07-12-10 12:11 PM
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  1. grahamf's Avatar
    since our carriers have switched to HSPA we've been able to get hot ticket items such as the iPhones and the 9700 from all of our carriers, yet in the states it is limited to only AT&T and maybe T-Mobile if everything goes well. This also gives all of the carriers to launch the newest items such as the Pearl 9100 because otherwise their competitor will be the only one with it. And once the unlocking bill passes through if you have your phone paid for (no longer subsidized), you can switch to the cheapest carrier whenever you want, which in theory will help bring our rates to near US levels and maybe even better.
    This would be nice in the States, right?
    why isn't it done?
    06-24-10 10:17 PM
  2. flchick75's Avatar
    LOL It's all about the competition and getting customers. Each network offers something new and unique to only themselves to lure new subscribers.
    06-24-10 10:19 PM
  3. _StephenBB81's Avatar
    Because non of the US Carriers have to worry about the Olympics

    HSPA was simply a way CDMA carriers were going to get some big business from world travellers at the Vancouver Olympics

    They also used it to grab some nice phones and push it,
    But truly if you travel a lot, the HSPA network sucks, I have lots of collegues who got sucked into buying a HSPA phone and now it never works like my tour does when we travel.

    it is VERY smart of Verizon to not go HSPA and to launch LTE once they have a large network inplace, the last thing they want is an AT&T reputation.
    06-25-10 07:40 AM
  4. elvin1983's Avatar
    since our carriers have switched to HSPA we've been able to get hot ticket items such as the iPhones and the 9700 from all of our carriers, yet in the states it is limited to only AT&T and maybe T-Mobile if everything goes well. This also gives all of the carriers to launch the newest items such as the Pearl 9100 because otherwise their competitor will be the only one with it. And once the unlocking bill passes through if you have your phone paid for (no longer subsidized), you can switch to the cheapest carrier whenever you want, which in theory will help bring our rates to near US levels and maybe even better.
    This would be nice in the States, right?
    why isn't it done?
    If I understand correctly (and I may not), HSPA (HSDPA?) is a GSM 3G data transfer technology. I don't believe that HSPA is compatable with CDMA networks. If I'm totally wrong someone please correct me...

    Now if we're talking agout 4G networks, than the only two types that I've heard of is WiMax and LTE...
    06-25-10 09:51 AM
  5. elvin1983's Avatar
    since our carriers have switched to HSPA we've been able to get hot ticket items such as the iPhones and the 9700 from all of our carriers, yet in the states it is limited to only AT&T and maybe T-Mobile if everything goes well. This also gives all of the carriers to launch the newest items such as the Pearl 9100 because otherwise their competitor will be the only one with it. And once the unlocking bill passes through if you have your phone paid for (no longer subsidized), you can switch to the cheapest carrier whenever you want, which in theory will help bring our rates to near US levels and maybe even better.
    This would be nice in the States, right?
    why isn't it done?
    My T-MO rep mentioned to me a week or so ago that they are going to be rolling out HSPA+ this year, not sure how it'll be deployed in your area...
    06-25-10 09:53 AM
  6. Borborygm's Avatar
    It's not even GSM based, and more expensive(To implement) for the same speeds as EVDO Rev A+ and/or 4G.
    06-25-10 09:58 AM
  7. BlackBerry Guy's Avatar
    If I understand correctly (and I may not), HSPA (HSDPA?) is a GSM 3G data transfer technology. I don't believe that HSPA is compatable with CDMA networks. If I'm totally wrong someone please correct me...
    You're absolutely correct.

    What's happened here in Canada is the 2 major CDMA carriers, Telus and Bell, decided to put up a HSPA network alongside their existing CDMA network. Officially they say this is to ensure a "smoother transition to 4G LTE", unofficially of course, we all know it was done to cash in on all the international visitors that would be here in Vancouver for the 2010 Olympics.
    06-25-10 11:56 AM
  8. mas3222's Avatar
    When it comes to networks I have little knowledge. What's the difference between Wimax and LTE. I know what they are but not the difference.

    Posted from my CrackBerry at wapforums.crackberry.com
    06-25-10 12:02 PM
  9. grahamf's Avatar
    You're absolutely correct.

