[DuexNoir]

Ya, but then people will come here saying they copied apple and google, no?

Some are already saying that on the Net, calling out certain BB10 features as copies of Android and iOS. smh

Even before BB10 is fully released, it's already gotten bad rumours and bad press (mostly from biased opinions). The rumours will really hurt BB10, I think. Paints a negative image in consumer minds well before it reaches their hands. Trying to break that is going to be hard.

I believe in BB's case, the spreading of positive consumer experiences itself (i.e. word-of-mouth) may have a greater affect than marketing from RIM, since RIM has already lost the trust of many consumers. Most consumers will believe personal reviews from someone who has used the product over what RIM will say. Don't get me wrong, RIM marketing is very necessary to start this ball rolling but I just believe consumer comments will truly make the product fly if it turns out to be successful with an initial smaller consumer population.

[simu31]

IF the marketing team were to try and start marketing an unfinished and unavailable product now, they are very limited in how they can go about it.

The thing is, you can't show off features or hardware.

In my humble opinion, they need to start off by intelligently marketing the brand.

I sometimes cringe when I read some people's "marketing" ideas on a fan forum, but the geek side of me has had a brainstorm...

An all black background, with an almost invisible black rectangle (the new BB10 phone), after a few seconds of "zoom in" (yes I know it'll be hard to make out), the red led indicator just starts flashing (almost eerily). Then a fade to black and the words "We're back" in BlackBerry font.

Ok, I'll admit to being a Battlestar Galactica fan, and the whole eerie red flashing could be seen as similar to a "cylon" strobe thing, but the point is that you can build up expectations without actually having to show anything.

Then start to show some functionality once we get closer to launch.

Si.

[melb_me]

What RIM does not want is a front page video on Bloomberg like this:
Battelle: iPhone a 'Massive Fail', Apple Losing Way: Video - Bloomberg
It would appear iOS has the odd bug which is something RIM must avoid. I think this is the reason for the delay in BB10. It would appear Apple has walked right into the not ready for primetime software release. My mother-in-law in fact lost ALL her contacts on her iphone 4.

[glamrlama]

Marketing Schmarketing. This will be key. But what is "BlackBerry10"? I'm on this site (duh!) and I am a fan of BB and I don't know 100% what BB10 is. Is it a consumer device? Is it a business device? These will need to be marketed very differently. Am I buying one for personal use or am I buying 2000 of them for my employees?

Thor transcends both of these positions and says it is a "communication" device; for getting sh1t stuff done. Now how do you sell that effectively into what is essentially the uneducated masses? Part of this will certainly be apps apps apps running in a powerful handheld device. Part of this will be seamless integration of phone and social tools into peoples daily activities. Part of this will be "Wow! Betty did you just post the latest product demo on the company web site for review and invite everyone in the technical group and customer support group to the online presentation next Tuesday and tell everyone on Twitter the product is available on Wednesday in like 8 seconds?" "Uh, almost. I ordered those little sammiches everyone likes as well." When people see that they will BUY it in droves. Bring it RIM.

[shemaree09]

Yea I always get upset when someone tells me that they traded in their BlackBerry 8300 (released in 2007) for an iPhone 4S (released in 2011) They say BB sucks because their iPhone is WAY FASTER ect. OFCOURSE IT IS!!! it's 4 years NEWER! Grr

It also doesn't help that some companies still issue their employees old BB's. Last year the employees of a company we did business with were all issued BlackBerrys. The workers complained to me constantly about how slow their phones were & how after having used these phones they would never buy a BlackBerry for them selves. One day after hearing them complain, I asked to see their phone. They had been issued BlackBerry 8350i's (released 2008). I don't know where their employer had even found those phones, in the corner of a dusty old wearhouse I'm sure...or maybe a museum.

This is also one of RIM's biggest issues. They should get rid off all non-OS 7 phones. Someone mentioned before that they should've offered some kind of incentive for businesses to upgrade their old phones to OS 7.

