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10-01-14 02:45 PM
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  1. eduzojordan's Avatar
    From @theonecid twitter "1920x1080 resolution BlackBerry device spotted with insane battery life. What do you say, Z50?..."
    I have a Z30, don't think is old...even some friends who are into iPhone like my Z30.
    One of then even bought my old Z10 and installed some Android apps. He is very happy with it.

    Edit: BTW he has a post..."BlackBerry 10 OS 10.3.1.704 SR 10.3.1.444 spotted..."
    09-27-14 12:07 PM
  2. bicyclexpress's Avatar
    I think BlackBerry is in a tough spot with its all touch phones. They have not sold many of them, but what momentum they have been able to build I believe has come from the Z10/30.

    The few people I know who are rocking a BlackBerry, even those with work issued phones, have the slabs. And, they like them. They like the screen real estate. Thus, even if it is not profitable, I think BlackBerry needs to get an all touch out there asap to keep these people happy.

    One very prominent project manager I have worked with should be the prototypical BlackBerry user. The type of guy who gets stuff done, is always on the go, and looks at documents on his phone. But, why does he prefer the iPhone? Because he plays words with friends with his daughter.

    When he switched from a qwerty to an iPhone the number of typos in his emails was almost embarrassing to read. But, he did not seem to care. Plus, his kids could play angry birds while he was driving them in his car.

    This is the unfortunate reality for BlackBerry. A lot of the prosumers out there are not overly concerned with their phones' productivity. Being able to watch a movie on their phone on a gorgeous, big screen is more important to them than the ability to quickly and rapidly fire off an accurate work email.

    Thus, even if not profitable, in order for us to have future passports and classics, I think BlackBerry has to get the Z50 out there.


    Posted via CB10
    kbz1960, gfondeur and andy957 like this.
    09-27-14 12:37 PM
  3. Genghis2k3's Avatar
    Why does one need to upgrade and get a new phone every year or two anyway? Why not just keep using your Z10?

    Posted via CB10
    It's largely because of the successful marketing/brainwashing by the carriers. The carriers "allow" the upgrade, so many think it's a must to upgrade from their current device (which is serving their needs) - to a new device with the new feature the carrier convinced them they want/need.
    gfondeur likes this.
    09-27-14 02:55 PM
  4. davinci4real's Avatar
    Z30 will be too old by then, sorry but Blackberry can't expect people to fork out for a two year old phone? They are going to lose allot of customers if they don't bring out a Z10/Z30 replacement.

    Posted via CB10
    What exactly about the Z30 would be too old? The Miracast? The nfc? the HDMI port? The speed? The ram? The OS? The big screen?
    This might be the first phone I would use for 2 years straight

    From Zarafet my Z30.
    Playbook007, gfondeur and andy957 like this.
    09-27-14 05:43 PM
  5. Emaderton3's Avatar
    I thought the new phones such as the Q10 were "world" phones and would work on CDMA and GSM networks?

    Posted via CB10
    09-27-14 06:57 PM
  6. raino's Avatar
    I thought the new phones such as the Q10 were "world" phones and would work on CDMA and GSM networks?
    To a degree. The all-GSM phones don't work on the CDMA networks, but the Verizon Q10 and Z30 have some cross-compatibility on GSM carriers, including their LTE networks. The Sprint Q10...not so much.
    09-27-14 07:03 PM
  7. KR2013's Avatar
    I thought the new phones such as the Q10 were "world" phones and would work on CDMA and GSM networks?

    Posted via CB10
    The Q10 is certainly not a "world" phone. That's why they have so many models of it (SQN100-1 to 5). And trust me, as for GSM, depending on what GSM model you buy, it might not even get data/internet when you travel to another GSM country with a non-frequency-compatible network. The Password seems to be more of a "world" phone, since it seems to cover more frequencies in the GSM world. I am not sure about CDMA though.

    Posted via Z10
    09-27-14 08:20 PM
  8. SK122387's Avatar
    Yeah, another full touch device, because the Z10 and Z30 really sold so well!


