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  1. ssbtech's Avatar
    This article about Apple's position on the changes to UK legislation that would allow for government backdoors into communications highlights a stark contrast to that of BlackBerry, where Chen was recently quoted as saying they would comply with government orders for access to data.

    Apple unsettled by the UK's draft surveillance bill
    lift likes this.
    12-22-15 11:02 AM
  2. Tradesman644's Avatar
    ...lawful requests, not just because a government says so.

    Z30/STA100-5/10.3.2.2474
    paulbbp, DaFoxGrey and timboalogo like this.
    12-22-15 11:59 AM
  3. GTVictor's Avatar
    Has Apple released a statement that they wouldn't?

    They issued a statement to be followed by a report highlighting their concerns. Until their product is actually more secure, possibly in defiance of future laws, then of what value is this stance to the average person?

    Similarly, assuming he gets elected, what are the chances of Trump actually building a wall between the USA and Mexico? Zero.
    12-22-15 12:37 PM
  4. early2bed's Avatar
    According to John Chen good people don't have anything to worry about.
    12-22-15 12:43 PM
  5. 4m4x's Avatar
    According to John Chen good people don't have anything to worry about.
    Good people don't exist, everyone is some kind of criminal

    Posted via CB10
    12-22-15 07:08 PM
  6. Irish Blues's Avatar
    We really need a tin foil picture here.
    rthonpm likes this.
    12-22-15 07:17 PM
  7. BeautyEh's Avatar
    Lol.
    The idea that Apple, or Google, or any other monstrous *consumer geared* Tech company is really, deeply committed to your privacy is not well founded. It is certainly in the ether now, but for crying out loud - Google has admitted in court that it essentially reads and monitors your EMAILS via their service to sell you ads. Apple's iCloud hack (scandal) ... the list is enormous.



    Posted via CB10
    12-22-15 08:16 PM
  8. ssbtech's Avatar
    Lol.
    The idea that Apple, or Google, or any other monstrous *consumer geared* Tech company is really, deeply committed to your privacy is not well founded. It is certainly in the ether now, but for crying out loud - Google has admitted in court that it essentially reads and monitors your EMAILS via their service to sell you ads. Apple's iCloud hack (scandal) ... the list is enormous.
    iCloud was hacked due to bad passwords and security question answers.

    You realize BlackBerry uses a single encryption key for ALL BBM users, right? Not so with iMessage. Apple claims to not be able to read the messages.
    12-22-15 08:21 PM
  9. lift's Avatar
    I like Apple's position on this. As I stated in a similar thread, privacy is and always should be a right that we should never give up and always fight for. Bad guy's will use any tool necessary to do what they want to do. Backdoor's for governments will always be abused and eventually also fall into the wrong hands.
    BlackBerry's position on Privacy is shameful (But it's written all over the Priv's box). What a discrace.
    12-22-15 08:32 PM
  10. paulbbp's Avatar
    I'm in the minority on this. I think BlackBerry and others should cooperate with law enforcement. Different than back doors and mass data collection.

    Posted via the CrackBerry App for Android on Priv.
    Last edited by paulbbp; 12-27-15 at 12:14 AM.
    12-22-15 08:52 PM
  11. ssbtech's Avatar
    I'm in the minority on this. I think BlackBerry and others should coordinate with law enforcement. Different than back doors and mass data collection.
    I get where you're coming from, but co-operating with law enforcement means there's some mechanism to save and copy chats between users. These mechanisms are what end up being targeted by hackers.

    As soon as you open the communication to the possibility of being recorded, you jeopardize the security of the users.
    12-23-15 01:50 AM
  12. spoonman9696's Avatar
    iCloud was hacked due to bad passwords and security question answers.

    You realize BlackBerry uses a single encryption key for ALL BBM users, right? Not so with iMessage. Apple claims to not be able to read the messages.
    Ya....and Ashley Madison didn't keep any records...lol

    Posted via CB10
    12-23-15 06:48 AM
  13. tinochiko's Avatar
    If that legislation passed, and BlackBerry was told to insert back doors, then they would exit the UK following their behaviour so far, no idea how you see otherwise.

