07-06-10 09:11 PM
190 123 ...
tools
  1. Matt_AC's Avatar
    Once upon a time, if you needed to send/receive emails from your phone frequently, or if your email was managed via an Exchange server, then BlackBerry was the obvious choice. Coupled with BIS/BES servers, BlackBerry was truly the market leader in enterprise messaging solutions from small to large businesses worldwide. Later in the game, as we all know, BlackBerry began intentionally marketing to residential consumers by offering applications along with APIs to write your own applications, and the Blackberry Storm was obviously their answer to the touchscreen smartphone market in an attempt to compete.

    Here's my question -- It's now June of 2010. Let's say you're a salesman for RIM. I walk into the store. I lay down a Droid Incredible and an Apple iPhone and ask you what, with the exception of BlackBerry Messenger and pin-to-pin PINGs, can the BlackBerry do that the iPhone or my HTC Droid Incredible cannot? I touched upon this a bit in a few posts I made earlier which are here and here. What would you say to me?

    I own a BlackBerry Curve 8310 for work, and I used to own a BlackBerry Storm 9530. I'm very familiar with the BlackBerry OS and their various devices. I've upgraded OSs, I've intentionally bricked and rebuilt them, I've done custom modifications, I've taken over managing the BES server at work when needed... what I'm saying is that I'm not ignorant to BlackBerry, and I'm coming from an informed place. And I really, truly feel that that BlackBerry is beginning a path to irrelevance. Everything they once had a stronghold on is now being done by others, and being done better, unless I'm mistaken, and they do offer something(s) unique. If that's the case, what am I missing? What is the reason, at this point, that somebody would choose a BlackBerry over a Droid or an iPhone, other than being uncomfortable with change?

    As a reference point, I am now an HTC Droid Incredible owner.

    P.S. - If I gave any indication that I am trolling, I promise that I am not! I am genuinely curious about the BlackBerry community's feelings on the topic of the relevance of BlackBerry in the current smartphone market.
    06-27-10 07:52 PM
  2. Heavy Fluid's Avatar
    Threads like this pop up all the time. I have one thing to say. Who cares? BB is not for everyone. If you want a fragile toy with poor battery life, get one of those. If you want a workhorse with great battery life, that gets the job done, get a BB.
    06-27-10 08:26 PM
  3. _StephenBB81's Avatar
    Simply put, I would say that BB has the best tacticle input method available in the smartphone world today, the ability to touch type.

    and you can not take out the advantages of BBM/PINtoPIN, that is a major feature of BB that has yet to be matched on other devices, seeing when a message is delievered is so useful when trying to plan things in low signal areas and not just assuming things have gone out, the always on element of it again is very nice for contant communication.

    Removalble media storage and changeable batteries would also be something I would push, as well as the durability added with an Otterbox is unmatched even using an otterbox on the touchscreen devices or slider devices because of the size of the potential screen breaking point, ( you can place a peice of plexiglass in the otterbox for the screen to be fully protected making it amazing for contruction sites.


    the iPhone and Driod DO have a bunch of fun features. but the I like my BB, and above are reasons it is superior,

    and we still don't even know what OS6 will have to offer,
    06-27-10 08:40 PM
  4. Heavy Fluid's Avatar
    One thing I forgot to mention. Security. Want security? Get a BB. Want to possibly lose your information? Go the other route.
    06-27-10 08:51 PM
  5. jrdtechdotnet's Avatar
    How don't see how BB is any less fragile then other smart phones? Anyway the traditional BB form factor is the best texting while driving phone that's a plus!! Frankly for me the form factor is it's only saving grace, I like the keyboard and one handed operation (kidding about the driving, I don't do that) but I have an upgrade due soon so I might give the Droid X or Incredible a good try. Your right though BB with out BES has nothing really to offer over the competitors. My grip is their hardware, I mentioned this before, how can the Bold 9650 have the same cpu running at the same speed as least years model Tour 9630. Processors got faster and more efficient yet RIM stays with a year old cpu while HTC and Motorola are seemingly cracking out fast smarter phones on a monthly basis.
    06-27-10 08:52 PM
  6. jrdtechdotnet's Avatar
    One thing I forgot to mention. Security. Want security? Get a BB. Want to possibly lose your information? Go the other route.
    Even for a non-BES user?
    06-27-10 08:56 PM
  7. Matt_AC's Avatar
    If you want a fragile toy with poor battery life, get one of those. If you want a workhorse with great battery life, that gets the job done, get a BB.
    I don't understand where this sentiment comes from. I've handled BlackBerry models from the Pearl to the Curve to the Bold to the Tour to the Storm, and they don't feel any more durable than my HTC Droid Incredible or my neighbor's iPhone. If that's what you mean by "workhorse," I think you're just being biased, because it's just not true.

