1. arickinreallife's Avatar
    do you think if RIM crippled some of their devices so that users couldn't do as much, or access as many settings, it would help sales a little bit?

    i know it sounds crazy but here is my logic:

    one of the major reasons iphone is so so successful across all age groups is because it's ease of use. it's too simple for someone to not figure out.

    if RIM were to limit some of the functions or made them more 'dummy-proof' on devices like the curve line, do you think people would be more inclined to use them? if they play with the device in the store and see how simple it is, or could be, the keyboard might sell the device by itself.

    people hear all sorts of negative things like freezing and stuff like that which you dont hear about the iphone. if RIM were to simplify the OS on some devices or removed a lot of features that someone say using a curve probably wouldnt use (like teenagers using curves are probably not using documents2go) there are great programs, but like, even i dont use that but i have before i just dont use it enough to justify having it come on my device preinstalled (but it IS nice!) the less people can do, the less chances of freezing up and causing other problems.

    anyways--- i guess my point is, the same way with sony and canon digital cameras.

    sony doesn't allow you to access all the manual controls that a canon does. most consumers are going to use autofocus or whatever anyway--- maybe there can just be a setting to unlock ALL the stuff BB has to offer. make the menus more consumer friendly


    thoughts?
    09-06-11 04:27 AM
  2. daveycrocket's Avatar
    Sounds like a simple or advanced key needed, I see your logic but I wonder if it is just more about how it's sold and fashion. For instance even when a product is exactly the same a branded item will sell more. I also wonder about how Apps have been pushed as the holy grail and therefore the device which uses them (I know thew device came first, but it has become self perpetuating because Apps make it possable). My view is that Apps tend to be for amusement/life management, we are into the whole gaming/cloud culture. Being an older person I sometimes think that we are creating a generation of folk who are dependant upon gadget fashion who may lose the ability to converse in a face to face way. I guess I feel that a "dummy-proof" gadget isn't what sells.my last thought is about the concept of dummy proof I think sometimes the reverse is true ie my wife wants the new curve because it is simpler to use, she has two degrees and a masters, she just can't be bothered to mess with the phone.
    09-06-11 05:26 AM
  3. BerryMind's Avatar
    This is a very interesting point. I definitely agree that one of the main reasons the iPhone does so well is its ease of use for the non-IT person.
    09-06-11 05:28 AM
  4. howarmat's Avatar
    RIM has a pretty good balance IMO. They are not locked down like apple is and they are not as free and open as android is. Their phones/OS do have a good deal of settings and options which does make it a bit tricky setting up out of the box for a first time BB user. But i think many people appreciate the added options RIM gives them over the iOS counterpart. Android i found easy to set up and work out of the box, all the customization did take addition time to get down and tweak the phone to its max.

    All brands have their own way of doing things and have their own learning curve. it will come down to each individual on how hard or easy that setup will be.
    09-06-11 11:17 AM
  5. rrrebo's Avatar
    I find that BlackBerries are very stable with a minimum of user intervention. I have several friends with BBs who know little to nothing about their extensive capabilities, but are completely happy with them because they work like they want them to. Those of us that are power-users and tweakers have the freedom to do that, but those who don't care still get a stable device that's easy to use.

    Dumbing down a smartphone is dumb. That's what feature phones are for, and RIM has NEVER been in that market. That's not their demographic. Smartphones are making smarter consumers. Friends who mocked me for being a BlackBerry geek are now rooting their Androids and eagerly awaiting the next OS version to drop. They are becoming phone geeks like me.

