[theruined]

Well, nice to have a 4G device right now. Now only for want of a network. LTE is just now rolling out. Spot here, spot there. By the time you can use your marvel of 4G technology, you're gonna be looking to upgrade anyway, unless, of course, you live in one of the 'gifted' locations. Meanwhile, your $$ goes out the door. It's kinda like drooling over an egg thinking of smoked turkey.

Of course the others are rolling out 4G phones now. But they have just as much 3G capability as A BlackBerry . However, will you get to use it in 4G? Stay tuned....

Posted from my CrackBerry at wapforums.crackberry.com

That's pretty accurate of how it will play out, paying for new technology when it's not even capable...just like 3G did when it was first released - the phones were hyped up as godly, until the roll out was 60-70% through and new phones just blasted the competition...history has a tendency of repeating itself, maybe this time RIM can actually use this down time to gauge the market and release a winner...

There are plenty of Android devices in developing countries.

Yea I hear my cousins in UAE are just now getting the HTC Dream (Google Phone)...lol

Surprised? More like aggravated, if the report is true. RIM needs to stop being last to the party.

Like I mentioned above...patience isa virtue...maybe it' a good thing they're finally thinking about quality of their product versus appeasing the market

One of these things I have to say is that aside from ATT's lack of 3G-ness (is that a word? lol) some of their 3G cities, such as Houston for example have speeds of over 5 Mbps on 3G, so I can wait for 4G/LTE once the phones have been tested and built to perform and/or have some battery life... just look at the evo 4g... when on 4g it's a battery hog ... nuff said lol

How can a company put up good 4G coverage if their 3G coverage still lacks? Easy. They can't. Simply put, VZW will set the bar and set it high...but even they won't have that 100% done until 2013 and by then who knows what will be the next GEN tech

[1812dave]

That's pretty accurate of how it will play out, paying for new technology when it's not even capable...just like 3G did when it was first released - the phones were hyped up as godly, until the roll out was 60-70% through and new phones just blasted the competition...history has a tendency of repeating itself, maybe this time RIM can actually use this down time to gauge the market and release a winner...



Yea I hear my cousins in UAE are just now getting the HTC Dream (Google Phone)...lol





Like I mentioned above...patience isa virtue...maybe it' a good thing they're finally thinking about quality of their product versus appeasing the market



How can a company put up good 4G coverage if their 3G coverage still lacks? Easy. They can't. Simply put, VZW will set the bar and set it high...but even they won't have that 100% done until 2013 and by then who knows what will be the next GEN tech

"appeasing the market"? There won't BE any market if they don't get their act together quickly. It will have all gone to Android.

[theruined]

that's a pretty naive thing to say as there are millions of subscribers jumping around phones each week...as long as there is new technology there will be a huge market to push product...

[Daniel Ratcliffe]

BlackBerry is fast losing momentum in the UK as well. I try to recommend a BlackBerry to a friend, and they're mostly like "Nah, I don't want a BB, I hate it". RIM's lack of competitveness is bringing them to their knees here in the UK. They need to get their act together soon or I'm swimming to Canada to give them what for! Android and iPhone, and even WP7, are stealing RIM's slice of the pie, even the scraps! BlackBerry hype is dying down, bigtime. Android hyper, and iPhone hype, are what's really kicking in. Way I see it, by 2015, Android and WP7 will have the big chunk, with iPhone having a nice large feast of scraps. RIM? What RIM?

That is working by the way that the UK market seems to be unfolding, at least in my area.

[reginald_1986]

For me, I stick to some members thinking that I rather have a good BB and having it late compared to having a BB (fast issue and production) which has many problems

Just keep finger cross that the new BB will be out faster than expected.

[Rizzleman716]

I can see your concern being that you have an upgrade soon. But I agree, I'd much rather have them take their time and perfect the device rather than have it released and its garbage like the Storm. That was a horrible mess that should have never happened. And if we can solve that by taking time... then by all means, take all the time you need.

[BergerKing]

I live in a city with 4G coverage, and money isn't an issue. Usefulness of the phone is what's my prime concern.

