[nomloj]

Perhaps they've found a better replacement for the trackpad. It was a trackball once, then morphed into the trackpad. Maybe they've found a way to improve it like, say, use the sliding finger over the keyboard as a new and improved trackpad. I for one would miss the precision of the trackpad. I had to learn the new trackpad from the trackball, so if they come out with something like the track(key)board, I'll learn that, too. Now you can press the keyboard for characters and options, or just slide over it for finer control. Anyway, until the new unit appears, we'll just have to wait and see what their solution is.

Edit: I'm assuming we're talking about the keyboard phone here when the 2-3 inches was mentioned... It's late for me...

[anon(3750701)]

I don't know about the rest of you, but trying to use some drop-down menus on the playbook is damn near impossible. Gotta hold the tab which opens the drop-down menu, but when you remove your finger to select the desired option, the drop-down menu disappears. But, with bridge, you can use the cursor to open a drop-down menu and click the option you want.

Precision is needed.

Trackpads help.

Off topic, but if you triple tap the menu link on the playbook, the drop down menu will stay put. . This trick generally works on most sites.

[gxgs]

I sure hope the Trackpad makes a return. Think about it; you can navigate the entire phone while *barely* moving your thumb. Whereas with a large touch screen device, that may sometimes involve using up to both hands and moving your finger up and down the screen.

I would understand that for a galaxy note or the playbook, but on a sub 4 inch screen, you barely have to move the finger at all to uncomfortable positions to do any scrolling or selection. In fact, on overly long websites you can scroll faster with a touch screen by swiping a small area of the screen and releasing the finger (not talking about jump to bottom). You rarely have to move your finger all the way to the top of the screen or to the bottom during that, which could probably be a nuisance on a screen like 4.8 inches, because even at 4.3 its not a problem.

If it doesn't return, I hope RIM will have a trackpad on the touchscreen (maybe down in the corner somewhere) for the browser. You can zoom in to click on links, sure, but that's an additional step that wouldn't otherwise be necessary.

That's picky personal preference, and it doesn't seem to slow down the sale of full larger sized touchscreens. I sure hope they put a trackpad on smaller phones that have a keyboard, they have always covered a large audience with several form factors and would help for cramped up buttons in small screens. The least they need right now is their very own fan base leaving them. But on larger screens, they should actually try to get as most viewable screen as possible and more if they will be adding screen border gestures to the phone.

A virtual trackpad has been suggested as an app or native feature since the playbook was released. Would be a good a idea on a third party browser or even the native one as a semitransparent screen overlay at the bottom. Whether RIM or any other developer will do that, is another question.

I don't know about the rest of you, but trying to use some drop-down menus on the playbook is damn near impossible. Gotta hold the tab which opens the drop-down menu, but when you remove your finger to select the desired option, the drop-down menu disappears.

Do you have a website for this? This sounds more like a functionality bug rather than a problem with touchscreens.

[sf49ers]

I don't get it. The trackpad makes up for the problems that are caused when you have a screen under 3 inches. It makes scrolling and clicking easier, particularly on websites which are shrunk down to fit the small screen where the buttons on the webpage are small. It's more accurate then a fat finger and I rather not have to use my nail while having to pinch to zoom. That's more time consuming and also annoying.

I get removing the trackpad on a 4 inch screen device but on the Bold/N Line? It seems RIM is just trying to recreate the wheel and is going to anger a lot of people like me. I may have to reconsider BB10 as this ISN'T practical at all.

few reasons I can think of are:

1) if you want to accommodate a large screen with a QWERTY keyboard then there is an amount of trade off, for example rumored devices has 720x720 resolution with 330 PPI, which mean it has approx 3.1" display (bigger than bold 9900 which has a 2.8" display), also it is rumored the display has a 1:1 ratio, that means 2.2" each side, 2.2" means a taller in height compared to any current Bold. If they have to keep the weight balance and the current form factor intact then the trade off is a must. 2.2" width is approx 55mm wide i.e same as 9790, and hence imagine BB10 keyboard phone in 9790 form factor but with a bigger display.

2) BB10 is gesture based, if you have to add trackpad then it is additional overhead and creates fragmentation in the ecosystem even before it takes off.

Sadly, but this is true BB10 will not have support for trackpad (at the launch atleast) and it was confirmed in one of the BB Jam session.

[Devhux]

People are complaining about the loss of the trackpad, when they have no clue how RIM is going to deal with text / link selection in the BB10 browser yet. You can't compare the experience on the Bold 9900 here!