    I hope BlackBerry brings something for the all touch lovers, but really, why would they be in any hurry to? It's not like they did well. The Z10 was cause for a huge write down and loss for the company, and it soured relations with carriers who were then wary to carry the Z30. I owned a Z10 and have a Z30 and I think they're great, but don't expect BlackBerry to be in any hurry. The app situation hasn't really improved, so it's not like consumers will give BlackBerry a look. Sure there are some more in the Amazon App Store, but BlackBerry will likely never have the native apps that most full touch using consumers want.

    If they did come out with a Z50 or something, I'd expect it to be geared towards business users again, on sale for full retail price on Shop BlackBerry and through a few carriers.

    I feel bad for the touchscreen users who choose BlackBerry... you have nice devices and can see BlackBerry can compete in terms of hardware and software, but because the majority of users rejected those devices, you're sort of punished and have to wait for BlackBerry to see if that's really a road they want to go down again.

    Posted via CB10
    ALToronto, gfondeur and andy957 like this.
    09-27-14 08:53 PM
  9. BB_Junky's Avatar
    Yeah, another full touch device, because the Z10 and Z30 really sold so well!


    I hope BlackBerry brings something for the all touch lovers, but really, why would they be in any hurry to? It's not like they did well. The Z10 was cause for a huge write down and loss for the company, and it soured relations with carriers who were then wary to carry the Z30. I owned a Z10 and have a Z30 and I think they're great, but don't expect BlackBerry to be in any hurry. The app situation hasn't really improved, so it's not like consumers will give BlackBerry a look. Sure there are some more in the Amazon App Store, but BlackBerry will likely never have the native apps that most full touch using consumers want.

    If they did come out with a Z50 or something, I'd expect it to be geared towards business users again, on sale for full retail price on Shop BlackBerry and through a few carriers.

    I feel bad for the touchscreen users who choose BlackBerry... you have nice devices and can see BlackBerry can compete in terms of hardware and software, but because the majority of users rejected those devices, you're sort of punished and have to wait for BlackBerry to see if that's really a road they want to go down again.

    Posted via CB10
    Well said and I agree with you 100% nobody to blame but themselves! but still in this day and age???sure cater to the few who want keyboards and old time devices....what happens when you put these phones in their hands. Sales stop and then what? You've cut off everyone else .... Just something to think about


    Sent from my super cool shoe device using Tapatalk HD
    MarsupilamiX likes this.
    09-27-14 09:25 PM
  10. MarsupilamiX's Avatar
    With all due respect (and I'm a Z10 owner and user myself), when will these "need new all-touch BBRY slab" posts stop?

    :-)

    Nothing on the Verizon nor horizon for a while, and that's a fact.

    I am sure that John Chen is aware of the need for some new 16:9 phone (with or without an expandable / hidden keyboard, or similar). These posts are not gonna change much.

    Contact BBRY, participate in their surveys, go to "icanmakeitbetter", use Twitter, etc. and let them know.

    It's keyboard time right now.

    The Passport is important and unique. Another high-spec'ed all-touch slab wouldn't nearly have had such an impact as this new innovative phone that breaks common design boundaries.

    I assume if they had made the "Z50" instead of the Passport, BlackBerry would be in deep trouble now, and the turnaround would be protracted.

    Keyboard phones are their (pardon the pun) classic enterprise phones. They need to stabilize the company with those enterprise sales first, then will they use the funds to produce a standard slab again and advertise in the consumer space.

    Get everything out of your Z10/Z30 now, and please be patient.

    I'm looking forward to another awesome all-touch (with probably a whole bunch of new innovations) myself , but the time for that's isn't (right) now.

    That's just opinion, and you're welcome to disagree.
    No offense to all-touch users, I'm gonna upgrade my wife's phone to a Z30 as soon as funds are available.

    ? BlackBerry? I premdict the future's gonna be chenomenal! ?
    I can't accept that reasoning, sorry.
    Keyboard phones, at best, will have a marketshare of 0.5% this year.