Congratulations. You just passed Go, collect $200.

Posted from my CrackBerry at wapforums.crackberry.com

[fadown]

meh, late 2011 we will see an epic LTE, dual core, QNX based berry. and the vast majority of people are willing to wait for that.
I work in one of the busiest rogers in SWO, and to be honest the vast majority of people are not looking for the newest latest and greatest tech.

[BergerKing]

You win the award for the most naive post of the week. Ever heard of using one's cell phone to access the internet?? NO BB is good for that--too darn slow. When I'm out and about, I'm not going to stand there like an *****, waiting a minute or more to do something that should have come up in a few moments. Browsing the web on a BB is a pitiful experience.

Gee, that's interesting. I operate with my BlackBerry in lieu of toting a laptop and have for the past 2 years plus. Even my venerable BlackBerry Curve 8330 didn't take a minute to load pages. Typically, and I demonstrated to people in the know that I was loading pages in 4-8 seconds on it. Tour was even faster. Was it the most satisfying experience all the time? No. Page loading is heavily dependent on signal.

Now I'm running a Style, Webkit browser, even still being tweaked, I'm not waiting around for pages to load. I've gone side-by-side with Droid users, and the page-loading differences are minor. Do I need all of the animated Flash banners? No.

Surprisingly, quite often, a user's experience is is based on his/her settings. But, dependent on signal, if it's taking a full minute to load a web page, something isn't right.

Posted from my CrackBerry at wapforums.crackberry.com

[the_sandman_454]

My D2 in the same areas and on the same carrier loads full HTML webpages quicker than the Tour could load mobile optimized pages.

That's flawed thinking that a delayed BB is going to be bug free. When have they ever released an OS without any flaws? They've had some pretty severely flawed OS' for Tour for example. .591 anybody?

QNX is a totally new OS. It is naive to think it'll be perfect when it rolls out. The same folks that complain how "immature" Android OS is, despite there being 4-5 revisions already are chomping at the bit for a brand new relatively untested BB OS. Interesting...

[barrist]

Ah yes more irrational anger disguised as nonchalance ("i pick whatever phone is best for me, no brand loyalty!") if that were true, you wouldn't start a tantrum thread and threatening to *gasp* not buy another blackberry.

all these threads about RIM dying, and its the whiners that seem to be ones taking it the worst and crying like babies.

[JRZLocal]

Just because your next phone may not be a blackberry doesn't mean you're done with blackberry for good. It just seems right now there are other options which are better for some peoples needs. I'm a verizon customer and I have the bold and the incredible, if I had to choose I'd probably go with the htc but that doesn't mean I'd never own a blackberry again it just means bb needs to step up their game especially on americas largest network(big red)

[theruined]

My D2 in the same areas and on the same carrier loads full HTML webpages quicker than the Tour could load mobile optimized pages.

That's flawed thinking that a delayed BB is going to be bug free. When have they ever released an OS without any flaws? They've had some pretty severely flawed OS' for Tour for example. .591 anybody?

QNX is a totally new OS. It is naive to think it'll be perfect when it rolls out. The same folks that complain how "immature" Android OS is, despite there being 4-5 revisions already are chomping at the bit for a brand new relatively untested BB OS. Interesting...

lol...ok if it seriously takes them one year to produce a phone and it still has bugs after releasing the PB and debugging that, then I will believe you, for now, I couldn't care less what you have to say.

...The past is the past, this may or may not be a new step forward. Regardless, it is the step RIM desperately needs to stay afloat, and I'm pretty sure if I was the CEO I'd know this and plan my strategy accordingly...if they fail then so be it, at least they tried...there's no dishonor in that.

[the_sandman_454]

lol...ok if it seriously takes them one year to produce a phone and it still has bugs after releasing the PB and debugging that, then I will believe you, for now, I couldn't care less what you have to say.

...The past is the past, this may or may not be a new step forward. Regardless, it is the step RIM desperately needs to stay afloat, and I'm pretty sure if I was the CEO I'd know this and plan my strategy accordingly...if they fail then so be it, at least they tried...there's no dishonor in that.

