[toddpart]

Sorry...reposting because the mod moved my original to BB10 forum because I put BB10 in the title. But my thoughts are not JUST about BB10... To the mod, you can close the other thread you moved so that there are not duplicates.

As long time supporter of Palm and the webOS I always found myself upset towards the end when another manufacturer introduced a 'new' feature and got lots of external media credit for said feature....when all of us in webOS world new we had had such a feature first. The card metaphor for multi-tasking, Synergy, ummm GESTURES.

This week I was reading about MS SmartGlass and saw a video demonstration and all the buzz in the media about SmartGlass, its features, and its possibilities. And all the time I could only think about one thing...Blackberry Bridge! Watching the MS product manager use a Lumia 900 and open web pages and apps from it ONTO his tablet or XBox. Using the Lumia 900 as a remote control for the UI on the Xbox connected to his TV. This type of functionality was there for RIM 18 months ago with Bridge (arguably webOS debuted it with TouchToShare...but I want cry about that anymore either) and now they will get NO credit for the innovation. It will be seen as "oh yeah...that's just like SmartGlass."

I just wonder if I'm watching the same movie again as all the great things that make up the BB experience between devices are replicated elsewhere and BB goes off into the sunset....just as it all happened to webOS. I hope not. At least the management team at RIM seems to be a bit more in line with their strategy than HP was...so I have hope.

Thoughts?

[dbmalloy]

OS in it's nature have two main components... First....The underlying OS which I think QNX blows the major players away with it's reputation for being rock solid and efficent........

The second is User Interface which can be somewhat murky..... In true essence everything goes back to the origonal Windows and Mac interface... the argument cam be made that everyting sprung from that platform.... Windows and icons beng main underpinnings of all current OS..... from there you get into semanitics if how to use said UI.... It becomes a frutless exercise to point out how other OS "borrows" from one another.... it is simply how the current "innovation" works.... To make an issue that others are using what you created starts sounding like sour grapes....

Innovation is only as good as the last one you created....

[cgk]

The funny thing is - all of the discussions that people are having here are pretty much exact copies of the discussions that were had over at WebOSnation during and after the launch of WebOS - the main ones were:

* Nobody needs that many apps
* Why do people want skype/netflix?
* why apps are over-rated and HMTL5 is more important
* Our tablet/phone will beat the iphone because it supports flash
* People will flock to the platform because of 'true' multi-tasking
* People will flock to the platform because it's not android/ios
* Having to discount the tablet device is really a secret marketing plan
* Samsung/sony/amazon are planning to buy the company

[toddpart]

Very good point. I guess I was thinking about it more from Product Marketing point of view and less from an engineering/PM perspective.

Without a perception of being innovative and something 'new and shiny' gaining market share and momentum cane very difficult in this segment...even with the best intentions.

[toddpart]

The funny thing is - all of the discussions that people are having here are pretty much exact copies of the discussions that were had over at WebOSnation during and after the launch of WebOS - the main ones were:

* Nobody needs that many apps
* Why do people want skype/netflix?
* why apps are over-rated and HMTL5 is more important
* Our tablet/phone will beat the iphone because it supports flash
* People will flock to the platform because of 'true' multi-tasking
* People will flock to the platform because it's not android/ios
* Having to discount the tablet device is really a secret marketing plan
* Samsung/sony/amazon are planning to buy the company

That's exactly what I'm talking about...I couldn't agree more. I'm really hoping for a comeback for RIM because BB10 looks like everything I loved about webOS and then some. I just hope it's not to late. I've also gone and bought a Lumia 900 to hedge my bets. Today, the pairing of my BB phone and Playbook is second to none, bit WP7 and Win8 RT looks to have potential too. Having a phone and tablet that work together is a tremendous productivity suite.

[cgk]

I should point out, I'm not saying that in itself means that BB10 will not be a success simply that a lot of the arguments made for why it *should* be a success are identical to those made for WebOS.

[cgk]

Very good point. I guess I was thinking about it more from Product Marketing point of view and less from an engineering/PM perspective.

Without a perception of being innovative and something 'new and shiny' gaining market share and momentum cane very difficult in this segment...even with the best intentions.

Plus you need to be willing to plunk down billions of dollars over multiple years - which is what HP were unwilling to do and might be problematical for RIM as a stand-alone company.

[sleepngbear]

The funny thing is - all of the discussions that people are having here are pretty much exact copies of the discussions that were had over at WebOSnation during and after the launch of WebOS - the main ones were:

* Nobody needs that many apps
* Why do people want skype/netflix?
* why apps are over-rated and HMTL5 is more important
* Our tablet/phone will beat the iphone because it supports flash
* People will flock to the platform because of 'true' multi-tasking
* People will flock to the platform because it's not android/ios
* Having to discount the tablet device is really a secret marketing plan
* Samsung/sony/amazon are planning to buy the company

* RIM has acknowledged that people do want that many apps and are currently courting developers to address it. Not much discussion left there.
* jury is still out on whether or not Skype and/or Netflix will make it to the new platform. Lots of discussion about it, but I think most people agree that it will help a lot if BB10 has it, and it will hurt a lot if it doesn't.
* see the first point.
* I haven't seen anyone using the Flash argument for BB10. It was beaten to death about the PlayBook, but I think we're over that now.
* True multitasking is still a benefit; most users just don't understand the difference.
* not android/iOS is also an advantage in my opinion (especially not android); whether people will flock to it remains to be seen, though I really haven't seen my heart discussion on the subject other than the market needing more than two platform options.
* I think two posters here actually believed discounting the PB was part of a plan, and they were quickly fragged by even some of their own troops.
* it's the idiots in the media spewing the buy-out nonsense; as far as I can tell, most here aren't having any of it.

A few commonalities, but lots of key differences.

[machus]

There are a number of differences between RIM and PALM that seem to be overlooked:

1 - RIM is in a much better financial position than PALM was.

2- RIM has a much larger installed user base than PALM ever did.

3- RIM has a core of large corporate / government clients that are sticky i.e. they will take longer to move away from Blackberry than the consumer market because RIM still has the best security solution which is their number one priority.

4- IN the end HP killed WebOS because it was not their core business. Blackberry is RIM's core business....for now.