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09-23-13 10:52 AM
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  1. ronniell's Avatar
    As we all watch the tumbling down of the biggest Tech Company in Canadian history, I find it hard to comprehend, how the government is just sitting back and just watching all this happen. I mean, that has to be the biggest brand out of Canada as nobody hears anything else from that silent country. I deem it as a big shame on them. We all saw what happened to the American auto industry. Job cuts, dwindling sales and all that, but guess who saved them? It was the government, Obama went about making sure he revived the industry and now they seem to be doing ok. Now, take a look at the situation at canada, the government only put out a statement stating, they keeping an eye on what's happening with blackberry. Which concerned government does that. This has just solidified how i view Canadians. The quiet type that just sits back with their hands folded and watch it all crumble down. I don't even think the citizens are that concerned, so it's no surprise this company will come crushing down.
    Chicago777Guy likes this.
    09-21-13 09:55 AM
  2. CrackedBarry's Avatar
    Eh... It's hardly the Canadians governments fault that Blackberry ran itself into the ground, is it?

    And what do you suggest that they'd do? Call in the army to force people to buy Z10s at gunpoint?

    The buying public didnt take to the Z10 and BB10. There's a reason for that. Many. But there isn't much the government could do.

    Sure, they could throw a couple of billion dollars at BBRY but A: that would be illegal (per NAFTA and WTO) and B: it would probably be throwing good money after bad money. If BBRYs 3 billion dollars couldn't help, why would an extra couple of billion?
    09-21-13 09:59 AM
  3. wjptam's Avatar
    Why should the Canadian government be shamed by the incompetence of a private enterprise? The first tenet of the market is that people are rewarded and punished for their decisions.

    Instead of competing with the iPhone they dismissed as a toy. They face the consequences of that decision. And the most successful brand out of Canada is Lululemon, at least they know what their customers want, make it and charge much more than its worth.
    09-21-13 10:01 AM
  4. kbz1960's Avatar
    So who else should your government bail out or help?
    09-21-13 10:05 AM
  5. Roo Zilla's Avatar
    What's the Canadian government going to do? Pass a law that requires each Canadian citizen to buy at least 3 BlackBerries each? Now if you're talking bailout..... why does BBRY need one? They have $2.6B in cash and no debt.
    09-21-13 10:09 AM
  6. amazinglygraceless's Avatar
    There is an enormous difference between BlackBerry and the US auto industry. The collapse of BlackBerry will surely hurt but it will not have anywhere near the same effect as that of the auto industry tanking.

    With the auto industry you have billions upon billions of dollars not to mention millions of jobs from the manufacturers, dealerships, part suppliers, retailers and all the related ancillary concerns. The effect on the countries economy plus the massive spike in the already abysmal unemployment / underemployment numbers would have been devastating.

    Can you honestly say that even if BlackBerry were to fold it would have the same probable effect on Canada and it's economy? Of course not and that is why the Canadian government bears no shame for the "demise" of BBRY nor should they intervene to save it. (Mind you, I said "SHOULD". If they decide to then good on them)
    09-21-13 10:09 AM
  7. CrackedBarry's Avatar
    I wonder how many billions of dollars it would actually take to "bail BBRY out" and put them in a position where they could survive on their own.

    (First step would obviously be to clean house thoroughly. Everybody above a mid-level managerial position should be fired, though be free to reapply for the job.)

    Ten billion dollars? At least thereabouts... It would take 3 years, if not more, and even then there are no guarantees of success.
    09-21-13 10:10 AM
  8. ray689's Avatar
    Hey OP, when you cite those American Corps and say the government saved them...you do realize it was the people and their tax dollars that did that right?
    As much as I want blackberry to succeed, I don't want the government to "save" them. I want to live in a true free market. BlackBerry had it all and pissed it away and ran the company into the ground. In no way, shape or form should the tax payers of Canada have to bail them out for incompetence of their so called "executives".
    All this bailout would mean is a big bonus for Thor and the gang if it went anything like the US bailout.

    And finally, if it's bailouts you want...maybe focus on the small companies that would truly need it to compete rather than a company that was worth hundreds of billions and ran their operation into the ground due to plain stupidity.

    Posted via CB10
    Berry_Pink, JeepBB and kbz1960 like this.
    09-21-13 10:13 AM
  9. amazinglygraceless's Avatar
    I wonder how many billions of dollars it would actually take to "bail BBRY out" and put them in a position where they could survive on their own.

