[Dunt Dunt Dunt]

Sure 20 bucks per unit of PKB that is reliable.

They cost more to build and to warranty.... I'm not sure $20 would cover it.

Someone suggested a TCL PLEX KEY... I think you'd see a $100 adder for the keyboard on the retail side. Becuase I don't think anyone expects a PLEX KEY to sell many units.

It wouldn't be a BlackBerry
It wouldn't have the HUB+
It wouldn't have even patches or updates (unless TCL is changing their MO - wonder why they have gone Android One?).
So it's wouldn't really be very secure.

For now the KEY2 would be the better option. TCL might not move more of them than Unihertz has the Titan.

[robnhl]

Razr definitely got the hype from tech pundits but their problem, like everyone else not Samsung and Apple, is that the device was not actually ready to sell to consumers. How long after an Apple or Samsung launch is the device in carrier stores? This has now allowed everyone else making a fold hit the accelerator to get one to market. Exclusive carrier deals are also a death blow. Ask Pixel and Google just how well that has worked out for them.

This is a boutique device but it seems you are thinking of it as a mass market one. Carrier exclusives are how devices like this get funded. I'm certain sales targets and expectations are modest for the new RAZR.

I suspect its role as a splash device is as important to Moto as any actual profits it might make. A little cachet won't hurt.

[the_boon]

TCL might not move more of them than Unihertz has the Titan.

With proper distribution and hopefully some carrier support, of course TCL could move more KEYPlex's than UniHertz's basement levels of production.

You think TCL can't move more than 3000 units worldwide of a self branded PKB phone lol?

[conite]

With proper distribution and hopefully some carrier support, of course TCL could move more KEYPlex's than UniHertz's basement levels of production.

You think TCL can't move more than 3000 units worldwide of a self branded PKB phone lol?

BlackBerry devices have seen almost every conceivable business model at this point - proprietary OS, popular OS, own devices, contracted-out devices, and licenced devices.

At some point we just have to admit that the demand simply is not there.

[the_boon]

BlackBerry devices have seen almost every conceivable business model at this point.

At some point we just have to admit that the demand simply is not there.

Maybe the KEY to a successful PKB device is for the word "BlackBerry" to stay far, far away from it.

KEYBerry's haven't sold that well, but there is some demand for PKB phones.

[conite]

KEYBerry's haven't sold that well, but there is some demand for PKB phones.

Based on what? The 3000 devices that Unihertz has sold?

[the_boon]

Based on what? The 3000 devices that Unihertz has sold?

The UniHertz Titan doesn't have quite a traditional form factor. It's even bigger and much heavier than the Passport.

This is no metric.

I'm talking standard smartphone rectangle shaped candybars like the KEY series.

Once a real manufacturer makes one of those, then we'll see the sales numbers and have this conversation again.

[conite]

The UniHertz Titan doesn't have quite a traditional form factor. It's even bigger and much heavier than the Passport.

This is no metric.

I'm talking standard smartphone rectangle shaped candybars like the KEY series.

Once a real manufacturer makes one of those, then we'll see the sales numbers and have this conversation again.

But your statement was that there IS a demand (and by demand, I assume you mean sufficiently large for a "real" OEM to get into the market).

So, I was asking what makes you think that?

[robnhl]

The UniHertz Titan doesn't have quite a traditional form factor. It's even bigger and much heavier than the Passport.

This is no metric.

I'm talking standard smartphone rectangle shaped candybars like the KEY series.

Once a real manufacturer makes one of those, then we'll see the sales numbers and have this conversation again.

So, you're suggesting that if someone like Samsung made a Galaxy Keyboard phone it would sell in sufficient numbers to justify its existence? Or you are just saying to reevaluate once that device exists to see if there really is a market.

Samsung did try this once long ago with the Galaxy Pro. I don't think they iterated on it but I can't exactly recall.

https://www.phonearena.com/phones/Sa...AXY-Pro_id5271

[the_boon]

So, you're suggesting that if someone like Samsung made a Galaxy Keyboard phone it would sell in sufficient numbers to justify its existence? Or you are just saying to reevaluate once that device exists to see if there really is a market.

Samsung did try this once long ago with the Galaxy Pro. I don't think they iterated on it but I can't exactly recall.

https://www.phonearena.com/phones/Sa...AXY-Pro_id5271

Man I didn't even know of that Galaxy Pro.

Ahh how form factors were more interesting a few years ago...

Anyway, I don't see how a PKB on a folding device would mean failure especially if the outer display is gonna be as underwhelming as the one on the first Fold.

They have to market it as an all-in-one ultimate mobile device and NOT as some sort of a BlackBerry replacement.

The word BlackBerry has to stay far far away

[conite]

Man I didn't even know of that Galaxy Pro.

Ahh how form factors were more interesting a few years ago...

Anyway, I don't see how a PKB on a folding device would mean failure especially if the outer display is gonna be as underwhelming as the first Fold's is.

They have to market it as an all-in-one ultimate mobile device and NOT as some sort of a BlackBerry replacement.

The word BlackBerry has to stay far far away

There were a lot of form factors years ago. The market made its mind up since.

[bb10adopter111]

There were a lot of form factors years ago. The market made its mind up since.

More accurately, the power of the network effect for iOS and Android let them enforce standards which has stabilized the business model but thwarted innovation in ergonomics.

From the screen of my trusty Z10 using the exceptional BlackBerry VKB.

[conite]

More accurately, the power of the network effect for iOS and Android let them enforce standards which has stabilized the business model but thwarted innovation in ergonomics.

