1. Noneleft's Avatar
    There are many threads on this and other forums about people struggling to get their wifi working - but no one has yet come up with a definitive answer and we just give up. The problem generally is:
    1. We get a white dash instead of a green tick next to our wifi setting
    2. The blackberry shows as being connected to the local wifi network in the diagnostic screens, even having an ip address and Mac address allocated.
    3. The wireless router set up screen also lists the blackberry as being on the network along with any other computers, also with ip address and mac address allocated.

    BUT despite this, the blackberry still cannot access the internet using the wifi. And other computers on the same network cannot see the blackberry even though it is there and the router sees it. Hotspot browser is selected in both menus, but the blackberry can only access the web using the mobile network, with wifi it just fails to load web pages. Every conceivable advice on these forums has been followed but still no solution works.

    It seems that it would be most helpful if we could get a definitive answer to one particular part of the puzzle: Is wifi on a blackberry completely independent from carrier/BIS setup? Logically you would assume so, as with other non-BB devices, plus some people here can use wifi without even having a sim card installed. Still others can use wifi on a PAYG sim with no data plan. My carrier (O2 UK) tell me their BIS setup has no influence whatsoever over my local wifi problem, that it must be my handset or router settings, and yet other people on here say they got their wifi working after calling their carrier to reset their BIS settings (Relay switch?).

    Is there anyone reading with Blackberry/BIS expertise who can put this question to bed and tell us if wifi should work regardless of carrier/BIS set up, or might the answer to this problem be to persuade our carriers to change our BIS settings to enable our handset wifi? It would help us to diagnose if our handsets are faulty, if our carriers are to blame, or if we should keep fiddling with our settings.

    Please advise - getting desperate! Many thanks.
    02-09-10 07:29 AM
  2. PDM's Avatar
    Yes, it is independent.

    Did you switch your BB Browser to "Hotspot Browser"?
    i.e. Browser > Options > Browser Configuration > Browser > Hotspot Browser

    The WiFi symbol only goes bright white IF you have BIS Services over WiFi and hence also the little green tick.

    The Relay Switch fiasco was Orange (as they offer UMA and BIS over WiFi).
    02-09-10 07:57 AM
  3. Noneleft's Avatar
    Thanks for reply, yes I have switched to Hotspot browser in browser config menu and also the other menu. I have BIS through O2 unlimited blackberry bolt on, and can get web using mobile connection, but wifi icon always stays grey and never get the green tick in setup screen - does this imply O2/BIS problem then? No internet access possible using wifi, and cannot see blackberry on the wifi network from other home computers on network. I know my router is working as other computers operate.

    Thanks for info re. Relay switch / Orange, this suggests not relevent for me on O2 then.

    It's just very bizare that it connects to the wifi network and registers on the router with mac and ip addresses, but still doesn't work. To me implies some sort of carrier/BIS based blocking or faulty handset?

    Have tried rebooting router, batt pulled blackberry and everything else I read from other threads.

    Do you happen to know if/what I need in the APN settings? Or any other items I may have overlooked?
    02-09-10 10:24 AM
  4. mofoahh's Avatar
    you dont have adjust apn settings for wifi router i berlieve.
    02-09-10 10:26 AM
  5. Noneleft's Avatar
    Ok so at the moment they are unpopulated/unchecked.

    Curious to understand why wifi icon stays grey and dash instead of green tick since many posts say this indicates BIS is not connected via wifi.

    At the risk of exposing my stupidity, could all this all be caused because I have not yet created my BIS blackberry email account on the O2 BIS website?
    Still doesn't explain why I can't use the handset for local wifi network though, or general internet browsing over wifi.
    02-09-10 10:37 AM
  6. mofoahh's Avatar
    yes try creating your BIS blackberry and then go to your advance options->host routing tables->register device. do it a few times. Then do a battery pull and then plug the battery back in and hopefully all your service books will be there and it will hopefully sort out this wifi problem for you.
    02-09-10 10:41 AM
  7. Reed McLay's Avatar
    Wifi is included in several BlackBerry models to support Unlicensed Mobile Access (UMA), which provides a second pathway for data.

    UMA requires carrier support, not all carriers are able to support it at this time. According to the information I have, O2 does not support UMA despite the fact they offer several Wifi equipped models.

    The Green check mark will only appear when your have both BIS and UMA active.

    In your case, you should be able to use Wifi with your Hotspot Browser, only.

    You mentioned not being able to access the BlackBerry or any of your network resouces through Wifi.... yea, that's right.

    could all this all be caused because I have not yet created my BIS blackberry email account on the O2 BIS website?
    I would think that could explain part of your problem. In addition to Email, Messenger and nearly all third party software, BIS is required for your Internet Browser to work correctly.

    02-09-10 10:47 AM
  8. Noneleft's Avatar
    mofoahh: Will try creating BIS account as you advise and see what happens. I have already registered from host routing tables screen but perhaps ineffective until BIS account created?