    They are basically ignoring a potential customer base of 99.5%...

    I could reply point by point, but I think that 0.5% should contradict most of your points.
    Especially the whole turnaround thing.

    When 99.5% want a touchscreen, then you effing give it to them.

    Posted via CB10
    09-28-14 03:05 AM
  11. MarsupilamiX's Avatar
    I don't get my upgrade for a year yet but if there isn't any new all touch bb I'll be going WP
    From no apps, to one app :P

    Your carrier won't allow it? How is that possible?

    So if you bought a phone second hand (is broke yours and needed a replacement until renewal let's say) it won't work? They block it?

    Posted via CB10
    It has to be one branded for them.
    That's odd. I've never heard of that (i'm not always up on the times though).

    Thanks and wow, that's odd.

    Posted via CB10
    That's what happens when you don't have enough regulations and something akin to a duopoly:
    The customer gets screwed.

    To be honest, I think BlackBerry's phone strategy is straight forward and logical. Rebuild and strengthen the Qwerty which centers to the productivity needs of enterprise. Frankly, BlackBerry has done an excellent job. For a niche company, they captured lots of attention in September whereas Apple was always backpedaling explaining one major gaft after another. Once the classic is out, it will be onto the touch screens, a value phone Z20 to capture the mid range and the fabled Z50. My bet is that they will be launched in spring where they can gather more attention and it will be bundled with a new service offering. This offering, combined with blend and the power of 10.3, will help differentiate the product from the rest of the slab. Smart move if they do it.

    Posted via CB10
    Until you realise that business professionals have long made the jump to the touchscreen.

    About 0.5% of phones sold this year will have a keyboard (at best).
    Where do you think all those professionals who don't like keyboards are going? (hint: they are definitely not staying with BlackBerry).

    The Z20, which will be the Z3 LTE btw will be a low-range phone, not a mid-range one.

    BB came out with the Z10 and 30.... Nobody bought them. So now they said the heck with us consumers and are focused on keyboard devices for enterprise. So enjoy your z30 or sadly like others have...move on.


    Sent from my super cool shoe device using Tapatalk HD
    Both phones were super overpriced when they launched.
    Both phones have the same inexistant app store and ecosystem.

    What do you expect?

    Z10 and Z30 did outsell Q5 and Q10 though.

    I don't know why but I see the Z3 as a downgrade from my Z30.
    It obviously is in all regards.
    So the why isn't important.
    (but just looking at the specs, you'll see that the Z3 is a massive downgrade)

    Posted via CB10
    Last edited by MarsupilamiX; 09-28-14 at 03:20 AM.
    09-28-14 03:08 AM
  12. ZeroBarrier's Avatar
    I can't accept that reasoning, sorry.
    Keyboard phones, at best, will have a marketshare of 0.5% this year.

    They are basically ignoring a potential customer base of 99.5%...

    I could reply point by point, but I think that 0.5% should contradict most of your points.
    Especially the whole turnaround thing.

    When 99.5% want a touchscreen, then you effing give it to them.

    Posted via CB10
    Isn't it safe to say the out of the 99.5% that do what a touch screen, less than 0.5% want a BlackBerry touch screen device? And if so then BlackBerry is smart to cement themselves as the king of QWERTY since no one can match them in that space.

    This is of course conjecture, there's many other factors that go into play that none of us actually know; but I do think you're over-generalizing the 99.5% and saying they would all equally give a BlackBerry touch screen device a fair chance, but the reality is that the vast majority of that 99.5% wouldn't even fathom getting a BlackBerry touch screen device.

    Posted via CB10
    gfondeur and solitude1984 like this.
    09-28-14 03:32 AM
  13. anon(4067838)'s Avatar
    Z30 will be too old by then, sorry but Blackberry can't expect people to fork out for a two year old phone? They are going to lose allot of customers if they don't bring out a Z10/Z30 replacement.

