- amazinglygracelessRetired ModI'm not following you. The adult is not the one in possession or control of the teens
phone so what exactly would be they basis for charging him with possession of
child pornography?08-03-12 08:34 AMLike 3 - Interesting results from teen sexting survey. Got me thinking about privacy again and why the security of a mobile phone seriously matters. When I think of an adult riding in a car with a teenager and what could happen if the police stopped them. Since police can search your phone anytime they want. Imagine the cop grabs the teen's phone, scans it and finds a naked picture of a minor. The adult could, and I have no doubt would be charged with possession of child pornography. Really wants me to insist everyone in the car have a locked BlackBerry.
Go ahead tell me a politically ambitious prosecutor would not bring such a case. Tell me you have nothing to hide on your iPhone or Android so it doesn't matter if the cops take an image of it. Privacy, everyone's privacy, matters to all of us.
(The Seventh Circuit opinion is a good read because it discusses various kinds of technological porn like remote wiping and using the phone to remotely turn on one's webcam at home.)
In any event, you are confusing the facts you laid out with case law that allows someone in a car to found guilty of constructive possession of controlled substances if they know of the presence of the substances, are able to exercise dominion and control over them, and know of their illicit nature. So it wouldn't even be applicable here.08-03-12 09:17 AMLike 3 - kbz1960Doesn't MatterMaybe because the phone is in the adults name and in the adults car. I know someone who arrested for illegal drugs because a passenger had some and stashed them under a seat. When the cop found it he started arresting the driver, when the person who owned them spoke up and said it was his the cop said in his car therefore in his possession.08-03-12 09:30 AMLike 0
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- amazinglygracelessRetired ModIf the police stopped you for a traffic violation and had an idea you were TXTting, and therefore not paying attention, they could search the phone's TXTs to see if you were TXTting at the time of the violation.
The whole situation can be avoided if they can't access your phone. That is an excellent reason to have a phone the phone image reading devices can't access.
the device itself, they can easily get it from the carrier.08-03-12 10:11 AMLike 0 - Maybe because the phone is in the adults name and in the adults car. I know someone who arrested for illegal drugs because a passenger had some and stashed them under a seat. When the cop found it he started arresting the driver, when the person who owned them spoke up and said it was his the cop said in his car therefore in his possession.
Even if the adult in the car were the driver, the cellphone in the teen's pocket is another thing altogether. Cops aren't going to (and can't) go looking through the entire cellphone for sexting pics. The prosecution would still have to prove the adult knew there were pictures of child porn in the car, knew the pictures were illegal, and exercised dominion and control over the pictures. The knowledge element is unlikely -- "Hey, Dad, look at this picture of my johnson I sent to Mary Lou!" -- and the control element is questionable unless the prosecution could prove the adult had access to the phone (presumably with the porn on it).08-03-12 10:19 AMLike 0 - The way that I understand it, the cops use cellebrite to use your phone's emid to ping the cellphone tower to see if you were texting or making a phone call while you were driving. That's all. It was explained in another thread here, and I've done extensive searches on the internet for information as to what cops are looking for if they ask for your phone, and from what I can gather, whether your phone is locked or encrypted does not matter as they only ping the tower to see if you were texting. They are not looking at your pictures.08-03-12 11:02 AMLike 0
- Tre LawrenceBetween RealitiesSo, if one wants to dabble in illicit imagery and driving practices, the platform of choice is almost clear.pantlesspenguin and reeneebob like this.08-03-12 12:30 PMLike 2
- Tre LawrenceBetween Realities
If someone can show me a case of law enforcement illegally procuring data from a law-abiding citizen's phone, I am all ears.
My point is that advertising BBs as the "official device for teen sexting privacy" is a flawed premise.amazinglygraceless likes this.08-03-12 12:49 PMLike 1 - kbz1960Doesn't MatterAll I'll say is that if one is doing stuff that goes against local laws, having a Blackberry really won't save him/her.
If someone can show me a case of law enforcement illegally procuring data from a law-abiding citizen's phone, I am all ears.
My point is that advertising BBs as the "official device for teen sexting privacy" is a flawed premise.08-03-12 12:57 PMLike 0 - ...Really wants me to insist everyone in the car have a locked BlackBerry.
Go ahead tell me a politically ambitious prosecutor would not bring such a case. Tell me you have nothing to hide on your iPhone or Android so it doesn't matter if the cops take an image of it. Privacy, everyone's privacy, matters to all of us.08-03-12 01:00 PMLike 0 - The cell phone imaging equipment the police have can grab the image of iPhone and Android even if they are locked. That is not true with BlackBerry. A locked BlackBerry is almost impossible to image or access.
