12-07-11 10:07 PM
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  1. GingerSnapsBack's Avatar
    I'm not OS expert but I'd like to ask a question. Does EVERY company allow old devices to update to new a OS? Would you be able to update say an old mac laptop to completely new mac OS? and if you could, would it make it worth having or would it run slow?
    I'm still running a laptop with Windows ME on it. Works fine for me. If I ever decided to upgrade, I'd probably try it before I go drop $1500 on a new laptop.

    In Rim's case, let's take your storm 1 for example. You think the hardware specs on your storm 1 can handle running os 7? And if it did, would you keep it more than 10 mins when you realized how slow and choppy it was? Rim won't invest time and money making an OS backwards compatible because it just doesn't make that much sense.
    I don't have a Storm1. I have a Storm2. I think I've said it at least a dozen times in this post. I know my Storm2 can't handle an OS update. My point was RIM should make a phone that can. When OS6 came out, only one or two handsets could upgrade to OS6. Out of the few people that I know personally who did, all but one downgraded to OS5 after installing OS6 because it was buggy and the phone lagged.

    Having a phone that can handle more than one OS isn't backwards. It's common sense. People don't want to have to shell out $750 on a new BB or iPhone or Droid or whatever when a new OS comes out because they want the newest OS or want to update their devices so they perform better. They want a phone that can handle the new OS with a simple update. That's the one thing that peeves me off the most about BB is you have to have a new BB when a new OS comes out, no matter what. It's pointless to be locked into a contract with a BB that will be EOLd as soon as the next wave of devices come out. After BBX comes out, the OS7 devices will be EOLd and wind up in the same position as my S2: Stuck in the past with an outdated OS.

    Further, Rim has a bunch of form factors to deal with. I understand you can upgrade the iPhone 3 to OS 5 but really (and I don't say this to p!ss anyone off as I've never owned an iPhone) how different is an iPhone 3 from and iPhone 4 and how different is the iPhone 4 from the iPhone 4s? The form factor is the same, they are all single core. They basically have to make the new os work with 1 other device.
    4s is dual core. Link thing

    The form factors of the Bolds are all the same. The form factors of the Curves are all the same. Other than being slightly thinner, my 8350i isn't different from my 8530. My Storm2 is slightly bigger than a friend's Storm1. The Bold 9650 looks just like the 9930 to an unsuspecting person off the street. All the iPhones look the same, but their innards are different.

    Even if Apple has to tweak the iOS to work on a 3GS and the iPhone4, they do it to keep their customers happy. That's something I'm not sure RIM can do.

    Its the same everywhere.
    The iphone 4S is a battery drain and Apple is scrambling to fix it.
    The iPhone4s battery drain can be fixed by turning the time zone finder off. I've yet to have a battery problem with my 4s and I use mine all the time. Even with Sirius on, wifi on, texting and constantly emailing, my battery lasts until 2 or 3 before it needs to be rejuiced so I can YouTube at the gym. My S2 has poorer battery lfe, needing to be rejuiced before noon with the same usage.
    Last edited by ColdSunshine; 11-23-11 at 09:32 AM.
    11-23-11 09:29 AM
  2. ichat's Avatar
    They do right, its the fanboyism that hurts

    Posted from my CrackBerry at wapforums.crackberry.com
    11-23-11 09:41 AM
  3. brucep1's Avatar
    In Rim's case, let's take your storm 1 for example. You think the hardware specs on your storm 1 can handle running os 7? And if it did, would you keep it more than 10 mins when you realized how slow and choppy it was? Rim won't invest time and money making an OS backwards compatible because it just doesn't make that much sense.
    Simple solution..If you stop releasing phones with last gen specs, it will be easier to upgrade to a new OS.

    Problem solved.
    11-23-11 09:59 AM
  4. GingerSnapsBack's Avatar
    Simple solution..If you stop releasing phones with last gen specs, it will be easier to upgrade to a new OS.