    BlackBerry are just admitting that there is no 'easy' solution, they are speaking to the reality instead of to the whims of snowden scare tactics


    Also, see
    http://forums.crackberry.com/showthread.php?p=12157836

    Posted via CB10
    TgeekB and GenghisKahn2011 like this.
    12-23-15 06:52 AM
  14. anon(9188202)'s Avatar
    Does John Chen's definition of a "criminal" include a CEO "PlayBooking" his loyal customers? Seems criminal to me.
    12-23-15 06:58 AM
  15. anon(6038817)'s Avatar
    Define "lawful".

    Posted from my Q10 via CB10
    lift and FF22 like this.
    12-23-15 08:18 AM
  16. Mark Sb's Avatar
    This article about Apple's position on the changes to UK legislation that would allow for government backdoors into communications highlights a stark contrast to that of BlackBerry, where Chen was recently quoted as saying they would comply with government orders for access to data.

    Apple unsettled by the UK's draft surveillance bill
    "Chen was recently quoted as saying they would comply with government court orders for access to data."

    Get your facts straight.

    Was apple as unsettled about Pakistans demand for a backdoor? I don't recall them planning to cease operations as blackberry has...

    "After November 30, BlackBerry will no longer operate in Pakistan. While we regret leaving this important market and our valued customers there, remaining in Pakistan would have meant forfeiting our commitment to protect our users’ privacy. That is a compromise we are not willing to make."

    From the article: Apple unsettled by the UK's draft surveillance bill:
    "That law requires companies, when served with a notice tied to an interception warrant, to hand over customer data in a readable, preferably decrypted format."

    John Chen, BlackBerry CEO: It's A 'Social Responsibility' To Hand Over Private Info In Some Cases


    Chens comment was about allowing Law enforcement access through the courts. If a company is issued a court order to gain access to data they should have no choice but to comply...that is how society works. If they do not comply they should be charged with obstructing justice.

    John Chen, BlackBerry CEO: It's A 'Social Responsibility' To Hand Over Private Info In Some Cases
    Last edited by Mark Sb; 12-23-15 at 08:53 AM.
    12-23-15 08:24 AM
  17. Jaiden's Avatar
    "Chen was recently quoted as saying they would comply with government court orders for access to data."

    Get your facts straight.

    Was apple as unsettled about Pakistans demand of a backdoor? I don't recall them planning to cease operations as blackberry has?

    "After November 30, BlackBerry will no longer operate in Pakistan. While we regret leaving this important market and our valued customers there, remaining in Pakistan would have meant forfeiting our commitment to protect our users privacy. That is a compromise we are not willing to make."

    (Apple unsettled by the UK's draft surveillance bill)
    "That law requires companies, when served with a notice tied to an interception warrant, to hand over customer data in a readable, preferably decrypted format."

    Chens comment was about allowing Law enforcement access through the courts. If a company is issued a court order to gain access to data they should have no choice but to comply...that is how society works. If they do not comply they should be charged with obstructing justice.
    This ^^^

    Posted via BlackBerry Priv
    David Tyler likes this.
    12-23-15 08:39 AM
  18. bb10adopter111's Avatar
    Apple doesn't have the technology or inclination to secure its systems, so it wants all users' data encrypted to transfer all responsibility for privacy to the user.

    If the UK law passes, Apple would be screwed. Tim Cook is pretending to be on the side of Apple's customers, but this is the company that tries to tie your credit-card authenticated ID to every App on your phone.

    Apple didn't even consider pulling out of Pakistan because the Pakistani intelligence services is very happy with customers using iPhone. They had to ask Blackberry for keys because Blackberry was unhackable.

    People like the SOUND of Apples' position better because it's simple, but that doesn't mean it's a better way to protect privacy.

    Most privacy threats are through the tying of your ID to your online activities. Apple and Google are disasters in this area because there business models are based on selling apps through their play store, and transactions require non-alias credentials.