    Posted via CB10
    The Z30 may be getting old but this 12 month old device is still pretty much on par with the latest iPhone, and in some ways, still craps all over it. I just updated from Z10 and couldn't be happier.
    Playbook007 and gfondeur like this.
    09-28-14 03:38 AM
  14. MarsupilamiX's Avatar
    Isn't it safe to say the out of the 99.5% that do what a touch screen, less than 0.5% want a BlackBerry touch screen device? And if so then BlackBerry is smart to cement themselves as the king of QWERTY since no one can match them in that space.

    This is of course conjecture, there's many other factors that go into play that none of us actually know; but I do think you're over-generalizing the 99.5% and saying they would all equally give a BlackBerry touch screen device a fair chance, but the reality is that the vast majority of that 99.5% wouldn't even fathom getting a BlackBerry touch screen device.

    Posted via CB10
    1) BlackBerry doesn't cement itself in the keyboard niche, they already did that some years ago.
    BlackBerry basically owns the whole keyboard sector anyhow.

    2) The keyboard segment is a shrinking one.
    There haven't been any gains in years, concerning this part of the market.

    And we should all know what usually happens when a manufacturer specialises in an ever shrinking niche:
    He disappears together with the niche.

    3) It's not safe at all to say that smartphone buyers don't want a BlackBerry touchscreen device.

    First of all, the Z10/Z30 outsold the Q5/Q10.

    Secondly, the Z10/Z30 had an atrocious launch, both had some of the worst ad/marketing/PR strategy in years, both were incredibly overpriced at launch and both never had the specs, ecosystem, or apps they should have had, when they cost around 600$/Euro.

    Thirdly, we have no idea how big the demand for something like the Passport is.
    The 200k Passport sold could have been the pent-up demand, and after that sales disappear.
    Or the 200k could just be the beginning of a huge "comeback"
    And then we have everything in between.

    We do know, that 99.5% of the market doesn't want a keyboard though, so even if the Passport is something like a success, it will never be able to come remotely close to a touchscreen device that is even a little bit popular.

    In other words, BlackBerry owns about 100% of the keyboard niche, which translates into 0.5% of the overall market.
    Now, as long as BlackBerry is at least able to convince 1% of the rest of the touchscreen market, they would by far sell more touchscreen phones than keyboard ones.

    I agree with your last point, BlackBerry won't convince the majority of touchscreen users to switch. But that shouldn't be the goal at this point.
    If they can convince a small part of those 99.5%, they will sell far more phones, than if they concentrate on the keyboard niche.

    Overall, I would therefore say that BlackBerry isn't smart to focus even more on keyboards, because they own the market anyhow.
    One might call it natural selection, as BlackBerry is the only manufacturer who still sells keyboard phones.

    All of those are reasons why I can't agree with you and why I think that it's incredibly stupid to not have launched a new touchscreen flagship by now.

    There is also the possibility that the whole keyboard phone thing becomes a self fulfilling prophecy:
    As BlackBerry cares less and less about touchscreen phones, and they focus more and more on keyboards, it's only natural when their touchscreen offerings would become less appealing .

    Which is also a scenario BlackBerry shouldn't want.

    Posted via CB10
    09-28-14 04:03 AM
  15. ZeroBarrier's Avatar
    I think the issue some touch screen users are having is wanting more than just the Z3; because even if BlackBerry decided to released the Z3 globally most Z10 and Z30 users wouldn't have bothered getting one. I do think BlackBerry should have released the Z3 globally though, and try their hand at an affordable touch screen device in markets other than the emerging markets like India.

    In truth, I think that overall BlackBerry has taken a good road. They released the Z30 and more recently the Z3, now the Passport and soon the Classic. Next year we will certainly see another touch screen device; whether it's a flagship, mid-range or low-end device remains to be seen however. Blend is also positioning itself to be one of those features to entice users toward BlackBerry, even if it's a small business oriented amount of users.

    The company is running lean now, focusing on their strengths and playing the best possible hands; so all in all everything is looking brighter and brighter with each passing quarter.