    What's happened here in Canada is the 2 major CDMA carriers, Telus and Bell, decided to put up a HSPA network alongside their existing CDMA network. Officially they say this is to ensure a "smoother transition to 4G LTE", unofficially of course, we all know it was done to cash in on all the international visitors that would be here in Vancouver for the 2010 Olympics.
    And now all Carriers have transitioned to HSPA with SaskTel still setting up theirs.
    And if you do a quick check Bell, Telus, etc are now almost always getting the GSM version of new devices (the 8530 is their newest CDMA Blackberry, due to the 8520 not being compatible with their network.

    I can see that long term they will transition to carrying almost all GSM devices, but no doubt they will hold onto their CDMA network for older customers/China roaming/etc.

    One last thing is that I feel that the Belus HSPA network is better than Rogers, as they have HSPA nearly everywhere that they have EVDO, while Rogers still has quite a few places with only EDGE.
    problem is when you have no HSPA, you have no service
    Last edited by grahamf; 06-25-10 at 12:07 PM.
    06-25-10 12:03 PM
  10. dsdawson's Avatar
    ...
    One last thing is that I feel that the Belus HSPA network is better than Rogers, as they have HSPA nearly everywhere that they have EVDO, while Rogers still has quite a few places with only EDGE.
    problem is when you have no HSPA, you have no service
    Rogers is certainly feeling the competitive pressure though. I've noticed (in Eastern Ontario) that many places that used to have EDGE signals only are now being served by 3G.
    06-25-10 12:27 PM
  11. webmeister's Avatar
    Because non of the US Carriers have to worry about the Olympics

    HSPA was simply a way CDMA carriers were going to get some big business from world travellers at the Vancouver Olympics

    They also used it to grab some nice phones and push it,
    But truly if you travel a lot, the HSPA network sucks, I have lots of collegues who got sucked into buying a HSPA phone and now it never works like my tour does when we travel.

    it is VERY smart of Verizon to not go HSPA and to launch LTE once they have a large network inplace, the last thing they want is an AT&T reputation.
    Speak for yourself! ;-) I haven't had any issues with the HSPA network at all. I travel a lot, and have yet to see where it "sucks". Congratulations on your Tour...I'm glad you like it but Bell's 3G network has covered me well coast-to-coast. I get coverage where I used not to with Bell's CDMA network, too. When I travel to foreign countries, I can pop a SIM into my unlocked phone. HSPA and HSPA+, 4G, etc., are next-gen networks and there's no point digging in and saying how good the old technology is when there are so many benefits to HSPA.

    Interesting theory you have there. Bell built the HSPA network to snag and lure world travellers when they attended the Vancouver Olympics? Pretty lame theory IMHO. 5 billion dollars investment to gain a few converts way out on the left coast? Right.

    I can talk and use data at the same time. Try that on 2G, GSM, edge, CDMA or whatever..... That's the advantage and that's why you're envious.

    /ES
    06-25-10 12:46 PM
  12. webmeister's Avatar
    You're absolutely correct.

    What's happened here in Canada is the 2 major CDMA carriers, Telus and Bell, decided to put up a HSPA network alongside their existing CDMA network. Officially they say this is to ensure a "smoother transition to 4G LTE", unofficially of course, we all know it was done to cash in on all the international visitors that would be here in Vancouver for the 2010 Olympics.
    That is the second most ridiculous thing I've heard on this forum today. Let me get this straight....Bell spent 5 billion dollars to roll out a coast-to-coast 3G HSPA network to snag some $$ from some visitors to the west coast of our fair country during a one month window in January/February 2010? Unbelievable!
    06-25-10 12:53 PM
  13. grahamf's Avatar
    That is the second most ridiculous thing I've heard on this forum today. Let me get this straight....Bell spent 5 billion dollars to roll out a coast-to-coast 3G HSPA network to snag some $$ from some visitors to the west coast of our fair country during a one month window in January/February 2010? Unbelievable!
    Their roaming charges are astronomical.
    06-25-10 01:19 PM
  14. _StephenBB81's Avatar
    Speak for yourself! ;-) I haven't had any issues with the HSPA network at all. I travel a lot, and have yet to see where it "sucks". Congratulations on your Tour...I'm glad you like it but Bell's 3G network has covered me well coast-to-coast. I get coverage where I used not to with Bell's CDMA network, too. When I travel to foreign countries, I can pop a SIM into my unlocked phone. HSPA and HSPA+, 4G, etc., are next-gen networks and there's no point digging in and saying how good the old technology is when there are so many benefits to HSPA.

