performer... but what's the point?"


    Exactly.
    Surface 2?
    What is the point.

    Another tidbit:
    Microsoft Technet: What antivirus software should I use on a Surface unit?
    You just did what I absolutely HATE the most when talking about RT or the Surface: it can't run desktop apps which is a huge drawback. Do you criticize the ipad for not running OS X desktop apps? No. THEY'RE TABLETS! RT is a tablet OS. It's not supposed to. Granted, Microsoft didn't do the best job when marketing RT so I can understand how some consumers would be confused but it just bothers me.

    But because it doesn't run desktop apps (like any other tablet) it isn't susceptible to many viruses (like any other tablet).

    Photo a Day: C002B5A07, my amateur photography Channel
    04-05-14 09:35 AM
  23. sinsin07's Avatar
    You just did what I absolutely HATE the most when talking about RT or the Surface: it can't run desktop apps which is a huge drawback. Do you criticize the ipad for not running OS X desktop apps? No. THEY'RE TABLETS! RT is a tablet OS. It's not supposed to. Granted, Microsoft didn't do the best job when marketing RT so I can understand how some consumers would be confused but it just bothers me.



    But because it doesn't run desktop apps (like any other tablet) it isn't susceptible to many viruses (like any other tablet).

    Photo a Day: C002B5A07, my amateur photography Channel
    You got the wrong takeaway from the quoted text.

    As you state, its a tablet OS.

    Therein lies one of its problems, it's app store.

    It's Windows, but not full Windows, it can't use all of the apps available to Surface Pro/Pro2.

    Add to that the other issue, it's still a version of Windows with the baggage that brings.

    Moreover, wasn't your original proposal a replacement for a laptop?

    Enterprise is not really looking for a crippled version of Windows.

    Google Windows 8 adoption rate.
    Enterprise doesn't appear to banging down the doors to update, granted they don't like change. Why would they want to support another version of Windows? Some Enterprises are still trying to get rid of Windows XP.
    04-05-14 09:54 AM
  24. ajst222's Avatar
    You got the wrong takeaway from the quoted text.

    As you state, its a tablet OS.

    Therein lies one of its problems, it's app store.

    It's Windows, but not full Windows, it can't use all of the apps available to Surface Pro/Pro2.

    Add to that the other issue, it's still a version of Windows with the baggage that brings.

    Moreover, wasn't your original proposal a replacement for a laptop?

    Enterprise is not really looking for a crippled version of Windows.

    Google Windows 8 adoption rate.
    Enterprise doesn't appear to banging down the doors to update, granted they don't like change. Why would they want to support another version of Windows? Some Enterprises are still trying to get rid of Windows XP.
    My original proposal? No, I just saw someone talking about a Surface Pro 2 and jumped in. It's about a good companion for a BlackBerry phone. The Surface RT/Surface 2 can run all of the apps in the Windows Store that the Surface Pro/Surface Pro 2 can run if that's what you're trying to say. If you were talking about desktop apps then I already addressed that. But you say they would not want a "crippled" version of Windows. What about iOS or Android? They are probably both more crippled than RT.
    04-05-14 10:00 AM
  25. DenverRalphy's Avatar
    My original proposal? No, I just saw someone talking about a Surface Pro 2 and jumped in. It's about a good companion for a BlackBerry phone. The Surface RT/Surface 2 can run all of the apps in the Windows Store that the Surface Pro/Surface Pro 2 can run if that's what you're trying to say. If you were talking about desktop apps then I already addressed that. But you say they would not want a "crippled" version of Windows. What about iOS or Android? They are probably both more crippled than RT.
    With iOS or Android, you have access to a much more robust selection of apps than you'd get with RT. So there wouldn't be much of a sting. With RT, you're limited to the Windows Store, which to be quite frank, is severely limited. If there wasn't an option to run desktop apps, I probably wouldn't touch a Windows tablet until their store improved drastically.

    Sent from my SCH-I545 using Tapatalk
    04-05-14 10:53 AM
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