    Posted via CB10
    09-28-14 04:20 AM
  16. menshawy's Avatar
    Current strategy of BlackBerry is right and any other strategies could have had fatal impacts on them.

    They currently need:

    1) remind people of BlackBerry, that it's not gone and still can surprise them
    2) get attention from media, either positively or negatively the point is it saves BlackBerry the buck they could spend on marketing
    3) some cash, even if it's not billions, with the strategy of cost cuts, each penny now can be helpful

    After this they could invest in the high end consumer market. While they didn't stop investing in it actually, but they are in low end to midrange devices.

    Z30 is a great upgrade and it won't be slow or feel dated in two years from now. And anyway there is news in the horizon of the next possible touch flagship that could be announced in MWC, March 2015

    Check out my photography channel
    09-28-14 04:58 AM
  17. Emaderton3's Avatar
    If it is a niche that will go away, then why are high end cars like Ferrari still in business? They haven't gone away. Lambourghini? Jaguar?

    Posted via CB10
    09-28-14 06:18 AM
  18. kbz1960's Avatar
    If it is a niche that will go away, then why are high end cars like Ferrari still in business? They haven't gone away. Lambourghini? Jaguar?

    Posted via CB10
    Because they cost more than other cars they can do the selling less as people still buy them. Plus cars last a lot longer than phones. Now bb could try the same thing but I doubt very many would pay more for them than any other phone.
    MarsupilamiX likes this.
    09-28-14 06:28 AM
  19. Emaderton3's Avatar
    Because they cost more than other cars they can do the selling less as people still buy them. Plus cars last a lot longer than phones. Now bb could try the same thing but I doubt very many would pay more for them than any other phone.
    John Chen said BlackBerry can continue to sell phones as long as they sell 10 million a year. That will keep that part of the business afloat. Sounds like a niche to me. If the bulk of these sales are keyboard phones, then I imagine that will be all they will continue to make.

    And some do yearn for a keyboard phone and want to switch but are hesitant. Else, there would be no reason why investors spent time and money in developing the keyboard that attached to iPhones.

    Regardless, I think they would be wise to stay the course and get positive name brand recognition back first. If that happens, then perhaps a push on touchscreen phones will resume.

    Posted via CB10
    gfondeur likes this.
    09-28-14 06:45 AM
  20. Emaderton3's Avatar
    John Chen said BlackBerry can continue to sell phones as long as they sell 10 million a year. That will keep that part of the business afloat. Sounds like a niche to me. If the bulk of these sales are keyboard phones, then I imagine that will be all they will continue to make.

    And some do yearn for a keyboard phone and want to switch but are hesitant. Else, there would be no reason why investors spent time and money in developing the keyboard that attached to iPhones.

    Regardless, I think they would be wise to stay the course and get positive name brand recognition back first. If that happens, then perhaps a push on touchscreen phones will resume. Why go after a market you failed in without first trying to be successful in one you once were?

    Posted via CB10


    Posted via CB10
    09-28-14 06:51 AM
  21. Banco's Avatar
    There doubtless will be an all touch phone, for the reasons people are saying - it keeps everyone who wants one inside the tent. Just because the focus is on the enterprise sector doesn't mean they want to turn away everyone else.

    It's actually a deliberate repeat of what they did accidentally some years back - targeting the corporate sector and hoping the rest follows. And corporates like touchscreen as well as keyboard phones, so it needs to be an option.

    The Z30 is fine for now (notwithstanding some don't want it) and a replacement will happen no doubt. The Passport is the halo product. Some will look at the Passport and buy the Z30 or the Z10 since its cheap. It's the whole point of having a range.

    Posted via CB10
    09-28-14 06:55 AM
  22. MarsupilamiX's Avatar
    If it is a niche that will go away, then why are high end cars like Ferrari still in business? They haven't gone away. Lambourghini? Jaguar?

    Posted via CB10
    Have you looked up the sales stats for luxury goods, in our case, cars?