The point is, you could be the victim of a prosecution even if you are totally innocent simply because someone near you has a phone with weak security. If you think the US Constitution will protect you, I'm afraid you are living in an America that no longer exists. Yes, maybe the Supreme Court of the US will overturn your conviction about 10 years after you are convicted. In the meantime you are bankrupt and your life is ruined. Go on with your insecure phones. You have nothing to worry about.While there have been many reports in the media of teens being arrested and prosecuted for this behavior there have not been reports of parents incurring punishment.08-03-12 01:41 PMLike 0 - The cell phone imaging equipment the police have can grab the image of iPhone and Android even if they are locked. That is not true with BlackBerry. A locked BlackBerry is almost impossible to image or access.
The point is, you could be the victim of a prosecution even if you are totally innocent simply because someone near you has a phone with weak security. If you think the US Constitution will protect you, I'm afraid you are living in an America that no longer exists. Yes, maybe the Supreme Court of the US will overturn your conviction about 10 years after you are convicted. In the meantime you are bankrupt and your life is ruined. Go on with your insecure phones. You have nothing to worry about.
You can find more details here:
http://copgeek018.wordpress.com/
A cop pulling you over for a traffic stop is mostly interested in whether or not you were texting while driving, and regardless of the phone you have (including BBs) they can use a cellebrite to ping the tower.
Edit:
Crud. They've added a password requirement to access the information in my link. I'll try to find a new one.Last edited by hootyhoo; 08-03-12 at 02:26 PM.
Laura Knotek likes this.08-03-12 01:43 PMLike 1 - amazinglygracelessRetired ModThe cell phone imaging equipment the police have can grab the image of iPhone and Android even if they are locked. That is not true with BlackBerry. A locked BlackBerry is almost impossible to image or access.
The point is, you could be the victim of a prosecution even if you are totally innocent simply because someone near you has a phone with weak security. If you think the US Constitution will protect you, I'm afraid you are living in an America that no longer exists. Yes, maybe the Supreme Court of the US will overturn your conviction about 10 years after you are convicted. In the meantime you are bankrupt and your life is ruined. Go on with your insecure phones. You have nothing to worry about.
The police need probable cause, if that's what you mean by "suspicion." And mere proximity to drugs -- simply being a passenger in the same car -- is not enough for someone to be found guilty of possession. The prosecution has to be able to prove the three elements I set out above, knowledge of the presence of drugs in the car, knowledge of their illegality, and -- most critically -- the ability to exercise "dominion and control" over the drugs. So a driver could be found guilty because he or she exercises control over the car.
Even if the adult in the car were the driver, the cellphone in the teen's pocket is another thing altogether. Cops aren't going to (and can't) go looking through the entire cellphone for sexting pics. The prosecution would still have to prove the adult knew there were pictures of child porn in the car, knew the pictures were illegal, and exercised dominion and control over the pictures. The knowledge element is unlikely -- "Hey, Dad, look at this picture of my johnson I sent to Mary Lou!" -- and the control element is questionable unless the prosecution could prove the adult had access to the phone (presumably with the porn on it).Laura Knotek likes this.08-03-12 01:44 PMLike 1 - Tre LawrenceBetween RealitiesBlackBerry: the only device that protects your constitutional freedoms (until LE subpoenas your carrier records).08-03-12 01:56 PMLike 0
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Are you sure you're not making this up? If anyone else has heard of such equipment, I would like to hear about it. Some links to where such equipment might be obtained would also be appreciated.08-03-12 02:49 PMLike 0 - I have never heard of this type of equipment, let alone LE having it as standard issue in patrol cars. How does it even work?
Are you sure you're not making this up? If anyone else has heard of such equipment, I would like to hear about it. Some links to where such equipment might be obtained would also be appreciated.
Cellebrite - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia08-03-12 03:41 PMLike 0 -
The Cellebrite tool is for data extraction, basically, a memory extractor. For the cops to use this method, they would have to have physical access to your phone, which in most cases, would require at the bare minimum probably cause that a crime was committed with your phone.
And AFAIK, the Cellebrite can also extract data from Blackberries, and just about anything else since it's basically a memory extractor.08-03-12 04:19 PMLike 0 -
A good forensic tool will bypass the passcode and extract all user data from most popular Android devices. The newer portable Cellebrite UFED units now bypass the passcode on 59 different Android phones.
No tool or software will bypass the password on a locked BlackBerry, and researchers have still not figured out a way to attack its passcode. Skilled investigators can obtain a raw memory dump with specialized equipment however, so encrypt your data if you wish it to remain confidential.08-03-12 08:15 PMLike 0
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