[sleepngbear]

They have mobile versions because the market used to be dominated by phones with WAP Browsers, and from a world-wide point a view, it still is. Feature/dumb phones are still over 65% of the phone market.

Then there was Windows Mobile which only had IE mobile, which was largely a WAP Browser, and Blackberry OS 6.0's browser is still pretty much a glorified WAP Browser.

"Desktop Browsing" on Mobile phones didn't really become mainstream until late 2008 or so, and for Mobile HTML5 browsers most sites that care are building HTML5 versions of their mobile sites, not WAP versions.

There's a stark difference between m.facebook.com and touch.facebook.com, for example.

Even m.bing.com was recently optimized for HTML5. Try it out, if possible.

But you're still working with mobile devices with displays that, while amazingly high in resolution, are still many times smaller than any desktop, laptop, or even netbook computers. So the question then becomes one of practicality, which I fully understand is very subjective and varies from one individual to another. So I'll ask you the same question I just asked Chrisy -- are you able to actually read the contents of a full web site such as CB without zooming?

[Chrisy]

Can you view those full sites as they are on that TB without zooming them to be able to read anything on them? Say, the full CrackBerry, for example? If you can, I applaud your eyesight! If you can't, don't you find it a bit of a nuisance having to zoom, and then scroll the screen to get to the section of the page you want to read or navigate from? Or are those extra steps worth it to you for the benefit of viewing Flash content? Not trying to be snotty, I sincerely want to understand. I tried viewing full pages on a Captivate in the phone store (My Yahoo, to be specific), and while they were definitely clearer than on the Torch, there was still no way I could read them without zooming. I personally prefer not to have to do that.

Yes, easily! My screen is huge. Also, I have my default web text set to large. I don't need to zoom unless it is to click a page number. Then I do. But really, i love being able to zoom in and out if I need to. There is no lag, it's so fast and smooth.

I don't find full sites hard to read at all. And I don't seem to be zooming or scrolling a lot.

[Chrisy]

Again Chrissy looks like you had the tour with os5 IT's not a fair comparison! Like you know I've had the Evo and Now I have the Bold with OS6 and its not much different. OS6(Bold) is a big step up from the tour.

Oh I agree. But my choices were to upgrade to a Bold or switch phones. The Bold wasn't worth signing a two year to get. There was nothing for me to upgrade to on VZW in terms of Blackberry.

If the Storm 3 was out I may have gone that way!

[Chrisy]

The Thunderbolt renders pages to fit the screen even if text is large. It looks amazing. I wish I could show you a screen shot!

[anon(73368)]

Oh I agree. But my choices were to upgrade to a Bold or switch phones. The Bold wasn't worth signing a two year to get. There was nothing for me to upgrade to on VZW in terms of Blackberry.

If the Storm 3 was out I may have gone that way!

Just to bad you couldnt hold out for a couple of months longer. i think you would be very Happy with the S3 or montana Honestly the Bold is a very solid device and have no regrets of returning the Evo.

[Rickroller]

So I'll ask you the same question I just asked Chrisy -- are you able to actually read the contents of a full web site such as CB without zooming?

I can yes..although I prefer a quick double tap (same as with the Torch) and have it re-wrap and zoomed. I've only got a 3.7" screen on my HTC and with it in landscape mode on Crackberry's full site it takes minimal scrolling around.

There is no need to "pinch to zoom" unless you REALLY are looking to zoom into something. My android browser works the same as the Torch in regards to double tap..just much faster/clearer, and with bigger real estate.

[iN8ter]

But you're still working with mobile devices with displays that, while amazingly high in resolution, are still many times smaller than any desktop, laptop, or even netbook computers. So the question then becomes one of practicality, which I fully understand is very subjective and varies from one individual to another. So I'll ask you the same question I just asked Chrisy -- are you able to actually read the contents of a full web site such as CB without zooming?

Yes.



Uploaded with ImageShack.us

HD7 WP7 browser. Default zoom on the Crackberry General Forum.

BTW, the WP7 IE browser will blow up some text on a site if you're zoomed all the way out to make it usable if the site is really big. The algorithm is not perfect, but Android doesn't do that.

