05-19-13 08:34 PM
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  1. currentodysseys's Avatar
    Food for thought:

    Look at the Marketing Mix theory (basic stuff)
    Marketing Product Oriented Price Theory - Free PDF downloads

    Marketing mix - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

    then if you like look at this:
    http://cms.bsu.edu/-/media/WWW/Depar...ure2003mer.pdf

    There is much more to look at, if one really wants to understand pricing.

    My point: We are talking apples and oranges, since we oversimplify mainly and give personal perceptions to back our view of "expensive vs well priced or cheap".

    just aiming to some constructive input.
    Thanks.
    MarsupilamiX likes this.
    05-01-13 11:17 AM
  2. MarsupilamiX's Avatar
    Thank you for your post. I am really conscious and aware of marketing realities and then some, believe me, and I agree in what you specify on in a way. My comment was indeed in personal level. If a marketing strategic positioning and implementation works or not, is not equal to cheap or expensive being absoute truths though. If the marketing implementation is successful it will be just that: a successful marketing implementation and a job very well done, as to the specifics of the mk planning and strategy. So we are in agreement essentially.

    In theory the basic laws of demand should work in the marketing mix, except if they are affected by strategically positioned and shifted parameters on the marketing design and they work in the implementation, that is what this is all about, and always with a target group in sights and with marketing study and research behind it. So I am not really prone to simplifying "expensive" or "cheap", this is too much of generalisation and as said, we should be looking a mk mix and strategy, something that we can touch upon in the case of bb but not really discuss if we want to be effective, given that we know their general direction but not have the info.

    My post was not to say I agree with the OP or not. My post was that as a person, in my life, I find the reaction of bashing the op as pathetic, to say the least. I think he is entitled to voice his opinion on his perception of pricing (especially when he is not coming out saying it should cost 2USD...).

    I do agree with you, I would say we are at about 99% (I leave 1% out due to the difference between mk theory and practice when it comes to results ).

    Thanks again.
    Since your first post, it was clear for me, that you know what you are talking about.
    I also like your analysis. You surely took some time to write the 2 posts

    Posted via CB10
    currentodysseys likes this.
    05-01-13 11:30 AM
  3. currentodysseys's Avatar
    1st of May holiday... gives time to come out and play lol (even today I got caught up in refreshing my reading due to this thread, so it has been very constructive ).

    Thank you for your conversation, I really appreciate it!
    05-01-13 11:41 AM
  4. tangyorangesour's Avatar
    Yes, Z10 is expensive.

    Contract, no-Contract as many would say - but if I simply compare the unlocked phone(worldwide-amazon/bestbuy) prices - it costs a fortune here in India.
    hvd23 and semperfi45 like this.
    05-01-13 12:39 PM
  5. MichealBerry's Avatar
    In India the BlackBerry Z10 is overpriced .
    Hardware comparison Only.
    Is this phone meant for hardcore BlackBerry fans only, who will buy only out of love and loyalty but is this enough to attract new customers.
    This thread is not intended to offend anyone in anyway.
    Is it worth buying for a slightly higher ppi n 2 GB ram

    1.Samsung Galaxy S2 MRP 32000/- price at launch April 2011[best price 18000/-]
    1.2 Dual Core/217 ppi/1650 mAh battery/8 MP/ GPU Mali 400/4.3 inch display/1gb ram

    2.Nokia Lumia MRP 39000/-[best price 33,990\-]with wireless charging. Announced 2012 September
    1.5 Dual core krait/332 ppi/2000 mAh battery/8 MP/GPUAdreno 225/4.5 inch display.

    3.Blackberry Z10 MRP 43,500/- price at launch Feb. 2013[best price 42,500]
    1.5 Dual core krait/355 ppi/1800 mAh battery/8 MP/GPU Adreno 225/4.2 inch display/2gb ram

    4.Samsung Galaxy Cricket 20,600/- price at launch. nov 2012
    1.5 dual core krait/306 ppi/2100 mAh battery/8 MP/GPU Adreno 225/4.8 inch display/2gb ram

    5.Samsung S3 MRP 36,500/- Price at launch 2012 May[best buy 2012 Oct. 28,000/-][2013 jan 26500/-]
    1.4 Quad core/306 ppi/2100 mAh/8 MP/GPU Mali 400/4.8 inch display

    6. Samsung S4 MRP. 41,500/- price at launch. March 2013
    1.6 Quad core & 1.2 Quad core/441 ppi/ 2600 mAh/ 13 MP/ GPU PowerVR SGX 544MP3 / 5.0 inch display.

    Edited to avoid confusion.

    I'm not saying it's a bad phone or its the best phone I'm just trying to say it's expensive in comparison to the hardware.