    As far as the "toy" comment, my Droid Incredible "toy" regularly initiates Remote Desktop connections to my work's domain controller and Exchange server through our perimeter firewall via port forwarding. I'm running an FTP server on my Droid as well, to more easily send/receive data when needed. It syncs with the Exchange server at work, too; true sync, and without even needing to use our BES server! It's remarkable, and I would absolutely call it getting "the job done." Were there to be a full migration to the Droid platform in our office, our BES server could be decommissioned, and the hardware could be recycled for a different server-based purpose altogether.

    A smart phone is what you make it to be. I'm glad to hear that you're enjoying your BlackBerry, but calling non-BlackBerry phones fragile toys is totally incorrect.

    The battery comment is 100% true, though. That one I give you. I have to charge mine twice per day. My Storm could easily go 48 hours.

    we still don't even know what OS6 will have to offer
    This is definitely something to consider. Any press releases discussing RIM's OS6 yet?
    Last edited by mattjh; 06-27-10 at 09:03 PM.
    06-27-10 08:59 PM
  8. Matt_AC's Avatar
    One thing I did neglect to hand to BlackBerry's favor is BES server, which basically gives an admin GPO-esque powers to limit what an employee can and cannot do with their BlackBerry, while permitting group-push of OS updates, new IT policies, etc. This is a pretty big deal, actually. For a residential / casual user, though, I still can't think of a reason to choose a BlackBerry when all of the other options out there are capable of doing so much more. And even in a corporate environment, there's no need to invest in purchasing, configuring, and maintaining a BES server unless you do need the GPO-esque abilities. The days of needing BES simply for Exchange sync are gone. Both the Droid and iPhone can do this now.
    Last edited by mattjh; 06-27-10 at 09:08 PM.
    06-27-10 09:06 PM
  9. Motorcycle Mama's Avatar
    ..... What is the reason, at this point, that somebody would choose a BlackBerry over a Droid or an iPhone, other than being uncomfortable with change?
    Quality physical keyboard.
    06-27-10 09:11 PM
  10. Matt_AC's Avatar
    the durability added with an Otterbox is unmatched even using an otterbox on the touchscreen devices or slider devices because of the size of the potential screen breaking point, ( you can place a peice of plexiglass in the otterbox for the screen to be fully protected making it amazing for contruction sites.
    I had an OtterBox for my BlackBerry Storm 9530 and I never thought it protected it any less than a non-touchscreen device (unless I'm misunderstanding you). It doesn't really matter what type of phone the Otterbox is protecting. If it's an Otterbox, your phone is virtually indestructible; BlackBerry, Droid, iPhone, or other! :)
    06-27-10 09:11 PM
  11. Matt_AC's Avatar
    Quality physical keyboard.
    BlackBerry does produce very nice keyboards, but I never thought they were the best. Oddly enough, my favorite non-touch keyboard I've ever handled was on the Verizon Qualcomm eNV. That phone was pretty great during the pre-smartphone age. Loved it. But yes, the keyboard is nice. Then again, I'd imagine the amount of people out there who would purchase a cellphone specifically for its keyboard over all of the other features and abilities are slim to almost-none.
    06-27-10 09:15 PM
  12. Laura Knotek's Avatar
    BlackBerry does produce very nice keyboards, but I never thought they were the best. Oddly enough, my favorite non-touch keyboard I've ever handled was on the Verizon Qualcomm eNV. That phone was pretty great during the pre-smartphone age. Loved it. But yes, the keyboard is nice. Then again, I'd imagine the amount of people out there who would purchase a cellphone specifically for its keyboard over all of the other features and abilities are slim to almost-none.
    One of my friends liked the Android OS. However, he took the Droid back. He was unable to type on the touchscreen or the tiny physical keyboard. When he used the Droid for 2 weeks, his e-mails looked like they were written by someone who was not fluent in the English language.
    06-27-10 09:18 PM
  13. FuzzyB's Avatar
    Ok Matt...question: I own a business and manage multiple email accts (not gmail)...and I rely on speed in responding to requests and orders. Have closed many of deals using my BB and the email push speed. Is there another device out there than can compete with a BB in email?