From the screen of my trusty Z10 using the exceptional BlackBerry VKB.

I don't buy into that. In the end, consumers get what they want.

[bb10adopter111]

I don't buy into that. In the end, consumers get what they want.

I didn't mean to imply that Android and iOS didn't earn their success. But, now that we have a duopoly, it's pretty difficult to innovate with hardware that neither Android or iOS support.

From the screen of my trusty Z10 using the exceptional BlackBerry VKB.

[conite]

I didn't mean to imply that Android and iOS didn't earn their success. But, now that we have a duopoly, it's pretty difficult to innovate with hardware that neither Android or iOS support.

From the screen of my trusty Z10 using the exceptional BlackBerry VKB.

Ok, but Android is not really limited to form-factor. It powers everything from Android TV boxes, to phones like the Punkt, to smartphones - including foldables.

I don't think you can come up with a design you couldn't adapt Android for if there was a desire for it.

If Samsung thought they could take 10 million iOS users away with an Android device that looked like an armadillo, they would.

[bb10adopter111]

Ok, but Android is not really limited to form-factor. It powers everything from Android TV boxes, to phones like the Punkt, to smartphones - including foldables.

I don't think you can come up with a design you couldn't adapt Android for if there was a desire for it.

Certainly, but we both know that there's a difference between possible and easy. I'd have loved to see a 1:1 screen on top of the KEY PKB, but it would have been very hard to make work with the ecosystem.

From the screen of my trusty Z10 using the exceptional BlackBerry VKB.

[conite]

Certainly, but we both know that there's a difference between possible and easy. I'd have lived to see a 1:1 screen on top of the KEY PKB, but it would have been very hard to make work with the ecosystem.

From the screen of my trusty Z10 using the exceptional BlackBerry VKB.

It's not really that hard. It's just that nobody wants that (a few hundred thousand users counts as nobody).

Bring 10-20 million users to the table and it will be done before breakfast tomorrow.

[babugaru1]

What would a Key3 do that K2 doesn't? More ram? Upgraded processor?? If K3 is just another repeat of previous Ks and if virtually everyone interested in K's oversized Q form already owns a K, K3 will only appeal to some shrinking fraction of existing userbase. Imo. A userbase that hasn't yet fully migrated from K1 to K2. Significant migration out of that userbase toward significantly identical "oversized Q" product seems pretty unrealistic, to me. Unless "they" find a way to appeal to some untapped "slab lover" market? (lol)... OR some way to appeal to untapped legacy market... ???

Not saying either is viable. Just saying that I, myself, don't KNOW. Does any mortal around here KNOW present legacy (pre Q/Z) userbase numbers? Userbase of the last arguably profitable BB'S?? Surely NOC enjoys access to data that might indicate how many BBOS users are still active? AND maybe even some insight into what those users are using them for??

Nope... sorry, Crackberry community has proven too antagonistic toward legacy over the years to reliably gage that userbase on CB activity. Imo. BB's NOCs, on the other hand might provide quite informative data... SURELY TCL demanded access and reviewed that data before jumping in? ?? Who knows? Lol.

BlackBerry should go with passport kinda design for Key3 as 1:1 screen aspect ratio will not be a problem anymore.

[babugaru1]

Or they can go with priv kinda design with high specs.

If key3 design follows key1 and key2, then only subset of a subset of subset customers will only buy key3.

They should either go with passport or priv design for key3 to attract new customers and BB10 fans,

[conite]

Or they can go with priv kinda design with high specs.

If key3 design follows key1 and key2, then only subset of a subset of subset customers will only buy key3.

They should either go with passport or priv design for key3 to attract new customers and BB10 fans,

Or, none at all - which appears to be the strategy.

[the_boon]

Or, none at all - which appears to be the strategy.

That's one part of said "strategy".

The other part consists of selling the KEY2 for more than it cost at launch, about a year and a half ago.

Who are they fooling with this?

[conite]

That's one part of said "strategy".

The other part consists of selling the KEY2 for more than it cost at launch, about a year and a half ago.

Who are they fooling with this?

Why sell at a steep discount when they are still moving inventory? It's not like there are many left.

[bb10adopter111]

That's one part of said "strategy".

The other part consists of selling the KEY2 for more than it cost at launch, about a year and a half ago.

Who are they fooling with this?

Your assertion that someone is being "fooled" is faulty. People pay premium prices all the time for all sorts of reasons. There is no such thing as a "fair" price when it comes to discretionary purchases. BlackBerry Mobile decided it didn't want to risk over producing so stocks have been scarce enough to command premium prices. That's just basic micro economics. When demand exceeds supply, prices rise.

From the screen of my trusty Z10 using the exceptional BlackBerry VKB.

[Chuck Finley69]

It will be similar to the iPhone 8 in size with 64GB and the latest chip. No face ID (Touch ID) Single lens camera probably similar to the XR. It is being released to appeal the the SE fans and address the attack by midrange phones and pricing. If it has the square build of the SE (5S) and size of 8 I believe they will sell copious #'s of them.

I suspect how the SE used the 5 chassis the SE2/9 will use the 8 chassis for simplicity

[Chuck Finley69]

Ok, but Android is not really limited to form-factor. It powers everything from Android TV boxes, to phones like the Punkt, to smartphones - including foldables.

I don't think you can come up with a design you couldn't adapt Android for if there was a desire for it.

If Samsung thought they could take 10 million iOS users away with an Android device that looked like an armadillo, they would.

That sounds like Unihertz Titan and well short of 10 million......