    And by the way, I know for a fact that iPhones freeze and require resets or complete reloads frequently. I hear friends talk about it all the time. I can honestly say I've never HAD to reload my OS. I've only done so by choice, to up/downgrade, add or remove files, etc. That's in 4 years, including 2 8300s, an 8310, 2 9700s, and a 9900.
    Last edited by rrrebo; 09-06-11 at 11:26 AM.
    09-06-11 11:24 AM
  6. BBThemes's Avatar
    its called a SMARTphone for a reason.
    09-06-11 11:37 AM
  7. tchocky77's Avatar
    And by the way, I know for a fact that iPhones freeze and require resets or complete reloads frequently. I hear friends talk about it all the time. I can honestly say I've never HAD to reload my OS. I've only done so by choice, to up/downgrade, add or remove files, etc. That's in 4 years, including 2 8300s, an 8310, 2 9700s, and a 9900.

    Absolutely false. BlackBerry's on the other hand, are famous, or rather infamous, for the "battery pull" manoeuvre. I love it when BB folk talk about the iPhone's sealed battery as though it's somehow a disadvantage. Lol. "battery pull's" are unnecessary on the iOS platform.
    09-06-11 12:17 PM
  8. qbnkelt's Avatar
    I would not follow iphone's model through the whole BB product line. I could see, however, a line of devices that you would just pick up out of the box and start using out of the box with simplified features. Youngish users who are into texting and music but who might care less about docs to go could possibly use such a line. Or some groups of seniors who might be more interested in exchanging photos and messaging than perhaps productivity apps. I'm thinking of my mother who's a maniac on her 9700.
    However, if such a line were to be launched, the rest of the phones must remain intact.
    09-06-11 12:18 PM
  9. jlb21's Avatar
    This is a very interesting point. I definitely agree that one of the main reasons the iPhone does so well is its ease of use for the non-IT person.
    This is EXACTLY the reason why when my parents' VZW contract is up in 2 months that they are both getting iPhones. My Dad switching from a Droid that has been nothing but trouble for him and my Mom is switching from a dumb phone.

    Will be easy peasy for them. As much as I would love them to get Blackberries, it would never happen. Oh well.
    09-06-11 01:11 PM
  10. rrrebo's Avatar
    Absolutely false. BlackBerry's on the other hand, are famous, or rather infamous, for the "battery pull" manoeuvre. I love it when BB folk talk about the iPhone's sealed battery as though it's somehow a disadvantage. Lol. "battery pull's" are unnecessary on the iOS platform.
    That's a flat-out falsehood. Be careful when you use the word "absolutely" and make blanket statements. It has a tendency to make you look foolish.

    Let me google that for you
    Let me google that for you
    Let me google that for you

