1. jaconat's Avatar
    hi, had my 8520 for a couple of days now and have some wifi questions which I hope someone can answer. I have a Seimens SE 587 wireless router (through Tiscali UK - now Talk Talk) and I am sitting next to the router (so signal strength is not a problem). I am on an Orange 15/mth contract and do not have the Blackberry Internet Service option. So my questions...

    1. If I cycle the power on my router I can connect to the wifi through the bb & my wifi name appears in the top bar. No problems. However, for no obvious reason (time out? Event on the bb?) the connection gets dropped (I haven't moved the phone from next to the router). If I scan network for networks it finds my network but when I try to connect I get the error Failed to associate with the network and I am unable to connect. My son has an iPod touch and can connect/reconnect/stay connected all day without problems so I don't suspect it is the router. Any ideas how to fix this?

    2. Still sitting next to the router (and connected to my wifi) the phone is constantly displaying Searching for Network (I live in the sticks & have poor gprs signal strength). Occassionally I get one bar. Sometimes (again not worked out when) the phone will connect via UMA. It will stay like this for a while then will have the Searching for Network message again. UMA then may come back or it may go to gprs. Why is this? Half of the reason for buying the bb was for uma so without it it's a bit of a waste of time.

    My settings are,
    Options > Wifi Connections >
    - Wifi Selection Mode Automatic

    Manage Connections
    - Mobile Network (ticked): Orange
    - Wifi (ticked): ON (but does not show my network name)

    Manage Connections > Mobile Network OPtions
    - Data Services: On
    - Connection Preference: Wifi preferred
    - Mobile Network: Orange
    - Network Selection Mode: Automatic.

    Any help would be gratefully accepted as I am now getting quite frustrated and beginning to regret my choice of handset. Many thanks
    07-19-10 05:44 AM
  2. SaBu3011's Avatar
    I can help you with one thing: UMA is extremely temperamental. Like you, I live in a rural area with little signal strength so UMA is a must. It's great when it works! There was an outage on it yesterday for hours. Something we have to live with unfortunately. Orange need to sort their UMA out!

    Posted from my CrackBerry at wapforums.crackberry.com
    07-19-10 03:50 PM
  3. jaconat's Avatar
    Ok so that could explain the uma problems. Anyone any ideas about my connection problems?
    07-20-10 03:20 AM
  4. jaconat's Avatar
    Anyone?????????
    07-20-10 03:15 PM
  5. xo_ceri's Avatar
    same positon. apparently connected to the wifi however can't browse using it. any ideas anyone?
    07-20-10 03:55 PM
  6. Reed McLay's Avatar
    The first place to check is the built in Wifi diagnostics.

    Connections / Wifi Options. Menu / Wifi Diagnostics.

    The first section is for the Wifi network. If you have a good connection you will see two green check marks and a Successful connection status Message. If not, there will be a status message that will help pinpoint the failure.

    Once you have established a connection, scroll down to UMA where you should also see two green check marks and a Successful connection status message.

    If I cycle the power on my router I can connect to the wifi through the bb & my wifi name appears in the top bar. No problems. However, for no obvious reason (time out? Event on the bb?) the connection gets dropped ...
    This is unusual behaviour. Look for a status message when this happens.

    Sometimes (again not worked out when) the phone will connect via UMA. It will stay like this for a while then will have the Searching for Network message again. UMA then may come back or it may go to gprs. Why is this? Half of the reason for buying the bb was for uma so without it it's a bit of a waste of time.
    ...
    I am in exactly the same situation. At best, I may get 1 bar of signal from my carrier, more often, there will be no signal available.

    UMA is critical for me too. The good news is, once we get it working reliably, it does the job really well.

    One detail I would like to confirm, is your BlackBerry branded to your carrier, Orange UK? If so, it should have the correct provisioning to enable UMA.

    07-23-10 04:38 PM
  7. hoglite's Avatar
    I have a 8520 which I bought solely for UMA, it works well with my Sky basic router but I have noticed it drop out once or twice with 'call failed' on the screen.

    I put this down to either the cell signal competing with the WiFi signal which sends the phone into 'search' mode resulting in the temp failure - is there anyway to lock the phone to UMA/WiFi whilst in range?

    Thanks,

    David
    07-24-10 10:13 AM
  8. hoglite's Avatar
    I also came across this other review on my travels looking for a suitable UMA phone - could it be competing with data traffic on your router too?

    "Reviewed by David from England on 21st Jul 2010

    I have recently had this phone as an Orange upgrade because I liked the idea of the UMA technology (automatic call routing via a domestic broadband hub when cell recption is poor).

    Essentially, the service is not robust or reliable. Couple this to a five hour standby battery life on UMA and it simply isn't fit for purpose. As mentioned in previous reviews Orange UMA also stops you using standard Wi-Fi for data access.