    (First step would obviously be to clean house thoroughly. Everybody above a mid-level managerial position should be fired, though be free to reapply for the job.)

    Ten billion dollars? At least thereabouts... It would take 3 years, if not more, and even then there are no guarantees of success.
    Then you are left with the question; after all the years of missteps and truly atrocious decisions who would want to invest that amount of money and time? You would literally have to resign / commit yourself to rebooting and completely reinventing the company.
    09-21-13 10:14 AM
  10. berklon's Avatar
    The idea of the Canadian government bailing out Blackberry is ludicrous.

    Remember, when you're saying the Canadian government - you're actually saying taxpayers.

    The taxpayers are buying the competing products, so why should they have to pay their hard-earned money to support a company that makes products they don't like?

    And if we're supposed to be footing the bill for Blackberry's losses, why didn't I get a cut when they were making profits? It works both ways... screw the socialized losses/privatized profits scenario.

    Blackberry has no one to blame but themselves for this mess - and the taxpayers shouldn't be left to pay for their stupidity.

    The only thing the Canadian government should do is mandate that the history of Blackberry be taught in economics and business classes in College/University. There's a huge lesson to be learned here and students should learn how NOT to run a company.
    imz, ray689, app_Developer and 3 others like this.
    09-21-13 10:23 AM
  11. CrackedBarry's Avatar
    True...

    As much as people talk about the board of directors and management being to blame at BBRY, I really think it goes deeper than that.

    The whole company must have bred a culture of arrogance, indifference, and complacency. An army of yesmen, sticking around for the paycheck.

    If you look back at tech pundits in 2009-2010, even back then they were warning BBRY that they're falling behind. Didn't anybody at the company see what was becoming fairly obvious?!?
    09-21-13 10:23 AM
  12. stabstabdie's Avatar
    It's called capitalism
    09-21-13 10:24 AM
  13. jh07's Avatar
    Hey OP, when you cite those American Corps and say the government saved them...you do realize it was the people and their tax dollars that did that right?
    As much as I want blackberry to succeed, I don't want the government to "save" them. I want to live in a true free market. BlackBerry had it all and pissed it away and ran the company into the ground. In no way, shape or form should the tax payers of Canada have to bail them out for incompetence of their so called "executives".
    All this bailout would mean is a big bonus for Thor and the gang if it went anything like the US bailout.

    And finally, if it's bailouts you want...maybe focus on the small companies that would truly need it to compete rather than a company that was worth hundreds of billions and ran their operation into the ground due to plain stupidity.

    Posted via CB10
    Got that right, TAXPAYERS! I'd like to see if the Canadian taxpayers want to be paid back with BlackBerry stock like US taxpayers were with GM and Chrysler.

    Posted via CB10
    ray689 likes this.
    09-21-13 10:25 AM
  14. raggdoll's Avatar
    Shame on the management of BB, both past and present. What the hell does the government have to do with anything????????.
    09-21-13 10:26 AM
  15. ronniell's Avatar
    Lulemon!? I bet it's only known to Canadians. Never heard of it. Have no idea what they even about. And I strongly doubt they are popular than blackberry
    09-21-13 11:15 AM
  16. ronniell's Avatar
    I do agree with you that there's a big difference but the point was for government to intervene when their most popular companies start folding. If not for anything, at least, blackberry has put the country in the fore front when it comes to technology. I barely knew anything about canada, but I've learnt a little bit more from being a blackberry user.
    Last edited by ronniell; 09-21-13 at 11:36 AM.
    wincyUt likes this.
    09-21-13 11:24 AM
  17. notfanboy's Avatar
    Yes, shame on the Canadian government for their policies on science.

    Stand up for science! (This post is completely serious BTW)

    Stand Up for Science rallies target federal government - Technology & Science - CBC News
    09-21-13 11:33 AM
  18. R Field's Avatar
    The government hasn't even bought a ton of BlackBerry 10 devices. That pisses me off that they won't support their own countries major tech companies. They spend all this wasted money on the action plan commercials but can't even invest I'm our tech industry growth.