    Posted via CB10
    If I were you and really wanted the Z10, I would hold off for a few months until they start giving them away due to low sales. They had to do the same for the overpriced PB. Honestly, it would behoove them to have a more aggressive price point and get the phone in as many hands as possible.
    05-01-13 12:52 PM
  6. currentodysseys's Avatar
    If I were you and really wanted the Z10, I would hold off for a few months until they start giving them away due to low sales. They had to do the same for the overpriced PB. Honestly, it would behoove them to have a more aggressive price point and get the phone in as many hands as possible.
    Yes maybe, but the point is that this would affect pricing and phone status in other markets.
    Just look at how segmenting launches with a couple of months difference is made a big deal in the global perception form some markets. Pricing is the same principle +customs fees that protect the purchasing in cross sales between markets may not apply regionaly in some cases (eg Europe).
    Core marketing targeting and strategy apart, it is also a matter of how lower pricing would affect sales and collaborations in the broader area geographically around india.
    As a secondary effect, this could cause for out of market purchases in bigger numbers, from people buying from india, instead of the other way around. Obviously someone did not want to see that happen either in this case.

    In global application when it comes to market positioning and marketing strategy things are complicated and multi-factor dependant according to the strategy in each case.

    Personally, as you said, I would also opt to wait it out a bit, till the price drops. (and keep posting on CB contests lol).
    MarsupilamiX likes this.
    05-01-13 01:02 PM
  7. MarsupilamiX's Avatar
    Yes maybe, but the point is that this would affect pricing and phone status in other markets.
    Just look at how segmenting launches with a couple of months difference is made a big deal in the global perception form some markets. Pricing is the same principle +customs fees that protect the purchasing in cross sales between markets may not apply regionaly in some cases (eg Europe).
    Core marketing targeting and strategy apart, it is also a matter of how lower pricing would affect sales and collaborations in the broader area geographically around india.
    As a secondary effect, this could cause for out of market purchases in bigger numbers, from people buying from india, instead of the other way around. Obviously someone did not want to see that happen either in this case.

    In global application when it comes to market positioning and marketing strategy things are complicated and multi-factor dependant according to the strategy in each case.

    Personally, as you said, I would also opt to wait it out a bit, till the price drops. (and keep posting on CB contests lol).
    It is a refreshing feeling, to read posts with more economical background.
    It is by far not as subjectif as some opinions around here.

    I don't want to imply that every economical theory does make sense, but supply and demand is something we have a track record worth of 5000+ years.

    Posted via CB10
    05-01-13 03:42 PM
  8. bambinoitaliano's Avatar
    Just my 2 cents and bring the hate if you like, will not be surprised.

    What DOES surprise me though is the following: Consumers (that is US buying phones for example) arguing against price drop on ANY service or good. For the consumer it IS important to pay the less possible money when acquiring something, this is plain and simple to the consumer's interest.

    I see lately people going about that the price should be higher or that it is ok and top it up with "if you cannot afford it do not buy it" cliche.

    REALLY? Realise that even if you can afford it (I could and I bought it, as I did the playbook and my other bb and non bb phones), it is YOUR money, YOUR hard work. It does not matter how much money one has, money is always (or in most cases anyway) earned through hard work, so yes, any time I ll take a discount and I will press for the price to drop, and I will let people know it is too expensive, not because I can or cannot afford it, but because some times (one too many) products ARE overpriced... we are saving BlackBerry's bottom (line) by buying a phone that is sold at x3 or x2 the cost.

    Will not get into cost analysis, I know there have been very informative posts in CB and obviously the production cost is not the marketing cost so, lets say roughly that the retail price is x2 the costs from factory to retail... that is 100% gross profit for the people/companies in the whole chain.

    Also according to the per capita GDP of each country/ Market a product can become "luxurious" or not, depending on the "segment" it is directed when priced. Thorstein said the same about the Q10 yesterday in his interviews. They are aiming a certain segment (economically as well) with the Q10 (that it is expected to sell by the 10ns of millions...). And there came a comment on the CB front page by a user, that he thought the Q10 should be sold for 1500USD... implying that business people do not really care or get affected by price.... REALLY!?

    Some People here have gone mad? It really offends you when someone comes out to say that a phone is overpriced (mind you with 700-800 or 1000USD in some places, a family lives for a couple of months or more...) and it does not offend you that we all spend 4 times the PRODUCTION cost of the phone to acquire it or x2 the cost for production+marketing+distribution?
    I love BB products and my buying history proves it, I accept the pricing and decide to buy them, so I do not pretend to be an idealistic hypocrite. I paid for the z10 a hefty ammount because I could afford it. But to come out saying that people are crazy or plants from companies when they voice their opinion as consumers asking for a lower price, that is totally crazy and offensive.

    This is what happened with the iphone and all started calling people sheep etc... its price converted it to a status symbol... even if people could not afford it, they would buy it, prioritise their phone acquirement over other issues in life and many people in here would go on to critisise them as fashion and status symbol victims. Now some come here to advocate that BB is niche, that it is for the "few that CAN afford it" because it is THAT good, and if you cannot, well.. poor you....

    This is proof of the sheep mentality being inherent to people... they take our money and we cheer. Up to that it is our own decision. then someone comes over and says: "You are asking too much for this phone, I love it but hell, 700-1000USD is way too much for a z10-q10"... and then the "select few" come and bash over them, as if they are not being logical or at least do not have the right to voice their opinion based on general competition pricing.