    Interesting theory you have there. Bell built the HSPA network to snag and lure world travellers when they attended the Vancouver Olympics? Pretty lame theory IMHO. 5 billion dollars investment to gain a few converts way out on the left coast? Right.

    I can talk and use data at the same time. Try that on 2G, GSM, edge, CDMA or whatever..... That's the advantage and that's why you're envious.

    /ES

    I didn't attack you, yet you come out and get all agressive

    HSPA is good in major urban centres in Canada, HSPA in the tbay tell/ dryden tell area is non exisitant, the Outside of Sudbury, North Bay, Timmins, you again are left with CDMA only.


    It was widely publisized Bell and Telus were racing to get HSPA up and running before the Olympics to maximize on roaming charges,
    It also was clearly a way to get a peice of the iphone pie and other GSM phone offerings. I'm not saying the Olympics were the only reason, but it was a major part of it.

    As mentioned this also was a transition before moving to LTE which is Bells Ultiumate goal, I suspect HSPA was a cheaper roll out to really test how they can handle the dual network.

    What is the Bell network coverage in Canada?

    please check here to see how HSPA does not cover what CDMA does.
    06-25-10 02:59 PM
  15. _StephenBB81's Avatar
    And now all Carriers have transitioned to HSPA with SaskTel still setting up theirs.
    And if you do a quick check Bell, Telus, etc are now almost always getting the GSM version of new devices (the 8530 is their newest CDMA Blackberry, due to the 8520 not being compatible with their network.

    I can see that long term they will transition to carrying almost all GSM devices, but no doubt they will hold onto their CDMA network for older customers/China roaming/etc.

    One last thing is that I feel that the Belus HSPA network is better than Rogers, as they have HSPA nearly everywhere that they have EVDO, while Rogers still has quite a few places with only EDGE.
    problem is when you have no HSPA, you have no service

    Not all Carriers are moving to HSPA, Tbay Tell, and possibly Dryden Tell are actually working with Rogers for their next gen networks, not with Belus, they should be up and running by september according to the Rogers people I have spoken with if that is the case, Rogers might actually start to have Better Ontario Service than Bell, as that is a region that Rogers currently can't touch, and is ruled by CDMA.

    I really hope that the HSPA network in the Major centres is going to be enough to push Rogers in throwing up more towers and improving service, and inturn get Belus on the same battle for network dominance.
    06-25-10 03:06 PM
  16. grahamf's Avatar
    Ah. here in alberta the whole frickin' province is covered, so that's how I never see poor reception.
    06-25-10 03:08 PM
  17. BlackBerry Guy's Avatar
    Speak for yourself! ;-) I haven't had any issues with the HSPA network at all. I travel a lot, and have yet to see where it "sucks". Congratulations on your Tour...I'm glad you like it but Bell's 3G network has covered me well coast-to-coast. I get coverage where I used not to with Bell's CDMA network, too. When I travel to foreign countries, I can pop a SIM into my unlocked phone. HSPA and HSPA+, 4G, etc., are next-gen networks and there's no point digging in and saying how good the old technology is when there are so many benefits to HSPA.

    Interesting theory you have there. Bell built the HSPA network to snag and lure world travellers when they attended the Vancouver Olympics? Pretty lame theory IMHO. 5 billion dollars investment to gain a few converts way out on the left coast? Right.

    I can talk and use data at the same time. Try that on 2G, GSM, edge, CDMA or whatever..... That's the advantage and that's why you're envious
    That is the second most ridiculous thing I've heard on this forum today. Let me get this straight....Bell spent 5 billion dollars to roll out a coast-to-coast 3G HSPA network to snag some $$ from some visitors to the west coast of our fair country during a one month window in January/February 2010? Unbelievable!
    Woh woh take it easy there webmaster. No one's attacking you or your precious HSPA network. No one's debating the technical merits of EVDO vs HSPA. Anyone who argues that EVDO is superior to HSPA would be an *****.

    That being said, deRusett is correct when noting that HSPA coverage (at least here in Canada) isn't as comprehensive as the older CDMA network. By Telus' own marketing material, the 3G EVDO network covers 98% of the Canadian population vs 93% for the 3G+ HSPA network. And it does not have a fall back to an older EDGE network like Rogers' does.