[siddo_d]

I think the N series should be for the existing blackberry users and the rest for present users who aren't afraid to try something new and also new comers.

The N series might have bezel which has an invisible trackpad and when the touch the bottom bezel it lights up and acts like a typical trackpad and is click able


Sent from my BlackBerry 9800 using CrackBerry forums application

[Pete6]

That's what pinch to zoom is for.
There's links on iPhone & Android that are tiny that you pinch to zoom to see.
If you're that lazy to zoom in with your finger than that's a personal issue lol.
Try again.

Yes, you are right. You CAN do it that way but the trackpad is a BETTER way to do it.

BlackBerrys have several clear advantages over other phone types a (sleep mode in holster, trackpad, speed of use) and getting rid of the trackpad will drag RIM phones down to the level of thingn like iPhone and touch only Android phones.

Many of us do not want this. We want the best phone on the market and in this threadm we think that means keeping a trackpad.

IMO, Mercedes-Benz + Rolex + BlackBerry (with trackpad) = THE BEST

[jerybis]

It would seriously drive me insane if I had to pinch to zoom to click links in the web browser. Call me lazy. I guess I am, that is probably why I enjoy using BlackBerry smartphones so much. They are efficient to use. Pinching and zooming on a small screen to navigate a website isn't efficient. It just adds another step. If I wanted more steps added to my daily activities on my smartphone I would just start using Android as my primary device full time.

Totally agree! I have a 9900 and i do use 90% of the time my dear trackpad. I though touchscreen with 9900 would change radically my habits but i do love reading articles by just clicking the trackpad to zoom and fit to the exact size of the screen.
If the trackpad disappears on BB10, then the same automatic zoom will be enable by tapping twice on the touchscreen as it is with the playbook.
So the alternative of the trackpad for zooming will be a double tap.

But I do have to say that the trackpad is much efficient to scroll down straight vertically while scrolling down on touchscreen may be not so straight loosing the text outside of the screen.


Sent from my BlackBerry 9900 using Tapatalk

[belfastdispatcher]

I have a feeling RIM has a trick up the sleave with the N and I don't think we've seen the end of the trackpad, watch this space, think RIM are bringing something new to the table

[ubizmo]

I use the trackpad far more than I use the touchscreen on my 9900. If I use my Android phone for a while, when I pick up the 9900 I do use the touchscreen a bit more than I otherwise would, but this tendency soon wears off and I'm back to the trackpad.

And I very much like having a cursor.

I don't think any of this is a dealbreaker for me, and I'm sure the trackpad adds to the expense of the phone, not only in initial manufacturing cost but also inhandset replacements due to trackpad failures. I haven't had a failure myself but I've read enough reports of them that I can believe the trackpad isn't the most robust part of the BB. I can see why RIM would want to leave them behind.

[sleepngbear]

I have no answer as to why (or if) RIM is abandoning the trackpad but
I know that that one issue is not going to stop me from buying the device.

We have all had things change in technology and managed to adapt to those
changes just fine. This may be one more of those occasions. If it becomes
a PITA (should know fairly early on) the device can just be returned.

I too find the trackpad an irreplaceable item ... right now. I'm guessing that the designers fully understand the importance of the functionality and flexibility the trackpad provides, and if they are eliminating it, I have no doubt that they'll be replacing it with a 'soft' option that's equally functional and easy to use. At least I'm desperately hoping so. Because all the touch screen options I've seen so far for selecting and manipulating text simply suck.

[Alex_Hong]

I think we can hold of these thoughts for a moment here and just enjoy the leaks slides. RIM started with a trackwheel, then trackball, and then the trackpad, each of them were better than the one before imo. I'm sure they know the importance of the trackpad in a smaller screen. So lets give them a benefit of the doubt first. There is still so little we know about the N series and BB10. After it launch, and we have all had enough time to try and get use to it, then we can start the discussion about which is better. Peace out.

[kbz1960]

Do you comprehend that the BlackBerry browser can only zoom in so far yet on Android you can keep zooming in until you blow up the button to where it fills the screen? Any Android phones with a 2-3 inch screen (HTC Wildfire) have a touchpad. The iPhone has a 3.5 inch screen and most androids have a 4-5.5 inch screen which isn't a problem. BlackBerry has a 2.4 inch screen, and it has nothing to do with laziness, rather a necessary feature in-order to navigate without headaches.