Old Blackberry's continue to tarnish RIM's brand.

[shemaree09]

Its not hard and it doesn't take long to change peoples opinions. Right now to the average person theres really only 3 or less options they even know of. They likely know what a blackberry is, if carriers push it in the US it will sell. Elsewhere this isn't as big a deal.

Sounds easy enough, but when you have people who already have their minds made up about a brand it doesn't matter. People know what a blackberry is alright, but they associate email machine, work-issued, no apps, no internet, boring, and trackball right along with it. There are people who don't even know that Blackberrys still make phones or that touchscreen Blackberrys exist!

Like I said before, its gonna take a TON of marketing, starting with an image overhaul.

[SixStringMadness]

In today's world, perception is reality.

Perception is that BBOS is old, outdated, archaic, clunky and can't run an app to save its life.

Have some guy wake up, and sit up from a casket with a cell phone, and somehow transition that into the guy walking by people using smartphones stuggling with whatever they don't do as well as Blackberry... Make it a cool young person, working and playing.... Its all about common perception, which is what made the "I'm a PC, I'm a Mac" commercials so rabidly successful.

Find a way to take the common perception, and use it to their advantage in their marketing campaign. Make fun of yourself to an extent, but transition it into featuring what you can do that nobody else can....

The Galaxy S3 or whatever it is, is one of my favorite commercials, making fun of iPeople camping out, assuming their new iThingy is automatically going to have all the new industry features, because it somehow is just automatically the best phone due to it having a half chewed apple for a logo. Dishing it to Apple the way they dish it out.

RIM needs to find a crafty way to play off the common perception, and that's what will stick in peoples minds, and be an effective marketing of BB10.

[shemaree09]

I agree!

But the sad part is, why are we able to come up with such awesome ideas but RIM's OWN marketing department cant. It seems so obvious what they should do, but they drop the ball every time!

[knowledge_6]

anyone want to join me in an experiment in Downtown Toronto???

here is my idea.. or maybe crackberry can do it..

When BB10 comes out i want to go around with a camera and give the Device to a bunch of poeple.. Hopefully those that know Blackberry but not about BB10..

cover the BB logo at the bottom and just give it to them to play with and show them features etc.. tell them it's a brand new phone company that is going be coming out in the market soon and we just want to know their thoughts..

this would eliminate the BB negative stigma and if they hate it then they hate it.. but if they like it or love it.. explain to them it's a blackberry..

i wanna see how much the negative media, press, stories etc affect people..

plus u'd probably get some people asking if it;s the new iphone.. jk ; >

[knowledge_6]

I agree!

But the sad part is, why are we able to come up with such awesome ideas but RIM's OWN marketing department cant. It seems so obvious what they should do, but they drop the ball every time!

yes and that is why their entire executive staff was revamped...

including a new CMO..

[shemaree09]

anyone want to join me in an experiment in Downtown Toronto???

here is my idea.. or maybe crackberry can do it..

When BB10 comes out i want to go around with a camera and give the Device to a bunch of poeple.. Hopefully those that know Blackberry but not about BB10..

cover the BB logo at the bottom and just give it to them to play with and show them features etc.. tell them it's a brand new phone company that is going be coming out in the market soon and we just want to know their thoughts..

this would eliminate the BB negative stigma and if they hate it then they hate it.. but if they like it or love it.. explain to them it's a blackberry..

i wanna see how much the negative media, press, stories etc affect people..

plus u'd probably get some people asking if it;s the new iphone.. jk ; >

This is what RIM should be doing! Can you imagine a commercial like that!? That would be awesome!

[Vee_G]

Excellent read some of the ideas on here are awesome. I really like the handing random people the phone idea and covering up the logo. I also really like the black background with the red flashing light and then the we're back. BB10 & then fade back to black idea. Great stuff. Let me guess those who work for RIM's marketing department have marketing degrees right? Pffffft

[undone]

To date Frank and his marketing team have remained asleep at the wheel or more likely asleep in the flop house filled will interns. The marketing has to begin now and slowly intensify the anticipated release of BlackBerry 10. Waiting until 2013 will be too little too late. Build a storyline for the arrival of BlackBerry 10. Produce 30-second vignettes like the prequel series before the Simpsons was a television programme. Show them before movies in the theatres and play them on television during prime-time news broadcasts. Give them an edgy look and feel...a conspiracy theory..."The Truth is Out There."