    Problem solved.
    That's been my point all along. Move the specs along and into the same league as Android and Apple and you won't have to worry about not being able to upgrade OS.
    11-23-11 10:44 AM
  5. TheMimic's Avatar
    I'm still running a laptop with Windows ME on it. Works fine for me. If I ever decided to upgrade, I'd probably try it before I go drop $1500 on a new laptop.
    A 500$ new laptop today would run cirlces around a machine that came with ME so I'm not sure why you mention a 1500$ price point. And with the hardware specs of an ME machine, updating to a modern OS is pointless. You'd be better off buying a used XP or vista laptop then upgrading the OS.


    I don't have a Storm1. I have a Storm2. I think I've said it at least a dozen times in this post.
    My bad.


    Having a phone that can handle more than one OS isn't backwards. It's common sense. People don't want to have to shell out $750 on a new BB or iPhone or Droid or whatever when a new OS comes out because they want the newest OS or want to update their devices so they perform better. They want a phone that can handle the new OS with a simple update. That's the one thing that peeves me off the most about BB is you have to have a new BB when a new OS comes out, no matter what. It's pointless to be locked into a contract with a BB that will be EOLd as soon as the next wave of devices come out. After BBX comes out, the OS7 devices will be EOLd and wind up in the same position as my S2: Stuck in the past with an outdated OS.
    I can see why you'd be angry but it's not like Rim ever promised you you'd be able to upgrade the OS to future ones. Jsut like they said os7 won;t go bbx. People buying it know that. And to be honest, I don't think average consumer knows the difference between os6- os7 or bbx. They just want the lastest and greatest.
    11-23-11 11:23 AM
  6. TheMimic's Avatar
    That's been my point all along. Move the specs along and into the same league as Android and Apple and you won't have to worry about not being able to upgrade OS.
    You gotta understand, not everyone wants nor needs a quad core phone. My single core 9900 is already lacking battery life and if this 9900 had a dual core or quad core, I'd have to have an ambilical cord for it so I could always use it. It makes no sense to add all this power to a phone if I have to charge it every 3 hours.

    Further, I don't see how I would benefit from anymore cpu power from this phone. The OS runs smooth and with no lag at all.
    11-23-11 11:27 AM
  7. anthogag's Avatar
    The biggest advance in terms of specs will probably be the QNX operating system. This OS might be much easier for backward compatibility.

    What happend when Mac changed cpus to intel....was there backward compatibility...no The Lion operating system is only backward compatible to what, 2 generations
    11-23-11 11:27 AM
  8. TheMimic's Avatar
    The biggest advance in terms of specs will probably be the QNX operating system. This OS might be much easier for backward compatibility.

    What happend when Mac changed cpus to intel....was there backward compatibility...no The Lion operating system is only backward compatible to what, 2 generations
    I was going to mention that but I wasnt' sure about mac OS and how backwards compatible it was.
    11-23-11 11:40 AM
  9. Blackberry_boffin's Avatar
    The iPhone4s battery drain can be fixed by turning the time zone finder off. I've yet to have a battery problem with my 4s and I use mine all the time. Even with Sirius on, wifi on, texting and constantly emailing, my battery lasts until 2 or 3 before it needs to be rejuiced so I can YouTube at the gym. My S2 has poorer battery lfe, needing to be rejuiced before noon with the same usage.
    Of course some may be happy with their 4S battery life but fact of the matter is there is an issue and a simple setting like 'time zone finder' is NOT the solution. Even Apple have admitted that and even outted an update to try to sort it (which largely didn't work).
    11-23-11 11:40 AM
  10. TheMimic's Avatar
    Again, let's get back on track here. We've gone off topic with backwards compatibility.
    11-23-11 11:42 AM
  11. sleepngbear's Avatar
    Simple solution..If you stop releasing phones with last gen specs, it will be easier to upgrade to a new OS.

    Problem solved.


    Because every iPhone and Android device ever made is fully upgradeable to every new OS released, right? Ok, you go with that.