We understand you have no idea what you're talking about. Maybe you could ask RIM for a job, seems you all got rocks in your head so you'll fit right in.

Which BB10 phone will have a 2.4 inch screen?

[sleepngbear]

Pinch to zoom or double tap? If double tapping is such a hassle then damn... there's no hope for any of you. I would understand having to use the other hand when you could do it with one, but tapping fixes that, and most of the time that gives you readable text and its even better when you can set the amount of zoom tapping gives you so it doesn't zoom in too much, but since bookmark management is not even implemented yet on the browser, i highly doubt they will give users that option.

If accuracy is such a problem, then they could also go the opera mini way in which if you press more than two buttons/link in one tap it zooms into the zone you tapped so you can make a more accurate touch. You would only zoom in to click buttons next to each other, links are easy to click if they are surrounded by text in the case of for example, wikipedia or crackberry articles.

The only thing a trackpad can do is accurate clicking on websites you already know where to click, and that's it, because if you don't know where to click on such a small screen, you still have to get the text to readable size by zooming in. Also, well implemented touch functionality allows you to select text and apply actions to a selection faster than with a trackpad. Scrolling text with a trackpad is completely irrelevant when it can be done with the finger.

Double-tapping doesn't always zoom a page enough to accurately pinpoint a small link. And I've found that Opera Mini is very inconsistent in the way it does and doesn't zoom pages.

Anyway, browsing is only half of the problem. The bigger issue many of us have with any touch screen device is accurately pinpointing, selecting and pasting text. Nothing compares to the precision the trackpad affords there. Without that precision I find it to be a frustrating and painful process, even on the 7" screen of the PlayBook.

[bounce007]

I think we can hold of these thoughts for a moment here and just enjoy the leaks slides. RIM started with a trackwheel, then trackball, and then the trackpad, each of them were better than the one before imo. I'm sure they know the importance of the trackpad in a smaller screen. So lets give them a benefit of the doubt first. There is still so little we know about the N series and BB10. After it launch, and we have all had enough time to try and get use to it, then we can start the discussion about which is better. Peace out.

Exactly! Give RIM the benefit of the doubt. There was no official statement that the trackpad will be non-existent on BB10 phones. People thought the keyboard would be non existent, and were wrong. The leaked images of the N-series have white lines where the keyboard will be, so does that mean there will be no keyboard? NOOOO. That's just one of their mock ups and we all know the keyboard will be present on the N series even though we don't see a keyboard in the image. So just because we don't see a trackpad in the image, doesn't mean the trackpad won't be there.

Until RIM says "BB10 phones will not have trackpads" give them the benefit of the doubt that for the smaller screen BB10 phones, a trackpad will be present.

[amazinglygraceless]

People are complaining about the loss of the trackpad, when they have no clue how RIM is going to deal with text / link selection in the BB10 browser yet. You can't compare the experience on the Bold 9900 here!

I don't think anyone is complaining. It is more speculation based on the images that have been
leaked so far and a statement of what like they / we would like to see going forward.

[jegs2]

My own evil scheme is to wait and see how my fellow physical keyboard die-hards like the N-series before purchasing it myself. I'm sure we'll see plenty of value-added report cards right here on Crackberry.

[sleepngbear]

Darn, was hoping they would go more PS3 style.

Bet you didn't realize Atari designs were part of RIM's vast patent portfolio -- or why, did you.

[Saiga]

Totally agree! I have a 9900 and i do use 90% of the time my dear trackpad. I though touchscreen with 9900 would change radically my habits but i do love reading articles by just clicking the trackpad to zoom and fit to the exact size of the screen.
If the trackpad disappears on BB10, then the same automatic zoom will be enable by tapping twice on the touchscreen as it is with the playbook.
So the alternative of the trackpad for zooming will be a double tap.

But I do have to say that the trackpad is much efficient to scroll down straight vertically while scrolling down on touchscreen may be not so straight loosing the text outside of the screen.


Sent from my BlackBerry 9900 using Tapatalk

I was the exact same way. All of the pre launch hype before the 99s release made me think I was going to be using the touchscreen a lot. Like I honestly thought it would be nearly 50% track pad and 50% touchscreen. Boy that hasn't happened. I love having the touchscreen option for certain things. Because there are a few minor things that are easier to do with it than with the track pad. But I mostly use my 99 the same way I used my 9650. I've never heard of anyone that has said they use the 99 touch screen more than they use the track pad.