I dont believe this to be true. (note opinion) With the addition (net) of 2 million subscribers, someone is doing something. And that is with OUT the new OS and a known factor that existing devices will NOT be compatible.

BB10 is a vaporware until its released. Period. The North American market has become an instant gratification market. Apple specifically has created the announce and then release tomorrow strategy that everyone seems to accept as the new norm. RIM HAS to follow this pattern. Announce and then shortly release it. Only thing marketing wise before then is peeks and unofficial thingies that the general media hype up. Better for RIM to really target sell/advertise at the time of launch, they are in cash starved mode.
Like corresponding the NA release to the Super Bowl and running ads during the game, thought that could possibly be a big waste too.

[shemaree09]

I dont believe this to be true. (note opinion) With the addition (net) of 2 million subscribers, someone is doing something. And that is with OUT the new OS and a known factor that existing devices will NOT be compatible.

BB10 is a vaporware until its released. Period. The North American market has become an instant gratification market. Apple specifically has created the announce and then release tomorrow strategy that everyone seems to accept as the new norm. RIM HAS to follow this pattern. Announce and then shortly release it. Only thing marketing wise before then is peeks and unofficial thingies that the general media hype up. Better for RIM to really target sell/advertise at the time of launch, they are in cash starved mode.
Like corresponding the NA release to the Super Bowl and running ads during the game, thought that could possibly be a big waste too.

The 2 million number means nothing to me. As an actual real world user I (and many others in the US) have very little to ZERO BBM contacts or friends/family who still use a Blackberry.

Apple's announce and release strategy is GENIUS! and needs to be done for most devices. Who wants to see this big huge reveal for a new device but cant actually purchase it until 6 months later?

Its pretty obvious that RIM's previous/current marketing strategies are NOT working. Its time for them to make a change if they dont want to fail. BB10 is really their last shot. Honestly, no one outside of Crackberry cares about a Playbook.

[jivegirl14]

Ideas are easy... and cheaper than table salt. They're like opinions... or that other thing. Everyone has one.

Execution is the key. RIM right now has a full blown image problem. Blackberries are not seen as hip or cool or desirable. They are now percieved as the phones you use if you want to do things "the way they were done before," in some bygone age. To some extent RIM hasn't really done anything to dispel this image,with their "getting things done mantra which simply harks back to that bygone age in people's minds. The competition can get things done too... and you need only look at how many they've sold to see that customers like the way they get things done better than Blackberry.

I know a couple of people looking at getting new phones... so they want to check out my SG3. I ask them what they think of iphone and I tell them that there's a new Blackberry coming out. Reaction? Strange look then "I'm not interested in Blackberry (with a dismissive gesture)". "Might look at the iphone but really like the SG3".

Aside from this forum perhaps RIM isn't even on most people's radar - except as a struggling company. The number of people waiting to ditch their current phones for the competition is probably much higher than we might think and because there is no new product NOW, RIM lost them as well.

Their marketing has never been particularly good, but then they didn't really need it because they thought everyone knew what a Blackberry was (and wanted one). Which they did once upon a time. I'm not sure marketing alone is going to capture hearts and minds or win them back. Plus many current BB users are going to stay on their current phones and not upgrade especially if the price is high and there is no incentive.

The best marketing they could have done would be to have their phone launching this year - so that it was available for people to consider. That boat has sailed.
You can have a great product but the only thing that matters is if enough people want to buy it.

[knowledge_6]

The 2 million number means nothing to me. As an actual real world user I (and many others in the US) have very little to ZERO BBM contacts or friends/family who still use a Blackberry.