That being said, a quick double tap on either browser will typically zoom you in on the table column and allow you to read the forum on either landscape or portrait without issues. The larger screens (especially 4.3") have a HUGE advantage over the Bold/Torch screens in that regards, and the browsers in WP7 and Android are simply better than the BB browser (and WP7's browser is 2x faster than Androids and 5x faster than Blackberry's).

I'd have done Android's browser as well, if I had an Evo with a kickstand :P

[sleepngbear]

And what's with people's obsession here with calling others rude/arrogant here? Just want to give yourself and excuse to do the same or something? You certainly are no shining example of politeness. Quite the opposite XD

It's not an obsession -- certain people often come across as rude, authoritative, condescending, and at times inflammatory and downright antagonistic. Sometimes it just becomes too much to quietly overlook. You in particular have toned it down recently, whether intentionally or not, I don't know; but you seem to be very knowledgeable about this technology, and when you share that knowledge I find what you have to offer very enlightening. Without naming names, because I'm still personally committed to avoiding pissing contests today, there's a handful of others who are all of the things I noted above but bring nothing positive or informative to any conversation. But they know who they are. They cannot be avoided because they regularly inject themselves and their obvious loathing for everything BlackBerry into every thread, whether it's pertinent to the topic or not. Sometimes their postings are blatantly inflammatory, sometimes they just have no meaningful purpose other than bringing attention to themselves. Some people can let it go, some cannot. Guess which one I am.

We have our reasons for preferring BB's, just as iPhone and Android users have their reasons for preferring those. It's not that people here don't want to hear opposing opinions. As stated many times, we welcome them. This discussion on mobile browsing, for example; it's probably not going to change my browsing habits or my personal phone preference (though you never know...), but it's still interesting to me nonetheless to understand how others use their phones and why they may prefer one model over another. There's a good mix of users here who obviously prefer the better browsing experience of other brands of phones, and right now most of us are calmly and intelligently sharing those ideas. If we could just keep the tone to that level, this would be a much more peaceful place.

[iN8ter]

It's not an obsession -- certain people often come across as rude, authoritative, condescending, and at times inflammatory and downright antagonistic. Sometimes it just becomes too much to quietly overlook. You in particular have toned it down recently, whether intentionally or not, I don't know; but you seem to be very knowledgeable about this technology, and when you share that knowledge I find what you have to offer very enlightening. Without naming names, because I'm still personally committed to avoiding pissing contests today, there's a handful of others who are all of the things I noted above but bring nothing positive or informative to any conversation. But they know who they are. They cannot be avoided because they regularly inject themselves and their obvious loathing for everything BlackBerry into every thread, whether it's pertinent to the topic or not. Sometimes their postings are blatantly inflammatory, sometimes they just have no meaningful purpose other than bringing attention to themselves. Some people can let it go, some cannot. Guess which one I am.

We have our reasons for preferring BB's, just as iPhone and Android users have their reasons for preferring those. It's not that people here don't want to hear opposing opinions. As stated many times, we welcome them. This discussion on mobile browsing, for example; it's probably not going to change my browsing habits or my personal phone preference (though you never know...), but it's still interesting to me nonetheless to understand how others use their phones and why they may prefer one model over another. There's a good mix of users here who obviously prefer the better browsing experience of other brands of phones, and right now most of us are calmly and intelligently sharing those ideas. If we could just keep the tone to that level, this would be a much more peaceful place.

No, that's not what I'm talking about. I'm talking about how quick some of them (to not generalize too much) are to flaming others for being rude whilst displaying an even worse attitude because someone posted a dissenting opinion about RIM or RIM's phone/smartphone OS.

The question was mostly rhetorical. It's largely just hypocrisy and bitterness (which is not equatable to envy or jealousy, BTW).

No one is trying to make anyone switch, but people like you asking rhetorical questions like "can you view it without zooming in" does not help the situation because if you haven't bothered to look/use at an Android/WP7 phone [in any factorable manner] in a carrier store or come to an educated conclusion about each platform before "choosing" one you really cannot carry on an "intelligent" objective discussions about them. If you're such a diehard BB fan, that's fine, but coming here to make sweeping generalizations or give damning opinions about a platform you've never seriously used... Well, it's just laughable, and that has nothing to do with preference.

Most of the iOS/Android users here have had Blackberries. A lot of the BB seem to have only "seen a friend running for a charger" or some BS like that... Lol. (****, people make 5+ new threads a week just to say that).