I find it funny that RIM understood the importance of the track pad enough to put it on the 9850, yet they are gonna make the next Bold ish device without it? Sorry RIM, but track pads are for people who do. IF they weren't than why did you put them on every single OS7 BB there is? It is like RIM came out with the ultimate phone for BlackBerry people and then for the refresher of it they are going to go backwards by removing a crucial part.

A new OS isn't going to completely remove the usefulness of the track pad. Like Sleepngbear said - how much of a pain in the rear is it to select text on the PlayBook? Now imagine trying to do it on the Dev Alpha. I have tried, it is a out right nightmare. I am sure final BB10 will be better than the PlayBook OS is, but I have my doubts that it will be good enough to keep me from missing the track pad. Android OS doesn't need a track pad, but the people who have one find them useful.

I hope they have something really good in mind to replace the track pad with. The majority of the people who care about BlackBerry 10 (Or even knows that it exists) are current or ex BlackBerry people. Most of those people also understand the importance of the track pad.

I have a 99 and a PlayBook. I use the 99 for communication and the PlayBook for entertainment. Eventually I will have the developer's trade in BlackBerry 10 device. And I see it replacing my PlayBook for entertainment, but the more I see of BlackBerry 10 the more I think I will be hanging on to the 99 for a few more years.

[Toodeurep]

I too find the trackpad an irreplaceable item ... right now. I'm guessing that the designers fully understand the importance of the functionality and flexibility the trackpad provides, and if they are eliminating it, I have no doubt that they'll be replacing it with a 'soft' option that's equally functional and easy to use. At least I'm desperately hoping so. Because all the touch screen options I've seen so far for selecting and manipulating text simply suck.

I also find the trackpad very important. I guess I may have to Bridge my 9810 to by BB10 phone. So I will be able to use the remote on my 9810 to control my BB10 phone to control my Playbook.

[JTATL]

1) Moving parts are prone to wear, the track pad is a moving part that can wear out after so many clicks; the track ball was worse I wore out five of those over the years.

2) The main reason is screen real estate; the button bar where the track pad was takes up room that could be used for more touch display.

[jivegirl14]

Since the first mention of BBX (pre-BB10), there have been images leaked. As we grow closer to BB10 launch, these designs get closer to the final product. I just came across what appears to be a newer leak which I think will answer everyone's question about replacing the trackpad.

LOL...Awesome!

[gregorylkelly]

I don't know about the rest of you, but trying to use some drop-down menus on the playbook is damn near impossible. Gotta hold the tab which opens the drop-down menu, but when you remove your finger to select the desired option, the drop-down menu disappears. But, with bridge, you can use the cursor to open a drop-down menu and click the option you want.

Precision is needed.

Trackpads help.

As bad as the Storm was, it handled these situations PERFECTLY! It even allowed you to hover over a thread in the CrackBerry forums and see the little snippet of the first post that you get when you mouse over a link.

Most times when I want to do a "hover" over a link or item on the PlayBook, I press on the item I want to "hover" over and drag the screen slightly so it doesn't get recognized as a click. Most of the time, the website will handle this manuever as a mouse "hover" and enable the script to run.

[gregorylkelly]

Did you read my post? How is it being a gesture based OS relevant to this discussion? Rather it has nothing to do with the software, rather hardware limitations and making up for a major problem that comes with having a small screen.

The OS itself is completely irrelevant because there's no bit of software they could implement which would fix this problem. Gesture based isn't going to make up for it.

I agree with this to a certain extent. No gestures we have seen to this point can really make up for the trackpad, but they could implement something in the future.

For example, maybe a swipe from the bottom right corner would pull up a trackpad similarly to how a swipe from the bottom left corner will bring up the keyboard. The gesture would have to be more smooth than the keyboard one, maybe more like the notification gesture on the top left that allows the gesture to be slingshot back and forth without letting go.

With the keyboard, top menu gesture, bottom up gesture and the side gestures on the PB, they don't allow for "Peeking" like the top left and top right gestures allow for. However, it is my understanding that BB10's gestures will be more like the top left and right, and less absolute like the sides, top, and bottom gestures.

[gregorylkelly]

Off topic, but if you triple tap the menu link on the playbook, the drop down menu will stay put. . This trick generally works on most sites.

Can someone give me an example of a website this will work on? I'm a little confused at what you mean and would love to try it out in a situation that you could explain to me.