    That's not a shrinking niche, that's a growing one.
    There were never, in the whole history of humanity, more luxury cars sold than today.

    You might also want to check on Jaguar again.
    They are cheaper than the equivalent BMW and Mercedes. Not by much, but slightly cheaper.

    You also seem to have the completely wrong analogy at hand.
    You are comparing luxury goods with very distinct USPs (cars) to mass consumer goods. That's something that doesn't work.

    "Everyone" in "developed" markets can afford an iPhone on contract, if he so desires.
    The same does not apply, in any way, to a 200000$ car.

    Also, you might want to check the history behind brands like Ferrari and Lamborghini.
    They went through many different periods of crises, just to end up as a part of another enterprise.

    Ferrari is now owned by Fiat, and Lamborghini is owned by VW. Lamborghini did go into bankruptcy before they found a new owner though.

    So the answer to your question has 2 parts:
    1) You are comparing things, that have nothing in common.
    Neither their relative value, nor their absolute one, nor the business model, nor their importance in the marketplace nor the category of product they represent (luxury good vs mass consumption).

    2) Those brands still exist because other enterprises were willing to invest in them, and because they took over those brands, while integrating them into their group structure.

    Because they cost more than other cars they can do the selling less as people still buy them. Plus cars last a lot longer than phones. Now bb could try the same thing but I doubt very many would pay more for them than any other phone.
    The cynic in me, tells me, that they did exactly that with the PlayBook, Z10, Z30 and Q5.

    The cynic in me then proceeds to tell me how good that worked.

    Posted via CB10
    kbz1960 likes this.
    09-28-14 07:03 AM
  23. bakron1's Avatar
    I do laugh when I hear folks tell me that most businesses professionals have moved into all touch devices and prefer them over the physical keyboard ones. The majority of the business folks I have talked to hate their all touch devices and would gladly have their physical keyboard BlackBerry devices back because it was simple to use and just worked.

    Most devices supplied for corporate folks have limited Internet access anyways and are used primarily for email and messaging and is where BlackBerry really shines. You would be surprised how many times I hear folks tell me "I want my BlackBerry back".

    Sent from my awesome passport on T Mobile USA (10.3.0.1154)
    Banco, Playbook007 and gfondeur like this.
    09-28-14 07:08 AM
  24. MarsupilamiX's Avatar
    John Chen said BlackBerry can continue to sell phones as long as they sell 10 million a year. That will keep that part of the business afloat. Sounds like a niche to me. If the bulk of these sales are keyboard phones, then I imagine that will be all they will continue to make.
    But the bulk of those phones aren't keyboard phones.

    The Z line outsells the Q line....

    And some do yearn for a keyboard phone and want to switch but are hesitant. Else, there would be no reason why investors spent time and money in developing the keyboard that attached to iPhones.
    Completely wrong reasoning sorry.
    I probably couldn't make you a list of all the failed investments that happened since humanity conducts business, because the list would be too huge.

    Just because someone pours money into something, does not mean, in any way, that it makes sense to do that.

    Now, apart from that: How many accessories did the guy sell?
    How many millions were sold until today?

    Regardless, I think they would be wise to stay the course and get positive name brand recognition back first. If that happens, then perhaps a push on touchscreen phones will resume.

    Posted via CB10
    The positive brand recognition would happen if you give the 99.5% of the market which buys touchscreens what they want, not the 0.5% you own anyhow.

    Also, as was said before, Z sales > Q sales.

    Posted via CB10
    kbz1960 likes this.
    09-28-14 07:15 AM
  25. ALToronto's Avatar
    Passports are sold out across Canada, on Amazon and BlackBerry. I don't think that 99.5% of the market wants touchscreen phones, the OP and other TS fans are projecting their own preferences onto the entire market.

    A lot of professionals are tired of endless editing of emails or appearing as semi-literate imbeciles through their writing. It's just that BlackBerry hadn't released a kb phone that was worth switching to - until now.

    Posted via CB10
    Playbook007 likes this.
    09-28-14 07:27 AM
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