Let's look at OS5 for 9630 Tour/9650 Bold as an example. They had roughly 2 years to perfect that, and it still has flaws.

Windows has been around for how long and it still has flaws? iOS has been around how long and it still has flaws? Android has been around how long and it still has flaws?

Humans are making whatever OS will be in the new BB. Guess what is a common factor for things humans make: they have flaws. Perfection is something humans cannot achieve. They may be able to get close, but things are still flawed.

You do realize that's how you pick everything from a mobile device to a brand of shoes or a brand of canned soup by choosing the one with the set of flaws you can live with, right?

Come on, you can't tell me the QNX BB will be produced by Zeus or his offspring on Mt Olympus or something.

[theruined]

flaws are implied, come on, quit arguing semantics, but with the track record QNX has as far as sustainability, longevity, and refinement it has a better chance than any of the OS's you listed to be closer to flawless...

And Zeus wasn't perfect...pick a better reference next time

[the_sandman_454]

flaws are implied, come on, quit arguing semantics, but with the track record QNX has as far as sustainability, longevity, and refinement it has a better chance than any of the OS's you listed to be closer to flawless...

And Zeus wasn't perfect...pick a better reference next time

Sorry, but virtually nothing this complex comes out of the gate, especially on its' first try without flaws of some kind. It may take time to discover them or they may be readily apparent. The software company itself and the few beta testers if there were any will not be able to find every way to break it so they can fix it.

I am not saying QNX is a bad thing. RIM has to try something. I'm sure it will shake out to be a great OS, and far better than any previous RIM OS.

I am saying that it is naive and unrealistic to assume it's going to be perfect right out of the gate. Regardless how hard they put it through testing, it'll still have issues.

Well, theoretically none of the Gods are what we might consider perfect, as they all have flaws from our perspective.

[theruined]

Reread it please...

lol...ok if it seriously takes them one year to produce a phone and it still has bugs after releasing the PB and debugging that, then I will believe you, for now, I couldn't care less what you have to say.

Sorry, but virtually nothing this complex comes out of the gate, especially on its' first try without flaws of some kind. It may take time to discover them or they may be readily apparent. The software company itself and the few beta testers if there were any will not be able to find every way to break it so they can fix it.

I am not saying QNX is a bad thing. RIM has to try something. I'm sure it will shake out to be a great OS, and far better than any previous RIM OS.

I am saying that it is naive and unrealistic to assume it's going to be perfect right out of the gate. Regardless how hard they put it through testing, it'll still have issues.

Well, theoretically none of the Gods are what we might consider perfect, as they all have flaws from our perspective.

I said no such thing, in fact I mentioned debugging...I'm well aware that perfection as far as phones come will most likely never exist, I'm just saying it has the potential to get really close...When? Who knows...

And touch� for the god comment...although that may eventually start a religious battle lol

[the_sandman_454]

Reread it please...





I said no such thing, in fact I mentioned debugging...I'm well aware that perfection as far as phones come will most likely never exist, I'm just saying it has the potential to get really close...When? Who knows...

The playbook doesn't have a radio in it besides wifi does it? The playbook may not have the same hardware as the BB that gets to copy the OS. There are enough differences between the playbook and the handheld that could still lead to some issues. Perhaps not though, but what I do know for sure is there has never been a perfect OS in the history of OS'.

Debugging is all well and good but that still doesn't mean you squash them all, sometimes fixing one creates another one. There have been OS' more or less out for years that still have issues. Maybe different issues than the original ones, but issues nevertheless...

And touch� for the god comment...although that may eventually start a religious battle lol

I have one I tend to believe in but sometimes he has flaws as well, as determined by me. But that's neither here nor there for BB discussion...

[theruined]

The playbook doesn't have a radio in it besides wifi does it? The playbook may not have the same hardware as the BB that gets to copy the OS. There are enough differences between the playbook and the handheld that could still lead to some issues. Perhaps not though, but what I do know for sure is there has never been a perfect OS in the history of OS'.

Debugging is all well and good but that still doesn't mean you squash them all, sometimes fixing one creates another one. There have been OS' more or less out for years that still have issues. Maybe different issues than the original ones, but issues nevertheless...