    Posted from my CrackBerry at wapforums.crackberry.com
    brucep1 likes this.
    11-23-11 11:45 AM
  12. mithrazor's Avatar
    Well to be fair. They said the Bold 9700 wouldn't get OS6 either. But it did. I was surprised actually.
    11-23-11 11:53 AM
  13. GingerSnapsBack's Avatar
    You gotta understand, not everyone wants nor needs a quad core phone. My single core 9900 is already lacking battery life and if this 9900 had a dual core or quad core, I'd have to have an ambilical cord for it so I could always use it. It makes no sense to add all this power to a phone if I have to charge it every 3 hours.

    Further, I don't see how I would benefit from anymore cpu power from this phone. The OS runs smooth and with no lag at all.
    Joe Q User may not want a dual core phone or even understand what it is. He doesn't understand why he can't update to BBX when it comes out. He's just mad that he can't. Not everyone who owns a smartphone is smart and not everyone who has one understand why they can't update. They just want to.

    I don't need an umbilical cord for my phone and I have a dual core phone. My battery lfe is better than on my S2 and I'm a heavy data user and a texting *****. Plus most people are at a desk or near one so they can easily charge so it's not a big deal. Those who drive OTR like truck drivers and others have access to charging ports in their cars through the cigarette lighters and some cars even come with USB ports built right in for charging. I had a rental car a month ago that had a USB port built in right in the center console. Kinda neat IMO.
    moiselles likes this.
    11-23-11 11:54 AM
  14. Danf's Avatar
    I think Blackberry fans and moderators at Crackberry need to really both sides of the picture and give everyone a fair chance at understanding what is out there.
    And why exactly would I come to a specialty (BB) site to learn about, "what is out there?"

    I think this goes to the heart of the real issue that generates conflict on this site. You have the majority that come here because they have a BB and this is a Dedicated BB forum, then you have those that either ditched BB or BB is just one of their phones who want to try and turn the site into a General phone site instead of a BB dedicated one.

    I think the ones that came here because it is a BB specialty forum are pretty much sick and tired of the Iphone\android crowd jumping into very thread to promote, "defend" iPhone\Android and or just denigrate Blackberry.

    I think the vast majority of users here understand and acknowledge Rim's failures they are simply tired of having it thrown in their faces on a constant basis from the small core of iPhone/Android fans that do so every chance they get.
    11-23-11 12:29 PM
  15. avt123's Avatar
    Ok, I'll give ya that.

    Folks need to start being a little more respectful of other folks around here, regardless of what brand of phone, soft drink, grass seed, pizza, beer, cars, nail polish, cotton swabs, canned vegetables or power tools they all happen to prefer. That especially goes for the BB zealots who feel the need to disparage other brands and their users. You're not doing yourselves or the rest of us any good. Seriously.
    Completely agreed. The bashing should be nonexistent. Everyone should just play nicely and things can be great.
    11-23-11 12:37 PM
  16. Danf's Avatar
    Joe Q User may not want a dual core phone or even understand what it is. He doesn't understand why he can't update to BBX when it comes out. He's just mad that he can't.
    This is called "projection" YOU are mad because you cannot update your phone to the newest operating system so you claim so is John Q User.

    The truth however is that John Q User for the most part isn't to bothered about it. and in many cases may not even be aware of the new operating system or care about it. It's the "power Users" that care not your run of the mill Cell phone owner.

    On average I would say that John Q User whether it is his cell phone or his computer doesn't rush to adopt the latest OS for either and seldom even gets the latest patches or updates for what he already has unless it is pushed out to him from the OS provider or wireless provider.

    John Q User is the one that joins here to post about how he has had his phone for two years and now he something happened and he lost his contacts and wants to know how to get them back. And oh yeah in that two years he never once backed up his phone with either the tools provided by BB or his carrier or any of the free utilities offered for download.
    11-23-11 12:43 PM
  17. brucep1's Avatar
    18to7fiddy,

    Someone didn't hear the latest crackberry jingle did they?

    But in all seriousness, the BB 07 phones aren't going to be upgradeable to QNX. Thats anywhere from having a 6 month to 12 month window.

    The 3gs has been getting upgrades for over 2 years.