You're doing nothing but carrying a subjective, opinion and heresay-based discussion, and those are never fun...

Also, with as much crutch-hugging and Android/iOS bashing that goes on in this forum, you people expect Android/iOS users to stand idly by as you bash their platform and spread FUD about it, yet when someone posts some opinion that isn't a glowing review of BB you have the right to jump down their throats and call them trolls? Gimme a break.

XD

Yes, this is a BB-oriented forum, but only an ***** would expect to post negatively about any platform without their users jumping in to set records straight and debate those "facts." These threads show up in Search Results, etc. and some of these threads are linked in other forums. Stop acting like the BB community is under assault by Android/iOS communities. They didn't put your phones/OS in the position it's in - RIM did (God forbid someone bashes RIM, though!)...

[sleepngbear]

Well so much for keeping the tone peaceful.

Two clarifications of my own here, to set the record straight:
1 - I did try other devices in the phone store before deciding to stay with BB and get the Torch. I tried the Captivate and the iPhone, I didn't like them. I never said they suck, I just preferred the Torch for reasons there's no point in going into now. My preference, my choice. Period.
2 - I have never once made a sweeping generalization or a damning opinion of any other platform, specifically because I've never seriously used them. So please do not put me in that group.

Now, I thought we might actually have an opportunity to find some common ground here. I see that's not going to happen.

I'm done.

[iN8ter]

Well so much for keeping the tone peaceful.

Two clarifications of my own here, to set the record straight:
1 - I did try other devices in the phone store before deciding to stay with BB and get the Torch. I tried the Captivate and the iPhone, I didn't like them. I never said they suck, I just preferred the Torch for reasons there's no point in going into now. My preference, my choice. Period.
2 - I have never once made a sweeping generalization or a damning opinion of any other platform, specifically because I've never seriously used them. So please do not put me in that group.

Now, I thought we might actually have an opportunity to find some common ground here. I see that's not going to happen.

I'm done.

I wasn't talking about you. I was speaking generally form my observations on this forum. The post you quoted wasn't about you, and neither was my reply to your reply about it.

Way to go, buddy

And if you haven't bothered to check something as trivial as whether or not you need to zoom in on a site to read the text on a 4.3" screen on a WP7/Android device, then I seriously doubt you made any decent observations on any of the other devices you supposedly tested. Seems like that would be one of the first thing a consumer would test on a smartphone (I've been through 7 phones in 9 months, so I'm quite adept at "reviewing" them before buying and do spend a factorable amount of time in carrier stores in my dead/spare/nothing else to do time (even the others I'm not using) to play with the phones and see if something else compelling is out there that may warrant a switch).

Your preference, your choice. Period...

I wish you'd think about that before replying to other people. It would probably save you and other people a lot of time before they hit that "lack of comprehension-induced" brick wall with you.

[jebulls]

The only reason the BB gets better battery life is because of the lack of a touchscreen. That's it. It offers an extremely limited and craptastic user experience and is just a big pain in the **** to deal with. Every phone does email better and Blackberry offers nothing not available elsewhere (and everything Blackberry does, both iOS and Android do much better).

You Blackberry lovers are becoming an endangered species, and soon you will be extinct. Enjoy 3 year old technology on new devices, with empty promises of better things to come.

The best thing I ever did was give up my 9700. That thing would need a battery pull every day and the trackpad on it was a j-o-k-e. RIM is a dying company with no direction nor any desire to innovate.

RIM is not even close to a dying company! Posts like this frustrate me.... Could the poor battery life be because of the touchscreen? Absolutely. But what do you do for a living that would give you the credit to say with certain that's the only reason for the poor battery life? To me that was an educated guess by someone that is probably not educated enough in the technical engineer field? So what is the difference between Moto and HTC droids? Why is Moto's battery life pretty good. Why is the iphones battery life actually very good? RIM has a decent lineup of phones coming out this summer and the QNX right behind that. 12-18 months from now hopefully RIM will be very competitive. That would give 3 very nice platforms for us consumers to pick from. The Bold is no doubt behind but to say the trackpad is a joke? IMO if you are not smart enough to use the very useable trackpad maybe you shouldn't be making predictions on a company the size of RIM.