    If you are buying this phone locked to Orange you are wasting your time. The basic phone is decent, and in its standard non-Orange form is probably OK
    Rating:


    Should you buy the LG GT505? Read our LG GT505 review plus LG GT505 reviews by users and find the best buy in the UK (Free LG GT505 / LG GT505 pay as you go - 3, O2, Orange, T-Mobile, Three, Vodafone)
    07-24-10 10:27 AM
  9. Reed McLay's Avatar
    Couple this to a five hour standby battery life on UMA and it simply isn't fit for purpose. ...
    That does not match my UMA experience at all. This particular review is for the LG GT505, not the BlackBerry.

    I start the day with a fully charged battery and it usually has 1/3 to 1/2 charge after a 16 hour day. There are days when I am using the phone a lot, that will drain my battery by mid day and require a recharge.

    There have been occasions when UMA will not go active, a fault at my carrier. On those days, I can discharge my battery quickly attempting to maintain a sub 1 bar connection.

    Here is the comparable BlackBerry 8520 review.

    Should you buy the BlackBerry 8520? Read our BlackBerry 8520 review plus BlackBerry 8520 reviews by users and find the best buy in the UK (BlackBerry 8520 Black / BlackBerry 8520 White / BlackBerry 8520 Violet - 3, O2, Orange, T-Mobile, Three, Vodafo

    Reviewed by Sabina from England on 9th May 2010
    I loveee it soo much, it is actually the best phone that I've ever had! It's my first blackberry and I love it! I've only had it for a week now and it is soo much fun just playing with it, you can never get bored! I would recommend this phone to absolutely anyone. I thought the phone would be really hard to use (it is a blackberry) but to my surprise I actually got used to it in the first 10 minutes! If anyone needs a new phone, YOU HAVE GOT TO BUY THIS ONE
    ...
    07-24-10 10:33 AM
  10. Reed McLay's Avatar
    I have a 8520 which I bought solely for UMA, it works well with my Sky basic router but I have noticed it drop out once or twice with 'call failed' on the screen.

    I put this down to either the cell signal competing with the WiFi signal which sends the phone into 'search' mode resulting in the temp failure - is there anyway to lock the phone to UMA/WiFi whilst in range?

    Thanks,

    David
    There is a reason they call it, Unlicensed Mobile Access. Wifi uses 2.4 GHz frequencies, the same as many other wireless products.

    If there are other wireless products active, like portable phones or Garage door openers, there is a chance of interference.

    I had wireless Skype phone at one time. If I received an incoming call while on my UMA BlackBerry, the call would fail because of the interference.

    Try a Site Survey under Wifi Diagnostics. If you note other nearby sources, using the same channel, that could explain your connect failures. It is a simple matter to reset your Wifi Router to use an alternate channel.

    I have been advised that channel 1 is the least subject to outside interference.
    07-24-10 10:43 AM
  11. hoglite's Avatar
    There is a reason they call it, Unlicensed Mobile Access. Wifi uses 2.4 GHz frequencies, the same as many other wireless products.

    If there are other wireless products active, like portable phones or Garage door openers, there is a chance of interference.

    I had wireless Skype phone at one time. If I received an incoming call while on my UMA BlackBerry, the call would fail becasue of the interference.

    Try a Site Survey under Wifi Diagnostics. If you note other nearby sources, using the same channel, that could explain your connect failures. It is a simple matter to reset your Wifi Router to use an alternate channel.

    I have been advised that channel 1 is the least subject to outside interference.
    Cheers Reed, you guys really know your onions so to speak,

    I spoke to several techies at Orange all had Blackberry's for UMA access so were pretty good and said pretty much the same as you albeit slightly differently.

    Do you think having Orange broadband would help? going to change anyway as they have a better package.

    Btw, the review above is for UMA not the phone as the reviewer is talking about an LG 505 handset

    Thanks again,

    David
    07-24-10 11:08 AM
  12. jaconat's Avatar
    Thanks folks, this is making much more sense now. The wifi dropouts appear to happen for no reason so could be interference as stated above (neighbour has wifi, 3 girls all with laptops - poor chap). Checked his channel & mine which are different.

    One thing I did do which has seemed to make the connection more reliable is to force the router to assign the ip address 192.168.1.50 rather than pick the next on the list. Also I have set up the MAC address on the router. Connection is dropped less often and I get the Unable to associate... error less often.

    Interesting about UMA also. I clearly stated this was a critical feature when buying the phone but the sales rep didn't / forgot to mention the unreliability. I wonder why....
    07-24-10 02:31 PM
  13. Reed McLay's Avatar
    Thanks folks, this is making much more sense now. The wifi dropouts appear to happen for no reason so could be interference as stated above (neighbour has wifi, 3 girls all with laptops - poor chap). Checked his channel & mine which are different.

    One thing I did do which has seemed to make the connection more reliable is to force the router to assign the ip address 192.168.1.50 rather than pick the next on the list. Also I have set up the MAC address on the router. Connection is dropped less often and I get the Unable to associate... error less often.

    Interesting about UMA also. I clearly stated this was a critical feature when buying the phone but the sales rep didn't / forgot to mention the unreliability. I wonder why....
    My best guess? There is no reliability issue with UMA.