    Posted from my CrackBerry at wapforums.crackberry.com
    06-27-10 09:27 PM
  14. Matt_AC's Avatar
    One of my friends liked the Android OS. However, he took the Droid back. He was unable to type on the touchscreen or the tiny physical keyboard. When he used the Droid for 2 weeks, his e-mails looked like they were written by someone who was not fluent in the English language.
    Interesting! There's certainly a learning curve going from a tactile to a touchscreen keyboard, but it usually just takes a few days. I'm typing on my Incredible right now.

    The quick brown fox jumps over a lazy dog
    Pneumonoultramicroscopicsilicovolcanoconiosis

    Shrug. A little practice is all, and a determination to adapt. When I went from my tactile eNV to the Storm 9530, I spent the first few days stopping myself from shattering it out the window, but I was resolved to get used to it. Eventually, I did, and now it feels weird typing on actual buttons. Human brains are weird, I guess.
    06-27-10 09:32 PM
  15. Matt_AC's Avatar
    Ok Matt...question: I own a business and manage multiple email accts (not gmail)...and I rely on speed in responding to requests and orders. Have closed many of deals using my BB and the email push speed. Is there another device out there than can compete with a BB in email?

    Posted from my CrackBerry at wapforums.crackberry.com
    Are you comfortable divulging your email setup? Do you have your email hosted elsewhere, or is it via a local mail server? If the former, is it POP or IMAP? If the latter, is BES involved?
    06-27-10 09:37 PM
  16. SnoozerBold's Avatar
    I like (love) my Blackberry Bold. End of story for me. what other phones have doesn't matter to me as this one does what I need.

    Posted from my CrackBerry at wapforums.crackberry.com
    06-27-10 09:39 PM
  17. FuzzyB's Avatar
    Are you comfortable divulging your email setup? Do you have your email hosted elsewhere, or is it via a local mail server? If the former, is it POP or IMAP? If the latter, is BES involved?
    POP...no BES.

    Posted from my CrackBerry at wapforums.crackberry.com
    06-27-10 09:41 PM
  18. Heavy Fluid's Avatar
    I don't understand where this sentiment comes from. I've handled BlackBerry models from the Pearl to the Curve to the Bold to the Tour to the Storm, and they don't feel any more durable than my HTC Droid Incredible or my neighbor's iPhone. If that's what you mean by "workhorse," I think you're just being biased, because it's just not true.

    As far as the "toy" comment, my Droid Incredible "toy" regularly initiates Remote Desktop connections to my work's domain controller and Exchange server through our perimeter firewall via port forwarding. I'm running an FTP server on my Droid as well, to more easily send/receive data when needed. It syncs with the Exchange server at work, too; true sync, and without even needing to use our BES server! It's remarkable, and I would absolutely call it getting "the job done." Were there to be a full migration to the Droid platform in our office, our BES server could be decommissioned, and the hardware could be recycled for a different server-based purpose altogether.

    A smart phone is what you make it to be. I'm glad to hear that you're enjoying your BlackBerry, but calling non-BlackBerry phones fragile toys is totally incorrect.

    The battery comment is 100% true, though. That one I give you. I have to charge mine twice per day. My Storm could easily go 48 hours.



    This is definitely something to consider. Any press releases discussing RIM's OS6 yet?
    When I say work horse, I mean work. Email, browsing, BBM, getting things done. I don't need an app to get multiple push email accounts on my device. I add it via the BIS website.