    Reed McLay: Thanks for info re UMA and carriers, not available with O2. So even if BIS account created, because O2 have no UMA I will never see a green tick or white logo? Fortunately my talk allowance with O2 is generous enough not to need free internet calls, but my real need is to participate fully on local network using a wifi router, doing hotspot browsing, file sharing between other networked computers etc.

    Need to get home and set up the BIS blackberry account - fingers crossed hopefully I can come back here later and report some progress.

    Thanks for all your replies.
    02-09-10 11:18 AM
  9. Noneleft's Avatar
    Just read your post again - are you saying I will only ever be able to use wifi for hotspot browsing - no file and resource sharing on the local wifi network? That would be a real disappointment :-(

    With the wifi browsing, would it be true to say then that this is not really independent of BIS/carrier blocking, since I do need to have created a BIS account to unlock use of the hotspot browser by the looks of things. I'm confused then how others on this forum are using wifi browsing without even having a blackberry data plan on their sim card, let alone creating a BIS account
    02-09-10 11:28 AM
  10. fidel88's Avatar
    without the blackberry internet service plan i think you cud use the wifi.. just setup the wifi network properly..
    02-09-10 12:06 PM
  11. jattboyzes2000's Avatar
    im having the same problem with my BB.

    some info: i have a BB 9700
    i have t mobile service...
    i setup the wifi correctly because my bb has a ip and everything.
    i logged into my college's wifi and the bb browser worked fine, while i had no sim card in there.
    but at home it doesnt work at all. no matter what i do.

    so its not that somehow the bb service is blocking it from accessing the net, theres some sort of another issue going on with this.. and its pissing me off really bad...
    02-10-10 08:35 PM
  12. Noneleft's Avatar
    I can now report that I am set up with bis email account - but still no home wifi working. I too have ip and mac address, PSK security successful etc. One thing I noticed is that in wifi diagnostics, lower down under 'Blackberry Infrastructure' I get a red x next to Connecting: instead of a dash or tick' even though I am connected to my wifi router and my router is on the internet (which i prove from other computers on the same network).

    So I still can't be convinced one way or the other if this is a BIS/mobile network setting on my account, or a local wifi/handset/config problem at my end.

    Any advice anyone?
    02-11-10 05:11 AM
  13. Noneleft's Avatar
    Those people who can get wifi working - are you able to file share and map network drives from your computers to the blackberry, or does the wifi only allow you to use your web browser without a mobile signal? Trying to understand what it is that I am not able to do. If it's just web access then I won't bother wasting any more hours persuing it.
    02-11-10 06:31 AM
  14. tschlaef's Avatar
    So I still can't be convinced one way or the other if this is a BIS/mobile network setting on my account, or a local wifi/handset/config problem at my end.

    Any advice anyone?
    My advice, based on my experience, is talk to your carrier. I have had similar problems with my wifi, and after extensive troubleshooting, have concluded that the problems I'm having relate to the service books on my phone, which are controlled by at&t. Unfortunately, at&t feels my phone is working as designed.

    As to your original question, I don't think there is a definitive answer. My experience is that I cannot use wifi without a BIS connection; even with the hotspot browser. This is contrary to how the hotspot browser is supposed to work (direct connection to the Internet), but it is how it works for me. There are, however, plenty of posts from at&t users whose wifi works fine, even some who don't have data plans and therefore no BIS connection. There seem to be similar diverse wifi experiences with other carriers, including O2.

    As much as I like things to be black and white this particular issue seems to be gray. I'm still trying to get my wifi working reliably, but I've also resigned myself to the possibility that that might not ever happen.
    02-11-10 07:25 AM
  15. Noneleft's Avatar
    Thanks tschlaef, I suppose it's reassuring to know I'm not the only person with this problem, but like you I would like these things to be black and white. If my blackberry can log onto my home wifi network (which it can) then why can't the hotspot browser work, since my other computers use the same wifi router to access the web without needing a 3g connection. something is wrong here and the only variable I have no visibility or control of is whatever is happening at the carrier/bis end of things. I conclude it must be with them. I read another thread in the 9700 forum where swapping sim cards with someone else whose wifi worked fixed the handset temporarily, until the original sim card was reinserted !
    02-11-10 08:52 AM
  16. PDM's Avatar
    Those people who can get wifi working - are you able to file share and map network drives from your computers to the blackberry, or does the wifi only allow you to use your web browser without a mobile signal? it's just web access then I won't bother wasting any more hours persuing it.
    WiFi will not allow you to map network drives to your BB. You would require additional protocols in order to be able to do this... I can transfer files over WiFi using a browser to other PCs/Notebooks using a 3rd party app (WifiFileTransfer from Chocolate Chunk).

    Basically, WiFi (+Hotspot Browser or 3rd Party Browser) allows you to surf without the mobile network.

    You mentioned WiFi diagnostics earlier too. Your WiFi symbol will ONLY go bright white IF your carrier has enabled BIS over WiFi (ontop of BIS over mobile network). Otherwise, it remains grey (with a connecting error to BB Infrastructure) - you can nevertheless surf without having to go over RIMs infastructure.