[jebulls]

Agreed. Paying $30 a month for email was getting to me. Full sites load faster on my Thunderbolt than mobile sites did on my Blackberry.

I just prefer full sites to mobile, but that's just me. Many sites that I visit do not have mobile versions. Or if they do there is functionality missing.

I like email better here because pictures are embedded, and I can view all my labels so sorting is easy.

I agree totally with your thinking here. But lets remember that, by looking at the upcoming specs for this summer, it looks as if the experience on a bb this summer could be much much better. Especially for the people that are not going to have 4g in there area for a while. If the new BB's this summer are still closer to the current lineup instead of the current Android or iphone then it will be very hard to hold onto a BB!!

[jebulls]

I also think with the price of the full data and texting plans you want the best experience ever. These plans are expensive and to have limitations on the experience is just ridiculous.

Yes, but for some people, not having the kb for speed dial or shortcuts and even for text input would take away their better experience. Having said that hopefully the upcoming BT will give the best of both worlds!! We will c!

[jebulls]

News to you - there is NOTHING to keep me from buying an Android device IF I WANT ONE. In fact, I C-H-O-S-E not to buy one because I DID NOT WANT ONE.
If my experience were so "craptastic" as you call it, I would buy something else. But I L-I-K-E my experience on BB.

If and when RIM dies, I will go Apple, but I will NOT go Android because I DON'T LIKE THE PLATFORM.

Now.....the important points are in caps for emphasis. People have choices. There is absolutely nothing in this world that would keep me from getting an Android if I wanted one. I simply do not want one. I dislike the platform as much as I dislike *certain* posters who happen to use that platform because of their rude and arrogant demeanor, whose attitudes are akin to that of immature 16 year olds.

Oh, thank you for letting me know I'll be extinct in three years' time. I guess I'll have to take care of my will now.

I agree. It's either the BT or iphone 5 for this guy!

[jebulls]

Well so much for keeping the tone peaceful.

Two clarifications of my own here, to set the record straight:
1 - I did try other devices in the phone store before deciding to stay with BB and get the Torch. I tried the Captivate and the iPhone, I didn't like them. I never said they suck, I just preferred the Torch for reasons there's no point in going into now. My preference, my choice. Period.
2 - I have never once made a sweeping generalization or a damning opinion of any other platform, specifically because I've never seriously used them. So please do not put me in that group.

Now, I thought we might actually have an opportunity to find some common ground here. I see that's not going to happen.

I'm done.

Exactly!! I tried a Droid X and it just wasn't for me. Was it faster than a 9650 BOLD. Of coarse!! But there were some things on the phone that I just didn't like. But I didn't come on this forum after my two weeks of use with the X and start bashing the phone! The people that come on this site and say BB sucks and RIM is done and wont be around in a year or two, come of as if they are missing BB and are not fully happy with their current platform. There is one person on this forum that I often ask advice from that has had BB, Droid X and an iphone. Why do I ask them for advice? Because they are not constantly bashing the other two platforms that they are not currently using. These people that do the RIM bashing on a daily basis will probably be the first ones back when QNX comes out. Which imo, would imply that they were not completely satisfied on their current platform!

[BoldtotheMax]

Why are you so mad?

I have multiple phones as well. If one of them sucks more than the others, what's wrong with letting people know. Just cause you prefer the phone he thinks sucks more than the others, does not invalidate his opinion.

And what's with people's obsession here with calling others rude/arrogant here? Just want to give yourself and excuse to do the same or something? You certainly are no shining example of politeness. Quite the opposite XD

Are all you anti-rim people on the same page or something?

Many of you people come off the deep end and can't see it, probably because they are defending something you like right?

Tescor and many others have done It over and over to the point of name calling, slandering us up and down for what we choose to use. Then turn around and say why are you talking to me that way and calling me names and what not. Like really!

If you can't see that Nadar, well there is a reason for it and I am sure you know why...

If you think I am opposite, so be it...not gonna lose sleep on that as you have done the same in the day. Might have changed recently, but I remember when you tooted your horn high and mighty about what you preferred...

Your not as bad as most...yet, lol!