    It has nothing to do with durability, but since you mentioned that, I will bring up the new iPhone4 and it's glass housing. Durable? I think not. Look on the internet. Read how fragile this phone is. Drop that once versus a BlackBerry, even the Storm, and see what the outcome is.
    06-27-10 09:45 PM
  19. Matt_AC's Avatar
    When I say work horse, I mean work. Email, browsing, BBM, getting things done. I don't need an app to get multiple push email accounts on my device. I add it via the BIS website.
    I guess I still don't understand. I'm able to all of that, too, without an app. With the exception of BBM, obviously - I just use SMS or GTalk for that function.
    06-27-10 09:48 PM
  20. tomemail's Avatar
    I love the pure functional abillities that my BB provides. I use Windows Live Msngr with all work (office) contacts at our company, I use BBM, have multiple email accounts, SMS, internet and phone going seemingly all the time and on a Windows Mobile or Android, it just hammers the battery. BB just goes and goes.
    Do other platforms like above have the ability to filter out emails like the BB does under security? I have selected to only get email from those in my contacts (about 1000 people) and had Android & WIndows Mobile. The spam was a killer. Those phones also seem to work harder to send and receive email than BB.
    Of course there are some things the others have that I wish BB had, but overall, the way things stand now, BB is the only one that wouldn't drive me nuts. With Android, I enjoyed a lot about it, but was constantly having to fuss with something to keep it funtional. I find BB's Facebook app pretty buggy in comparison as well. Not a deal breaker as my phone is mainly a work phone, but Android kicks BB all over the place in that.

    just my 2 cents
    06-27-10 10:12 PM
  21. exelant's Avatar
    Matt, at best you are being disingenuous. You post on a BlackBerry website that BlackBerries are becoming irrelevant, and then say you're not being a troll. Then ask us to say what we like about our devices so you can disagree with almost all comments with statements like "I can do that too." And then feel proud of yourself for putting us poor deluded BlackBerry owners in our places. Please spare us your exercise in self-aggrandizement.
    Why don't you find a nice Android site where you can talk about how wonderful your device is and how smart you are for buying it to a receptive audience - and you'll be able to do it without criticizing anyone else's choices.

    Posted from my CrackBerry at wapforums.crackberry.com
    06-27-10 10:13 PM
  22. Matt_AC's Avatar
    Matt, at best you are being disingenuous. You post on a BlackBerry website that BlackBerries are becoming irrelevant, and then say you're not being a troll. Then ask us to say what we like about our devices so you can disagree with almost all comments with statements like "I can do that too." And then feel proud of yourself for putting us poor deluded BlackBerry owners in our places. Please spare us your exercise in self-aggrandizement.
    Why don't you find a nice Android site where you can talk about how wonderful your device is and how smart you are for buying it to a receptive audience - and you'll be able to do it without criticizing anyone else's choices
    I'm not disagreeing to disagree. I'm sifting through the information to find unique things that BlackBerry offers that other smartphones do not. So far, it's BBM, a good tactile keyboard, and BES for group policy management in corporate environments. There's a reason I posted this thread; I'm doing research for a client. I apologize if I have come off in any way condescending, aggrandizing, or disingenuous. It was not my intent.

    I do admit that there's a feel of looking backwards in time, though, and I'm sure that comes through in some sort of flavor in my posts. Sorry about that. It's unavoidable, but I'm trying.
    06-27-10 10:18 PM
  23. alby4ever's Avatar
    One thing I forgot to mention. Security. Want security? Get a BB. Want to possibly lose your information? Go the other route.
    Security? For who? How many BIS users are more secure than Android and iPhone users? You obviously don't know jack.

    Android and iPhone smartphones can be wiped if they're lost. How's that for secure? If your BB gets lost and you don't have a password on it, tell me what this "security" is going to do?

    Let me guess: you're a very important person who has high-level information on your BB and that's why you need the security? Because if not, security is not an argument for BB. Keep reaching and making stuff up buddy.
    06-27-10 10:18 PM
  24. Matt_AC's Avatar
    POP...no BES.
    Got it. I wish I could help! I don't use traditional POP on my Droid, so I don't have direct experience to give you input. It looks like this may get you started, though. The Droid has both a "Gmail" app and a "Mail" app. The "Mail" app is for POP or Exchange push/pull from non-Google email accounts.
    06-27-10 10:25 PM
  25. Heavy Fluid's Avatar
    Security? For who? How many BIS users are more secure than Android and iPhone users? You obviously don't know jack.

    Android and iPhone smartphones can be wiped if they're lost. How's that for secure? If your BB gets lost and you don't have a password on it, tell me what this "security" is going to do?

    Let me guess: you're a very important person who has high-level information on your BB and that's why you need the security? Because if not, security is not an argument for BB. Keep reaching and making stuff up buddy.
    Read it and weep.

    https://www.smrtguard.com/index.jsp
    06-27-10 10:26 PM
190 123 ...
LINK TO POST COPIED TO CLIPBOARD