    Reliable, high performance networks | Why TELUS | TELUS Mobility

    Perhaps my sarcasm didn't quite show through when typed out on a forum. I realize that by having a HSPA network in place, it does make it easier to transition to LTE. But the timing of it being pushed out a few months before the Games was meant to cash in on roaming.
    06-25-10 04:49 PM
  18. webmeister's Avatar
    Woh woh take it easy there webmaster. No one's attacking you or your precious HSPA network. No one's debating the technical merits of EVDO vs HSPA. Anyone who argues that EVDO is superior to HSPA would be an *****.

    That being said, deRusett is correct when noting that HSPA coverage (at least here in Canada) isn't as comprehensive as the older CDMA network. By Telus' own marketing material, the 3G EVDO network covers 98% of the Canadian population vs 93% for the 3G+ HSPA network. And it does not have a fall back to an older EDGE network like Rogers' does.

    Reliable, high performance networks*|* Why TELUS*|* TELUS Mobility

    Perhaps my sarcasm didn't quite show through when typed out on a forum. I realize that by having a HSPA network in place, it does make it easier to transition to LTE. But the timing of it being pushed out a few months before the Games was meant to cash in on roaming.
    LOL A couple of emoticons could've conveyed your sarcasm if that's what you intended, but it sure sounded cynical to me. I call BS. I think I caught yours and deRusset's hands in the cookie jar. You can try to minimize your FUD by surrounding it with reasonable sounding discussions about relative coverage of the different technologies, but in the end it amounts ill-considered innuendo. I'm hardly an apologist for Bell, but I think they're right to be proud of their accomplishments and not inconsiderable investment. It's always easy to hate big.
    unofficially of course, we all know it was done to cash in on all the international visitors that would be here in Vancouver for the 2010 Olympics.
    Because non of the US Carriers have to worry about the Olympics

    HSPA was simply a way CDMA carriers were going to get some big business from world travellers at the Vancouver Olympics
    06-25-10 08:09 PM
  19. thymaster's Avatar
    If Big Red says NO! Then everyone must obey.
    06-26-10 01:52 AM
  20. grahamf's Avatar
    Kinda helps me understand why the Australian government forced the transition to GSM...
    06-26-10 02:49 AM
  21. peacey's Avatar
    You all have your points. Though, the fact remains that unless you're a hillbilly and only travel within US/Canada, then having a CDMA network is the worst thing ever. I travel internationally, and if it wasn't for the HSPA+ network from Bell/Telus, I wouldn't be able to use my phone at all.

    I used to be with a CDMA network, and it was the worst experience ever. I could never use my phone outside US/Canada and I always had to buy some really cheap old phone just so I could have a phone to use in the country I was in.

    Anyways, unless you're someone who travels only around 16.5% of the world's lands (and let's face it, everyone travels internationally nowadays), then having a CDMA network is a serious turn off.
    06-27-10 06:51 PM
  22. _StephenBB81's Avatar
    You all have your points. Though, the fact remains that unless you're a hillbilly and only travel within US/Canada, then having a CDMA network is the worst thing ever. I travel internationally, and if it wasn't for the HSPA+ network from Bell/Telus, I wouldn't be able to use my phone at all.

    I used to be with a CDMA network, and it was the worst experience ever. I could never use my phone outside US/Canada and I always had to buy some really cheap old phone just so I could have a phone to use in the country I was in.

    Anyways, unless you're someone who travels only around 16.5% of the world's lands (and let's face it, everyone travels internationally nowadays), then having a CDMA network is a serious turn off.

    Ummm really?
    8800, 9630?? both are great CDMA phones for world wide use, NO HSPA required, and work great in China, Brazil, and England FYI
    06-27-10 06:59 PM
  23. avt123's Avatar
    Verizon isn't moving to HSPA because they are going LTE. No need to stay in the 3-3.75G realm. Same with Sprint but they are using WiMax.
    06-27-10 07:02 PM
  24. peacey's Avatar
    Ummm really?
    8800, 9630?? both are great CDMA phones for world wide use, NO HSPA required, and work great in China, Brazil, and England FYI
    deRusett, I think the problem is that CDMA phones usually do not support GSM networks. GSM is used by over 212 countries. Having a CDMA phone is a huge disadvantage if you're going to be travelling around the world.
    06-27-10 07:14 PM
  25. _StephenBB81's Avatar
    deRusett, I think the problem is that CDMA phones usually do not support GSM networks. GSM is used by over 212 countries. Having a CDMA phone is a huge disadvantage if you're going to be travelling around the world.
    Both CDMA phones I listed are both CDMA and GSM best of both worlds
    06-27-10 07:31 PM
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