Posted from my CrackBerry at wapforums.crackberry.com

[BoldtotheMax]

exactly. I have NEVER attacked anyone first like a few of the posters here. Its always been in "self defense" of being called a name. Some of the posters here are just rude. Its amazing how personal they take a statement like "my bb 9650 stinks".....it triggers an all out war and it really says a lot about the people who start it. I really dont care because its funny to me that saying an OS stinks triggers a reaction like that. I find it humorous how many people act as if this is real life. If we were face to face and I said "OS6 stinks", I highly doubt these guys would call me names and act as they do here. They wouldnt make it to lunch acting that way in public.

See, you did the same thing here in every post!

Say you don't get it, yet make threats...online! Real cool dude...

Not to mention, I have seen plenty of times where you are name calling, being ignorant and tout yourself glorious in just about anything.

We get it, you are just so cool! Maybe you are Jay-Z in disguise?

Posted from my CrackBerry at wapforums.crackberry.com

[baxvent]

I actually own several phones running most different operating systems. I used to switch a lot (until Sprint started charging $10/mo for "premium" data). I don't feel like paying more $ for nothing, so I've stuck with my Style and I couldn't be happier. I also have an HTC Hero running 2.1 and I can say that battery life was never an issue for me. I did have to tweak the settings (no widgets, turned off GPS, screen brightness, etc) but I was getting about the same battery life as I am with my Style (around 50-60% after 18hrs). I got similar life out of my Tour. Some of the things that I didn't like about Android (or the Hero)

I missed the BB keyboard... way too many errors typing with the on-screen keyboard (tried several keyboards like Swype, etc). The auto-correction was horrendous! This may have been an HTC thing as opposed to Android since it happened on both my Hero and Evo, but I doubt it since it didn't happen on my Touch Diamond... There were several things that didn't even make any sense! Auto "correction"?! I would type the word "didn't" and it would give that as the SECOND option... The first option you ask? "dibn't"!!!! That's not even a word!! If I was typing fast and hit send too fast, guess who looked like a jackass? haha Another "quirk" I found, whenever I typed a word that wasn't recognized by the phone (or in my user dictionary) if it had the letter "I" in the middle of the word, it would automatically capitalize it! It looked something like thIs. Another issue was the Android software fragmentation. They seemed to pick phones at random when they were deciding which to update to 2.2, 2.3, etc. It doesn't feel very good to know that the phone you bought 3 months ago will not be supported and you have 21 more months to be reminded of this as new apps are released and you can't have them. Many of the Apps are only being built for the newest version of Android. Not to mention that I was always in fear of updating an app because 9 out of 10 times they somehow made the app WORSE than it was before the "update" (possibly because they had to write the app to work on so many different brands of phone, all with their own manufacturers custom "skin" and other issues). I also had privacy concerns... want to install an app? Well, why on earth would a music player app need access to your phone calls, text messages, etc? Well, some did. The messaging app was also inconsistent, sometimes I wouldn't be notified of incoming texts even though vibrate and ring were on. I had to get an app to fix this. There was a horrible lag in the phone dialer. I would press call by accident... sometimes it would take a minute for the phone to dial the person... next thing I know, someone is talking to my pocket! I had to get an app for that also. The next thing I knew, I was getting more and more apps to correct issues with the phone (and OS) than I was for actual use or enjoyment! There were a lot more things that I dibn"t (jk haha) like, but there were a lot of things that I did like... Most importantly, people need to pick a phone that works with their carrier, fits their budget, and has the lesser of the evils when it comes to issues. ALL phones have problems... it's just a matter of which problems bother you the most. I came back to BB because it has always been rock solid. The more I think about my phone, the more I realize it's supposed to be about communication, not the apps and games. I decided to use my phone for communication, and will get a tablet and a mifi for play. (Opera Mini lets me get any info I need on the go... I don't need flash in the browser, etc). I love the BB keyboard, I love that I can feel the phone vibrating on my belt and I can hear it ring (something I was never able to feel or hear with Android) I love my Sleep Mode holster and desktop charging pod, different profiles (no more email waking me in the middle of the night), etc. I realize my post is getting long and out of control so I will end it now

I agree. I find my Blackberry Bold 9650 and my 3G iPad are a great combination. I will be considering the Playbook though as well.

[avt123]

If someone quotes a study to prove his point, then a rebuttal where other parts of that same study can be quoted if there is an opposing point.

These were all charts in the same article. If one is quoted, the others can be quoted as well.