    Have you tried connecting over WiFi to a different wireless access point? To see if the problem is your router?
    02-11-10 09:31 AM
  17. jattboyzes2000's Avatar
    hey.. i was having the same issue as you (OP) and i was going through everything... i finally found out what was wrong with my setup and it might be the same thing for you. my wifi was locked with a WPA key... so i took off the key and tried to use the net through my BB and it worked. then i locked it back with WPA2 key and it still worked... try that and hopefully you'll be on your way to enjoying the device...
    02-11-10 09:58 PM
  18. Noneleft's Avatar
    PDM - thanks, useful to know what I should be able to do if it were working properly. Also, to know that I might still get a bis infrastructure connection failure in wifi diagnostics, and this shouldn't stop the hotspot browser from working. All these snippets of info gradually accumulate to eliminate all the red herrings.
    I have not yet tried another wireless router/network (assume this is the same as 'wireless access point'?. Planning to do that this afternoon at an O2 shop where they have a network and have agreed to see if they can help me.

    Jattboyzes - Before you got yours working, what did you see? Did it let you connect to the wifi router and give you an ip address, or did it prevent you from connecting due to the key being rejected? I ask because although I have a Pre shared key set up, the BB does allow me to enter the key successfully and tells me I am now connected with wifi network name displayed at top of home screen - but still no web access.
    I will try as you suggest when I get home anyway and see what gives - thanks.
    02-12-10 06:05 AM
  19. jattboyzes2000's Avatar
    i had the same exact issue as you... just unlock the wifi and relock it with a WPA2 key
    02-12-10 10:43 PM
  20. Noneleft's Avatar
    Thank you Jattboyzes2000. If I didn't have a laptop on my lap I would now be dancing. Disabled security key on the router, the BB connected and also gets out onto web using only wifi. Re-enabled security on the router, reentered security key on the BB and retained ability to get web using wifi only. It has stopped working again, but it worked briefly and is a big step forwards.
    I don't understand it worked, it's counter intuitive to me but it works. Like Tschlaef I was becoming convinced it was a service book or carrier/bis problem. Went into O2 shop yesterday afternoon and I was able to use their Cloud hotspot zone (at least get into the toll login in screen) but on return home could still not use home network as I suspected. The shop people tried to tell me service books have no influence on wifi, even when I showed him the wifi service books he still tried to deny it! But Jattboyzes knew where the answer lay, nice one pal.

    Tschlaef - if you are reading this I urge you to try it. This worked for me and you have been stuck on the same problem - disable your wifi security key, then use your BB to get onto the web, then re enable security again -Bingo.

    For info, I did get the correct green tick for for blackberry infrastructure in wifi diagnostics, and I think also for the wifi set up screen too.

    Thanks again Jattboyzes. Forums finally come good :-) Now to make this a permanent solution....
    02-13-10 03:49 AM
  21. tschlaef's Avatar
    Now to make this a permanent solution....
    Therein lies the rub for me. I think I may have given you the wrong idea about the nature of my wifi problem. My wifi works at home and elsewhere, just not consistently or reliably.

    I'm glad you've made progress and hope that your problem is close to solved but I don't think mine is. Nevertheless I'll keep plugging away at it.

    I won't post my whole troubleshooting procedure here as it's very lengthy and is already posted in bits and pieces all over this website and others. I'll just say, though, one of the very first things I did was turn off my wpa2 security and run on an open system--no change. I've run open, wep, wpa, wpa2; doesn't make any difference.

    My current investigation involves looking at the wifi diagnostics screen when I'm connected at an at&t hotspot and comparing that to the screen I get at home or at a non-at&t hotspot. This is of interest because the one thing about my issue that has always been consistent is that wifi always works, and works well for me at at&t hotspots. Never had any problems at any at&t hotspot.

    Anyway, keep me apprised of how you're doing and I'll do the same.
    02-13-10 04:42 PM
  22. Noneleft's Avatar
    Latest and final update from me is that it seems my problem is solved. Jattesboyzes advice has pretty much fixed it for me. It's not totally reliable but no worse than my normal home internet connection. In fact posting this from my 9700 using the wifi. Sorry to hear you are still struggling. Will get back here if I do come across anything which might help. Thanks for all your assistance!

    Posted from my CrackBerry at wapforums.crackberry.com
    02-14-10 01:30 PM
  23. PD in T-DOT's Avatar
    OK I have a new one...can connect to a variety of networks that employ various secuity protocols. Not a problem.

    I was recently travelling to Singapore and wanted to use the free hotel wifi to connect and surf/download large attachments since the data charges are ridiculously expensive.

    Disabled radio, connected, could see the network name but the wifi symbol was greyed out. The network secuity was open. Checked diagnostics and saw the connection, IP address etc. The only issue was BES01 not connected / error. My BB is on a BES (enterprise). Called my IT and they have no wifi access restrictions on the account.

    Hot spot browser selected everywhere. Managed to get to the hotel login page and enter the password, but stuck after that point. (FYI could connect / surf via laptop - just not BB). My IT suggested its a router problem.


    Posted from my CrackBerry at wapforums.crackberry.com
    02-16-10 03:08 AM