Well not to sound like I'm nit-picking but I think after the initial wifi support I think they will have radio support...but ok, I will concede to the fact it may have differences in scaling down the OS...of course...but regardless if they can create a standard OS across all phones (somewhat like Android) I think it'd be the next step up and a step towards 1) Simplifying their devices 2) Creating strong support and development 3) Making it easier for troubleshooting

So far it seems like this could very well be the case, and I know I'm reading into things a bit here, but bear with me. From what I've read, researched, and heard this is the goal here...and it makes logical sense. Or at least to me it does.

And yes, debugging may prompt a cascade of never ending issues. Or maybe it won't...Yes there are several OS's out there that have been out for years that still need patches, updates, and mods to make them work. The issue that sticks out the most to me is that RIM is venturing outside the walls of Waterloo in an attempt to remedy their in house development flaws...This is surely a gamble, but...ahh...I don't know man, it seems like QNX has their sh*t together and it just gets me all warm and tingly inside just thinking about the possibilities.

One can only dream...

[belfastdispatcher]

Well not to sound like I'm nit-picking but I think after the initial wifi support I think they will have radio support...but ok, I will concede to the fact it may have differences in scaling down the OS...of course...but regardless if they can create a standard OS across all phones (somewhat like Android) I think it'd be the next step up and a step towards 1) Simplifying their devices 2) Creating strong support and development 3) Making it easier for troubleshooting

So far it seems like this could very well be the case, and I know I'm reading into things a bit here, but bear with me. From what I've read, researched, and heard this is the goal here...and it makes logical sense. Or at least to me it does.

And yes, debugging may prompt a cascade of never ending issues. Or maybe it won't...Yes there are several OS's out there that have been out for years that still need patches, updates, and mods to make them work. The issue that sticks out the most to me is that RIM is venturing outside the walls of Waterloo in an attempt to remedy their in house development flaws...This is surely a gamble, but...ahh...I don't know man, it seems like QNX has their sh*t together and it just gets me all warm and tingly inside just thinking about the possibilities.

One can only dream...

My worry would be this, will the qnx os be any good on a non touch screen qwerty blackberry? I couldn't even cope with OS6 which seems to be built with touch in mind, OS5 seems so much more efficient at doing quick tasks.

Posted from my CrackBerry at wapforums.crackberry.com

[Evan_O]

I'm eligible for an upgrade in Feb--getting a 3G phone would be like buying a b&w TV or a monophonic music system. It's 4G or bust!

But, more advanced 3G can be as good or pretty close to pre4G. 4G by every company is marketing and we, no matter which carrier, don't have true 4G. Also once they perfect it and release the qnx,etc people will say wow... I'm glad they put the extra time and effort in this quality product. I may be wrong... But its my opinion and I think RIM is making sure they are going to be one of the Big Boys.

Posted from my CrackBerry at wapforums.crackberry.com

[anon3396357]

OS5 seems so much more efficient at doing quick tasks.

You took the words right out of my mouth.. OS5 just works for me.

[belfastdispatcher]

But, more advanced 3G can be as good or pretty close to pre4G. 4G by every company is marketing and we, no matter which carrier, don't have true 4G. Also once they perfect it and release the qnx,etc people will say wow... I'm glad they put the extra time and effort in this quality product. I may be wrong... But its my opinion and I think RIM is making sure they are going to be one of the Big Boys.

Posted from my CrackBerry at wapforums.crackberry.com

What is the speed the 4G is supposed to get? I remember when 3G came out it was advertised to get up to 7.5 mb. Never really got it though except vodafone in certain areas, other carriers I think chose to cap the speed in favour of bigger coverage.

Posted from my CrackBerry at wapforums.crackberry.com

[belfastdispatcher]

I just observed 160kb/s download speed trough the blackberry browser using BIS connection while downloading a 10 minutes mp4, what's 4g download speed supposed to be?

Posted from my CrackBerry at wapforums.crackberry.com

[lssanjose]

I looked at VZW's website and it says somewhere in the avenue of 10-12 Mbps