I understand this. I am just pointing out the fact that people like to tout BBs great battery usage every second they can, meanwhile, you (generalization) are comparing it to devices with twice the power. It is obvious BBs are going to get better battery life in certain areas.

People seem to think the fact that BBs get better battery life is amazing, yet they are missing the bigger picture. You are barely getting better battery life than devices that have twice the power (according to some charts), full touchscreens and don't run through a NOC. If anything, the battery life these Android devices and the iPhone is getting is something to praise at due to the fact that these devices do everything by itself.

And notice. BBs are communications devices, yet they are not the top spot in 3G calling, a primary communications feature. These so called "media" devices score higher.

[sleepngbear]

I understand this. I am just pointing out the fact that people like to tout BBs great battery usage every second they can, meanwhile, you (generalization) are comparing it to devices with twice the power. It is obvious BBs are going to get better battery life in certain areas.

People seem to think the fact that BBs get better battery life is amazing, yet they are missing the bigger picture. You are barely getting better battery life than devices that have twice the power (according to some charts), full touchscreens and don't run through a NOC. If anything, the battery life these Android devices and the iPhone is getting is something to praise at due to the fact that these devices do everything by itself.

And notice. BBs are communications devices, yet they are not the top spot in 3G calling, a primary communications feature. These so called "media" devices score higher.

I don't think anybody is saying that BB's are all that because of superior battery life. People are simply pointing out battery life as one measurable advantage that most (not all) BB's have over most (not all) other smart phones. To many people, battery life is the most important benefit after reliable and timely messaging. It keeps coming up every second because other people keep throwing out the myriad other things every other phone does better than a BB every second. It doesn't matter what the reason is, whether it's a slow processor or low-res display or it only dispenses single-ply toilet paper, it does what it does for longer stretches and in most cases the user doesn't have to worry about keeping it charged to get them through the day. No one is saying that BB has the market cornered on that, BB's are just generally better at it. And yes, just a few hours more between charges means the difference between a phone that will and will not make it through a whole work day, which is a deal-breaker for a lot of people, specifically people who don't happen to have all day to spend browsing the web and playing games.

Not saying you're one of those people ... just saying.

[qbnkelt]

Well, alert the media. I have seen the first Android device that has turned my head.

The Atrix. First time *ever* I have thought to myself.....hhhhhhmmmmmm......

I'm actually planning a strategy. 9 hours talk time?!?!

WHAT?!?!?!?!??


Fingerprint recognition??!?!?

WHAT?!?!?!?!?!??

FLASH?!?!?!?!!??!?!?

SAY WHAT?!?!?!?!?!?!?!!!!??!?!!

HHHHHHMMMMMMMMM...................................

not as fluid as iOS, though.....

I *do* have some cash laying around in my kitchen drawer......

[Rickroller]

@Qbnkelt

Whaaaat?! Never would I even have imagined you considering one..simply for all the distate some of the android boys have left with you..even though I know you're pretty open minded

Atrix does seem nice..I have yet to actually play with one..but as soon as I get away from work (sometime in the next month I hope) I'm gonna check one out.

[qbnkelt]

@Qbnkelt

Whaaaat?! Never would I even have imagined you considering one..simply for all the distate some of the android boys have left with you..even though I know you're pretty open minded

Atrix does seem nice..I have yet to actually play with one..but as soon as I get away from work (sometime in the next month I hope) I'm gonna check one out.

I KNOOOOOOWWWWWW!!!!!!!!

LOVE the fingerprint feature. And the battery life *appears* to be good. It's nowhere as smooth as iOS and I prefer having BB's latest-email-in-your-face feature. I still prefer BB's messaging.

I actually have an empty line that I use for relatives who come from across the pond to visit. It was my old 3GS line. My contractor and I are going to the Chinatown AT&T store at lunch. I might just come back with an Atrix!!!!

Still can't stand certain Android fanboys.

Posted from my CrackBerry at wapforums.crackberry.com

[Rickroller]

Well..if you do truly decide to give it a shot..my first piece of advice would be to try out Motoblur and if you don't like it..get rid of it and install LauncherPro. This will give you options to have a 5 row icons along the bottom (which can be scrollable..so up to 15) which can also be customized to open an application with a swipe as well as a tap. So basically with a 5 icon row you can access 10 functions right at your fingertips. LauncherPro is what androids all about imo.