    CB10 - Z10 -10.2.0.1725
    09-21-13 11:47 AM
  19. the_sleuth's Avatar
    Canadian politics is no different than U.S. or European countries. It's all about political calculus. The federal government (led by Progressive Conservatives) and provincial government (Ontario Liberal Party, the "democrats" for American perspective) just announced this week a major investment (government money) into Ford plant in Oakville, Ontario:

    Ford invests $700 million in Oakville plant, secures 2,800 jobs | Toronto Star

    Now this riding (Halton Region) is led by Lisa Raitt (Progressive Conservative Minister of Transport). A woman prone to scandal:

    The real shame in the Raitt scandal - Paul Wells - Macleans.ca

    Auto industry is a major lobbying group (both the unions and manufacturers) with money for the ears of Kevin Flynn (Liberal MPP of Oakville in provincial government) and Lisa Raitt.

    The problem with tech industry in Canada, it is not as well organized politically as the auto industry. This was proven the Nortel fiasco.

    Lobbying with money speaks and all the more surprising since Peter Braid (Progressive Conservative serving Kitchener-Waterloo Region in federal Parliament in Ottawa) represents BlackBerry's riding. There are a lot of auto parts manufacturers in his riding.

    Follow the money trail folks....
    09-21-13 12:14 PM
  20. TGR1's Avatar
    Lulemon!? I bet it's only known to Canadians. Never heard of it. Have no idea what they even about. And I strongly doubt they are popular than blackberry
    Popular sports clothing line primarily for a certain body type woman that's getting a bit of bad press for some of their aesthetics policies (iow, as a big girl myself they aren't of interest to me). Stock sizzled for awhile due to rapid growth.
    09-21-13 12:51 PM
  21. Darlaten's Avatar
    There's a lot to shame about the Canadian government - the fact that it's conservative, forces scientists to be silent, refuses to listen to academic research and relies solely on political ideology and religious dogma - but blaming it for Blackberry's woes and demanding it to bail out a poorly run company is absurd. As a Canadian, I am glad that the government has not stepped in and will not, assuming Minister James Moores comments are accurate, step in. Blackberry lives or dies on their own - no way should my tax dollars be used to bail out this company.
    VJMotz, notfanboy and wjptam like this.
    09-21-13 01:09 PM
  22. BoldPreza's Avatar
    I'm glad they didn't bail them out. I don't want to live in a marketplace dominated by who can get what out of the government. They should be able to compete.

    We have done that far too long with companies like bombardier and protections for airlines like air Canada.

    If the pensions plans wanted to invest however I would be fine with that as its their job to find investments anyway.

    Posted via CB10
    09-21-13 01:13 PM
  23. Zedi Master's Avatar
    Eh... It's hardly the Canadians governments fault that Blackberry ran itself into the ground, is it?

    And what do you suggest that they'd do? Call in the army to force people to buy Z10s at gunpoint?

    The buying public didnt take to the Z10 and BB10. There's a reason for that. Many. But there isn't much the government could do.

    Sure, they could throw a couple of billion dollars at BBRY but A: that would be illegal (per NAFTA and WTO) and B: it would probably be throwing good money after bad money. If BBRYs 3 billion dollars couldn't help, why would an extra couple of billion?
    Did they declare military law, or roll out the army in the US to help the auto industry?

    Posted via CB10
    09-21-13 01:13 PM
  24. ronniell's Avatar
    Looks like the Canadians on here don't even support blackberry. I wonder what they offer to the outside market that is as popular as blackberry. Bailing a company out involves pushing for good leaders ad well. The new devices are now good enough to rival their competition. If anything, we can all see blackberry has learnt it's lessons and it's trying to push for success but with the comments am seeing from Canadians on here to me are quite disappointing. If we will all be totally honest, Apple is really selling because the American people have bought into the company, yeah, they doing a good job but Samsung galaxy line as a smartphone has a whole lot features than iphone. Samsung has pushed twice as much to beat apple and it's simply because Americans are still staying with the iPhone making it more difficult for Samsung. But if Canadians can't do the same, the death of their greatest tech company will be a laughing stock.
    NotGoodIMO likes this.
    09-21-13 01:33 PM
  25. wjptam's Avatar
    Lululemon generates $2000 per square foot of retail space. There are only two North American retailers that generate more revenue per square foot of store space. One is named after fruit, (not a berry) and the other is Tiffany and Co.

    Blackberry dreams that its fans were as successful at evangelizing the brand as those thin women in tight pants.
    JeepBB likes this.
    09-21-13 01:40 PM
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