    I say, if your biggest concern about privacy is government accessing your records after obtaining a warrant, a Blackberry might not be for you. If your concern is routine degradation of your privacy due to tracking online, then Apple and Google are not for you.

    Posted via CB10
    12-23-15 09:36 AM
  19. anon(2313227)'s Avatar
    There is already a thread for the same topic. Justt a different article.
    12-23-15 09:43 AM
  20. BerrySoul's Avatar
    I say Chen should go.

      
    lift and Q10Bold like this.
    12-23-15 12:15 PM
  21. lift's Avatar
    So ANY Govt. can go to BlackBerry and say "yeah, John Doe is involved in illegal activity and we want his data". Now what may be considered illegal activity in some countries may not be here (speaking against the Govt., etc.). That's why I like Apple's stance on this. A company that says it will co-operate with Govt. requests for criminal activity is ripe for abuse.
    Chen should go. Making the statements he made has put BlackBerry (A company supposedly committed to PRIVacy and security) in a bad light.
    Q10Bold and Coachbulldog like this.
    12-23-15 03:22 PM
  22. Mark Sb's Avatar
    So ANY Govt. can go to BlackBerry and say "yeah, John Doe is involved in illegal activity and we want his data". Now what may be considered illegal activity in some countries may not be here (speaking against the Govt., etc.). That's why I like Apple's stance on this. A company that says it will co-operate with Govt. requests for criminal activity is ripe for abuse.
    Chen should go. Making the statements he made has put BlackBerry (A company supposedly committed to PRIVacy and security) in a bad light.
    So if apple makes a car you would support the notion that while you are driving it, you can commit crimes with impunity?
    Last edited by Mark Sb; 12-23-15 at 05:00 PM.
    12-23-15 04:49 PM
  23. lift's Avatar
    So if apple makes a car you would support the notion that while you are driving it, you can commit crimes with impunity?
    That was stupid. Just because something CAN be used to commit a crime does not make it OK to commit a crime. People break the law. That's the way it is and always will be. Taking the privacy away from everyone so that you have the ability to catch a few is not for the greater good. It's just big brother wanting the ability to spy on anyone at any time however they want. That's just wrong. You have a right to privacy and if you do something wrong, law enforcement has to find a way to prove you are guilty. There are many ways to do this. One of them does not have to be taking the privacy away from everyone to do it.
    FF22, Elephant_Canyon and JeepBB like this.
    12-23-15 05:16 PM
  24. crackbrry fan's Avatar
    Anyone who thinks that Apple has no "back door " or are in the position that they don't release information to Law enforcement is clearly Deluded.

    Posted via CB10
    12-23-15 05:30 PM
  25. Mark Sb's Avatar
    That was stupid. Just because something CAN be used to commit a crime does not make it OK to commit a crime. People break the law. That's the way it is and always will be. Taking the privacy away from everyone so that you have the ability to catch a few is not for the greater good. It's just big brother wanting the ability to spy on anyone at any time however they want. That's just wrong. You have a right to privacy and if you do something wrong, law enforcement has to find a way to prove you are guilty. There are many ways to do this. One of them does not have to be taking the privacy away from everyone to do it.
    Oh ok...so only the people doing bad things should have their data seized? That sounds a lot like what Chen said.

    BTW I'm pretty sure you don't even care about this issue...just see it as an opportunity to sound alarm bells in your mission to smear blackberry, but here is a link...and a quote.

    He also offered some more insight into his post highlighting a "longstanding policy" established at BlackBerry before his arrival two years ago, which outlines when the company would be willing to give access to police under a court order.

    "We are going to be able to provide your location, who's called who, and all of the metadata around that," he said in a roundtable with reporters.

    But he emphasized that BlackBerry wouldn't give authorities a user's specific texts or other communication.

    "The data itself is safe because we never have it," he said. "We never save the content."
    John Chen, BlackBerry CEO: It's A 'Social Responsibility' To Hand Over Private Info In Some Cases

    Posted via CB10
    Last edited by Mark Sb; 12-23-15 at 05:56 PM.
    12-23-15 05:32 PM
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