Apple's announce and release strategy is GENIUS! and needs to be done for most devices. Who wants to see this big huge reveal for a new device but cant actually purchase it until 6 months later?

Its pretty obvious that RIM's previous/current marketing strategies are NOT working. Its time for them to make a change if they dont want to fail. BB10 is really their last shot. Honestly, no one outside of Crackberry cares about a Playbook.

although u are right about the apple market and that is the ideal marketing strategy to release a week or 2 after annoucement .. RIM at the moment doesn't have that grace from customers to hold out and show nothing until release..

if they hold back people will bash them and say they have ntohing.. analysts would have a field day and release more negative media..

so it's a lose lose situation and they chose to show people little by little to keep people hanging on..

what would you say if RIM Showed NOTHING since they announced it as BBX last year?

and yes i lost a lot of BBM contacts .. but i still have about 85 contacts on BBM.. that;s all over the world (family, friends etc) after losing some contacts i never tal kto them unless needed through SMS or whatsapp.. and whatsapp is DEFINITELY not nearly as good as BBM.. yes RIM has had their outages.. but Whatsapp .. sometimes i don't get messages for hours.. sometimes they are important messages ..

and my wife and i both have a S3 (i have my BB for work) and the fact that we miss the groups fucntion in BBM to make lists and calendar events and share those as well as get notifications as they are updated instantly is horrible.. and the one driving point that is getting my wife to go back to a BB when BB10 is released

and i know a lot of people with aplaybook due to their mass sale... and those people are pleasantly surprised by it..

[shemaree09]

although u are right about the apple market and that is the ideal marketing strategy to release a week or 2 after annoucement .. RIM at the moment doesn't have that grace from customers to hold out and show nothing until release..

if they hold back people will bash them and say they have ntohing.. analysts would have a field day and release more negative media..

so it's a lose lose situation and they chose to show people little by little to keep people hanging on..

what would you say if RIM Showed NOTHING since they announced it as BBX last year?

and yes i lost a lot of BBM contacts .. but i still have about 85 contacts on BBM.. that;s all over the world (family, friends etc)

I dont think they should hold out at all. They should have released THIS year. Since they aren't the feature displayed should have been a bigger deal. Give people (outside of current BB users) something to look forward to in 2013.

The recent BB10 display at Blackberry Jam as gone unseen by the masses. Outside of Crackberry and tech sites, who else saw the Blackberry Jame Keynote?

This is where Marketing failed again. Why wasnt the BB Jam Keynote a BIG web event? I mean BB10 is something completely different from what they've done before. They should have at least made it a big deal for the masses. Especially considering that we cant buy it until a mysterious date in 2013.

[BrizzadMan]

I dont think they should hold out at all. They should have released THIS year. Since they aren't the feature displayed should have been a bigger deal. Give people (outside of current BB users) something to look forward to in 2013.



The recent BB10 display at Blackberry Jam as gone unseen by the masses. Outside of Crackberry and tech sites, who else saw the Blackberry Jame Keynote?



This is where Marketing failed again. Why wasnt the BB Jam Keynote a BIG web event? I mean BB10 is something completely different from what they've done before. They should have at least made it a big deal for the masses. Especially considering that we cant buy it until a mysterious date in 2013.

Hardly a failure. It is a developer conference - not a media & consumer focused event.

Outside of the CrackBerry & tech sites (that represents a lot of eyeballs you do know?) the recent BB10 news has reached all traditional media platforms - TV interviews & newspaper articles. Heck, even stock prices moved during the event as BB10 details emerged - the world is indeed watching...

[timmy t]

They need some hot celebrities to use them again.
They need some hot celebrities to offer BB only content, like having these celebs do BBMing to groups of fans. Maybe some of the nice looking women can do sexting to these groups.

[brucep1]

If you want to understand why this is, you need to face facts.