    For those keeping score at home, 2 years > 6 months

    Because every iPhone and Android device ever made is fully upgradeable to every new OS released, right? Ok, you go with that.
    I have no idea what, who, or where you think you read that. But yeah, you go with that argument.
    11-23-11 01:05 PM
  18. LisaOnline's Avatar
    More like damned if they don't.

    Ignoring the Flintstones phones and just focusing on the Playbook- the failure to do much of anything with it since launch (email and calendar in particular) is a huge insult to early adopters. I still have not heard anyone explain what makes the Playbook 'Professional Grade' and a company that is so disconnected as to proclaim it as such, in the face of superior offerings from both Samsung and Apple and even Motorola deserves the disdain it has been getting.

    Damned if they do, damned if they don't. Some people just need to see their pearls of wisdom in a public place. I think it gives them a sense of purpose. My opinion, buy what you like; and if you don't like something you bought, it's nobody's fault but your own. I mean, why can't Dr. Pepper taste more like a soft drink I like.

    Posted from my CrackBerry at wapforums.crackberry.com
    11-23-11 02:11 PM
  19. sleepngbear's Avatar
    18to7fiddy,

    Someone didn't hear the latest crackberry jingle did they?

    But in all seriousness, the BB 07 phones aren't going to be upgradeable to QNX. Thats anywhere from having a 6 month to 12 month window.

    The 3gs has been getting upgrades for over 2 years.

    For those keeping score at home, 2 years > 6 months



    I have no idea what, who, or where you think you read that. But yeah, you go with that argument.
    The iOS 5 going on the 3Gs is not the iOS 5 that went on the 4Gs. They can call it whatever they want, but it's still an incremental upgrade on older iPhones. As far as I know, older BB's continue to get updates for a few years. So an old Curve wont get BB6, and a 9000 won't get BB7, and the BB7 phones won't get BBX. They still get updates. Same thing, different name. Of course when RIM does give an OS a new number, everybody still jumps on them for just changing the name on basically an old OS. So, it's pretty much as the OP said, isn't it.

    Posted from my CrackBerry at wapforums.crackberry.com
    11-23-11 02:11 PM
  20. GingerSnapsBack's Avatar
    The iOS 5 going on the 3Gs is not the iOS 5 that went on the 4Gs. They can call it whatever they want, but it's still an incremental upgrade on older iPhones. As far as I know, older BB's continue to get updates for a few years. So an old Curve wont get BB6, and a 9000 won't get BB7, and the BB7 phones won't get BBX. They still get updates. Same thing, different name. Of course when RIM does give an OS a new number, everybody still jumps on them for just changing the name on basically an old OS. So, it's pretty much as the OP said, isn't it.

    Posted from my CrackBerry at wapforums.crackberry.com
    iOS5 may not be a true iOS5 on a 3GS, but it is an update nonetheless. Apple doesn't ignore the older model phones like RIM does.

    I've had my S2 almost a year and I've yet to get an OS update. Once the new BBs are released, the older ones like my S2 are EOLd and nothing will be updated again.
    11-23-11 02:25 PM
  21. sam_b77's Avatar
    For a lot of people, Apple hasn't done anything to get pissy over. As far as I know, Apple has never had a service outage like RIM has. Siri has quit working a time or two since I've had my iPhone, but my phone was still fully functional. I could text, email, YouTube and goof off on it. I just couldn't tell her I **** my pants and watch her tell me to mind my language. When the RIM fiasco happened, I was left with a glorified Jitterbug. I could only text and make phone calls. When Apple starts having problems like BB is having, rest assured, the masses will be pissed.





    I can't speak for Android as I don't know that many people with one, but Apple still provides support to their phones. My ex has an iPhone3Gs. He was able to update to iOS5 without a problem when it came out. My sister has an iPhone4 as does her husband. They were able to update to iOS5 when it came out.

    I have a Storm2. I'm stuck with OS5 until the thing dies. I can't update to anything and there hasn't been an OS update since I got it back in February.