    I have been using it for the past two years with over 99.9% uptime reliability.

    Jaconat, have you determined the error message associated with your dropout? You will get that from Wifi Diagnostics.

    I suspect you are having issues with your router connection. If that fails, UMA also fails, but you can not blame that on the carrier.

    For trouble shooting purposes, you can try resetting the router back to factory spec. That will give you and Open connection on Channel 6 with all the correct defaults.

    Test that connection, If you achieve the reliability you are looking for in testing, it is usually a simple matter to switch both to enhanced security.
    07-25-10 09:56 AM
  14. jaconat's Avatar
    I don't know what UMA is like in Canada but it certainly sound like a more robust system than here in the UK. As per the review posted by Hoglite...

    "Reviewed by David from England on 21st Jul 2010

    Essentially, the service [UMA] is not robust or reliable. Couple this to a five hour standby battery life on UMA and it simply isn't fit for purpose. As mentioned in previous reviews Orange UMA also stops you using standard Wi-Fi for data access.
    I am on an Orange contract so this could be indicative of some of my UMA problems. However Seimens who make my router have not released a firmware upgrade for some years now so this coupled to Orange's (possible) UMA issues may not be helping things. What routers are people using successfully?
    07-25-10 10:08 AM
  15. hoglite's Avatar
    I tried the recommendations as above and found no real errors to speak of.

    My router appears quite basic in terms of settings (couldn't find the QOS setting) but works ok.

    I changed the channel to 3 after doing a site survey, no one else was on the same channel but I switched it anyway.

    One thing that I haven't seen mentioned and this maybe a guess on my part is that when you create a new connection on your BB it seems to need a GSM connection first before picking up the IP address assigned by the router?

    I tried this a few times and each time no connection until it picks up your local carrier via the cell network for a 'handshake' then off it goes - does it need to register first?

    The best improvement for me happened when I relocated my router/laptop/wireless phone setup to minimise interference as highlighted by Reed.

    As I will be using UMA quite a bit is it worth investing in one of these GL's (WRT54GL)
    07-25-10 10:12 AM
  16. hoglite's Avatar
    I don't know what UMA is like in Canada but it certainly sound like a more robust system than here in the UK. As per the review posted by Hoglite...



    I am on an Orange contract so this could be indicative of some of my UMA problems. However Seimens who make my router have not released a firmware upgrade for some years now so this coupled to Orange's (possible) UMA issues may not be helping things. What routers are people using successfully?
    Take a look at this thread bud, has some tweeks to QoS settings along with specific routers namely the WRT54x which has bandwidth apportioned to the UMA side of things.
    07-25-10 10:47 AM
  17. hoglite's Avatar
    Couldn't post a link above due to less than 10 posts so here goes;

    LOL, 10 or greater......
    07-25-10 10:48 AM
  18. hoglite's Avatar
    07-25-10 10:49 AM
  19. Reed McLay's Avatar
    I also use the Linksys WRT54G router. This model is recommended by T-Mobile (USA) for UMA service.

    You may be on the right track with the router firmware upgrade. Once you have a Wifi connection, it holds it with bull dog tenacity.

    Hogligh has in interesting observation. On start up, it does progress through GSM, EDGE and then UMA. I will do some testing later, I have to keep it available at now.
    07-25-10 02:47 PM
  20. hoglite's Avatar
    I also use the Linksys WRT54G router. This model is recommended by T-Mobile (USA) for UMA service.

    You may be on the right track with the router firmware upgrade. Once you have a Wifi connection, it holds it with bull dog tenacity.

    Hogligh has in interesting observation. On start up, it does progress through GSM, EDGE and then UMA. I will do some testing later, I have to keep it available at now.
    Does it matter if its a 'WRT54G' or 'WRT54GL' bud?

    Just trying to work out the differences here,

    Linksys WRT54G series - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia


    "Linksys released the WRT54GL in 2005 to support third-party firmware based on Linux, after the original WRT54G line was switched from Linux to VxWorks, starting with version 5. The WRT54GL is technically a reissue of the version 4 WRT54G."

    ta,
    Last edited by hoglite; 07-25-10 at 03:18 PM.
    07-25-10 03:15 PM
  21. jaconat's Avatar
    OK so looks like a change in router could be on the cards.

    Can I just check one thing? The version number, is it a firmware version or a hardware version? ie can I buy a WRT54G v2 and upgrade it to a v5 (or whatever) just by downloading the latest firmware?

    There seem to be lots of v2 on ebay and not much else. I don't want to buy a v2 if I am going to have the same problems as I'm having now.
    07-26-10 04:15 AM
  22. hoglite's Avatar
    Could anyone technical confirm if the UMA service is anything to do with the broadband provider ie, if you used Orange or T Mobile you would get a btter service tailored to UMA?

    I know they say any ISP but T Mobile routers are customised for UMA so maybe the bb is too?

    TIA
    07-29-10 12:51 PM
  23. hoglite's Avatar
    TTT

    C'mon peeps, no one have a heads up here
    08-01-10 06:34 PM
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