A lot of the OS 4 and 5 Blackberry devices left a sour taste in consumer mouths. Whether it be freezing, reloading an OS, installing a hybrid OS for the phone to work (looking at you Storm), bricking phones, etc. Sure, other phones had their problems too, but remember, people weren't really on other phones. They were using BlackBerry.

If I'm driving a 5 year old Jeep that's been giving me problems, I'm not gonna go shopping to the Jeep dealer for my next car saying, "Hey, did you guys fix all those problems because I really want to get another Jeep". I'll go with any other car other than Jeep.

Consumers move on. It just so happened that when Smartphones were going through growing pains they were on BlackBerry.

[shemaree09]

Hardly a failure. It is a developer conference - not a media & consumer focused event.

Outside of the CrackBerry & tech sites (that represents a lot of eyeballs you do know?) the recent BB10 news has reached all traditional media platforms - TV interviews & newspaper articles. Heck, even stock prices moved during the event as BB10 details emerged - the world is indeed watching...

To me that doesn't matter. It all boils down to the consumer. They are the ones who are going to buy. It doesn't matter what newspaper articles say or stock prices.

The masses know nothing about BB10 or even care about it right now.

[madman0141]

OP very good post. I liked what you said about people assumptions. In a small post you have said more than an alledged Business Insider named Steve "Something".
Nice Job
Steve was from another post some big wig I went FanBoy about.

[BrizzadMan]

In today's world, perception is reality.

Perception is that BBOS is old, outdated, archaic, clunky and can't run an app to save its life.

Have some guy wake up, and sit up from a casket with a cell phone, and somehow transition that into the guy walking by people using smartphones stuggling with whatever they don't do as well as Blackberry... Make it a cool young person, working and playing.... Its all about common perception, which is what made the "I'm a PC, I'm a Mac" commercials so rabidly successful.

Find a way to take the common perception, and use it to their advantage in their marketing campaign. Make fun of yourself to an extent, but transition it into featuring what you can do that nobody else can....

The Galaxy S3 or whatever it is, is one of my favorite commercials, making fun of iPeople camping out, assuming their new iThingy is automatically going to have all the new industry features, because it somehow is just automatically the best phone due to it having a half chewed apple for a logo. Dishing it to Apple the way they dish it out.

RIM needs to find a crafty way to play off the common perception, and that's what will stick in peoples minds, and be an effective marketing of BB10.

You've hit the nail on the head I believe.

RIM conceding to past failures will be key in gaining respect back from consumers. Admitting to mistakes is not done easily through traditional media though.

I believe they are doing a great job on pre-launch efforts at the moment. Points being:

- BB Jam events on every habitable continent, going TO the Devs
- Previewing BB10 devices & current OS state to: Tech bloggers, Carriers (Consumer Forum), Enterprise customers & partners (Enterprise Forum)
- Thorsten doing an editorial in a major Candian newspaper
- Hosting BB Benefits charging & prizes stations at major events

The key here? GET IN FRONT OF THE MASSES - IN PERSON.

Get your message out direct to the consumer where possible. They should continue this approach for the BB10 launch.

Great traditional advertising will be important, though it won't be enough to change made up minds at this point.

[thebignewt]

If RIM really thinks that BB10 is going to save them then they're in the toilet. What could save them is a cool phone, not an OS. Take a tip from Apple: what was the big deal recently that buzzed the news and sold 5 million phones in 3 days, the iPhone5 or iOS6? Because the operating system was sent to phones this week. See any news about that? Operating systems are not what makes you money, phones make you money. Apple almost gives away their OS updates for iMacs. They sure don't give away those phones. Operating systems shouln't be noticed, they should just let you use the phone easily. They should just stay out of the way. I never had any problems with BB4 or 5. No battery pulls, no freezes. They were fine for the day. The phones, on the other hand, got long in the tooth. The BB keyboard is a dinosoar (sp), they should keep it around for diehards, but move it to the boneyard with the clickwheel and the trackball. Cute in the day, but old, like the Palm stylus.

[Thunderbuck]

I agree, but only up to 90%.

I'd rate my own agreement at 94.738%