    If RIM would make devices that can be updated to the new OS when they come out, that'd wow the masses, myself included. I know that by the time you get technology, six months later it's out of date, but at least with Apple products, you can continually update the iOS every time a new one comes out. With BB, you can't.
    My post was directed specifically towards Android, as an Android user has made a statement regarding updates.
    As for iOS, yes, Apple does support their old hardware as far as as possible. And that is where Apple and RIM are different from Android. Both Apple and RIM control their hardware and software and they support their own hardware for a long time.
    As I said, Android support is negligible as the hardware manufactures have no incentive to support their old devices. Maybe with Google taking over Motorola this would change for Motorola phones, but other manufacturers are behaving like fly by night operators.
    My wife has an HTC Legend running on Froyo 2.2. I like the interface and I know that there have been numerous updates from Google for 2.2, but HTC has simply abandoned the Legend and not pushed out the updates from Google. The option now is to root the device which I don't want to do.
    Apple and RIM have a distinct advantage here.
    11-23-11 03:10 PM
  22. TheMimic's Avatar
    Joe Q User may not want a dual core phone or even understand what it is. He doesn't understand why he can't update to BBX when it comes out. He's just mad that he can't. Not everyone who owns a smartphone is smart and not everyone who has one understand why they can't update. They just want to.

    I don't need an umbilical cord for my phone and I have a dual core phone. My battery lfe is better than on my S2 and I'm a heavy data user and a texting *****. Plus most people are at a desk or near one so they can easily charge so it's not a big deal. Those who drive OTR like truck drivers and others have access to charging ports in their cars through the cigarette lighters and some cars even come with USB ports built right in for charging. I had a rental car a month ago that had a USB port built in right in the center console. Kinda neat IMO.

    I have a USB port in my car, I spend 8 hours at the office in front of my computer with USB ports. Do I want to plug my device in every time I drive or am at the office? No!

    And we're still off topic.
    11-23-11 03:11 PM
  23. anthogag's Avatar
    And why exactly would I come to a specialty (BB) site to learn about, "what is out there?"

    I think this goes to the heart of the real issue that generates conflict on this site. You have the majority that come here because they have a BB and this is a Dedicated BB forum, then you have those that either ditched BB or BB is just one of their phones who want to try and turn the site into a General phone site instead of a BB dedicated one.

    I think the ones that came here because it is a BB specialty forum are pretty much sick and tired of the Iphone\android crowd jumping into very thread to promote, "defend" iPhone\Android and or just denigrate Blackberry.

    I think the vast majority of users here understand and acknowledge Rim's failures they are simply tired of having it thrown in their faces on a constant basis from the small core of iPhone/Android fans that do so every chance they get.


    I think some of these people are hired by pr firms with an anti-BB agenda to visit this site, and other popular BB sites, to 'muddy the water'. Why wouldn't this be a tactic If I can see it as a tactic then so can 'questionable' pr firms.

    Comments coming from some posters on this site, and this thread, seem to me to be subversive...
    11-23-11 03:26 PM
  24. BoldtotheMax's Avatar
    It amazes me how many people would seemingly take a bullet to their heart for talking bad about a BB or honestly any phone. We are always trying to justify our purchase, especially a Bb, due to all the negativity on this very forum or looking at Market share.

    Honestly nothing wrong with debating, but some of ya go beyond the Thunderdome! If you like your phone or PB, then rock on. You have always had the iPhone lovers and now you have the Andriod users. Competition is good and inspires innovation.

    Me, I stay here as it is a cool forum and met some nice people, but then you do have the certain individuals who can really put a dent in your day. Don't let them get to you and enjoy your device. It works, that's what matters. I don't get all the arguing I suppose.

    Happy thanksgiving!

    Posted from my CrackBerry at wapforums.crackberry.com
    moiselles and howarmat like this.
    11-23-11 05:29 PM
  25. Blackberry_boffin's Avatar
    I have a suggestion:
    Kevin and co make me a moderator for one day (even an hour).
    Any one slating a BB device on IT'S OWN FAN SITE, I will strike off the site PERMANENTLY.
    That should do it
    Last edited by Blackberry_boffin; 11-23-11 at 06:16 PM. Reason: typo
    11-23-11 06:15 PM
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