    Shall I continue?
    ALL software platforms are capable of processing breakdowns, especially with so many applications and vendors in play. Some handle it better than others.
    Thank you for playing. Come again.
    09-06-11 01:21 PM
  11. daveycrocket's Avatar
    I don't think an automated OS would make that much difference to the popularity issue because folk in numbers seem to want a phone that will do everything. But maybe there is a case for a barebones OS for example for folks with restricted dexterity or maybe convert to voice control only now that would be neat
    09-06-11 01:38 PM
  12. pkcable's Avatar
    Sounds like a simple or advanced key needed, I see your logic but I wonder if it is just more about how it's sold and fashion. For instance even when a product is exactly the same a branded item will sell more. I also wonder about how Apps have been pushed as the holy grail and therefore the device which uses them (I know thew device came first, but it has become self perpetuating because Apps make it possable). My view is that Apps tend to be for amusement/life management, we are into the whole gaming/cloud culture. Being an older person I sometimes think that we are creating a generation of folk who are dependant upon gadget fashion who may lose the ability to converse in a face to face way. I guess I feel that a "dummy-proof" gadget isn't what sells.my last thought is about the concept of dummy proof I think sometimes the reverse is true ie my wife wants the new curve because it is simpler to use, she has two degrees and a masters, she just can't be bothered to mess with the phone.
    I don't necesarily agree with the OP, BUT if RIM did decide to go this route, THIS would be the way to do it. And to a degree they have done this, much of the BB's customization is below the surface and need not be used or accessed by the casual user. Sound profiles is a GREAT example of this, you can use the ones that RIM has provided, OR you can create a custom profile, PLUS you can edit any of the provided profiles, but the casual user need not touch them, other than to simply switch to silent or vibrate when at meetings. But a Basic/Advanced menu option could be handy in hiding some of the more advanced features of a BB from novice users who don't care about such features. And of course in time, they could ALWAYS just turn ON the Advanced menu.
    09-06-11 02:05 PM
  13. daveycrocket's Avatar
    I don't necesarily agree with the OP, BUT if RIM did decide to go this route, THIS would be the way to do it. And to a degree they have done this, much of the BB's customization is below the surface and need not be used or accessed by the casual user. Sound profiles is a GREAT example of this, you can use the ones that RIM has provided, OR you can create a custom profile, PLUS you can edit any of the provided profiles, but the casual user need not touch them, other than to simply switch to silent or vibrate when at meetings. But a Basic/Advanced menu option could be handy in hiding some of the more advanced features of a BB from novice users who don't care about such features. And of course in time, they could ALWAYS just turn ON the Advanced menu.
    I agree, not having my own BB yet (waiting for the 9810 to arrive in the UK) I am aware that I haven't experienced the depth of the existing automation but am becoming aware of the "advanced" possibilities although limited by useing the simulator, which I feel is a brilliant piece of kit, I feel like I already am familiar with my BB. At first I noticed as I think the OP is commenting about, the many menues, but I think that other OS's have similar but because we become familiar with them we/I tend not to see my use of them, I have noticed this with the simulator at first it felt involved now it feels natural/normal. I like to be able to use "advanced" mode to suit my needs, whereas the new windows phone 7 has become a "simple" version of windows mobile, hence my choice
    Last edited by daveycrocket; 09-06-11 at 04:38 PM.
    09-06-11 04:34 PM
  14. southlander's Avatar
    Absolutely false. BlackBerry's on the other hand, are famous, or rather infamous, for the "battery pull" manoeuvre. I love it when BB folk talk about the iPhone's sealed battery as though it's somehow a disadvantage. Lol. "battery pull's" are unnecessary on the iOS platform.
    IOS still has a hard reset. I know because my fiancee has an iPad2 and I have to reset for her from time to time. Just because you can't remove the battery does not mean you cannot reset it. And as for Android I always hear that little "droid" sound when I am hanging out with with my friends that have those. That means they are rebooting their devices.

    So then, all these platforms have hard reset methods and from time time to time it needs to be used.

    Posted from my CrackBerry at wapforums.crackberry.com
    rrrebo likes this.
    09-06-11 04:50 PM
  15. csickgrind's Avatar
    I agree but why not just let everything be accessible and continue to let people find out, I think my blackberry curve is of interest to me just for the simple fact there are so many shortcuts, secrets, etc that i work to find out which is really fun. But now i want to upgrade to a bold :/.
    09-06-11 08:06 PM
  16. arickinreallife's Avatar
    no phone is perfect and every phone will have its issues. but lately, it's blackberry that is infamous for it's issues

    i've never had an issue with any blackberry with the exception of freezing on my 9800 and then 9810 but i've since figured how to fix it and it works like a dream

    but neither i, or most people on CB are average consumers

    it is called a smartphone for a reason and no it's never been RIM's thing to make feature phones but maybe they should start because whatever they've been doing the past couple years isn't working in their favor.

    like someone else said, make a ready out the box turn on and go type blackberry.
    while a lot of people want ALL the features in the world, there are a lot more (in my experience) that just want a phone that works.

    the only reason i feel that RIM is infamous for issues with their devices is because people have gotten so use to doing the most on ios and android that they expect the same results from RIM and thats not fair

    but life isn't fair and RIM should roll with the punches. i'm 26 and i live in nyc and most people in their 20s and 30s that i know, mostly love BB because they can drop it and still use it without fault. that and bbm are the biggest selling points and pretty soon bbm is going to be a tough selling point.
    09-06-11 09:11 PM
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