    The iphone and the z10 are in approximately same prices...? maybe so. Maybe the most expensive phones on the market (q10 and Iphone)... and well, some people are just as proud to have the phone that is the most expensive, next to the i-phone, they will bash all that voice concern about price and then will go to bash i-phone users for being sheep. And now they will come to bash on me for my post, that is the character of human nature...

    To each their own, but when people come in here bashing over a legit voicing of opinion, well that is really what makes CB little by little, too similar to some other forums that are no fun at all. And personally I would like CB to continue being a fun and constructive/ friendly place to be.

    all the best and sorry about the rant, had to get it out of my system.
    Thanks.
    It's simple economy. The elasticity of supply and demand. The companies roll the dice on their products, the consumers decide their fate. Remember Playbook? Enough said! No hate, no bashing. OP purchased the phone, I'm sure he has a few days to mull over if it's worth the hype or his hard earn money. Consumers everywhere make this kind of decision everyday regardless if it's big purchases or small purchases. Sometimes we regret the decisions we made. Sometimes we were satisfied. At the end of the day you get to decide.
    currentodysseys likes this.
    05-01-13 07:00 PM
  9. agp101's Avatar
    Noob thread.
    You can't compare hardware in an apple to oranges scenario. Not unless they're completely off base.

    Posted via CB10
    05-01-13 07:03 PM
  10. Ankit RS's Avatar
    Not reading through every page here, but the best price for z10 is now 39K.

    Posted via CB10
    05-01-13 10:54 PM
  11. Omnitech's Avatar
    To the discussion about pricing theory etc: whether or not something is "overpriced" is almost entirely a subjective judgement.

    Opinions vary wildly about what that actually means. On the one hand you might have a laissez-faire capitalist who thinks that a "luxury product" is a sign of great prowess on the part of a company that can command a higher margin for a product which might not cost much more to produce than a product which typically sells for much less in the marketplace. On the other hand, you might have someone coming from a Marxist perspective that would argue that such things are a sign of conspicuous consumption and capitalist decadence and greed.

    Examples of what some people might consider "irrational" or "over" pricing:
    Veblen good - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
    Positional good - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

    As with terms like "overweight", there is no magical hard inflection point beyond which you immediately transition from "good weight" to "overweight", or "good price" to "overpriced". It all depends on context.

    The usual standard is that if a product is popular, it is not "overpriced". (As should be the standard for human weight: if a person is healthy and happy, then the fact that they don't meet some ideal BMI should be immaterial)

    And as I pointed out earlier, the way smartphones are typically marketed in India is very different than the way they are typically marketed in the west. The hardware cost in India is typically very high, and the service price very low.

    Blackberry just announced some new data plans for the Indian market, $2.50 per GIGABYTE for data. Can I get a show of hands from people in Western countries who are paying that sort of price for that much data? Anyone? I thought so.

    Research In Motion Ltd (NASDAQ:BBRY) launches low-cost plan for 15 circles in India | US Market Buzz

    Blackberry does not have the kind of hardware economy of scale to compete with companies like Samsung, LG and Huawei when it comes to low-end devices. That is a brutal, low-margin market that is most suitable to companies competing primarily on price. It's no surprise at all that Blackberry isn't interested in trying to compete with companies who own all their own factories in low-wage areas with low regulatory requirements. It would be stupid for them to try to compete in that market, because the company is not architected to be competitive in that market.

    So they focus on high-value, high-engineered products at the high end. If they have decent success selling substantial amounts of them, it's hard to rationalize that they are "overpriced" for the market they were built to appeal to, any more than arguing a Porsche is "overpriced" only by considering its affordability to someone of average means in a country like India. It's immaterial: Porsche is not attempting to target that sort of customer. (But there are companies that do, ie Tata Motors of Mumbai.)

    It's as silly as trying to complain that a Tata Nano is "underpriced" for a member of the Saudi royalty. If that person decides they like the car and they buy it, it is priced appropriately for them.
    Last edited by Omnitech; 05-02-13 at 04:25 PM. Reason: Minor typo
    05-02-13 01:26 PM
  12. hvd23's Avatar
    So you have already bought the Z10 and now your not happy with the price you paid? LOL sorry but thats funny.

    No offence.

    You could always take it back right?
    No I bought mine from dubai (no drama here pin:24D24AA2) and I'm not gonna return it unless I buy a Q10. And I'm not happy with the price in india because I know a lot of cell phone dealers and their customers are not buying and giving the same reason. Sales are not picking up and only reason they're getting is that price is too high, you will not believe that the demand for an used Z10 is even more than the new 1 its selling anywhere between 25-30,000 for a less than month old piece.

    I'm addressing this to everyone.
    My intension is not to offend anyone and i would appreciate if u all would do the same in return and i respect ur opinion even though I respectfully disagree.

    God bless and tc.



    Posted via CB10
    05-02-13 10:50 PM
  13. ChaoticBlissPA's Avatar
    The only thing I can say is...You get what you pay for. I'm not sure what those prices translate to American dollars, however, the $600 I paid for my phone was well worth every penny. In fact, I am looking into buying a second one.
    05-19-13 08:34 PM
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